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Haslem and Farmer should be ashamed....


Mudfly

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Thats right.....Haslem and Farmer....

 

They ARE the ones running this ship, right?

 

Haslem is the bigshot owner who was gonna make this team right.....and Farmer is the arrogant - know it all - GM who restocked this team with greatness....right?

 

So....Haslam has already fired 2 complete NFL staffs, and by all appearances, is about to fire his third in just 3 years....and, somehow, he'll try to sell us that its "those guys he's fired" that were the problem....even though HE has hired them all and is their leader....

 

And if he is the leader, why is he not saying one thing?......Ill tell you why.....he doesnt know what to say, He's lost. And as long as he has Pettine to take the heat, he's gonna let him stand out there alone and answer to this shit storm.....as if it's Pettines fault this team has not improved....

 

And Farmer?....where the fuck is he??????......Why does Pettine have to answer to Johnny, Bowe, Housler, Gilbert, West, etc etc etc.....????......Farmer has been absent this ENTIRE season and the one time we saw him, he was as smug and arrogant as they come. Really really a turn off for this fan. Whose fault is it that we have SO MANY overpaid non performing players? Whose fault is it that we claim to draft character, yet our roster has the head case Gilbert, party boy drunk QB, pot head WR in waiting, 4 th highest paid LB in the league, with 12 tackles, 12m WR who doesnt even try to play and a GM who gets himself suspended....

 

Yet, lets leave Pettine out there....all alone....to explain it away AND take ALL the heat.....(Oneill too, as if he's the reason this team sucks....which is so ridiculous I dont know what to say....we sucked before him and well suck after him).....I promise

 

For the 2 guys who are REALLY supposed to be LEADERS and the decision makers and the guys who are running things...Haslem and Farmer sure are absent....and definitely NOT being accountable in any way for this shit storm....

 

TERRIBLE LEADERSHIP FROM THE TOP DOWN......

 

Whether or not you think Pettine is a good coach, he is not the reason this team has been bad for 20 years...or the last 2 years......but he is the only one sitting out there....like a man....and answering questions and standing up to the heat......the other guys are hiding like the pussies that they are.

 

So....for all of you who think its Pettine or Jim Oneills fault that this team sucks....think again....

 

Everyone wants Pettine gone because he's the "leader" and not getting his minions to do their jobs....THINK AGAIN........

 

I say he's in the middle....FARMER and Haslem are his bosses and they aint leading shit....and they'll want you to believe they given Pettine "everything he needs to succeed"....which is a crock...

 

So....they'll let Pettine take the heat....twist in the wind....then they'll fire him(scapegoat)....and everyone will cheer!!....YAY!....

 

And then Haslem and Farmer will hire some new coach that is supposed to win with crap.....and the cycle starts again.....and they will just continue to give us more shit and less leadership......and this untalented team will continue to make coaches look bad....etc etc

 

Its a bad look and I got more respect than ever for Pettine, for just sitting up there alone and being the goat....while the rest of the organization hides....

 

Haslem is quickly becoming Daniel Snyder....didnt he learn ANYTHING from the Rooneys????

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Thats right.....Haslem and Farmer....

 

They ARE the ones running this ship, right?

 

Haslem is the bigshot owner who was gonna make this team right.....and Farmer is the arrogant - know it all - GM who restocked this team with greatness....right?

 

So....Haslam has already fired 2 complete NFL staffs, and by all appearances, is about to fire his third in just 3 years....and, somehow, he'll try to sell us that is "those guys he's fired" that were the problem....even though HE has hired them all and is their leader....

 

And if he is the leader, why is he not saying one thing?......Ill tell you why.....he doesnt know what to say, He's lost. And as long as he has Pettine to take the heat, he's gonna let him stand out there alone and answer to this shit storm.....as if it's Pettines fault this team has not improved....

 

And Farmer?....where the fuck is he??????......Why does Pettine have to answer to Johnny, Bowe, Housler, Gilbert, West, etc etc etc.....????......Farmer has been absent this ENTIRE season and the one time we saw him, he was as smug and arrogant as they come. Really really a turn off for this fan. Who fault is it that we have SO MANY overpaid non performing players? Whose fault is it that we claim to draft character, yet our roster has the head case Gilbert, party boy drunk QB, pot head WR in waiting, 4 th highest paid LB in the league, with 12 tackles, 12m WR who doesnt even try to play and a GM who gets himself suspended....

