MLD Woody Posted May 15, 2012 Report Posted May 15, 2012 Here is the article This will totally work. Cuz you know, not talking about things makes them not exist. That's why states that teach abstinence only sex ed have such low teen pregnancy rates..... oh wait.
Westside Steve Posted May 15, 2012 Report Posted May 15, 2012 Here is the article This will totally work. Cuz you know, not talking about things makes them not exist. That's why states that teach abstinence only sex ed have such low teen pregnancy rates..... oh wait. Lest we kid ourselves does anyone think that the high rate of teenage pregnancy is due to lack of education? Was it or is it a good idea to lessen the social stigma of illegitimate birth? Have the laws that make this easier and thereby more prevalent a net plus or minus for society regardless of religion? WSS
MLD Woody Posted May 15, 2012 Author Report Posted May 15, 2012 There is a higher rate of teen pregnancy in states with higher levels of abstinence education. That's a fact you can argue whether that's a cause and effect or just a correlation but I'm going cause and effect
VaporTrail Posted May 15, 2012 Report Posted May 15, 2012 Lest we kid ourselves does anyone think that the high rate of teenage pregnancy is due to lack of education? Was it or is it a good idea to lessen the social stigma of illegitimate birth? Have the laws that make this easier and thereby more prevalent a net plus or minus for society regardless of religion? WSS If I recall, those states that have abstinence only education have higher rates of teen pregnancies. The Christian right likes demonizing sex, which is a fruitless endeavor. I mean, "why don't we just tell them that premarital sex was a sin? Surely that'll stop them from doing the deed." I just really don't get that mentality. It doesn't work and they're unwilling to let it go. You teach people how to have safe sex, and you'll actually see results.
Mr. T Posted May 15, 2012 Report Posted May 15, 2012 Sounds like a job that is best left up to the parents to do than having the state meddling into the personal lives of families. Who cares about some libtards opinion is on these matters when these same people believe that homosexuality, beastiality, incest and NAMBLA are normal and cool.
MLD Woody Posted May 15, 2012 Author Report Posted May 15, 2012 It's not an opinion that abstinence only ed doesn't work, it's got data to back it up. Prove anything at the end you just said
calfoxwc Posted May 15, 2012 Report Posted May 15, 2012 Data is worthless - it's information that is important. For instance, when did the states start emphasizing abstinence? AFTER teen pregnancy was a problem? If so, it's foolish to simply assume.
DieHardBrownsFan Posted May 15, 2012 Report Posted May 15, 2012 No matter what education they provide in school, kids hormones will always prevail in the end. There will always be girls getting pregnant, etc. I think it is a fact however, that the more educated (not "sexually educated") the kid is, the less likely for this to happen. Because the kid is already intelligent and realizes that getting a girl knocked up/or getting pregnant, isn't a good idea for my future at this age. Does that mean they don't have sex? Hell no. They use condoms, birth control, whatever. They also stay quiet. Just my 2cents.
calfoxwc Posted May 15, 2012 Report Posted May 15, 2012 More accurately, reading, etc, data - means nothing. Accurately making the data mean something = information. Like, a bunch of numbers. Means nothin. Graph, etc, the numbers, show conclusions - and if accurately shown - that's information. That's all I meant. Teens, generally, will always be driven to fool around a bit... or a lot. Abstitence is fine to teach, the parents can teach about safety coping if they ever do. Something has to be done to stop the teaching of kindergarden kids stuff about sex, they aren't ready for that. it's a liberal adult fantasy that they "feel" it is necessary at those ages. It's stupid.
