D Bone Posted June 8, 2015 Report Share Posted June 8, 2015 Can we get one with a 7th round pick? It would have to be a high 7th Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted June 8, 2015 Report Share Posted June 8, 2015 lol... New punter.....new place kicker......new long snapper......and new holder.......plus, just watched a Dawg Pound Report and they said the Browns are working on getting some different guys returning kicks.....OH JOY!!!!!! OTA's had Tramon Williams, Benji and Duke as the punt returners......and Gilbert, Duke and Benji as the kick returners....so....Oh joy again!!! Definitely more attention being paid to the 3rd phase this year. I just like stronger guys returning kicks... Duke - yes; Gilbert/ Benji - not so much. LOL....ok....I see the mistake....3.6 is the factor. Actually, History. Anything but math, so point taken. You're a good sport... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Couch Pulls Out Posted June 8, 2015 Report Share Posted June 8, 2015 Can Mccown do what he is being called on doing being a game manager? I think he can. He will have one of the best O lines in the league which is a huge boost to any qb. He will have some good running backs. If the Browns establish a running game it will open everything else up. We are counting on ball control and conrolling the time of possession. Too many 3 and outs and no matter how good our defense is they will get worn down. If Lee's punting can pin opposing team's offenses in bad field position that is only going to benefit our defense. If other teams try stacking the line to stop our run game and force us to throw I think this team with McCown has the ability to make them pay for it. It is not like we won't have any passing game. The faith that I have is moreso in our offensive line, runningbacks and offensive coordinator. I think McCown can have a season somewhere between what we saw in Chicago and what we saw in Tampa, but I don't expect even lower-level greatness out of him. I expect a very similar performance to what we saw from Hoyer, although McCown will be working to groom Manziel more than Hoyer ever did...and that's where his benefit lies. People like to credit our offensive line and say "why can't McCown have a Chicago-like season?" The answer - we don't have Forte, Alshon, Marshall and Bennett. We may have equivalent talent in Johnson, Mayle and Housler, but that's top level homerism at it's finest. I expect Housler to surprise, I expect Mayle to develop into a receiver akin to what Greg Little could have been, and I think Johnson has the ability to become a very dynamic receiving back ( a la Forte). But I don't expect that this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miktoxic Posted June 8, 2015 Report Share Posted June 8, 2015 People like to credit our offensive line and say "why can't McCown have a Chicago-like season?" The answer - we don't have Forte, Alshon, Marshall and Bennett. We may have equivalent talent in Johnson, Mayle and Housler, but that's top level homerism at it's finest. I expect Housler to surprise, I expect Mayle to develop into a receiver akin to what Greg Little could have been, and I think Johnson has the ability to become a very dynamic receiving back ( a la Forte). But I don't expect that this year. isn't it great when you are unexpectedly surprised? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted June 9, 2015 Report Share Posted June 9, 2015 The answer - we don't have Forte, Alshon, Marshall and Bennett. True, but you only analyzed the WR corps... which BTW the Bucs did closely match. We have a shot at approaching Forte/Bush via some combination of Crow/West/Johnson and that level of run success bodes well for a PAP-oriented Offense/QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Couch Pulls Out Posted June 9, 2015 Report Share Posted June 9, 2015 True, but you only analyzed the WR corps... which BTW the Bucs did closely match. We have a shot at approaching Forte/Bush via some combination of Crow/West/Johnson and that level of run success bodes well for a PAP-oriented Offense/QB. That's my point exactly. The Bucs had the weapons, but not the protection. We have the protection, but not the weapons. McCown is a facilitator - give him talent (and keep him standing), and he should distribute to the appropriate target. We have solid, young, undervalued talent at our skill positions. Some of them will surprise. But they aren't nearly enough to be relied upon...which is what I'm worried about. We don't have big, dominating redzone threats at WR and TE and a proven every down back who is just as talented receiving out of the backfield as he is running between the tackles. All Chicago's OL had to do was keep McCown relatively clean, which they did (5th in pass pro per Football Outsiders). On paper, our offensive line should keep him clean and should make enough holes for our RB's to run through. What remains to be seen is whether our undersized, shifty WR's can make McCown look good, like Chicago's giant ones did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D Bone Posted June 9, 2015 Report Share Posted June 9, 2015 I bet McCown out plays Hoyer, and if he