Lombardi: Haden struggled in camp

[Thaak]

i'm surprised florio isn't reporting that haden is the biggest bust ever and will never make a single tackle in the pros.

 

I don’t believe that Florio is an unabashed Browns or Mangini basher. He forms strong opinions, makes no bones that he is often wrong (doesn’t know anything about talent or how to make a team win), and often makes fun of people who do things to make fun of. That’s his style.

 

Florio does a lot of regurgitation of other people’s reports, and then blogs about what others are reporting.

 

So Florio regurgitating Lombardi does not mean its Florio’s opinion.

 

He’s also regurgitated and commented on positive reports.

 

[LouieLane]

Lombardi must be out his mind. Let's at least get in to training camp, full pads, and some hitting before we give up on Joe Haden. I'll admit that I wanted Earl Thomas with the pick...but on the night of the draft, it took me the drive from Shaker to Walton Hills to accept and get excited about Joe Haden at #7. This kid was considered one of the best, if not the best athlete on an incredibly talented Gator squad. And all the scouts and "experts" readily admit that Joe Haden has only scratched the surface of his potential at the CB position.

 

At the presser for round 1, Heckert was asked if it was difficult to choose between Kyle Wilson & Joe Haden, to which he immediately replied "NO"!! Will there be some growing pains, will he have to adjust to the speed of the pro game...absolutely. But to already surmise that he doesn't have the speed to play the position is asinine and for Lombardi to make such claims severely impeaches his credibility.

[samoth]

Lombardi is the only person in the media who is more anti-Mangini than Grossi. At least Tony G has a reason to be upset; after all, Mangini fired all the media leaks from the front office so now Tony has to actually do some work.

[Canton Mike]

Hey folks, LAY OFF Lombardi!!!...He's one HELL of a gossip columnist. You just don't know talent.

I wanted Haden from the start & am still excited about the young man, but what do any of us really know? Unlike some of these fools who write "facts" after a minicamp, I'll wait to see what happens with my OWN eyes.

Mike

[Sez.EJ]

Anyone playing on the Florida defense (especially the Secondary) has speed to burn or they would never touch the field. Lombardi is a joke. I guess that 4.4 he ran does not make him fast enough.

[shepwrite]

Thanks for clarifying things, Mr. Mills.

 

Also, I'd like to add that I agree with Mike Lombardi that Haden won't be a top ten pick.

 

I think he meant "shouldn't be." Wink, wink, JK, har-har.

[pizzadeliveryguy]

Anyone playing on the Florida defense (especially the Secondary) has speed to burn or they would never touch the field. Lombardi is a joke. I guess that 4.4 he ran does not make him fast enough.

While I don't put a lot of stock in 40 times, I can't see Mangini and Holmgren not seeing a lack of speed while watching a ton of tape on Haden. I hope Lombardi is just talking out of his ass because the group of Brown, Wright, and Haden at cb actually has me excited for the secondary prospects.

[SJ_Browns]

it's funny how nobody in the media who was actually at the browns otas said haden was slow. i'm sure if haden was slow, someone would've said something about this last month.

 

only a fool or someone with a hidden agenda would actually believe lombardi's story.

[Gips]

Something lombardi likely missed in his hatred of all things browns is that if a rookie isnt struggling than he isnt learning the "mangini way" coach insists on getting things down first and getting them right as opposed to making a big splash but at the cost of not following the program which is a big no-no with mangini..haden should be fine..and time will tell us all soon enough!

[The Hawg]

Mike Lombardi doesn't know if he is washing or hanging out! He is the one who started the rumor re: McCoy's "lack of arm strength." He is a Tebow apologist and had to tear McCoy down to make Tebow look NFL good. He did such a good job that he suckered that idiot head coach at Denver into drafting him in the first round. I find it ironic that reports are now being circulated that Tebow doesn't have the strongest arm in the world, either.

[CLEVELandMILIDH]

Joe Haden holdout seems likely

 

Posted by Mike Florio on July 20, 2010 11:43 PM ET

When Browns coach Eric Mangini appeared on Monday's edition of The Dan Patrick Show with a certain Internet hack with whom you may be familiar, Mangini expressed optimism that the team's top three draft picks -- cornerback Joe Haden, running back Montario Hardesty, and quarterback Colt McCoy -- would sign their contracts in time for camp. (We forgot to mention second-rounder T.J. Ward.)

