Preseason game one

[miktoxic]

no one on the D thurs night could set the edge to save their life.

[gumby73]

2 view thoughts: When your 18 players down b4 kickoff, ugly was coming 3rd & 4th Qrts. Glad we lost, cause at practice and Pet after viewing tape will bust some ass with some work to do. We went up 14-3 was a win for the 1's imo. Offense fails= OL depths and RB's. Defense pisses me off to no end, Just a start. DL upfront middle no ?'s, better but lets not over pursuit the ball carrier. D outside with LB's sickening. 1st contact is a serious issue and no d penetration to start setting a edge. The worst possible pursuit angle's in tackling than not tackling, we can't wrap with those angles. Pullard was the best textbook tackler all night. Cover a WR= At a point we stop covering and we play just to make the tackle only and Gilbert is not the only one to do this. Gilbert's biggest problem is on a long field his eye control on ball and WR is awful which leads to blaming S for his mis-coverage. When Carcon blows by him he always miss reads speed of WR and thinks his speed will catch up and his hips and feet are not even turned yet. Than that leads to he has no Urgency to finish a play as you may see when he does nothing to make a tackle on WR on sideline that he has to put out of bounds. Yes O' Neil our D has a lot to do 2 Improve Tick Tock..

[Cielo]

Look at that the brah from bodybuilding.Com is one of the highest rated players from game one. This guy is going to be a stud

[Clevfan4life]

no one on the D thurs night could set the edge to save their life.

 

well I don't think you're gonna real see them try that hard during the preseason. In the 1st quarter I saw a lot of pinching in again from the OLB'ers to help pinch the gaps. You're not supposed to have your guys do that so it shows the coordinators still think our inside run needs help. I really only saw our two starters make two glaring mistakes in the run game in the 1st quarter and both was when they were trying to dive inside. That's how a big run broke when Kruger dove inside. They're not doing that because the mood struck them, especially Kruger he's a pro....they were explicitly told to try to do what they can to help out. I saw this mid way through last season when both Sheard and Kruger did just fine at edge containment...but mid way you could tell that they were being told to do whatever they could to try to dive inside. I really really really hope this isn't necessary once the season starts. The outside guys main job is not be pushed off the point, to funnel everything inside. If they start this shit up again from opening day it's gonna be a long long season of watching guys bounce outside for big runs, or gash us off the guards when the OLB'ers hold the point.

 

Having the OLB'ers do this is an explicit admission that our interior run defense still has issues...whether it's the D line or the MLB'ers I don't even know.

[miktoxic]

Having the OLB'ers do this is an explicit admission that our interior run defense still has issues...whether it's the D line or the MLB'ers I don't even know.

 

i think our interior line on D will be fine. it's the OLBs that have to show up.

[tiamat63]

 

i think our interior line on D will be fine. it's the OLBs that have to show up.

What Cleve highlighted is something I mentioned the other day - the off tackle runs arent a lone product of Kruger and Co. Not being able to hold the edge.

[Flugel]

Just watched my midnight recording for the first time. Here are my impressions...

 

Announcers: Patrick is a bit long in the tooth, but I always liked his ESPN broadcasts in the early SNF days. Wilcotts on the other hand... the dude just gives analysis a bad name. I likely won't have to suffer the pair again this preseason... my sympathies to those who do.

 

New Uniforms: Teams colors should inspire more than nausea. All the daylight video of practice did not prepare me for how bad the new orange would look under the lights. And I missed the glossy helmets. But my reaction may be my old, color-blind eyes which could barely discern the helmet logo painted at mid-field.

 

Preparation: Until very late in the game the team looked remarkably prepared with neither substitution issues nor players lining up improperly nor pre-snap penalties.

 

QBs: McCown looked the game manager part complete with pocket presence. Arm looked good. Ability to extend plays is a bonus... we got a bonus.

JM looked better, but playing safe is not the same as managing the position. I'd love a 22 read on his reads. Aside from one hot route, not sure he made any. Seemed to overreact to pressure, but TD run was very decisive and included nice job of setting up a block by Moore. Questions remain, but you crawl before you walk, walk before...

