TexasAg1969 Posted September 21, 2015 Report Share Posted September 21, 2015 Benji correctly read the scramble and ran for the open area knowing Manziel would pick him up. In fact he said either of their QB's know how to find him on the scramble play. That tells me it gets practiced much like Evans and JM practiced those each week before games. What many have called "sandlot football" is no accident. It's nice to know both our QB's get to do it during the week. What is funny in watching Pet talk about it yesterday was almost identical to the interviews with Sumlin post-game early in JM's career in which Summy would say after the games, "I was yelling No No No.................oh man Great play!" Summy then later admitted to later planning for the scramble with teaching all receivers where to go on the field when they realized JM was extending the play. Benji did exactly what they were taught, scramble into his vision while others kept defenders busy out of those areas.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob806 Posted September 21, 2015 Report Share Posted September 21, 2015 Benjamin has fully recovered from the knee injury. Thank God I took him in round 10 in my fantasy league!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flugel Posted September 21, 2015 Report Share Posted September 21, 2015 I really hate research. I prefer to get by on hazy recollections and half memories. But for you, it was Flugel. And you posted in this thread! Come on man comeonman!!! http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=37681&page=1 I really appreciate you remembering that and linking it up. Thanks! In fairness, there were quite a few others that liked him too. Real quickly, I'm reading a lot of really good posters in here beating themselves up because they weren't convinced he'd be what he's become. Don't do that to yourselves. That's not why we're here. It isn't like Ray Horton (who used to coach here) saw him coming either time or Dick LeBeau for that matter (Benjamin scored vrs Pitt last year). I'll guarantee a lot of you peg guys right way more frequently than I do. Today, Benjamin is our best play maker. The preseason kept reminding us of that no matter who was throwing to him. The continuation of leading our WR Corps in TD receptions and yards per catch from 2014 into the first 2 games confirms it. If that's not enough, ask the Tennessee Titans what Cleveland Brown scored 5 TDs against them in our last 2 match-ups. After what we've been through over the years, I love me a guy that not only gets open but catches the ball every time. Guys like Benjamin and Greco that came here without stunning resumes (1 drafted - the other traded for) are classic examples of why you invest time in players before giving up prematurely. One could guy could only run straight ahead routes or deep posts or flags as a wide eyed rookie. The other had something like 3 or 4 fill in starts in 3 years in St Louis. Part of his trade condition was if he started 1 game his first year here - it lowered the exchange value/round of the future pick we would be getting. Therefore he didn't start his first year here. Then we broke him in with some growing pains at LG in between auditioning guys like Pinkston and Gilkey before we found him a niche at RG. I'm not sure where the Manziel thing is heading; but it sure is nice seeing a more mature version that has really applied himself this offseason and throughout training camp to make what we saw yesterday not only possible but DOABLE. And folks, he's just as young as this year's first round QBs. He's only 22 playing out his final year of college eligibility in the NFL on our favorite team. It's been quite some since seeing a QB hooking up deep with throws hitting the guy in stride twice in 1 game. Last year, our starting QB only threw 12 TD passes, and I think only 8 went to the WRs. This year, Manziel has 3 TD passes to the WR position in just 2 games projecting improvement from that. Yesterday was fun. We deserve this folks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted September 21, 2015 Report Share Posted September 21, 2015 Yep.....at the start of camp, I definitely had Benji on the first train outta here......but by preseason game 3, it was clear he stepped his game up..... Really, really surprised(and pleased) with his explosive play to this point......already, he has matched his team leading 3 TD's(which aint hard, I get it)......still.....very nice indeed..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted September 21, 2015 Report Share Posted September 21, 2015 Which one of Farmer's trades didn't you like? Let me rephrase - which former Brown did well this week? Or last week? Or last year? Brandon Weeden? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted September 21, 2015 Report Share Posted September 21, 2015 And I thought I heard talk after the draft he might not make the team? I will eat crow if Manziel turns out to be the franchise QB. I wanted Garapollo or Blake Bortles who's done Zero. Blake Bortles is...will be quite good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted September 21, 2015 Report Share Posted September 21, 2015 Remember Kosar to slaughter? I'd love to see Manziel to Benjamin be that exciting a combo. Ryan to Warfield....even better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted September 21, 2015 Report Share Posted September 21, 2015 I really appreciate you remembering that and linking it up. Thanks! In fairness, there were quite a few others that liked him too. Real quickly, I'm reading a lot of really good posters in here beating themselves up because they weren't convinced he'd be what he's become. Don't do that to yourselves. That's not why we're here. Very kind of you, Sir... ... but focus on enjoying your victory lap before some asshole points out the first name on your WR list... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColumbusKing Posted September 21, 2015 Report Share Posted September 21, 2015 34 - Benjamin’s yards-per-catch average through two games, good for first in the NFL by 8 yards. 204 - Benjamin’s receiving yards through two games, a figure that ranks fourth in the NFL. The three ahead of him? Antonio Brown, Julio Jones and Rob Gronkowski 4 - Benjamin’s number of touchdowns through two games. That’s good for a tie for first with Gronkowski among non-quarterbacks. 164 - Benjamin’s punt return yards through two games, a total that is also best in the NFL. He had 127 last season and 257 in 2013 before suffering a knee injury. 4 - Touchdowns of more than 50 yards through two games. He’s the first player in the NFL to do this since Browns legend Jim Brown in 1963. 5 - Benjamin’s touchdowns vs. Tennessee in his last two games against the Titans. That’s 45 percent of his career touchdowns. 269 - All-purpose yards vs. Tennessee, a figure that ranks seventh in Browns history. 154 - Benjamin’s punt return yards against the Titans. That’s good for third in Browns history and was 25 shy of the record he set in 2013. 3 - receiving touchdowns through two games, matching his career high for a season and the high among Browns receivers in 2014. 1 - reception that’s gone for fewer than 15 yards. 1 - punt return that has gone for fewer than 10 yards, and that was a 9-yarder in Sunday’s second quarter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dawg2fan Posted September 21, 2015 Report Share Posted September 21, 2015 Remember Kosar to slaughter? I'd love to see Manziel to Benjamin be that exciting a combo. Not sure I'm ready to go that far. Let's see how the season plays out first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flugel Posted September 21, 2015 Report Share Posted September 21, 2015 i talked Benj up so long ago when Flugz started posting here again and wrote that bit on Benj it felt so reran to me i didn't even care to comment. keep pattin ur backs, i predated all you knockoffs... Doesn't surprise me! I've always enjoyed your posts as well as your compliments toward others you felt put a lot of time and passion into their posts. There's quite a few guys that liked Benjamin. I just felt like it was important to keep reminding people that they might want to start including Benjamin on their list of WRs that were going to make this team even before he started lighting it up in the preseason. If we all spent more time on what we predicted, we'd corner ourselves into not enjoying our favorite team/good stories unfolding. For example, that guy (Masterdong) who ran around getting in everyone's face about Manziel this last weekend cornered himself into a state of depression the same 3 hour period most of our fanbase got to enjoy what we were watching. When we're on a message board this size, there's always going to be other guys that have the same idea regardless of who gets to post it first or at a time when more people are on the board. I think Zombo did a nice job of reminding people of that in between beers and putting the binoculars on the fanny floss at the beach. His point was who gives a shit about who gets credit - let's talk football. As Tour wanted to remind me, I thought we could steal Breshad Perriman in round 2 up until he ran his forties in that intriguing frame. A former All American WR that always surrounds his NFL QB with WRs like Derrick Mason, Anquan Boldin, Torry Smith, and Steve Smith decided Perriman was greater value than round 2. Therefore he snagged Perriman at #26 overall. I'm guessing Ozzie Newsome has a greater understanding of how to make life easier on his QB than I do; but I've certainly been wrong before. I think we're paying Dwayne Bowe more $ than Baltimore has to pay Perriman, but I could be wrong about that too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flugel Posted September 21, 2015 Report Share Posted September 21, 2015 34 - Benjamin’s yards-per-catch average through two games, good for first in the NFL by 8 yards. 