 

Yet, lets leave Pettine out there....all alone....to explain AND take the heat.....

 

For the 2 guys who are supposed to be LEADERS and the decision makers and the guys who are running things....they sure are absent....and definitely NOT being accountable in any way for this shit storm....

 

TERRIBLE LEADERSHIP FROM THE TOP DOWN......

 

Whether or not you think Pettine is a good coach, he is not the reason this team has been bad for 20 years...or the last 2 years......but he is the only one sitting out there....like a man....and answering questions and standing up to the heat......the other guys are hiding like the pussies that they are.

 

So....for all of you who think its Pettine or Jim Oneills fault that this team sucks....think again....

 

Everyone wants Pettine gone because he's the "leader" and not getting his minions to do their jobs....

 

but I say he's in the middle....FARMER and Haslem are his bosses and they aint leading shit....and they'll want you to believe they given Pettine "everything he needs to succeed"....which is a crock...

 

So....they'll let Pettine take the heat....twist in the wind....then they'll fire him(scapegoat)....and everyone will cheer!!....

 

And then Haslem and Farmer will continue to give us more shit and less leadership......and this untalented team will continue to make coaches look bad....

 

Its a bad look and I got more respect than ever for Pettine, for just sitting up there alone and being the goat....while the rest of the organization hides....

Maybe Pet was setup to fail and take the heat so Farmer and Jimmy can bring in their real "guy". interesting theory.

 

I think we all agree that we need coordinators and a GM/President with EXPERIENCE and continuity. A full rookie staff seems setup to fail.

 

Farmer was sweating like crazy the one time I saw him give a presser. Jimmy needs to say something.

 

And I believe it's Pettine and O'Neil's fault the defense sucks. Pet talked today in his pressure about them needed to find out the problem with the D. Whether it was the players, coaches, or scheme. I personally don't think Pet has the balls to call out or fire his buddy O'Neil, even if he is the problem. Again it's a tough spot to fire your good buddy, but maybe Pet should of let O'Neil coach the linebackers and brought in an experienced D coordinator who's done it before.

 

I don't hate Pettine, but can we agree the whole front office is a clusterfuck, and a few more years of it with no changes could quite possibly set us back even more.

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My biggest issue is that Pettine is flying solo.....all the way......and that aint right....

 

I would say that Pettine is accused of not putting his players in position to win, but the same HAS to said for what Haslem and Farmer are doing to him.....

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I've been trying to say it myself. The shit starts at the top and flows down. And Pettine sure comes off as a stand up guy. He has had to answer for mistakes at the owner and GM level as well as his own....which he admits. And that's on top of trying to coach the talent he has to be game ready and dealing with player egos....without help or support from the top. He's got more backbone than the other 2 combined

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Thats right.....Haslem and Farmer....

 

They ARE the ones running this ship, right?

 

Haslem is the bigshot owner who was gonna make this team right.....and Farmer is the arrogant - know it all - GM who restocked this team with greatness....right?

 

So....Haslam has already fired 2 complete NFL staffs, and by all appearances, is about to fire his third in just 3 years....and, somehow, he'll try to sell us that its "those guys he's fired" that were the problem....even though HE has hired them all and is their leader....

 

And if he is the leader, why is he not saying one thing?......Ill tell you why.....he doesnt know what to say, He's lost. And as long as he has Pettine to take the heat, he's gonna let him stand out there alone and answer to this shit storm.....as if it's Pettines fault this team has not improved....

 

And Farmer?....where the fuck is he??????......Why does Pettine have to answer to Johnny, Bowe, Housler, Gilbert, West, etc etc etc.....????......Farmer has been absent this ENTIRE season and the one time we saw him, he was as smug and arrogant as they come. Really really a turn off for this fan. Whose fault is it that we have SO MANY overpaid non performing players? Whose fault is it that we claim to draft character, yet our roster has the head case Gilbert, party boy drunk QB, pot head WR in waiting, 4 th highest paid LB in the league, with 12 tackles, 12m WR who doesnt even try to play and a GM who gets himself suspended....

 

Yet, lets leave Pettine out there....all alone....to explain it away AND take ALL the heat.....(Oneill too, as if he's the reason this team sucks....which is so ridiculous I dont know what to say....we sucked before him and well suck after him).....I promise

 

For the 2 guys who are REALLY supposed to be LEADERS and the decision makers and the guys who are running things...Haslem and Farmer sure are absent....and definitely NOT being accountable in any way for this shit storm....