Shaw's arm looked stronger than I remember it. He has to feel pressure a bit earlier.

Thad looked like an early cut candidate.

 

RBs: Overall I feel like I saw why Ray Rice is being vetted...

Crow looked jacked up... maybe by Montgomery's recent words. He lacked patience and seemed to be racing his line to the edge. Instead he needs to glide behind them until a crack appears as he did last year. Nice run after his swing pass reception.

West looked lethargic.

Only other RB of note was Flanders who flashed a couple times including a blitz pick up or two. Might have a PS shot...

Johnson looked like a FB.

 

WRs: Hartline looked ready to go.

By this time Benji should be able to set up his DB and get deep...

Jennings may be the surprise of the nite. In addition to his 2 catches he had a very nice KO return in which he hesitated to set up a block (by Johnson IIRC). Our RBs should watch that return...

Mayle's hands looked plenty sticky.

 

TEs: Familiar pair started.

Bibbs made a strong H-back case. Hard to see him not making the 53.

I swear I saw Housler on the back of a jersey... on Special Teams.

 

O-line: Did some coach clicker stuff early. Debating on doing a full grading.

Mack played one series and looked good. Seymore filled in and did not.

Bito and Greco looked very good. Greco was the 2nd starter to sit; Bito the 3rd IIRC.

Erving played LT until Thad came in. Looked like a good rookie. Was surprised he did not get a series or two at Center.

Schwartz played deeper into the game than all the starters save Erving... good idea as Mitch has a history of starting slow.

Of our unknowns Painter looked decent subbing for Greco at RG early. I think Bowie started at RT and moved to left when Erving finally sat.

 

D:

Yes... the run D was disappointing, but I can hear Pet now... "It's a process." I agree. We will not go from #32 to top of the league overnite.

There were times when the line did it's job leaving an LB free to make an impact tackle. Kirksey early... and impressively Pullard late. The rookie may not have the measureables, but he seems to have the proverbial nose for the ball. Consistency in keeping the LBs clean is what we need and what will come with time.

Then the question will be are our LBs consistently up to the task. TBH I am not sure. I know it's my same old drum, but I just think our LBs are too easy to play call against.

 

At least I found a new way of saying that they are lacking in 3-down talent...

 

Excellent writeup - thanks! The very first preseason game tends to shakeup chemistries on the oline really quickly like we witnessed. I wanted Seymour and Bowie to show me more than they did. There's still time for them to do that; but it better come quick. I think you were spot on about Erving. I remember when Joe Thomas had a couple false starts and I think 1 holding penalty in his first preseason. The good news was his neighbor to the right was an experienced and savvy vet (Steinbach) who would become a calming and trick of the trades influence on Joe by the time we got to the opener. Bitonio had that on both sides of him last year and we saw the rest. I think we're okay on the oline.

 

They're going to scrimmage Buffalo soon; and that's a very talented front that will battle test our line.

 

I thought our WRs played well as McCown going 5 for 5 depicted. They got open and caught the ball.

 

Justin Gilbert is still scarier than the Exorcist. He got absolutely toasted; but he was lucky Garcon dropped the throw he had to turn around for. He makes plays here and there but he's too inconsistent to count on. Worst of all, he's an atrocious tackler.I don't know what to think of Bademosi as a DB here; but he's a very talented STs guy. He's our defensive version of Marlon Moore in the sense he's competing to make an active roster spot on a suddenly deep position (where he's very fortunate he's a stud on STs). In fairness, he's being switched to corner so we'll have to see how he progresses one week to the next. He had 1 nice coverage when he received Safety help over-the-top. I like the guy because of what he does for this team covering punts/kickoffs - a lot of vets don't want to do that kind of blue collar thing. Even though Moore made some plays the other night, I think his chances of making the team again are less than Bademosi's (especially since Bademosi will now have experience at Corner and Safety - while the WR depth sort of squeezes Moore out).

 

We lined Des Bryant up on the Nose quite a bit in that first series. Are we kicking him inside to compete for reps or do they just want to get a look at others in the 5 technique?

[Tour2ma]

In the 1st quarter I saw a lot of pinching in again from the OLB'ers to help pinch the gaps.