Westside Steve Posted May 15, 2012 Report Posted May 15, 2012 No matter, I think your point is incorrect anyway. I think the highest percentage of unwed teen mothers is in the inner city black community. None of those major urban school systems seem to be all that into Bible belt abstinence programs. WSS
Lady Z Posted May 15, 2012 Report Posted May 15, 2012 The new law helps define the existing Abstinence-only sex education. Wild guess - they don't want planned parenthood teaching girls and boys to have anal, or oral sex and trolling for abortions. Good gravy! The teachers union and Planned parenthood are against it. I wonder what the parents think about defining the law - um - you can probably find that information from the state house. TN has the 7th highest teen birth rate. OK one of you kids can look up the data by state and by year for teen pregnancy rate, teen birth rate, teen adoption rate, and teen abortion rate. Go back about 15 years, though data may only be available from 2009 and back. Also see if you can identify states with an abstinence only policy. You can't just post an article from Reuters with 30 sentences in it and expect to have an intelligent discussion until you have your data. Off you go, Woody.
VaporTrail Posted May 15, 2012 Report Posted May 15, 2012 No matter, I think your point is incorrect anyway. I think the highest percentage of unwed teen mothers is in the inner city black community. None of those major urban school systems seem to be all that into Bible belt abstinence programs. WSS How many of the kids who get knocked up are actually going to school? Truancy is a far bigger issue in the inner city. It doesn't matter what curriculum you plan on teaching if you have students whose parents couldn't give a single fuck about them.
MLD Woody Posted May 16, 2012 Author Report Posted May 16, 2012 The new law helps define the existing Abstinence-only sex education. Wild guess - they don't want planned parenthood teaching girls and boys to have anal, or oral sex and trolling for abortions. Good gravy! The teachers union and Planned parenthood are against it. I wonder what the parents think about defining the law - um - you can probably find that information from the state house. TN has the 7th highest teen birth rate. OK one of you kids can look up the data by state and by year for teen pregnancy rate, teen birth rate, teen adoption rate, and teen abortion rate. Go back about 15 years, though data may only be available from 2009 and back. Also see if you can identify states with an abstinence only policy. You can't just post an article from Reuters with 30 sentences in it and expect to have an intelligent discussion until you have your data. Off you go, Woody. Yo Abstinence-Only Education and Teen Pregnancy Rates: Why We Need Comprehensive Sex Education in the U.S\ This is the data you wanted Cal, if any of this confuses you just let me know and I'll help explain it
MLD Woody Posted May 16, 2012 Author Report Posted May 16, 2012 More accurately, reading, etc, data - means nothing. Accurately making the data mean something = information. Like, a bunch of numbers. Means nothin. Graph, etc, the numbers, show conclusions - and if accurately shown - that's information. That's all I meant. Teens, generally, will always be driven to fool around a bit... or a lot. Abstitence is fine to teach, the parents can teach about safety coping if they ever do. Something has to be done to stop the teaching of kindergarden kids stuff about sex, they aren't ready for that. it's a liberal adult fantasy that they "feel" it is necessary at those ages. It's stupid. So... you only like data when it is telling you what you want to hear, lol. That's not how it works. You get a bunch of numbers, through tests, polls, whatever, and you use that to draw a conclusion, if any can be made. You can't expect people to just tell you everything before hand, you actually have to be able to read the numbers for yourself... "Making the data mean something" sounds like taking the numbers, bending them as far as you can, and then trying to get them to support you beliefs. and I don't think anyone is talking about teaching sex ed to kindergarten kids... this isn't South Park
Westside Steve Posted May 16, 2012 Report Posted May 16, 2012 and I don't think anyone is talking about teaching sex ed to kindergarten kids... But, perhaps just to play the devil's advocate, why not? What's the downside of getting kids prepared at an early age? WSS
VaporTrail Posted May 16, 2012 Report Posted May 16, 2012 and I don't think anyone is talking about teaching sex ed to kindergarten kids... But, perhaps just to play the devil's advocate, why not? What's the downside of getting kids prepared at an early age? WSS I don't see one. Some of them start screwing in grade school, anyways.