 

TERRIBLE LEADERSHIP FROM THE TOP DOWN......

 

Whether or not you think Pettine is a good coach, he is not the reason this team has been bad for 20 years...or the last 2 years......but he is the only one sitting out there....like a man....and answering questions and standing up to the heat......the other guys are hiding like the pussies that they are.

 

So....for all of you who think its Pettine or Jim Oneills fault that this team sucks....think again....

 

Everyone wants Pettine gone because he's the "leader" and not getting his minions to do their jobs....THINK AGAIN........

 

I say he's in the middle....FARMER and Haslem are his bosses and they aint leading shit....and they'll want you to believe they given Pettine "everything he needs to succeed"....which is a crock...

 

So....they'll let Pettine take the heat....twist in the wind....then they'll fire him(scapegoat)....and everyone will cheer!!....YAY!....

 

And then Haslem and Farmer will hire some new coach that is supposed to win with crap.....and the cycle starts again.....and they will just continue to give us more shit and less leadership......and this untalented team will continue to make coaches look bad....etc etc

 

Its a bad look and I got more respect than ever for Pettine, for just sitting up there alone and being the goat....while the rest of the organization hides....

 

Haslem is quickly becoming Daniel Snyder....didnt he learn ANYTHING from the Rooneys????

 

Shit, we agree again. Hell has officially frozen. I don't know if Pettine is the answer as the head coach but I have seen very little progress from Farmer. Bitonio has had flashes but other than that not seeing much out of his first 2 rounds as a GM. Even the staunchest of Shelton supporters have to admit he isn't playing like #12. Hallam has been even worse.

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Great job Mud!

 

I've been saying this since the Johnny vs GF fiasco several months back.

 

I don't understand why Pettine has to answer for the clusterfuck that Farmer has assembled every Monday.

 

Haslam needs to crawl out from behind his mommy's apron and give an explanation...fucking pussy.

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My biggest issue is that Pettine is flying solo.....all the way......and that aint right....

 

I would say that Pettine is accused of not putting his players in position to win, but the same HAS to said for what Haslem and Farmer are doing to him.....

 

 

Great points again...you're on a roll lately.

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Welcome to the Rob Chud World & many more since 99. Just from a butt not in the seats, Jimmy needs to give the keys to a GM of Bill Polian or Parcells Than get the hell out of the way till GM has his coach. Than keep signing here Jimmy!! Mud, you pist. but positive. keep steamrolling straight ahead!!

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Great topic.

 

If you look at the elite teams they start at the front office. A buddy at work asked me why some teams have great luck getting qb's and some don't. My response is the same.

 

It starts by putting the right people in place to do their jobs. Whether its evaluating talent to coaching. Teams that have always seemed to have great qb's are the ones with a great front office.

 

Haslem needs to put the right people in place instead of running the franchise like one of his truckstops with a high turnover rate.

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Kinda torn, Mud...

 

On one hand I don't want to see Haslam (or Farmer) in front of the cameras as regularly as Jerrah is down in Dallas. When face time with the press was divvied up at their retreat I suspect Pet was designated to be the guy with Farmer doing his Draft, Pre-season, Mid-season and Season's end updates. Ditto for Jimmah except only twice a year.

 

Other than lame defenses of his logo, even Snyder is more scarce now in DC.

 

On the other hand at minimum I would have liked to have seen a press release from Haslam affirming that he backed Pet after Pet rescinded the starting job. Had the added step of suspending JM for two weeks been taken, then I would have fully expected Farmer to open the Presser with Pet and then leave.

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Kinda torn, Mud...

 

On one hand I don't want to see Haslam (or Farmer) in front of the cameras as regularly as Jerrah is down in Dallas. When face time with the press was divvied up at their retreat I suspect Pet was designated to be the guy with Farmer doing his Draft, Pre-season, Mid-season and Season's end updates. Ditto for Jimmah except only twice a year.

 

Other than lame defenses of his logo, even Snyder is more scarce now in DC.

 

On the other hand at minimum I would have liked to have seen a press release from Haslam affirming that he backed Pet after Pet rescinded the starting job. Had the added step of suspending JM for two weeks been taken, then I would have fully expected Farmer to open the Presser with Pet and then leave.

