PurplePantyWaste Posted October 16, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 Ah, look again. We are close to 1/3 of the way into the season, but not there yet since we had the bye week early. Already been over this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thenew23 Posted October 16, 2014 Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 Again, it's my perspective. Missing 2 games is different from missing 2/3 of the season. You guys do realize it was two games, not 4 right? I'm not saying he'll be a bum. He very well could impact the games. But I'd be shocked to see him just picking up where he left off last year. Being a decoy, his speed, all true things. But averaging over 115 yards a game? 10 catches a game? I think if that's your view of what's gonna happen, you're sippin the Koolade too much. I definitely didn't mean though that he'll be completely ineffective. Just not this huge difference maker you're all making him out to be, at least not right away. He gets a couple games in, and you guys make it to the post season, then I could see him busting loose then. Ofcourse if the opposing defenses are dumb and sleep on him when he comes back that's a different story. This is a different offensive system, and a new one for us, so if we can stay healthy it is only going to get better. When we get Gordon back, nothing will change other than the opposing D's needing to focus on him. This puts less focus on our AFC-leading rushing attack, which will lead to a more effective PA, which will open up more space for Cameron and our smaller group of shifty WRs, and eventually lead to opposing Ds to take the focus off of Gordon --- uh oh --- that means TDs for us... Can you follow? Sure it may take a game or two for the whole thing to click, but Gordon is such a natural talent he'll immediately begin effecting games. He is at our facility every day working out with the coaches, and he continues to study and learn the playbook. Plus, Gordon has never put 100% effort into his practice and preparation, so even if there is some "rust" to knock off, it's no different from what we are used to getting from him. He'll finish with 40 catches, 600 yds, and 4 TDs in 6 games... book it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted October 16, 2014 Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 Ding Ding Ding... Keyword talent... talent doesn't forget... just as size, speed and hands are not things that forget. Timing? Sure, but how many times thru his 14 games last year did 5(?) QB changes disrupt timing? He very well could impact the games. Ofcourse if the opposing defenses are dumb and sleep on him when he comes back that's a different story. So defenses will have to account for our most talented WR, but he merely could impact the game? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuckin Futz Posted October 16, 2014 Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 Again, it's my perspective. Missing 2 games is different from missing 2/3 of the season. You guys do realize it was two games, not 4 right? I'm not saying he'll be a bum. He very well could impact the games. But I'd be shocked to see him just picking up where he left off last year. Being a decoy, his speed, all true things. But averaging over 115 yards a game? 10 catches a game? I think if that's your view of what's gonna happen, you're sippin the Koolade too much. Who was throwing to him last year. If you think those numbers were good, wait until Josh hooks up with BH. Huge difference. I definitely didn't mean though that he'll be completely ineffective. Just not this huge difference maker you're all making him out to be, at least not right away. He gets a couple games in, and you guys make it to the post season, then I could see him busting loose then. Ofcourse if the opposing defenses are dumb and sleep on him when he comes back that's a different story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted October 16, 2014 Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 I think if that's your view of what's gonna happen, you're sippin the Koolade too much....has anyone said that's whats gonna happen or are you sipping your own koolade? I definitely didn't mean though that he'll be completely ineffective. Just not this huge difference maker you're all making him out to be, at least not right away. ...he's a huge talent and WR is one of the few positions where you rely more on your physical skill. He may not be in peak form, but his 80% is better than most players 100%. No matter what, he will be a major threat to go all the way the SECOND he steps on the field. He gets a couple games in, and you guys make it to the post season, then I could see him busting loose then....Fortunately for us, a down game for him is about 80-100 yards. He'll be more than good enough even if he doesn't perform at last years level Ofcourse if the opposing defenses are dumb and sleep on him when he comes back that's a different story.....so, if he does well it will be due to the other team being dumb and sleeping? But, if he doesn't do well, it will be due to him sitting out? Correct? And, if he's NOT gonna be good when he comes back, then why would the other team be dumb for not game planning him? And if they game plan him, then isn't he already effecting the other team? Can't have it both ways man..