shepwrite Posted July 4, 2010 Report Share Posted July 4, 2010 Throughout the offseason, I bitched a ton about not upgrading the WR corps that lacks an elite talent who can scare defenses into leaning to his side, opening up other receivers. Deion Sanders says it's the fundamental purpose of having an Andre Johnson type of guy. Teams with great WRs also tend to have a productive TE who benefits from a safety rotating over. That said, you can't discuss the WRs without admitting that our QBs were just SHIT last year. It's true. They were insanely inaccurate. And it's not a quirky phenomenon that teams with Brady, Brees, and Manning keep finding sleeper WRs all over the draft. If those guys are throwing you the ball, you're gonna catch a lot of passes. You didn't make it to the NFL because you suck. There's a theory that there are more guys who can run and catch than there are jobs, the exact opposite of the quarterback position. I mostly agree, although there often seems to be too many on some teams and none on others. There are a lot of people who think the Browns really stole one in Carlton Mitchell, a big kid who can run. While some have called him "raw," he's no Paul Hubbard. Not even close. And while there are some knocks that he'll drop one ever so often, he's no Bray-Bray. He can catch. Nobody woud've been shocked if he'd gone in the third round. If you've seen him interviewed, he's also a really smart kid and by all accounts, he's wearing out the Jugs machines. He wants to be good. He wants to contribute. I think Massoquoi is ready to take the next step and be something of a #1 WR who CAN get deep. Keep in mind that there's really no dominant receiver in New Orleans or Green Bay... and there wasn't one in New England for years. Not everybody subscribes to the notion of a "true #1 WR." But I think Massoquoi can be our version of one. Robiskie's biggest struggle last year was that he played slow and couldn't get open. This year, he's faster because he's not thinking about his routes and adjustments. That said, he is what he is, a possession receiver... but he can be a very good one. Chansi Stuckey is a medium quality slot guy and they have some value. I think the wild card here isn't even listed as a WR... and it's Evan Moore. In two TE sets with Watson, he'll likely slot out and become a Dallas Clark type, or even a bigger Joe Jurevicious. If he and Mitchell step up, our weapons could look a lot better by the end of the year than we expected at the beginning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CLEVELandMILIDH Posted July 4, 2010 Report Share Posted July 4, 2010 Good stuff, and I agree but dont forget about Josh Cribb's. Steve Smith was nothing but a return man when he was introduced to Delhomme. I see Cribb's being a huge threat in the slot this year. God I cant wait till football season begins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shepwrite Posted July 4, 2010 Author Report Share Posted July 4, 2010 How do I delete that dupe of this thread? I couldn't find delete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaak Posted July 4, 2010 Report Share Posted July 4, 2010 I agree, fantastic opinion Shep. It is something I'm being guardedly very optimistic about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Browns57 Posted July 4, 2010 Report Share Posted July 4, 2010 Good stuff, and I agree but dont forget about Josh Cribb's. Steve Smith was nothing but a return man when he was introduced to Delhomme. I see Cribb's being a huge threat in the slot this year. God I cant wait till football season begins. Nobody here has forgotten about Cribbs but please don't compare him to one of the best recievers in the NFL. Josh Cribbs is a great return man and all around special teams player. But even Mangini has come out and said that Cribbs needs a lot of work on his route running. A guy who can't run routes well should never be compared to a guy who is double and even triple covered and just keeps finding a way to put up big numbers. Smith is a HOF wide reciever. Cribbs isn't, but of course I hope that he improves in this area. I would have limited my reciever analysis to the same guys that Shep did do to this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CLEVELandMILIDH Posted July 4, 2010 Report Share Posted July 4, 2010 Nobody here has forgotten about Cribbs but please don't compare him to one of the best recievers in the NFL. Josh Cribbs is a great return man and all around special teams player. But even Mangini has come out and said that Cribbs needs a lot of work on his route running. A guy who can't run routes well should never be compared to a guy who is double and even triple covered and just keeps finding a way to put up big numbers. Smith is a HOF wide reciever. Cribbs isn't, but of course I hope that he improves in this area. I would have limited my reciever analysis to the same guys that Shep did do to this. Maybe I wasnt very clear, I'm not comparing the player I'm comparing the path. Many great WR's got started returning kicks and work over time to becoming better route runners. So why cant I compare them? Scouts do it everyday, Mangini compared David Veikune to Teddy Bruschi for god sakes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NW Ohio Brownie Posted July 4, 2010 Report Share Posted July 4, 2010 Having a clear-cut #1 receiver is nowhere near as important as a clear-cut QB. That's not even debatable. This franchise had an excellent passing game in 2002 without a franchise receiver. We did have four solid receivers though. This current Browns team needs all of its existing guys to step up to get us to that 2002 level. And remember, that was the year Willie Green ran for 1,000. Which means the two often complement each other. With all the talk about Robiskie making the leap, I expect even more from MoMass. He had a very good rookie year despite the junk behind center. Now with someone who's at least proven behind center, Massaquoi can do and should do even more. BTW, Caplan thinks we'll have one of the best running games in the NFL? You think so, doctor? We were only 8th last year after taking the first half of the season off. A good running game? Really? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballpeen Posted July 5, 2010 Report Share Posted July 5, 2010 I agree Shep. I think we are pretty good at receiver. No doubt a Bolden would be nice, but you can't reach for guys like that because as you said, there are more guys who can run, catch, and jump then there are jobs. While you might not have one of the elite players, you can find 2-3 guys who are pretty damn good. I like what MoMass brings. He is fast enough. He is big enough to fight for balls and get high enough to grab jump balls. I never understood why Robiskie didn't flash anything last year. He has had pro level coaching since he was a kid. He has the necessary measurables, and he played against top competition in a top college football conference. It just defied all my logic to think the guy just sucked. So now, the reports are he is starting to look like the player we thought we drafted. I still don't see anything to make me think the kid can't be a solid NFL receiver. I think both he and MoMass will make a nice tandem even if we never bring in a 'elite" guy. I like Moore as well. The guy was Mr. Everything in California as a HS player. I think he is a bit out of position as a TE....he isn't really a classic TE....I think we will see him in the slot....i think he can be superduper there. No matter where he plays, it given the shot, he can catch 70 balls a season.....but no matter how you cut it, the only guys who catch 70 balls a season are guys who have it thrown to them at least 70 times. The key in all of this...well, two keys really, is how well our OL forms a barrier for our QB and then how well the QB delivers the ball. We added Pashos and the rook Lauvio(sp). If they can firm up the right side, I think we will be pretty good up front....I'd still like to see OL a top priority in the draft the next few seasons....It's hard to have to many top offensive linemen. Then we get to Jake and Senneca. I have always liked Jake. Even if he isn't the player he once was, he brings a toughness to the position. Taking Garcia out of the mix since he was totally misused and barely got his feet wet here, we have had total pussies at the QB position since our return. I think Jake is going to do well here for a year or two. I can't say much about Wallace since i can't say i have really seen him play a lot, but from what i have, he looks like a guy we can win behind. While our QB play isn't going to be pro-bowl level, I think we will get professional play from the position. It's been a while since we had that. I know you worry about the passing game, or at least feel it's a passing league. I have a feeling our passing game is going to be pretty darn good. It may not be Air Coryell, but it isn't going to be high school quality either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted July 5, 2010 Report Share Posted July 5, 2010 My hunch is, that Robo was "over-coached" by his Dad, and it took him time to be "re-programmed" with the Browns' offense. He is apparently doing great this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canton Mike Posted July 5, 2010 Report Share Posted July 5, 2010 My hunch is, that Robo was "over-coached" by his Dad, and it took him time to be "re-programmed" with the Browns' offense. He is apparently doing great this year. Interesting observation. I wanted this kid in the draft, & am anxious to see what he can do. I am VERY much looking forward to this season. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gafreleets Posted July 7, 2010 Report Share Posted July 7, 2010 every year i hear how optimitstic brown's fans are for the upcoming season. and every year the browns are in the poop cellar of the league. you won't be going anywhere untill holmgren gets mangina out of there and gets a real coach instead of a half crazy despot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rich4eagle Posted July 7, 2010 Report Share Posted July 7, 2010 How do I delete that dupe of this thread? I couldn't find delete. not to bother it will be irrelevant three games into the season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEraDawg Posted July 7, 2010 Report Share Posted July 7, 2010 every year i hear how optimitstic brown's fans are for the upcoming season. and every year the browns are in the poop cellar of the league. you won't be going anywhere untill holmgren gets mangina out of there and gets a real coach instead of a half crazy despot. Thanks for that very educational post there Nafreleets............ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cdl15 Posted July 8, 2010 Report Share Posted July 8, 2010 every year i hear how optimitstic brown's fans are for the upcoming season. and every year the browns are in the poop cellar of the league. you won't be going anywhere untill holmgren gets mangina out of there and gets a real coach instead of a half crazy despot. I wasn't a huge mangini fan when he came to cleveland. I though he was a band-aid on a broken arm. Everyone said hes not Holmgrens guy. And hes not! But you know what hes giving mangini a golden opportunity. If mangini makes it through his contract he won't be one of those new england coaches getting a gig. He will be a Homgren guy, and if not then he just simply fires him and goes and gets a guy like gruden with a team that is ready to win now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted July 8, 2010 Report Share Posted July 8, 2010 every year i hear how optimitstic brown's fans are for the upcoming season. and every year the browns are in the poop cellar of the league. you won't be going anywhere untill holmgren gets mangina out of there and gets a real coach instead of a half crazy despot. That's what Patriot fans were saying about Bill Belichick in 2000. There is no more half crazy despot than Mangini. I can think of another half crazy despot: his name appears on the NFL Championship Trophy: And speaking of half crazy despots who did pretty good: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yw7KijRfU-c...feature=related Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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