MLD Woody Posted May 16, 2012 Author Report Posted May 16, 2012 and I don't think anyone is talking about teaching sex ed to kindergarten kids... But, perhaps just to play the devil's advocate, why not? What's the downside of getting kids prepared at an early age? WSS Because that's way too early for them to understand what's going on? Boys and girls aren't really attracted to each other yet? Boys can't ejaculate and girls don't have their periods and therefore no one can get pregnant? They need to be working on reading and math and stuff? Be devils advocate all you want, just say half way intelligent things
VaporTrail Posted May 16, 2012 Report Posted May 16, 2012 Because that's way too early for them to understand what's going on? Boys and girls aren't really attracted to each other yet? Boys can't ejaculate and girls don't have their periods and therefore no one can get pregnant? They need to be working on reading and math and stuff? Be devils advocate all you want, just say half way intelligent things Disagree. Might be too early for you to have seen shit like that at your age, but as a white, suburban kid your parents probably taught you lessons and sheltered you from things that you take for granted. I dated a girl who taught kids on the west side of Dayton and she'd tell me about how little some parents gave a fuck. It was disturbing. Hell, I remember when I was in first grade and there was a girl who was younger than me who would go to the woods at the back of my apartment complex and play with the boys' dicks.
MLD Woody Posted May 16, 2012 Author Report Posted May 16, 2012 Disagree. Might be too early for you to have seen shit like that at your age, but as a white, suburban kid your parents probably taught you lessons and sheltered you from things that you take for granted. I dated a girl who taught kids on the west side of Dayton and she'd tell me about how little some parents gave a fuck. It was disturbing ng. Hell, I remember when I was in first grade and there was a girl who was younger than me who would go to the woods at the back of my apartment complex and play with the boys' dicks. Well I hope that's an extreme case. And in that situation the parents should do something. I doubt you could get sex ed in kindergarten though. But you're right, in suburbs like this is definitely not needed.
Lady Z Posted May 16, 2012 Report Posted May 16, 2012 Yo Abstinence-Only Education and Teen Pregnancy Rates: Why We Need Comprehensive Sex Education in the U.S\ This is the data you wanted Cal, if any of this confuses you just let me know and I'll help explain it Hey Woody, I'm reading it. Thanks! Good work! I'll get back to you.
Lady Z Posted May 16, 2012 Report Posted May 16, 2012 Still reading the report. Thanks again. Very interesting. Have you read it?
MLD Woody Posted May 16, 2012 Author Report Posted May 16, 2012 Still reading the report. Thanks again. Very interesting. Have you read it? Some of it. I started work today. There now actually
ballpeen Posted May 17, 2012 Report Posted May 17, 2012 I don't see the problem with it, and I live here in Tennessee. They really need to hammer it home with the girls at a young age. Face it, guys have Roman hands and Russian fingers and that isn't going to change. What needs to change with them is a Mama or Daddy to slap the crap out of Jr if he doesn't act as a Gentleman. Girls at a young age react to reason. Guys don't, at a young age they only react to pain. It's why a generation of young men has been lost. To much Sesame Street reasoning crap with them. Now days, rather than a good licking, we place maybe 30% of young males on mind altering drugs or kick them out of school to keep them in line. No wonder most guys in this generation are a bunch of sissies. We made them that way because we didn't straighten them out the centuries old tested way....lick them with a switch when they acted up. I know. I am old school. Men and women aren't the same. You have to use the methods that work. Boys, you know the method. For girls, swatting them doesn't work, but if you can shame them or embarrass them, you'll get a change in behavior. They hate that. Dogs and cats.
Lady Z Posted May 17, 2012 Report Posted May 17, 2012 Interesting study. The researcher assigned levels of abstinence taught in sex education based on state laws. However, in Tennessee we know that abstinence only sex education included teaching anal and oral sex to avoid pregnancy, and people from Planned Parenthood visited the schools and instructed the kids. That was no abstinence only program. Since the new law has defined abstinence only sex education the data collected for a space of time, say 5 years out, should be collected and analyzed. Clearly, at least in Tennessee, abstinence only was not taught before the new law. Therefore we know that even though the state law said abstinence only sex education, that that was not necessarily the lesson delivered. I think it is not enough to look at state law to determine what is actually being taught. However, the study showed that in states where abstinence only laws were on the books teen pregnancy rate was higher than in states with comprehensive sex education. Though the numbers per 1000 teens was the difference between a rate of 57 for comprehensive sex education and a rate of 75 out of a thousand for abstinence only sex education. The birth rates were also divided by white, black and Hispanic populations. Whites had the lowest birth rate, blacks were higher and Hispanic birth rates were the highest. I believe this is partly related to culture, but that was not part of the analysis. The sample of students taking their SAT test, where college education was planned, had the highest abortion rates, but this rate was not correlated with sex education. The author stressed that we should be more like Europe, where teen pregnancy rates per 1000 were as low as 25. I believe that the culture of European countries was not a variable considered in that comparison with the USA.