204 - Benjamin’s receiving yards through two games, a figure that ranks fourth in the NFL. The three ahead of him? Antonio Brown, Julio Jones and Rob Gronkowski 4 - Benjamin’s number of touchdowns through two games. That’s good for a tie for first with Gronkowski among non-quarterbacks. 164 - Benjamin’s punt return yards through two games, a total that is also best in the NFL. He had 127 last season and 257 in 2013 before suffering a knee injury. 4 - Touchdowns of more than 50 yards through two games. He’s the first player in the NFL to do this since Browns legend Jim Brown in 1963. 5 - Benjamin’s touchdowns vs. Tennessee in his last two games against the Titans. That’s 45 percent of his career touchdowns. 269 - All-purpose yards vs. Tennessee, a figure that ranks seventh in Browns history. 154 - Benjamin’s punt return yards against the Titans. That’s good for third in Browns history and was 25 shy of the record he set in 2013. 3 - receiving touchdowns through two games, matching his career high for a season and the high among Browns receivers in 2014. 1 - reception that’s gone for fewer than 15 yards. 1 - punt return that has gone for fewer than 10 yards, and that was a 9-yarder in Sunday’s second quarter Nice! Here's his receiving stats since he's been here: 2012 14 GM 18 REC 37 TARGETS 298 YDS 16.6 AVG 69 LNG 2 TD 2013 8 GM 5 REC 13 TARGETS 105 YDS 21.0 AVG 39 LNG 0 TD 2014 16 GM 18 REC 46 TARGETS 314 YDS 17.4 AVG 43 LNG 3 TD 2015 2 GM 6 REC 7 TARGETS 204 YDS 34.0 AVG 60 LNG 3 TD He's been targeted 7 times this year and caught 6 for 204 yards and 3 TDs at 34 yards per catch. That's the great news. It's a nice reminder that it's easy to throw to guys that get open. Not only that, but Travis reminds me of Devin Smith in how he tracks the deep ball. Now, who's going to step up on the WR Corps to take advantage of all the attention Benjamin will be getting from here on out? Wouldn't it be nice if the guy who landed a really generous FA contract here felt like making our coaching staff and front office feel good about such a commitment? If nobody does, is it too late to re-evaluate bringing back Pryor or Lenz? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted September 24, 2015 Report Share Posted September 24, 2015 Nice! Here's his receiving stats since he's been here: 2012 14 GM 18 REC 37 TARGETS 298 YDS 16.6 AVG 69 LNG 2 TD 2013 8 GM 5 REC 13 TARGETS 105 YDS 21.0 AVG 39 LNG 0 TD 2014 16 GM 18 REC 46 TARGETS 314 YDS 17.4 AVG 43 LNG 3 TD 2015 2 GM 6 REC 7 TARGETS 204 YDS 34.0 AVG 60 LNG 3 TD He's been targeted 7 times this year and caught 6 for 204 yards and 3 TDs at 34 yards per catch. That's the great news. The biggest difference I see in him is that he is catching the ball now and looks to be regaining his confidence..... The truth about him is that, as a WR, he has had very suspect hands up till now.....historically low catch rates(even worse than Greg Little)....yet, this year he's catching an amazing 85%.....just hoping it's the real deal and not a few fluky games ....no doubt his speed is for real....dude is lighting fast.... definitely a risk to take it all the way on any play..... Here are his catch %'s. Note he started bad and then got worse each year. As a reference, good receivers usually are 60%+ and the best ones are in the 70's..... Catch rates 2012 = 50% 2013 = 41% 2014 = 39%(lowest in the league) 2015 = 85%......kablammo....huge increase.... I will say it looks like he is using his hands better to catch and no more body grabs....looks to me like this is a learned improvement in technique and a guy who has taken his coaching to heart.....just keep it going Benji!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted September 24, 2015 Report Share Posted September 24, 2015 One of the commentators on NFL Network said early this week that he thought Benji was the fastest player in he NFL. JM pretty much confirmed that when he said he could not out-throw him. Benji feels that neither JM nor Josh can out-throw him. He said he would have expected the same plays out of Josh. I'm not so sure Josh could spin out of that seemingly sure tackle on the game clencher however. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbedward Posted September 24, 2015 Report Share Posted September 24, 2015 Now that I got Benjamin on my fantasy team I expect he will stop making big plays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted September 24, 2015 Report Share Posted September 24, 2015 Now that I got Benjamin on my fantasy team I expect he will stop making big plays. LOL! You can bet every team will account for him now. Hopefully our staff knows how to use a fast decoy to open up the underneath game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted September 24, 2015 Report Share Posted September 24, 2015 ....no doubt his speed is for real....dude is lighting fast.... definitely a risk to take it all the way on any play..... Speed has surprised me some, even more is that it is translating to taking the top off the D. So something else is accompanying the speed... maybe respect for underneath routes in his arsenal? Whatever it is... I'm for it... I'm not so sure Josh could spin out of that seemingly sure tackle on the game clencher however. The spin was the truly special, unique part to my eye... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted September 24, 2015 Report Share Posted September 24, 2015 LOL! You can bet every team will account for him now. Hopefully our staff knows how to use a fast decoy to open up the underneath game. Speed has surprised me some, even more is that it is translating to taking the top off the D. So something else is accompanying the speed... maybe respect for underneath routes in his arsenal? Whatever it is... I'm for it... Should open the run game a bit too....Im guessing safetys start doubling to help out....eliminating that extra run defender.... Its all good..... And I liked his little hurdle at the end of the punt return.....elusive... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted September 24, 2015 Report Share Posted September 24, 2015 And I liked his little hurdle at the end of the punt return.....elusive... Yep, I heard Johnny taught him that little jump over defenders. BTW I saw a playback of his kick return where his speed was continually tracked. As he made his turn upfield around the 50 he actually hit 20 mph. WOW!! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cN0fidIi-_M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flugel Posted September 24, 2015 Report Share Posted September 24, 2015 The biggest difference I see in him is that he is catching the ball now and looks to be regaining his confidence..... The truth about him is that, as a WR, he has had very suspect hands up till now.....historically low catch rates(even worse than Greg Little)....yet, this year he's catching an amazing 85%.....just hoping it's the real deal and not a few fluky games ....no doubt his speed is for real....dude is lighting fast.... definitely a risk to take it all the way on any play..... Here are his catch %'s. Note he started bad and then got worse each year. As a reference, good receivers usually are 60%+ and the best ones are in the 70's..... Catch rates 2012 = 50% 2013 = 41% 2014 = 39%(lowest in the league) 2015 = 85%......kablammo....huge increase.... I will say it looks like he is using his hands better to catch and no more body grabs....looks to me like this is a learned improvement in technique and a guy who has taken his coaching to heart.....just keep it going Benji!!! Just a guess here but I think your catch rates above are target % which should not be confused with drop %. More on that in the next 2 paragraphs below. I'll agree he's had a lot to improve upon as a WR since he came here in 2012. That said, I don't think it was ever his hands that needed the biggest areas of improvement. In fact, the only season he has dropped more than 1 pass is 2014 (with 3). However, despite how many less reps he had than others - he led our WR Corps in TD receptions and yards per catch. Here's a link that shows dropped pass leaders (and you can choose whatever year you want to see). http://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/drops/2014/ Be careful not to count targets or target % as drops because we haven't had many keepers at QB here in terms of accuracy since 2012. Here's Benjamin's drops stats/rates per the link I gave: 2012: 18 receptions 1 drop 37 targets 48.6 target% 2.7 drop% 2013: 5 receptions 1 drop 13 targets 38.5 target% 7.7 drop% 2014: 18 receptions 3 drops 46 targets 39.1 target% 6.5 drop% 2015: 6 receptions 0 drops 7 targets (50% of his receptions are TDs where the biggest thing challenging his yards per catch has been the goal line) As for the Greg Little comparison, here's his drop stats/rates per my link: 2011: 61 receptions 12 drops 121 targets 50.4 target% 9.9 drop% 2012: 53 receptions 6 drops 92 targets 57.6 target% 6.5 drop% Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted September 24, 2015 Report Share Posted September 24, 2015 Good points Flugel.... Was not implying that he had drops.....just that he didnt win too many balls....