What Cleve highlighted is something I mentioned the other day - the off tackle runs arent a lone product of Kruger and Co. Not being able to hold the edge.

Are they testing run support recognition of our CBs wide? Safeties off tackle?

 

Even though Moore made some plays the other night, I think his chances of making the team again are less than Bademosi's...

Agree... Bade's two position versatility certainly helps.

[Flugel]

Rewatching the game as we speak here. My boy from Vandy (Seymour) didn't see more at all. That 3rd down blitz the LBer walked right up to his right shoulder pre-snap and Seymour looked left first (causing a total whiff picking up the LBer who hurried Manziel's throw).

 

Drive #2 with Manziel at QB looked much better from our oline and Seymour. Marlon Moore actually was throwing a nice block on Manziel's TD run. The DB tried to turn around to draw a flag but contact was already made and it was good the official in the vicinity saw the whole thing. The DB didn't complain either. I feel kind of bad for Moore because does a lot of the blue collar stuff that doesn't show up in the glamour dept. Moore is going down swinging - I'll give him that.

[alporcini]

 

Excellent writeup - thanks! The very first preseason game tends to shakeup chemistries on the oline really quickly like we witnessed. I wanted Seymour and Bowie to show me more than they did. There's still time for them to do that; but it better come quick. I think you were spot on about Erving. I remember when Joe Thomas had a couple false starts and I think 1 holding penalty in his first preseason. The good news was his neighbor to the right was an experienced and savvy vet (Steinbach) who would become a calming and trick of the trades influence on Joe by the time we got to the opener. Bitonio had that on both sides of him last year and we saw the rest. I think we're okay on the oline.

 

They're going to scrimmage Buffalo soon; and that's a very talented front that will battle test our line.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I thought our WRs played well as McCown going 5 for 5 depicted. They got open and caught the ball.

 

Justin Gilbert is still scarier than the Exorcist. He got absolutely toasted; but he was lucky Garcon dropped the throw he had to turn around for. He makes plays here and there but he's too inconsistent to count on. Worst of all, he's an atrocious tackler.I don't know what to think of Bademosi as a DB here; but he's a very talented STs guy. He's our defensive version of Marlon Moore in the sense he's competing to make an active roster spot on a suddenly deep position (where he's very fortunate he's a stud on STs). In fairness, he's being switched to corner so we'll have to see how he progresses one week to the next. He had 1 nice coverage when he received Safety help over-the-top. I like the guy because of what he does for this team covering punts/kickoffs - a lot of vets don't want to do that kind of blue collar thing. Even though Moore made some plays the other night, I think his chances of making the team again are less than Bademosi's (especially since Bademosi will now have experience at Corner and Safety - while the WR depth sort of squeezes Moore out).

 

We lined Des Bryant up on the Nose quite a bit in that first series. Are we kicking him inside to compete for reps or do they just want to get a look at others in the 5 technique?

Tour, Fluges... good analysis... must say I only watched each teams first two possessions, had read about all about the scrubs, etc... Gilbert's non-play was indescribably horrifying... and though he called the rest of his performance "flawless", his blown tackle on the sideline seriously made me wonder if it's time to give up on him... his head is so not in the game... offensively, I was pretty thrilled... McCown's drive was pretty damn flawless... Team looked in synch, he was in total control out there, was very impressed with his mobility on the TD pass... Second drive with JF was certainly helped out by the recovered fumble, but he too looked comfortable, mobile though not JFF antsy, nice touch, showed good release, and his TD made me jump off the couch... When was the last time we saw the Browns score two TD's on their first two opening drives... I was happy with what I saw... We've got the makings of something really fun this year.

[Mudfly]

Are they testing run support recognition of our.... Safeties off tackle?

 

I think were looking strong there....(safety).....Whitner was our primary run stopper last year, after everyone else missed their tackles....and in that first game, Campbell looked like the good box safety we hoped he would be.......

 

Marlon Moore actually was throwing a nice block on Manziel's TD run. The DB tried to turn around to draw a flag but contact was already made and it was good the official in the vicinity saw the whole thing. The DB didn't complain either. I feel kind of bad for Moore because does a lot of the blue collar stuff that doesn't show up in the glamour dept. Moore is going down swinging - I'll give him that.