Lady Z Posted May 17, 2012 Report Posted May 17, 2012 I don't see the problem with it, and I live here in Tennessee. They really need to hammer it home with the girls at a young age. Face it, guys have Roman hands and Russian fingers and that isn't going to change. What needs to change with them is a Mama or Daddy to slap the crap out of Jr if he doesn't act as a Gentleman. Girls at a young age react to reason. Guys don't, at a young age they only react to pain. It's why a generation of young men has been lost. To much Sesame Street reasoning crap with them. Now days, rather than a good licking, we place maybe 30% of young males on mind altering drugs or kick them out of school to keep them in line. No wonder most guys in this generation are a bunch of sissies. We made them that way because we didn't straighten them out the centuries old tested way....lick them with a switch when they acted up. I know. I am old school. Men and women aren't the same. You have to use the methods that work. Boys, you know the method. For girls, swatting them doesn't work, but if you can shame them or embarrass them, you'll get a change in behavior. They hate that. Dogs and cats. I think you've got a strong point about drugging boys in school to make them more like girls. Also, taking away competitiveness, in sports, where everybody is a "winner" further feminizes boys. When little boys are not allowed to play cowboys and Indians, or cops and robbers, or rough and tumble, or even dodge ball, they might as well just play with dolls.
Lady Z Posted May 18, 2012 Report Posted May 18, 2012 Hey Woody, did you see my comment about the research study? Post #27. BTW, how is it going on the job?
VaporTrail Posted May 20, 2012 Report Posted May 20, 2012 Interesting study. The researcher assigned levels of abstinence taught in sex education based on state laws. However, in Tennessee we know that abstinence only sex education included teaching anal and oral sex to avoid pregnancy, and people from Planned Parenthood visited the schools and instructed the kids. That was no abstinence only program. Since the new law has defined abstinence only sex education the data collected for a space of time, say 5 years out, should be collected and analyzed. Clearly, at least in Tennessee, abstinence only was not taught before the new law. Therefore we know that even though the state law said abstinence only sex education, that that was not necessarily the lesson delivered. I think it is not enough to look at state law to determine what is actually being taught. However, the study showed that in states where abstinence only laws were on the books teen pregnancy rate was higher than in states with comprehensive sex education. Though the numbers per 1000 teens was the difference between a rate of 57 for comprehensive sex education and a rate of 75 out of a thousand for abstinence only sex education. The birth rates were also divided by white, black and Hispanic populations. Whites had the lowest birth rate, blacks were higher and Hispanic birth rates were the highest. I believe this is partly related to culture, but that was not part of the analysis. The sample of students taking their SAT test, where college education was planned, had the highest abortion rates, but this rate was not correlated with sex education. The author stressed that we should be more like Europe, where teen pregnancy rates per 1000 were as low as 25. I believe that the culture of European countries was not a variable considered in that comparison with the USA. I agree, that is an interesting study, but could you cite it, please? I'm not sure if everything in this post is from the story or if your opinions are added in. Anyways, the bottom line is that an "education" that omits facts and scares you into not having sex is not worthy of the term "education" (I would know, I received abstinence only education in grade school). It is no secret that abstinence is the most effective method of birth control. That being said, kids need to be exposed to the facts, and both the positives and negatives of every method. In the end, there are always going to be people who won't heed any of the education, but at least with a real education, kids are being made knowledgeable of what's available for them.
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