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Next 2 games are key for Kyle Orton's future with Bears


Earle

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Chicago already has 2 inconsistent, wildly erratic qbs.

If I owned that team and the gm brought in DA I'd fire his ass.

 

 

Or your ass would get fired, .......but on second take Savage can always blame Braylon Edwards, for drop off in DA's production do to dropped passes.

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Or your ass would get fired, .......but on second take Savage can always blame Braylon Edwards, for drop off in DA's production do to dropped passes.

And who is going to fire the owner?

Not my point.

Orton and Grossman COULD be solid qbs like DA and both HAVE POTENTIAL.

NEITHER have consistency

Even with the drops, DA was still inconsistant.

All DA could beat were sub .500 teams, it's kind of like being a 5th grader beating up Retarded kindergartners and as soon as GOOD teams got put on the schedule he got his ass handed to him .

As soon as he got put up against a schedule of GOOD teams he started losing.

And don't tell me all of Edward's drops were on Edwards. You see how most of them happened? He looked like he was bracing himself to get killed because Dumb Ass was still hanging him out to dry, JUST LIKE Moss in Oakland. Now would Edwards make the turn around with given a decent qb? I don't know, he may be damaged goods from here on out.

 

 

 

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I predict McNabb stays in Philly ....other than that, I have no clue.

I agree...and this goes back to the thread I did on FA QBs. I think NE ends up TAGGING Cassel, forcing a 1st and 3rd out of somebody...and that may push the price a bit too high for most. He is, after all, nothing more than what DA was LAST YEAR. A one year wonder...and DA's numbers blew his away on a much worse team.

 

Sorry, don't see the Cassel love. It just doesn't make sense to me to hype a guy who has done decent on LAST YEARS SUPER BOWL RUNNER UP...and only for one year...when we all saw what happened to DA after his one year of greatness.

Besides which, I also showed that Cassel has not done well against anyone ranked above 20th in pass defense...so big deal.

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Would'nt it be NORMAL if the Browns traded Anderson and he ended up somewhere 2nd string, then after an injury, got his chance and turned into a franchise star ???? Maybe it's the lesson learned backwards - seen the worst, do the opposite and career takes off.

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Here is what I posted about the QB's on the market this year:

 

FA QB's and likely situations:

 

Kurt Warner - He will be resigned, or franchise tagged at the very least.

 

Matt Cassel - Depends on Tom Brady and his progress with his knee. We know that Brady had staph in the knee following surgery...so it depends on how fast he recovers. I figure he hits the market and the Patriots go after one of the other FA guys if they believe Brady is coming back at all next year.

 

Jeff Garcia - Tampa Bay is in no position to let Garcia get away. They were NOT winning with Garcia out...and Garcia is not going to cost THAT much to keep. He won't be hitting the market.

 

Rex Grossman - He has finally become what most thought he was...a career backup. He actually might be a good pickup for New England.

 

Kyle Boller - Also a career backup. Nobody is going to waste much on him...and if he is healthy he may also be tagged by New England.

 

Charlie Batch - He is going into his 12th season and coming off injury. I wouldn't be surprised to see him not get any interest until after the season starts.

 

J.P.Losman - Another career backup as of now. He has no arm strength, and has looked terrible in backup to Edwards. However, he is young enough (will be 28) and has starting experience. He will get looks, but again, no starting slots will be offered.

 

Patrick Ramsay - He was a late pickup last time...he will be a late pickup this time. Roster filler.

 

Other NON-FA QB's discussed:

 

Matt Leinart - Not going anywhere. He signed a 6yr deal in 2006 and won't be a FA until 2012. He is only $1.1m in 2009, and $2.485m in 2010. That means they can easily afford BOTH him and Warner.

 

As I said...I don't think Philly can dump Mcnabb...not with Kolb looking bad and the only QB in the wings. In Chicago...Grossman has run his course...so they will be looking for another guy for sure...just not sure if they think Orlavsky is the answer or if they go for competition.

 

Minnesota is going to be aggressive. I think they may just go DA...they have the ideal setup for him.

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minnesota's future plans definitely depend on how tavaris jackson does for the rest of the year. they've got him starting again, and he looked good in an absolute thrashing of the cardinals last week. for our sake, we need to hope he loses games on his own for them, 2 INTs returned for TDs or something else ridiculous. if he plays well, he goes into 2009 as their starter.