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PurplePantyWaste Posted October 16, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 This is a different offensive system, and a new one for us, so if we can stay healthy it is only going to get better. When we get Gordon back, nothing will change other than the opposing D's needing to focus on him. This puts less focus on our AFC-leading rushing attack, which will lead to a more effective PA, which will open up more space for Cameron and our smaller group of shifty WRs, and eventually lead to opposing Ds to take the focus off of Gordon --- uh oh --- that means TDs for us... Can you follow? Sure it may take a game or two for the whole thing to click, but Gordon is such a natural talent he'll immediately begin effecting games. He is at our facility every day working out with the coaches, and he continues to study and learn the playbook. Plus, Gordon has never put 100% effort into his practice and preparation, so even if there is some "rust" to knock off, it's no different from what we are used to getting from him. He'll finish with 40 catches, 600 yds, and 4 TDs in 6 games... book it Affecting, not effecting. Again, I'm not prideful, I could be wrong. But until I see it, I'll stand by my viewpoint. 600 yards would be a lot in six games, though I could see 4 touchdowns being feasible. I would guess somewhere more around 400 yards, maybe 30 catches. I'm not saying he's gonna play bad, just that he's not gonna come out and torch everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PurplePantyWaste Posted October 16, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 I think if that's your view of what's gonna happen, you're sippin the Koolade too much....has anyone said that's whats gonna happen or are you sipping your own koolade? I definitely didn't mean though that he'll be completely ineffective. Just not this huge difference maker you're all making him out to be, at least not right away. ...he's a huge talent and WR is one of the few positions where you rely more on your physical skill. He may not be in peak form, but his 80% is better than most players 100%. No matter what, he will be a major threat to go all the way the SECOND he steps on the field. He gets a couple games in, and you guys make it to the post season, then I could see him busting loose then....Fortunately for us, a down game for him is about 80-100 yards. He'll be more than good enough even if he doesn't perform at last years level Ofcourse if the opposing defenses are dumb and sleep on him when he comes back that's a different story.....so, if he does well it will be due to the other team being dumb and sleeping? But, if he doesn't do well, it will be due to him sitting out? Correct? And, if he's NOT gonna be good when he comes back, then why would the other team be dumb for not game planning him? And if they game plan him, then isn't he already effecting the other team? Can't have it both ways man..... Does anyone here know the difference between Effecting and Affecting? You're implying that I said he's gonna either play bad or well...there is middle ground you know. He'll play good or average. 65-80 yards a game compared to his average 120-130 yards a game, and he'll probably score somewhere around 4-5 times at most. That's not bad, but that's not his typical ridiculous production. Now if some team's defense is dumb enough to think he doesn't need a lot of attention because they think he's going to be ineffective, he could break out with a huge game, but I don't think anyone is gonna underestimate 4.3 40 speed. And yes, people here are basically telling me this "You're stupid, Gordon's a beast, he put up crazy numbers with bad qbs and in a bad system, he's gonna come out and light it up. Someone told me to book it...so yeah, that's what people are telling me is gonna happen. Timing with your qb, reading defenses and real game speed are things that are hard to simulate in practice. He's a huge talent, which is why I'm not counting him out as if he's gonna be a bum when he gets back, but aside from the defense being dumb and not giving him the attention he deserves, or Gordon being a supernatural freak of nature, for him to come back and put up his normal production would result in about 750 to 800 yards in 6 games, so I'm a little skeptical of that happening. But 400, maybe 500 yards is realistic, I certainly could see him getting 4 scores. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted October 16, 2014 Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 Again, it's my perspective. Missing 2 games is different from missing 2/3 of the season. You guys do realize it was two games, not 4 right? His first game back last year, after not playing the whole off season or first 2 games, was 10 catches for 150 yards.....shook that rust right off, I'd say.... I will admit he didn't blow up till later in the season(wk 8)....so, if he follows suit and plays a little below average to start, then we should be comparing him to his first 6 games last year(note, this was on a much worse offense, with a revolving door at QB)......and his first 6 games last year, with 3 QB's throwing to him, was 32 catches for 582 yards......not too shabby... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PurplePantyWaste Posted October 16, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 His first game back last year, after not playing the whole off season or first 2 games, was 10 catches for 150 yards.....shook that rust right off, I'd say.... I will admit he didn't blow up till later in the season(wk 8)....so, if he follows suit and plays a little below average to start, then we should be comparing him to his first 6 games last year(note, this was on a much worse offense, with a revolving door at QB)......and his first 6 games last year, with 3 QB's throwing to him, was 32 catches for 582 yards......not too shabby... 