 

But the rookies report Friday, and camp opens several days later. And while it's possible that Hardesty and McCoy will be signed, Haden's deal presents a couple of challenges.

 

For starters, Haden is represented by a relatively inexperienced agent, Malik Shareef. Then there's the fact that Haden is operating out of the same No. 7 overall slot occupied in 2009 by receiver Darrius Heyward-Bey, to whom the Raiders paid a whopper of a deal -- five years, with $23.5 million guaranteed.

 

The floor for Haden's deal will be set by another Raiders' top-ten pick, linebacker Rolando McClain. It would be foolish not to wait and see whether the Raiders do another foolish deal.

 

That said, Shareef said in June that Haden has no intention of holding out. To avoid a holdout, however, Haden and Shareef may have to leave a nice chunk of money on the table.

[samoth]

Ignore any Mike Florio article that contains the words "seems" "might" or "may".

 

Of course he'll hold out, hes a top 10 pick. That happens to every team every year.

[CLEVELandMILIDH]

I dont think he will, he might not have the contract done bye camp but I think he'll still be there.

[The Gipper]

Lombardi has no credibility? He's one of the few on TV that has a credible stance on everything football and he's only reporting what he was TOLD FYI. FeartheROO try not to shit the bed tonight first and foremost. Secondly the Steelers didn't have a lot of interest in Haden based on everything I read leading up to the draft. They too didn't like his speed and actually wanted Earl Thomas. Thomas was obviously drafted before their selection so Maurkice Pouncey was the next highest on the draft board. I would not have been happy with the Haden selection because I didn't feel he was any better than Kyle Wilson and Wilson went substantially later to the Jets. Wilson on the other hand has better size and speed and should do big things in New York. Soooooo no I don't bash the Browns just to Bash the Browns and when I do it's warranted. I'll send you some charmin wipes, just don't eat em okay?

 

 

No, sorry, Mike Lombardi is one of the least credible commentators around. He may or may not be right about Haden, but the fact is he is just one of those guys that throws a whole wheelbarrow of shit against the wall and hopes some of it sticks.

Again, who knows if this will stick or not. As for the Steelers not having interest in Haden....that is like saying the Browns had no interest in Ndamakong Suh. Yea, the Browns had no interest because they knew he wouldn't be there. Same with Haden.

[The Gipper]

However it's also important to acknowledge the propensity for NFL draft picks to bust, especially those coming out of the draft with question marks character related or skill related. He came from a big program where he excelled. He's also a tactician but speed kills in the NFL and if you can't be counted one in one on one coverage you become a liability. He could very well become a liability. HOWEVER he's also a rookie and that's obviously something everyone should take in to consideration. Lombardi is just doing his job and reporting what he was told and saw. There are people here calling for Haden to start opposite Wright and this may indicate he's in no way shape or form prepared to do so when the season begins. You can say "fvck his fat ass" but when it all bolis down he doesn't a pretty damn good job considering the company he keeps in his profession. He always does a great job with the draft just like Mike Mayock. It's a slow time right now but it would be foolish to just cast off what he says because you don't want to hear it.

 

 

So then, this entire analysis can apply to Maurkice Pouncey who came out of the same program and with even bigger issues, both skill and character related?

[shepwrite]

Lombardi says Haden is "struggling." OBR says he's "progressing" and will enter camp as "the third or fourth CB."

 

Same thing put different ways. Add in Mangini's very lukewarm review and the picture becomes not clear but less fuzzy: Haden didn't blow anybody away. The team seems more and more set on Wright and Brown as the starting corners.

 

Yes, it nice to not force a rookie into a starting job. But a corner picked #7 overall should make it impossible to NOT start him. I mean, if he's that much better than Kareem Jackson and Kyle Wilson, that much more value... how can you possibly sit him?

 

Bad pick. I acknowledge that it's early and I hope it ends happily... but that won't make it a shrewd use of assets. We could've moved around and taken one of the other two guys much later.