can, we should be in good shape............. As long as we can consistently stop the run, and then get off the field on 3rd down that is. If we don't do both of those things well, it's going to be a frustrating year. I just don't see McCown being worse than Brian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted June 9, 2015 Report Share Posted June 9, 2015 I believe McCown is underrated, and will be a terrific surprise this season.. They are saying he can still "spin it"... which Hoyer just couldn't do anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gumby73 Posted June 9, 2015 Report Share Posted June 9, 2015 Sorry peeps Am all done trying to read into how good this QB and Team is going to be. We have read this from media post season far to many times. Show me when the pre-season lights come on, that's closer to a real game with our real Team.. Go Cavs!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Couch Pulls Out Posted June 10, 2015 Report Share Posted June 10, 2015 I bet McCown out plays Hoyer, and if he can, we should be in good shape............. As long as we can consistently stop the run, and then get off the field on 3rd down that is. If we don't do both of those things well, it's going to be a frustrating year. I just don't see McCown being worse than Brian. I don't see him being worse than Hoyer, but I also don't see him being much better, either. As a matter of fact, I feel like they'll be just about the same, when all is said and done. If I had to throw some stats on it, I'd go for a season like: 238 completions - 408 attempts | 58.3% | 2,703 yds. | 15 TD | 14 INT | 76.2 Rating Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wargograw Posted June 10, 2015 Report Share Posted June 10, 2015 The faith that I have is moreso in our offensive line, runningbacks and offensive coordinator. I think McCown can have a season somewhere between what we saw in Chicago and what we saw in Tampa, but I don't expect even lower-level greatness out of him. I expect a very similar performance to what we saw from Hoyer, although McCown will be working to groom Manziel more than Hoyer ever did...and that's where his benefit lies. People like to credit our offensive line and say "why can't McCown have a Chicago-like season?" The answer - we don't have Forte, Alshon, Marshall and Bennett. We may have equivalent talent in Johnson, Mayle and Housler, but that's top level homerism at it's finest. I expect Housler to surprise, I expect Mayle to develop into a receiver akin to what Greg Little could have been, and I think Johnson has the ability to become a very dynamic receiving back ( a la Forte). But I don't expect that this year. Ha. Know how I know you're an SC fan? "Last name, Alshon, last name, last name." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Couch Pulls Out Posted June 10, 2015 Report Share Posted June 10, 2015 Ha. Know how I know you're an SC fan? "Last name, Alshon, last name, last name." Good eye! It's become so ingrained in me that I didn't even realize I was doing it. Not necessarily a S.Car fan per se, I'm still a Buckeye fan through and through...but all of my friends are alums, so I've become partial to S.Car over Clemson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted June 10, 2015 Report Share Posted June 10, 2015 Ha. Know how I know you're an SC fan? "Last name, Alshon, last name, last name." Cher Madonna Bjork Sting Bono Charro Beck Enya Flea Pink Moby Prince Sade Sinbad Rihanna Donovan Wynonna Alshon? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted June 10, 2015 Report Share Posted June 10, 2015 That's my point exactly. The Bucs had the weapons, but not the protection. We have the protection, but not the weapons. McCown is a facilitator - give him talent (and keep him standing), and he should distribute to the appropriate target. We have solid, young, undervalued talent at our skill positions. Some of them will surprise. But they aren't nearly enough to be relied upon...which is what I'm worried about. We don't have big, dominating redzone threats at WR and TE and a proven every down back who is just as talented receiving out of the backfield as he is running between the tackles. All Chicago's OL had to do was keep McCown relatively clean, which they did (5th in pass pro per Football Outsiders). On paper, our offensive line should keep him clean and should make enough holes for our RB's to run through. What remains to be seen is whether our undersized, shifty WR's can make McCown look good, like Chicago's giant ones did. Obviously then I missed the point. Not the first time... not the last... in fact I may still be. But if it is that of the three, offensive facets Chicago had right in '13, O-line, Run game and WRs, the one that a QB can influence the most is WR... then we agree. What I find telling from the Bears' '13 season is that Josh's and Jay's completion percentages were very close and their TDs were roughly proportional to their starts. Only their INTs were grossly different. Not sure if Mc's low INT figure is the mark of a "facilitator"; it is the mark of a game manager. Problem for the Bears' was that when your Defense ranks 29th in yards allowed and 30th in points allowed, then you actually need a little more gun-slinging and a little less managing from your QB. I don't think any of us expect this problem in '15. I don't see him being worse than Hoyer, but I also don't see him being much better, either. As a matter of fact, I feel like they'll be just about the same, when all is said and done. Two things put me in the "he'll be better" camp: 1. I get the feeling that Mc is mentally tougher... or at least that the "pressures" won't be as great on him, i.e., no home-town thing and not being hell bent to prove he's the starter. 