2 games vs 10? Assuming the same results? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted October 16, 2014 Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 Does anyone here know the difference between Effecting and Affecting? Apparently not......the real question is "does anyone care?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted October 16, 2014 Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 2 games vs 10? Assuming the same results? Why not?....time off is time off....and he has a better OC and QB and an offense that is clicking......which should give him an advantage over what he had last year.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PurplePantyWaste Posted October 16, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 Why not?....time off is time off....and he has a better OC and QB and an offense that is clicking......which should give him an advantage over what he had last year.... True, but people also underestimated him. This time, not only will people not be underestimating him, but no one is going to be under estimating the Browns anymore. I guess we'll see. If I'm wrong I'll be back to eat crow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted October 16, 2014 Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 2 games vs 10? Assuming the same results? I'm saying Gordon's production isn't going to matter as much as his presence. You're nuts if you don't think he's automatically going to draw the other teams #1 CB. That makes guys like Austin, Hawkins, Gabriel and Cameron much more effective. Or you think if all the Browns do is have JG run go routes or deep slants, that's not going to take guys out of the box, and make the running game much more effective? Having a legit home run threat out there will influence how teams game plan for the Browns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PurplePantyWaste Posted October 16, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 I'm saying Gordon's production isn't going to matter as much as his presence. You're nuts if you don't think he's automatically going to draw the other teams #1 CB. That makes guys like Austin, Hawkins, Gabriel and Cameron much more effective. Or you think if all the Browns do is have JG run go routes or deep slants, that's not going to take guys out of the box, and make the running game much more effective? Having a legit home run threat out there will influence how teams game plan for the Browns. I dont recall sying his presence wouldnt be felt or that we wasn't going to have no impact at all. I originally said there isn't any guarantee that Gordon is going to come back and instantly be the major threat he was last year statistically and to what extent he destroyed nfl secondaries. Never implied he was gonnna be a bum and do nothing for the team whatsoever. You guys on here have to realize you're a bit biased here, which is fine, it's your team, you're bound to be biased as much as I'm biased about my team's players. Everything you guys sa, most of it is based on belief, where as just an outsiders take looking in is that sitting out for long periods of time and coming in near the end of the season there isn't much precedent for that player doing very well, and it stands to say that logic is that there will be an adjustment period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted October 16, 2014 Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 I dont recall sying his presence wouldnt be felt or that we wasn't going to have no impact at all. I originally said there isn't any guarantee that Gordon is going to come back and instantly be the major threat he was last year statistically and to what extent he destroyed nfl secondaries. Never implied he was gonnna be a bum and do nothing for the team whatsoever. You guys on here have to realize you're a bit biased here, which is fine, it's your team, you're bound to be biased as much as I'm biased about my team's players. Everything you guys sa, most of it is based on belief, where as just an outsiders take looking in is that sitting out for long periods of time and coming in near the end of the season there isn't much precedent for that player doing very well, and it stands to say that logic is that there will be an adjustment period. Yeah. But no one is saying otherwise, yet you keep arguing that we are. I just read back through the thread and not 1 person has said he was gonna blow up and instantly be the monster he was last season. Not one. We all have just said,even if he isn't 100%, he's an improvement and an instant injection of talent that WILL make a positive difference. The most optimistic post in the whole thread predicts 600 yds in 6 games....which, IF it happens....actually makes you both right....hell, he had a run of 6 games last year that produced 950 yds.....so 600 would be quite the drop off from when he was "destroying nfl secondaries"....wouldnt it?....is producing at 65% a reasonable expectation?.. cause that's what it would be...... And, of course, we're biased. Hello???? Just saying....your arguing about something no one has said.....reread.....and show me where "you guys" are saying otherwise....