[The Gipper]

Let us not forget that Mike Lombardi has never had a good thing to say about the Browns, any of their players, owners, coaches, trainers, waterboys, or scouts since he was FIRED by the Browns for his incompetence.

If I recall correctly, it was Lombardi who was responsible for the drafting of the likes of Clifford Charlton and Mike Junkin.

That should tell you all you need to know about his talent evaluation skills.

 

[CLEVELandMILIDH]

Lombardi says Haden is "struggling." OBR says he's "progressing" and will enter camp as "the third or fourth CB."

 

Same thing put different ways. Add in Mangini's very lukewarm review and the picture becomes not clear but less fuzzy: Haden didn't blow anybody away. The team seems more and more set on Wright and Brown as the starting corners.

 

Yes, it nice to not force a rookie into a starting job. But a corner picked #7 overall should make it impossible to NOT start him. I mean, if he's that much better than Kareem Jackson and Kyle Wilson, that much more value... how can you possibly sit him?

 

Bad pick. I acknowledge that it's early and I hope it ends happily... but that won't make it a shrewd use of assets. We could've moved around and taken one of the other two guys much later.

 

Listen to the end of the D-Bowe interview I posted, I thought it was pretty telling of the situation. And he called him a beast

 

[shepwrite]

If he's a beast, he'll start and play really well. And I'd be thrilled.

[Thaak]

Lombardi says Haden is "struggling." OBR says he's "progressing" and will enter camp as "the third or fourth CB."

 

Same thing put different ways. Add in Mangini's very lukewarm review and the picture becomes not clear but less fuzzy: Haden didn't blow anybody away. The team seems more and more set on Wright and Brown as the starting corners.

 

Yes, it nice to not force a rookie into a starting job. But a corner picked #7 overall should make it impossible to NOT start him. I mean, if he's that much better than Kareem Jackson and Kyle Wilson, that much more value... how can you possibly sit him?

 

Bad pick. I acknowledge that it's early and I hope it ends happily... but that won't make it a shrewd use of assets. We could've moved around and taken one of the other two guys much later.

 

 

Shep, you are so biased and one-sided in your opinions it is ridiculous.

 

I don't care if its the #1 overall draft pick. If you are picking BPA, and you have two good players at that position already, then you expect the rookie to be the #3 or #4 going into camp. You EXPECT IT. If you don't, you're an idiot.

 

Stop with your biased-ness.

[The Gipper]

Lombardi says Haden is "struggling." OBR says he's "progressing" and will enter camp as "the third or fourth CB."

 

Same thing put different ways. Add in Mangini's very lukewarm review and the picture becomes not clear but less fuzzy: Haden didn't blow anybody away. The team seems more and more set on Wright and Brown as the starting corners.

 

Yes, it nice to not force a rookie into a starting job. But a corner picked #7 overall should make it impossible to NOT start him. I mean, if he's that much better than Kareem Jackson and Kyle Wilson, that much more value... how can you possibly sit him?

 

Bad pick. I acknowledge that it's early and I hope it ends happily... but that won't make it a shrewd use of assets. We could've moved around and taken one of the other two guys much later.

 

 

You know what: Wouldn't it be better to actually see him play in some real games for a couple of years before making knee jerk evaluations like "bad pick". You have no clue any more than I do if he is going to work out. So, Lighten up Francis.

[Thaak]

You know what: Wouldn't it be better to actually see him play in some real games for a couple of years before making knee jerk evaluations like "bad pick". You have no clue any more than I do if he is going to work out. So, Lighten up Francis.

 

What!?? No way! Why the hell would we want to do that?!

[shepwrite]

Shep, you are so biased and one-sided in your opinions it is ridiculous.

 

I don't care if its the #1 overall draft pick. If you are picking BPA, and you have two good players at that position already, then you expect the rookie to be the #3 or #4 going into camp. You EXPECT IT. If you don't, you're an idiot.

 

Stop with your biased-ness.

 

I don't get it. If I have a strong opinion that disagrees with your strong opinion, only one of us is "biased?"