(Little may have more drops, but he still caught a higher percentage, which is what matters) I guess there are guys who drop....guys who can catch.....guys who win contested balls....and guys who go get it..... No matter how you slice it....consistently catching 39-40% "could" land you in the "guys who can catch" category, but in reality that is not good enough to be a starter in this league.....and if 6 out of 10 plays to a guy dont work out, then they will not be going to him for long..... So far, hes at 8 outta 10, so no worries for now.....will ride the wave and see how it goes..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flugel Posted September 24, 2015 Report Share Posted September 24, 2015 Good points Flugel.... Was not implying that he had drops.....just that he didnt win too many balls....(Little may have more drops, but he still caught a higher percentage, which is what matters) I guess there are guys who drop....guys who can catch.....guys who win contested balls....and guys who go get it..... No matter how you slice it....consistently catching 39-40% "could" land you in the "guys who can catch" category, but in reality that is not good enough to be a starter in this league.....and if 6 out of 10 plays to a guy dont work out, then they will not be going to him for long..... So far, hes at 8 outta 10, so no worries for now.....will ride the wave and see how it goes..... Well said Mud. You know what's nice? When he has an accurate QB hitting him in stride - the outcome is fun. Like you said - I hope he keeps it up. The preseason projected some good stuff though like that slant pass McCown threw behind him that he hauled in with 1 hand. Best of all, I love it when we invest time in players like Benjamin and Greco to see the kinds of improvements they're showing us. Craig Robertson, Tashaun Gipson are a couple more examples. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted September 24, 2015 Report Share Posted September 24, 2015 yep...and the best news is that he did overcome all that mess from last year and the difference is huge.... Im definitely in his corner and NOT suggesting he's gonna bust......just trying to maintain a level reality after 2 games..... cause you know how THAT goes.....2 good games and he's a god.....2 bad games and then he suddenly sucks and Farmers an idiot.....another good game and he's all pro again..... The good news(for him) is that if he has an off game this week, it'll all be McCowns fault..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canton Mike Posted September 24, 2015 Report Share Posted September 24, 2015 Well said Mud. You know what's nice? When he has an accurate QB hitting him in stride - the outcome is fun. Like you said - I hope he keeps it up. The preseason projected some good stuff though like that slant pass McCown threw behind him that he hauled in with 1 hand. Best of all, I love it when we invest time in players like Benjamin and Greco to see the kinds of improvements they're showing us. Craig Robertson, Tashaun Gipson are a couple more examples. Yep. Targets don't mean a lot when the guy throwing at the target keeps missing it. Unfortunately, it STILL counts as a target & is often used against the receiver, who may not have had a chance of catching the ball. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted September 25, 2015 Report Share Posted September 25, 2015 And I liked his little hurdle at the end of the punt return.....elusive... So long as he sticks to the low hurdles, i.e., players on the ground. I've seen enough Peyton Hillis style... Once upon a time "Hurdling" was illegal in the NFL... wonder whatever happened to that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gumby73 Posted September 25, 2015 Report Share Posted September 25, 2015 Mud & Flug that's the stuff that makes this board for junkies like us, thanks. It sure is Rabbit Season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted September 25, 2015 Report Share Posted September 25, 2015 People are agreeing. WTF?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike H Posted September 25, 2015 Report Share Posted September 25, 2015 People are agreeing. WTF?!Josh Lenz sucks Discuss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted September 25, 2015 Report Share Posted September 25, 2015 Josh Lenz sucks Discuss Agree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted September 25, 2015 Report Share Posted September 25, 2015 Josh Lenz sucks Discuss I am too verklempt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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