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DownSouthKC Posted October 16, 2014 Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 True, but people also underestimated him. This time, not only will people not be underestimating him, but no one is going to be under estimating the Browns anymore. I guess we'll see. If I'm wrong I'll be back to eat crow. Whoa, man. At first he wasn't looked at in the same light as Mega, Dez and the like he played 14 games and was doing that all year. He's in the same caliber as those dudes and it doesn't matter how much teams 'estimate' mega, Dez, Marshall they still get their's week in and week out and when they aren't they make everyone better. Just by him stretching the field the team will be better. The difference between this year and last is he is going to have a really good quarterback throwing to him (barring injury) instead of last year with Weeden. You are right though that no one is underestimating the Browns by that time ... especially after these next 3 games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted October 16, 2014 Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 And an added factor is that Josh just might be really extra driven to make up for his suspension.....like he owes his team an extraordinary effort....and a man on a mission, with his physical skills, can be very very dangerous.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TypicalBrowns Posted October 16, 2014 Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 if we beat cincy and go 7-2 the shit is FO REAL and they are playoff bound. Defense needs to get better each week, then look out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbedward Posted October 16, 2014 Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 Affecting, not effecting. Again, I'm not prideful, I could be wrong. But until I see it, I'll stand by my viewpoint. 600 yards would be a lot in six games, though I could see 4 touchdowns being feasible. I would guess somewhere more around 400 yards, maybe 30 catches. I'm not saying he's gonna play bad, just that he's not gonna come out and torch everyone. Come back in week 12 and we'll find out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PurplePantyWaste Posted October 16, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 it happened just last year. josh gordan missed the first 4 games and led the nfl in receiving yards Ding Ding Ding... Keyword talent... talent doesn't forget... just as size, speed and hands are not things that forget. Timing? Sure, but how many times thru his 14 games last year did 5(?) QB changes disrupt timing? So defenses will have to account for our most talented WR, but he merely could impact the game? Again, it's my perspective. Missing 2 games is different from missing 2/3 of the season. You guys do realize it was two games, not 4 right? I'm not saying he'll be a bum. He very well could impact the games. But I'd be shocked to see him just picking up where he left off last year. Being a decoy, his speed, all true things. But averaging over 115 yards a game? 10 catches a game? I think if that's your view of what's gonna happen, you're sippin the Koolade too much. Who was throwing to him last year. If you think those numbers were good, wait until Josh hooks up with BH. Huge difference. I definitely didn't mean though that he'll be completely ineffective. Just not this huge difference maker you're all making him out to be, at least not right away. He gets a couple games in, and you guys make it to the post season, then I could see him busting loose then. Ofcourse if the opposing defenses are dumb and sleep on him when he comes back that's a different story. Yeah. But no one is saying otherwise, yet you keep arguing that we are. I just read back through the thread and not 1 person has said he was gonna blow up and instantly be the monster he was last season. Not one. We all have just said,even if he isn't 100%, he's an improvement and an instant injection of talent that WILL make a positive difference. It was sort of an implied thing the above posters' quotes and others were sort of getting at, that Gordon was going to come back and put the Browns over the edge and make them lethal, and that Gordon wouldn't be AFFECTED by the the lengthy time out. Yes, no one was saying he was gonna be earth shattering good, but it's just my opinion that Gordon will be good for 4 catches maybe 70 yards a game and me a nice contributor...but I don't think the Brown's offense will jump leaps and bounds ahead of the competition with his return. The most optimistic post in the whole thread predicts 600 yds in 6 games....which, IF it happens....actually makes you both right....hell, he had a run of 6 games last year that produced 950 yds.....so 600 would be quite the drop off from when he was "destroying nfl secondaries"....wouldnt it?....is producing at 65% a reasonable expectation?.. cause that's what it would be...... That's mathematically an incorrect way of looking at it imo. I was going off of the average input. His highest recorded input over a certain time isn't reflective of his overall average input, so to say 600 yards is 65% of his average output doesn't work. My original point was as much as you want to believe it, you have no clue what'll happen. I have no clue. We're all making educating guesses here. I'm making mine based off precedent of other players and similar situations, you and others are making it more off of how talented he is and random speculation, which is your prerogative to do. You don't have to take offense to the