 

That doesn't make any sense. I think you're saying that HAVING a strong opinion is biased?

 

If Joe Haden does something positive, like has a great preseason game or gets a great camp review, I won't be trying to spin it. I WANT him to be good. I'm no Lumbergh and never have been. I'd much rather win than be right.

 

But I don't by rote endorse every single thing the Browns. That sounds dull. And disagreement is good.

[shepwrite]

You know what: Wouldn't it be better to actually see him play in some real games for a couple of years before making knee jerk evaluations like "bad pick". You have no clue any more than I do if he is going to work out. So, Lighten up Francis.

 

Semantic breakdown.

 

I didn't say bad player. I said bad pick. That was my opinion heading into the draft, immediately after the draft, and now.

 

And all that said, he's a Brown now and I want him to do good. I actually would love to be wrong. But right now, today, I don't feel wrong, Francis.

[NewEraDawg]

I believe anyone taken in the first ten spots in the draft need to make a difference in the first year to be worth it . Can't judge him either way till we see him play .

 

Talking heads be damned .

[shepwrite]

I believe anyone taken in the first ten spots in the draft need to make a difference in the first year to be worth it . Can't judge him either way till we see him play .

 

Talking heads be damned .

 

I pretty much agree with that all the way around. The proof will be in the season. If you're looking for a player to develop at corner... you don't need to use a #7 pick on that.

 

Then again, if he ends up a perennial Pro Bowler, it's all good anyway.

 

But if we held up on discussing stuff until it was appropriate, we'd never talk about anything!

[Unsympathetic]

"disagreement is good"

 

Disagreement is good... IF AND ONLY IF your thought process is logical. Simply asserting that you have "a point" does not make it so.

 

 

1) Lombardi has ZERO sources. He's simply posting the same gratuitous nonsense that was available before the draft.

 

Yes, Haden had bad advisors prior to running at the combine.. take that as a clear indication that your posture affects your speed. Shocking! This isn't Faux News -- Haden's speed is just fine, as shown throughout the entire last college season AND his pro day.

 

2) Lombardi openly has a personal feud with Mangini.. but you take his article as truth OVER the statements from the Browns? On what planet is that a good idea?

 

 

Shep, you're quite simply wrong. There is no proof to any of Lombardi's claims. Drop it.

[Thaak]

I pretty much agree with that all the way around. The proof will be in the season. If you're looking for a player to develop at corner... you don't need to use a #7 pick on that.

 

Then again, if he ends up a perennial Pro Bowler, it's all good anyway.

 

But if we held up on discussing stuff until it was appropriate, we'd never talk about anything!

 

That’s your canned excuse Shep.

 

Discussion, at any time, is of course good. I’m no quibbling with that.

 

Its your modus operandi I have an issue with.

 

[The Gipper]

Semantic breakdown.

 

I didn't say bad player. I said bad pick. That was my opinion heading into the draft, immediately after the draft, and now.

 

And all that said, he's a Brown now and I want him to do good. I actually would love to be wrong. But right now, today, I don't feel wrong, Francis.

 

 

OK then, how about we agree just to wait and see how he does before jumping to conclusions.

Also: you will get a prize if you can identify the "Francis" reference.

[shepwrite]

"disagreement is good"

 

Disagreement is good... IF AND ONLY IF your thought process is logical. Simply asserting that you have "a point" does not make it so.

 

 

1) Lombardi has ZERO sources. He's simply posting the same gratuitous nonsense that was available before the draft.

 

Yes, Haden had bad advisors prior to running at the combine.. take that as a clear indication that your posture affects your speed. Shocking! This isn't Faux News -- Haden's speed is just fine, as shown throughout the entire last college season AND his pro day.

 

2) Lombardi openly has a personal feud with Mangini.. but you take his article as truth OVER the statements from the Browns? On what planet is that a good idea?

 

 

Shep, you're quite simply wrong. There is no proof to any of Lombardi's claims. Drop it.

 

Drop it? Uhhh... bite me?

 

I think it was a bad pick. Signs are that he didn't shine in camp (Kareem Jackson DID). It's absolutely a valid point. You just don't like it.

 

Now drop it.