 

if his play is mediocre, then anderson has a chance to go there.

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I think the McNabb/Vikings thing happens. He wants it and they want it. Just a gut, though.

 

Cassell is read hot whether you agree with it or not. He's playing better every week, he's healthy, he's 25, he's 6'4", he's strong-armed, and now he's experienced. He will NOT go back to being a backup and New England WILL move him, one way or the other. No doubt about it. If they franchise him, it will be to set up a trade, not pay him Top 5 QB money.

 

Just assume one job opening will be filled by Cassell. There isn't one GM on earth who would rather have Anderson. Not one.

 

And as I've said before, watch out for a Leinart move. I think teams would trade a higher pick for Leinart right now than for Anderson. If you polled NFL GMs, I'm convinced you'd get an overwhelming majority for Leinart.

 

If we get a third round pick for him, I'll be stunned.

 

I agree Cassel will fill a spot...I just don't get the love. When you look at him....he has DA stats. He does well against crap teams...but shits the bed against good ones....and he has a better surrounding team than DA did....just my opinion.

 

As for Leinart. I don't see a single reason why Arizona would even consider moving him. He is cheap...good insurance...and Warner isn't exactly a spring chicken...and in fact considered retirement earlier this year. Other teams may be interested in him...but there is NO MOTIVATION for Arizona to move him.

 

As for McNabb...if Philly misses the playoffs...sure, Minny might happen...but if they are in it again (and I think they make it) I don't see McNabb going anywhere.

 

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Shep, I agree 100% with you on Cassel's future.

 

And as I've said before, watch out for a Leinart move. I think teams would trade a higher pick for Leinart right now than for Anderson. If you polled NFL GMs, I'm convinced you'd get an overwhelming majority for Leinart.

 

I don't see this happening. IMO, the Warner/Leinart thing is kind of like your poor-man's (or homeless man's) Favre/Rodgers thing at this point.

 

I've never read where AZ is considering getting rid of Leinart, and Leinart knows Warner isn't going to play forever.

 

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As for Cassel. I disagree with John. Cassels stock is high NOW. just like DA's was at the end of last year. I don't doubt that NE tags him for that 1st and 3rd ( as we should have with DA), but someone will pay that price.

 

Cassell has a long way to go to get mentioned up with DA.

 

His 18 TD passes are about a third of what Tom Brady had last year with the same team.

 

And I didn't see Cassell on the Pro Bowl list either.

 

Where he's at next year depends on Tom Brady's recovery.

 

 

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I think the McNabb/Vikings thing happens. He wants it and they want it. Just a gut, though.

 

Cassell is read hot whether you agree with it or not. He's playing better every week, he's healthy, he's 25, he's 6'4", he's strong-armed, and now he's experienced. He will NOT go back to being a backup and New England WILL move him, one way or the other. No doubt about it. If they franchise him, it will be to set up a trade, not pay him Top 5 QB money.

 

Just assume one job opening will be filled by Cassell. There isn't one GM on earth who would rather have Anderson. Not one.

 

And as I've said before, watch out for a Leinart move. I think teams would trade a higher pick for Leinart right now than for Anderson. If you polled NFL GMs, I'm convinced you'd get an overwhelming majority for Leinart.

 

If we get a third round pick for him, I'll be stunned.

 

if there's one thing we know about shep it's that he not afraid to make bold predictions that are completely off base.

 

Here's some real truths:

 

McNabb likely will stay in Philly.

 

Cassell has done about half of what Anderson did, and did it on a MUCH better team.

 

Leinart isn't on anybody's radar at all.

 

 

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Here's some real truths:

 

McNabb likely will stay in Philly.

 

Cassell has done about half of what Anderson did, and did it on a MUCH better team.

 

Leinart isn't on anybody's radar at all.

I agree 100%.

 

Cassel's value is probably still pretty high (as others mentioned) in the QB starved NFL. But I still think he hasn't proven anything based on the level of defenses he played and the way he shat the bed against good defenses. The next 2 weeks he goes against 2 more shitty pass defenses...so he will continue to look like a god...but even if they make the playoffs they will be one and done as all the AFC playoff teams outside of Denver have very good pass defenses.