fact that I disagree. We look at the situation differently. And, of course, we're biased. Hello???? Just saying....your arguing about something no one has said.....reread.....and show me where "you guys" are saying otherwise....... Whoa, man. At first he wasn't looked at in the same light as Mega, Dez and the like he played 14 games and was doing that all year. He's in the same caliber as those dudes and it doesn't matter how much teams 'estimate' mega, Dez, Marshall they still get their's week in and week out and when they aren't they make everyone better. Just by him stretching the field the team will be better. The difference between this year and last is he is going to have a really good quarterback throwing to him (barring injury) instead of last year with Weeden. You are right though that no one is underestimating the Browns by that time ... especially after these next 3 games. Gordon hasn't become a proven commodity yet like those others. We've seen receivers, running backs, etc come out as 1-2 year wonders till the rest of the league figures out their game and finds ways to contain them. Guys like Megatron, Dez, etc find ways to beat any coverage and have done it for years. Gordon very well might be one of them, I just find it premature to label him as that with A. him only being in his 3rd year and B.) Not having played a 16 game season yet and C. Not seeing how he responds to NFL defenses trying to scheme him out of the game. And an added factor is that Josh just might be really extra driven to make up for his suspension.....like he owes his team an extraordinary effort....and a man on a mission, with his physical skills, can be very very dangerous.... Again, pure speculation. But sometimes players who try really hard to prove themselves try too hard and their play suffers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PurplePantyWaste Posted October 16, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 I acknowledge the stability at qb will in the long run help Gordon. But who knows if Gordon and Hoyer start out with good chemistry or not. The difference between practice and real game action sometimes bring out little nuances like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaconHound Posted October 19, 2014 Report Share Posted October 19, 2014 Bump for 7-9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TypicalBrowns Posted October 19, 2014 Report Share Posted October 19, 2014 7-9 looks reaaaaaaally good after today Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieHardBrownsFan Posted October 19, 2014 Report Share Posted October 19, 2014 5-11. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickers Posted October 19, 2014 Report Share Posted October 19, 2014 8-8 till I see otherwise... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PurplePantyWaste Posted October 20, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 20, 2014 Tried to keep you guys from getting ahead of yourselves. I still see 9-7 if we see good Brian Hoyer the rest of the season. If we see more bad Brian Hoyer, 6-10 at worst. And like I said before, the defense has to figure itself out. The Jaguars putting up that many points is concerning Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tml1138 Posted October 20, 2014 Report Share Posted October 20, 2014 I'm saying Gordon's production isn't going to matter as much as his presence. You're nuts if you don't think he's automatically going to draw the other teams #1 CB. That makes guys like Austin, Hawkins, Gabriel and Cameron much more effective. Brings a question to my mind. I haven't paid enough attention, but who currently has been covered by teams' #1 CB? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tml1138 Posted October 20, 2014 Report Share Posted October 20, 2014 And what the hell happened to the Bungals yesterday? I didn't see the game but it sounds like the O was worse than ours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Taintsniffer Posted October 21, 2014 Report Share Posted October 21, 2014 And what the hell happened to the Bungals yesterday? I didn't see the game but it sounds like the O was worse than ours. Our whole offense crapped the bed. A lot of my fellow Bengal fans are quick to blame Dalton, but, the whole offense looked terrible. The Oline was especially bad... I realize the Bengals aren't the top team in the NFL, but I also know we have to be better than that. I think the problem is the leadership on this team is not very good. Marvin Lewis isn't a leader. He is a nice guy and can spot talent, but he isn't a good head coach. Injuries are no excuse. That was just terrible. And to top off the crappy weekend, the steelers won.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickers Posted October 21, 2014 Report Share Posted October 21, 2014 Our whole offense crapped the bed. A lot of my fellow Bengal fans are quick to blame Dalton, but, the whole offense looked terrible. The Oline was especially bad... I realize the Bengals aren't the top team in the NFL, but I also know we have to be better than that. I think the problem is the leadership on this team is not very good. Marvin Lewis isn't a leader. He is a nice guy and can spot talent, but he isn't a good head coach. Injuries are no excuse. That was just terrible. And to top off the crappy weekend, the steelers won.... I hope Marvin Lewis is your coach for the next 100 years LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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