 

 

I get where both of you are coming from, but I agree with Mud on this. I think the FO is just leaving him out there week after week to deal with this shitshow. I don't want a Jerry Jones or Snyder type owner, but when things are going bad like they are this year, the man on top needs to be heard from occasionally and the same goes for Farmer. For these two to keep sending Pettine out there to deal with the media week after week is pretty weak.

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I get that Mark, but we're not doing anything as an organization...

 

Can't say what I was going to say because it made me realized we have done things that should have required Farmer to step forward. Been more than a few player releases that Pet was left to deal with.

 

 

OK... officially less torn now.

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I get that Mark, but we're not doing anything as an organization...

 

Can't say what I was going to say because it made me realized we have done things that should have required Farmer to step forward. Been more than a few player releases that Pet was left to deal with.

 

 

OK... officially less torn now.

 

 

Its ok to be sold on something by Mud. I was all in with Zombo on Camp Fire Everyone last night but Mud has pulled me back from the dark side (there are some here who will get that joke) to the good side that says there are changes that can be made without blowing up the entire coaching staff, especially the head coach.

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Yep, good stuff from the mudman, but that's just par for the course 'round here .

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Well you've made me think. And I think Farmer has been rather silent. Like him or not Pettine is all alone so far. Well, where is everyone? Why is there nothing coming out of front office at all?

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still time for those on the dark side with delusioned minds (gruden is coming....urban will sign....fire pet elevate flip) to get their story straight before another humiliating defeat of what they preach and believe in does not come true.

 

still got that case saying gruden nor urban coming so.......

 

where 'dem big mouths at?

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I'm a Muddite too. As he has said previously you can't fire the owner, but it's Haslam who has assembled a coaching staff of rookies who are supposed to be teaching, but in reality are still learning. Pettine is one of those and has a real tough job- even experienced HCs would suffer at Cleveland right now. I'm sure history will repeat itself though. We need a lot more experienced coaches for starters.

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I gotta wonder about Jimmy a bit tho. The media only got a "no comment" outa him after the game and read all sorts of things in it.

No worse time to comment on the record that when you're frustrated/ pissed...

 

Just think what this place would be like if we all didn't follow this simple guideline.

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I would be willing to give pettine another year with the assumption that whomever is in charge of defensive player personnel groupings and the overcomplicated read/react defense is replaced with a more traditional defensive scheme i would prefer and 4~3 with an emphasis on Interior Blitzer's. But with pettine at the head i just dont think that will happen as he is firmly a rex ryan man. To be honest if you wouldn't accept rob ryan or rex ryan as your HC. I don't see pettine as much different. Personally i just want smashmouth football back in cleveland ohio. These gimmick players and coaches are getting old. Also i would love to shift away from zone running and move back into power running.

 

I doubt pettine will do the things i want to see...but...i have seen hope in him...the type of players he prefers fit that system both offensively and defensively and i am hoping with time he realizes that the "speedy playmaker" defense looks real pretty when it works but it doesn't win championships. It is just not consistent enough.

 

Farmer should be let go at the end of the season. I just think he and pettine have two completely different visions on what makes a team good and the result is this mixture of two competing ideals. If i had to pick one to keep and one to fire it would be pettine over farmer.

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No worse time to comment on the record that when you're frustrated/ pissed...Just think what this place would be like if we all didn't follow this simple guideline.

Not really what I meant tho. I'm thinking he might be changing his ways. What can he say? We suck? Fire em all? The worst right now might be to say "we're riding it out". But a no comment and walk away may just mean we get the same HC and gm next year. I can't see him hiring a new gm and make him keep the coach when it's his job to hire the hc. About the only real cure is to ride it out and get a team assembled under 1 gm hc combo.

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And Pettine sure comes off as a stand up guy....... He's got more backbone than the other 2 combined

Agreed....he's not perfect, but damned if he isnt trying....and he has the biggest balls any of our coaches have had in quite some time.....

 

 

Shit, we agree again. Hell has officially frozen.

Well....it is that time of year.... ;)

 

Great job Mud!

 

I don't understand why Pettine has to answer for the clusterfuck that Farmer has assembled every Monday.

 

Right.....and I dont blame him for getting a bit of attitude toward some of these guys.....he is human after all....