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Guest Masters
Sorry, don't see the Cassel love. It just doesn't make sense to me to hype a guy who has done decent on LAST YEARS SUPER BOWL RUNNER UP...and only for one year...when we all saw what happened to DA after his one year of greatness.

Besides which, I also showed that Cassel has not done well against anyone ranked above 20th in pass defense...so big deal.

 

Do you not remember Rob Johnson and Matt Shuab? There stock jumped pretty darn high doing a lot less than Cassel has done.

 

No way will they Franchise tag Cassel. That would cost NE way to much money if they couldn't move him. Might give him the restricted tag, but even that might be a bit pricy. Cassel's value could change even more if NE makes the playoffs and they win in the first round.

 

 

 

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Guest Masters
Cassell has a long way to go to get mentioned up with DA.

 

His 18 TD passes are about a third of what Tom Brady had last year with the same team.

 

And I didn't see Cassell on the Pro Bowl list either.

 

Where he's at next year depends on Tom Brady's recovery.

 

:rolleyes: DA has proven to be who he is after 20+ starts. Cassel hasn't.

 

I didn't see Cassel look like a bad QB in the pro bowl last year either.

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Guest Masters
Oh, and NO... Anderson's situation last year wasn't worse than anybody's anywhere any time. He had perfect protection, a 1,300 yard rusher, and two Pro Bowl pass catchers.

 

Cassel has a better passer rating than Anderson, but the most important stat is his completion percentage of about 64. Anderson's completion percentage has been stuck in the 50s and it tells you something about his accuracy, which is really troubling.

 

Cassel is hot property right now and Anderson is not.

 

Shhhhhhh...... no one wants to hear that...

 

Cassel has also beat 2 teams that might make the playoffs. Something DA didn't do.

 

Oh, and John, you noted Cassel hasn't beat a team with a D in the top 20, but that isn't true. MIA's D is ranked 8th, but he lit them up for 415 yards and 3 TDs in the second meeting. A sign of learning. Something DA never did.

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Here's a nice blog on Leinart's situation, where he'll be very expensive for AZ to keep if they give Warner an extension:

 

http://28sherman.blogspot.com/2008/11/wher...art-end-up.html

Shep...please...

 

Here is Leinarts contract:

 

8/14/2006: Signed a six-year, $50.8 million contract. The deal contains $14 million in guarantees, including a $7.575 million option bonus in the second year. 2008: $735,000, 2009: $1.11 million, 2010: $2.485 million, 2011: $7.36 million, 2012: Free Agent

 

so he costs AZ just under $3.6M for the NEXT 2 YEARS!!! That is dirt cheap for a backup with his potential. The decision is AZ isn't coming until the end of 2010.

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On top of that, they JUST payed Leinart a $7.85M bonus this past offseason. They are going to want a big return on that money...and that means Matt can hold the clipboard for a couple of more years without complaining.

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Guest 88fingerslewy
I see a good chance that DA may be traded to St Lous Rams. They are in need of a NFL experience quarterback someone not too old but can hold down the job while they try to improve the team.
I think so too. Not only that, based on the Rams record, you'll get an early pick in whatever you round you trade for. I've thought St.Louis all along. We'll see.
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trading him to st. louis would be great. they're abysmal. even a fourth from them is practically a third. what i don't understand is why they'd want him. bulger is practically the same QB, and it seems like the fans and media in st. louis have soured on him.

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Something about contracts I don't get, and maybe you know, John: Why does it seem like EVERYBODY is a f/a after year 4? Is Leinart not a free agent until after year six? Why would he do that?

 

But if that's the whole story, you're right: He's trapped for two more seasons. And that would be another WEIRD situation. You rarely see a first round pick get so little on-field time to develop. Leinart looked really strong as his rookie year progressed, then he was on a very short leash with Wisenhunt. You get the sense they like each other as much as Crennel and Quinn.

 

Top of round 1 guys get 5-6 year contracts. Everyone else gets 3-4 yr contracts.

 

Leinart signed a huge 6 year deal in '06...meaning his FA is 2012.