Yep....not only did Moore provide the block for the TD.....he provided the turnover(fumble) that got us the ball to begin with....

 

Without Moore, we lose that game by 10.....

 

When was the last time we saw the Browns score two TD's on their first two opening drives... I was happy with what I saw...

I was happy too.....though we are still waiting for 2 scores on 2 drives, as Johnny actually scored on his second drive .....the first drive ended in a punt, which resulted in the fumble, which led to drive 3........

[calfoxwc]

When I first read Gilbert's take on his play.... I thought he

was kidding.

 

When we went to the first Browns practice, Gilbert was riding the bike near us.

One guy said "go Gilbert!, All-Pro !"...

 

and Gilbert turned, and smiled, and said "I was last year"........

 

I assume he was trying to say he was trying to be allpro last year.....

but GIlbert, and Winston, rb, also was riding the bike..seem to have no fire.

At all. Just observing them,

it's like they are somewhere else, or want to be. Just an impression...

[tiamat63]

Are they testing run support recognition of our CBs wide? Safeties off tackle?

Unlikely about the CB's. With the amount of man coverage we use, Coach has openly said he's not as worried about our corners getting involved stopping the run.

 

It is possible with the safeties, however you're routinely exposing them to constantly attack run. Eventually that will bite you in the ass. Need more tape and time to get a better feel of what's going on.

[Tour2ma]

Certainly unlikely on the 4th and short when man coverage is virtually mandatory...

[Flugel]

Tour, Fluges... good analysis... must say I only watched each teams first two possessions, had read about all about the scrubs, etc... Gilbert's non-play was indescribably horrifying... and though he called the rest of his performance "flawless", his blown tackle on the sideline seriously made me wonder if it's time to give up on him... his head is so not in the game... offensively, I was pretty thrilled... McCown's drive was pretty damn flawless... Team looked in synch, he was in total control out there, was very impressed with his mobility on the TD pass... Second drive with JF was certainly helped out by the recovered fumble, but he too looked comfortable, mobile though not JFF antsy, nice touch, showed good release, and his TD made me jump off the couch... When was the last time we saw the Browns score two TD's on their first two opening drives... I was happy with what I saw... We've got the makings of something really fun this year.

 

Thanks Al. Another thing to keep in mind is they didn't really prepare/game plan for Washington's tendencies and vice versa. For example, I don't know how often they will try to use Des Bryant on the Nose beyond the preseason. We saw it infrequently last year when injuries and depleted numbers had us putting guys in places we prolly wouldn't at full strength.

 

Gilbert rallied some in coverage; but you HAVE to be a good open field tackler in this league as a corner if your name isn't Deion Sanders. Gilbert isn't a very good tackler to begin with so he's one guy I'm sort of pessimistic about at this time. I hope he can prove me wrong about that especially if our staff isn't ready to give up on him this quickly.

 

I remembered Calfox astutely pointing out Pullard making a nice play in the scrimmage at Columbus. I thought Pullard put more examples of good first step instinct on film the other night. That can make or break a LBer every bit as much as the big guys up front tying up blockers.

 

All in all, I expect this preseason to get us ready for the real stuff in September.

[The Gipper]

Kruger diving in for a tackle where he completely missed the guy was tragic. We were shocking against the outside run. Up the middle, No problems, but whenever they tried to bounce outside we had no contain.

We had that same problem last year. No contain around the edge.

 

I am beginning to question the coaching technique where that is involved. Be it Sheard from last year, Mingo, Kruger, Armonty, Orchard, etc. etc......none of the seem to be doing the contain on the edge.

DC Jim O'neil better shore that up....or it is his head that could roll.

[gumby73]

none of the seem to be doing the contain on the edge.

DC Jim O'neil better shore that up....or it is his head that could roll.

Yep. And when Haslem said Pet was announced as safe 2015 the weight shifted to O'Neil imo. The Tick Tock on Jim is on I believe and brings a question. Where's Doug Marone and is he in the Pettine Tree??

 

[wargograw]

Coaching OL in Jacksonville