2. Mc's stronger arm... 45 yards will not be our air attack's effective range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted June 10, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2015 I don't see him being worse than Hoyer, but I also don't see him being much better, either. As a matter of fact, I feel like they'll be just about the same, when all is said and done. Cant disagree here....though I would say that Hoyer was pretty good weeks 1 thru 10, then was fairly terrible for his last 5 starts..... So, while I dont expect McCown to be notably better than Hoyer was(weeks 1-10), I do expect him to be more consistent....and less likely to get rattled like Hoyer did...... Hoping all those extra years of experience get him(and us) through the tough times with better results.....(fingers crossed)... I sure as hell hope we have more than 2700 yds passing though......yikes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted June 10, 2015 Report Share Posted June 10, 2015 Meanwhile back at the thread... Interesting take on the impact paying a Punter a Mil-a-year more than his predecessor will have on negotiations with Gip... http://espn.go.com/blog/cleveland-browns/post/_/id/14118/tashaun-gipson-had-to-notice-when-browns-added-salary-with-andy-lee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Couch Pulls Out Posted June 10, 2015 Report Share Posted June 10, 2015 Cant disagree here....though I would say that Hoyer was pretty good weeks 1 thru 10, then was fairly terrible for his last 5 starts..... So, while I dont expect McCown to be notably better than Hoyer was(weeks 1-10), I do expect him to be more consistent....and less likely to get rattled like Hoyer did...... Hoping all those extra years of experience get him(and us) through the tough times with better results.....(fingers crossed)... I sure as hell hope we have more than 2700 yds passing though......yikes! Those stats were McCown's average game (taken by dividing his yards/completions/TDs/INTs by his number of games) extrapolated over a 17 game season. It would be a more precise average if I removed the stats from games he didn't start, but I just didn't have that kind of time. It was a rush job. Either way, I exoect us to hover around the 3,000 yard mark, if preseason has been any indication. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted June 10, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2015 yeah....got no issue with the stats prediction other than it's way less than Id hope to see from an improved team....... But...assuming our O line is back and we have improvement at RB and WR...and that we had 3600 yds passing last year, then 2700 yds in 16 games would be a big drop off(way worse)....wouldnt it? If it happens, then I at least hope we add an extra 1000 or 2 to our running stats.....or we are in HUGE trouble..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Couch Pulls Out Posted June 10, 2015 Report Share Posted June 10, 2015 yeah....got no issue with the stats prediction other than it's way less than Id hope to see from an improved team....... But...assuming our O line is back and we have improvement at RB and WR...and that we had 3600 yds passing last year, then 2700 yds in 16 games would be a big drop off(way worse)....wouldnt it? If it happens, then I at least hope we add an extra 1000 or 2 to our running stats.....or we are in HUGE trouble..... I agree. We'll be in major trouble if the yardage isn't made up somewhere. I'd love to see us lead the league in rushing yards this season. A studly defense should contribute to better field position, meaning less yards for our offense to travel. Same goes for a better return game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted June 10, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2015 Definitely......sure wouldnt mind about 2200-2500 yds rushing( I think we had about 1800 last year)......It'd be nice to see a step up from the Crow/West tandem(dont care how it's split) .....and then add some extra for the Duke..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted June 11, 2015 Report Share Posted June 11, 2015 Considering that we are now at least one injury deep in the O-line, bumping last year's rushing total by 20-40% looks very doable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted June 11, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2015 Considering that we are now at least one injury deep in the O-line, bumping last year's rushing total by 20-40% looks very doable. Id say it's a realistic possibility....Ill take the 40% option, please..