 

Its hard to stay happy, when you're working your ass off and you keep getting knocked back by people who arent....

 

Mud, you pist. but positive. keep steamrolling straight ahead!!

Yes eye am.....frustrated at leased.... ;)

 

Other than lame defenses of his logo, even Snyder is more scarce now in DC.

 

Yes he is.....though he has the one other team with 8 Coaches since 1999....

 

I know Jimmy wants to seem like he's one of those guys who wont "accept" losing, but sometimes those types of guys are the ones making irrational decisions.....

 

Jerry, Snyder and Davis come to mind quickly....

 

Id like to see if some Rooney rubbed off on him.....cause I dont think he has EVER fired a coach after one or 2 years.......

 

Its ok to be sold on something by Mud. ........ but Mud has pulled me back from the dark side.....

I got some land in Florida......

 

Glad you rejoined us and can now enjoy some Mudshine.... :)

 

I'm a Muddite too. As he has said previously you can't fire the owner, but it's Haslam who has assembled a coaching staff of rookies who are supposed to be teaching, but in reality are still learning. Pettine is one of those and has a real tough job- even experienced HCs would suffer at Cleveland right now. I'm sure history will repeat itself though. We need a lot more experienced coaches for starters.

There it is.....rookies make mistakes(coaches, players and owners).......

 

If the WHOLE team is made up of rookies.....there are gonna be MORE mistakes.....it's just common sense.....

 

Lets see how they develop before we start cutting em...... ;)

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I don't despise Pettine - but it's his defense that does not work, the Browns defensive

players are playing all out.

 

but they certainly look po'd after seeing that the defense is making them look foolish.

and with the frustration goes mistakes.

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I agree with a lot of your original post. Injuries happen to just about every team in the NFL, so it's the responsibility of the GM to have the cupboard stocked at least A LITTLE bit so the drop off isn't so cataclysmic. When is the last time we drafted an impact player in the first round? I mean, it's not THAT hard. How many people were screaming for Derek Carr? Anthony Barr? Aaron Donald? Even Bridgewater isn't doing too poorly, and the reason is he plays on a team that can RUN THE BALL and has a decent defense. What about all of the WR's Farmer whiffed on, and then in his typical arrogant self, he says that the WR position isn't that important (I'm paraphrasing, but he said something like that).

 

Here's the thing: Just because we fire Pettine and his staff, doesn't mean that we're going to be able to find somebody BETTER. Farmer has to go too, right? What coach worth his salt will want a job with no security, a joke of a GM, and a culture that won't allow for 3-4 years of building? I've heard some say Gruden was advocating for the job, but I didn't get that sense at all. I think he was just pointing out the massive failures of our team as a whole. Mud has kind of changed my mind a little bit in regards to thinking it was all a scheme problem. Does Pettine deserve some blame? Of course he does, but he hasn't exactly been given the keys to a high performing squad, and his talent level is extremely poor. We don't have ANY talent (for the most part), and Pettine doesn't really have a say in that.

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but they certainly look po'd after seeing that the defense is making them look foolish.

 

 

Perspective is everything I guess.....Im thinking the players are making Pettine look foolish.....

 

Cal....you cant go on about our lack of talent, then blame coaching when we "continue" to lose.......this team hasnt been good for 20 years, so how is it that Pettine suddenly made them bad?....and if he has made them bad, WHEN did we get good?

 

Does Pettine deserve some blame? Of course he does, but he hasn't exactly been given the keys to a high performing squad....

Yes he does....and NO he hasnt.....agreed

 

I want Pettine to go to Clock Management Rehab, and drop the whole "We Own that" shit. I would be willing to give him another year if both conditions are met.

Yeah...ok....rookie errors, which we all knew would happen....but still cry when it does.....(no saying the NEXT rookie wont do the same).....

 

And owning it is better than not......too bad more of our players dont do the same......

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Cal....you cant go on about our lack of talent, then blame coaching when we "continue" to lose.......this team hasnt been good for 20 years, so how is it that Pettine suddenly made them bad?....and if he has made them bad, WHEN did we get good?

First half of 2014... remember? We were in first place and everything.

 

Hadn't thought about it until now, but the contrast between the elation created by that period of overachievement and the despair of our 2015 performance may make the fall seem a lot greater than it actually has been.

 

Add that we thought we knew why we fell off in late 2014 and felt we'd addressed the issues...

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