 

Quinn on the other hand signed a 5 yr deal in '07...so he goes FA in 2012 as well. Think about Quinns contract...is he never makes more than $700k as his base. The rest was all bonus driven.

 

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Guest 88fingerslewy
trading him to st. louis would be great. they're abysmal. even a fourth from them is practically a third. what i don't understand is why they'd want him. bulger is practically the same QB, and it seems like the fans and media in st. louis have soured on him.
It's just a hunch about the Rams but in todays pro sports and the egos out there, someone might think "I'll coach 'em up right" and they'll take a chance. Because DA's young, someone will probably want to give him a good look in their system. Who knows. Wishful thinking. His rostor bonus might be roadblock though. I'm not sure but doesn't the obligation of the bonus land with the team he's on in March?
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It's just a hunch about the Rams but in todays pro sports and the egos out there, someone might think "I'll coach 'em up right" and they'll take a chance. Because DA's young, someone will probably want to give him a good look in their system. Who knows. Wishful thinking. His rostor bonus might be roadblock though. I'm not sure but doesn't the obligation of the bonus land with the team he's on in March?

 

Anderson's 5 mil roster bonus is peanuts compared to the 27 mil guaranteed in Bulger's 65 mil contract.

 

Contrary to common belief, Anderson's roster bonus probably won't be much of a factor in whether he is traded or not. It depends a lot more on if the new coach likes him or not.

 

...cue shep claiming that DA will get cut and betting his left teste on it. This spring shep's nickname will become "ONE-NUT"

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Top of round 1 guys get 5-6 year contracts. Everyone else gets 3-4 yr contracts.

 

Leinart signed a huge 6 year deal in '06...meaning his FA is 2012.

 

Quinn on the other hand signed a 5 yr deal in '07...so he goes FA in 2012 as well. Think about Quinns contract...is he never makes more than $700k as his base. The rest was all bonus driven.

 

Butchie used to push for 6 year deals on rooks and it really pissed people off.

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Anderson's 5 mil roster bonus is peanuts compared to the 27 mil guaranteed in Bulger's 65 mil contract.

 

Contrary to common belief, Anderson's roster bonus probably won't be much of a factor in whether he is traded or not. It depends a lot more on if the new coach likes him or not.

I would agree with you somewhat, but the NEW guy is going to have until March 1st to make that decision...which means all he has to go on is film...and over the past 18 games that is not very flattering for DA.

 

Another factor is that in 2010 his contract balloons up to $7.45M with a $2M bonus...compared to the $700k per year for BQ.

 

With us needing SEVERAL players...his contact money (and bonus) will go a long way to landing some top FA's and signing our 1st round draftee.

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Anderson's 5 mil roster bonus is peanuts compared to the 27 mil guaranteed in Bulger's 65 mil contract.

 

Contrary to common belief, Anderson's roster bonus probably won't be much of a factor in whether he is traded or not. It depends a lot more on if the new coach likes him or not.

 

...cue shep claiming that DA will get cut and betting his left teste on it. This spring shep's nickname will become "ONE-NUT"

 

Looks like you're willing to bet Anderson is on our 2009 roster.

 

The fact is we're not paying his base $1.45 million salary plus the $5 million (correct?) roster bonus for 2009 for a backup QB. DA's (READ: your) saving grace here is that even though Romeo has named Quinn his 2009 starter, he isn't going to get the opportunity to do so unless he plays fantasy football. One never knows...perhaps the new coach will like DA better. But, if said new coach has a brain, he will not.

 

Bottom line: DA won't be here, and the reason is mostly financial. He'd be a serviceable backup.

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Anderson's 5 mil roster bonus is peanuts compared to the 27 mil guaranteed in Bulger's 65 mil contract.

bulger's contract is a monster, and he only signed it last summer. he's still got four seasons after this one on it. no way they can move him or really even justify benching him, so i don't really see a chance that the rams take DA off our hands.

 

that was some short-lived hope.

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In all probability, DA will be given the chance to negotiate a trade from the beginning...with the understanding that he will be re-negotiating his contract with any team that wants him. There is less than $15M remaining on DA's contact...and that would be a VERY affordable 5yr deal for some other club.

 

The Browns also have the ability to restructure his contract and avoid the $5M bonus on March 1...and that would give them MORE leverage to get a decent trade out of it.

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