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wargograw Posted June 11, 2015 Report Share Posted June 11, 2015 Are we sure we'll be running as much with the new OC? Isn't Shanahan kind of a run game extraordinaire (if nothing else)? There are certainly reasons to think we will well outdo our run game totals from last year, I'm just wondering if Flip will even keep the run volume just as high. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted June 11, 2015 Report Share Posted June 11, 2015 I'll bet he doesn't run on first down most all the time. that will be a breath of fresh air. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Couch Pulls Out Posted June 11, 2015 Report Share Posted June 11, 2015 Are we sure we'll be running as much with the new OC? Isn't Shanahan kind of a run game extraordinaire (if nothing else)? There are certainly reasons to think we will well outdo our run game totals from last year, I'm just wondering if Flip will even keep the run volume just as high. We won't be running as frequently, no. Oakland finished dead last in the league last year in rushing percentage - only rushing on like 38% of plays. However, I don't think that's indicative of what will happen this year, I put us more in the 45-48% range. You have to remember that Oakland's backfield was a mess last year. MJD got hurt, DMC was garbage (and also hurt, I believe), and Latavius Murray ended up taking over. I think we'll see a more creative rushing game, with a higher YPA, and a rather even distribution of carries (unless someone absolutely takes off). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted June 11, 2015 Report Share Posted June 11, 2015 Yup... in OAK they were pass happy out of necessity. It's not what earned Flip his shot here. I'll take the over, TC... I can see us running even more than we did last year. Two reasons: Pet sets the tone and his OC will march to his orders... especially if when the D improves over last year. With the depth added to the O-line we will run more effectively even should the 6th man be "up". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted June 12, 2015 Report Share Posted June 12, 2015 From OTA notes... http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/news/article-5/5-observations-from-Browns-OTAs/92eab669-eb5d-443e-aab7-70d3a6202a1c 1) Andy Lee can absolutely boom the football Cleveland’s new punter hit the 70-yard marker on at least two of his punts, prompting return men to jokingly complain if he could take some heat off the ball. Coach Mike Pettine said it was a tough choice to let Spencer Lanning go, but the Browns believe Lee provides an upgrade to the punting position. “It was difficult, but that’s life in the NFL,” Pettine said. “We felt we had an opportunity to make our team better. There was a Pro Bowl punter out there and we felt the cost associated was obviously very manageable.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted June 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 12, 2015 Yup... in OAK they were pass happy out of necessity. It's not what earned Flip his shot here. Agreed.......wasnt Flip only the QB coach at Oakland?.......I wouldnt think he was the source of their offensive philosophy.... It's been my impression that he was adopting much of the O scheme we already had in place, with a few of his own twists.....as opposed to bringing us Oaklands O scheme.....that way we weren't learning a whole new system again..... TCPO......you're starting to make me nervous with the offensive predictions...HA!....1000 less yards passing AND 10% less running?..... Im hoping for increased offense(both pass and rush), boosted by more opportunities due to improved defense......fingers crossed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Couch Pulls Out Posted June 12, 2015 Report Share Posted June 12, 2015 Agreed.......wasnt Flip only the QB coach at Oakland?.......I wouldnt think he was the source of their offensive philosophy.... It's been my impression that he was adopting much of the O scheme we already had in place, with a few of his own twists.....as opposed to bringing us Oaklands O scheme.....that way we weren't learning a whole new system again..... TCPO......you're starting to make me nervous with the offensive predictions...HA!....1000 less yards passing AND 10% less running?..... Im hoping for increased offense(both pass and rush), boosted by more opportunities due to improved defense......fingers crossed I don't think we'll have 10% less running. On the contrary, I was saying we'll have 10-15% more running that Flip showed in Oakland. My McCown prediction was based solely off of his career averages, nothing else. Probably an underrepresentation, considering everything else we've discussed recently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted June 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 12, 2015 No biggy...I guess I misunderstood what you said.....we ran about 47-48% last year and I thought you said we were gonna run less on the first line...but now I see it says different on line 2....just a lil confusing for me thats all..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.