RoyceRolls Posted December 18, 2015 Report Share Posted December 18, 2015 I haven't been around much lately, so I'm not sure if this has already been talked to death or not. I was listening to the Radio last month and heard an interview of the Browns defensive line coach, Anthony Weaver. He said something that piqued my interest when he asserted that at the end of the season, Danny Shelton will probably have similar numbers to Haloti Ngata's rookie campaign. Weaver said he was just comparing similarly built players playing the same position, and didn't know Ngata's rookie numbers off hand. I made a mental note to check up on the numbers at the time, but promptly forgot to do so until one of Tour's comments about Shelton in another thread reminded me of the conversation. It turns out that Shelton is on pace to almost exactly duplicate Ngata's rookie totals for tackles, and needs one sack to tie him in that category as well. after comparing the stats I found http://www.ohio.com/sports/browns/browns-defensive-line-coach-isn-t-worried-about-rookie-danny-shelton-s-lack-of-production-1.642583 The author did the legwork of matching up what the coach said to the data. I know we live in a very impatient society, but odds are good that at the end of the season people will be calling Shelton a bust for having numbers that look pretty similar to rookie numbers of a 9 year veteran who has gone to 5 pro bowls... Before I get flamed for being a homer in rose colored glasses, this isn't to say that Shelton IS the next Ngata, this is just saying that whats important in determining what Shelton will be in the NFL is yet to be seen. If he continues to follow a career arch similar to Haloti then he becomes a great first round pick, if not, well.....just another bust to toss on top of the pile. I am a well documented optimist, however, and do personally believe that Shelton, as well as Cooper and Orchard will develop into very important players for the front 7 of this Browns defense in the years to come. It may not look like it now, but that's why people in football say it takes 3 years to evaluate a draft class....lets see. P.S. if this is a redundant post, just give it the ax. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Couch Pulls Out Posted December 18, 2015 Report Share Posted December 18, 2015 I haven't been around much lately, so I'm not sure if this has already been talked to death or not. I was listening to the Radio last month and heard an interview of the Browns defensive line coach, Anthony Weaver. He said something that piqued my interest when he asserted that at the end of the season, Danny Shelton will probably have similar numbers to Haloti Ngata's rookie campaign. Weaver said he was just comparing similarly built players playing the same position, and didn't know Ngata's rookie numbers off hand. I made a mental note to check up on the numbers at the time, but promptly forgot to do so until one of Tour's comments about Shelton in another thread reminded me of the conversation. It turns out that Shelton is on pace to almost exactly duplicate Ngata's rookie totals for tackles, and needs one sack to tie him in that category as well. after comparing the stats I found http://www.ohio.com/sports/browns/browns-defensive-line-coach-isn-t-worried-about-rookie-danny-shelton-s-lack-of-production-1.642583 The author did the legwork of matching up what the coach said to the data. I know we live in a very impatient society, but odds are good that at the end of the season people will be calling Shelton a bust for having numbers that look pretty similar to rookie numbers of a 9 year veteran who has gone to 5 pro bowls... Before I get flamed for being a homer in rose colored glasses, this isn't to say that Shelton IS the next Ngata, this is just saying that whats important in determining what Shelton will be in the NFL is yet to be seen. If he continues to follow a career arch similar to Haloti then he becomes a great first round pick, if not, well.....just another bust to toss on top of the pile. I am a well documented optimist, however, and do personally believe that Shelton, as well as Cooper and Orchard will develop into very important players for the front 7 of this Browns defense in the years to come. It may not look like it now, but that's why people in football say it takes 3 years to evaluate a draft class....lets see. P.S. if this is a redundant post, just give it the ax. Refreshing to see. There are some on here who claim they know what they are talking about, yet believe that Shelton is a major bust. I voiced these same opinions a few weeks ago and was summarily called an idiot...so be prepared. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyceRolls Posted December 18, 2015 Author Report Share Posted December 18, 2015 probably the same folks calling for Orchard's head. that is, until he registered 2 sacks last week... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted December 18, 2015 Report Share Posted December 18, 2015 I think the aspect of being patient with Shelton because he will turn into what we all think and hope he would be is right on, baby. I mean....sometimes rookies play like rookies, then become the stud that they were projected to be. Sometimes rookies continue to play like rookies and never develop. I will vote for Shelton in the "Future Stud" column. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted December 18, 2015 Report Share Posted December 18, 2015 I hope to see more of Orchard, Cooper and Gaines the next 3 games. I've said for some time that Shelton just needs time to change about 50 lbs. of that body into muscle. That takes time even with a good S & C coach. He should get better if he works with one in the off season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted December 18, 2015 Report Share Posted December 18, 2015 Im with ya RR.....think he had a pretty solid start and did what was expected....took up a lot of space and double teams..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieHardBrownsFan Posted December 18, 2015 Report Share Posted December 18, 2015 Pillsbury dough boy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miktoxic Posted December 18, 2015 Report Share Posted December 18, 2015 loved the shelton pick. everyone needs time to grow and develop......unless you are a cranky old man. thens it's time shrivel and shrink. or in my case strink. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gumby73 Posted December 18, 2015 Report Share Posted December 18, 2015 Good work Royce. Malcolm Brown was the other NT out of Texas that went to Pats. to compare too. The O'Neil system I still question? Than pulling him on 3rd down is a whole other question? But I do not question Danny or Cam,(now seeing the NFL game) What they got to do to get better & staying positive about it. Danny's got the upper body & strong hands to match, but the short arms don't help when he's getting pulled into blocks. When he can get a swim move with his hands than some hips that can swing around it with some legs that can move he will be unstoppable with prober body training & coaching. Cam has a lot more work in sizing up than proper footwork to stay in balance & I am still screaming at Farmer that the pick was Shane Ray.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canton Mike Posted December 19, 2015 Report Share Posted December 19, 2015 Good thread RR. I have also read what you have about Danny & Ngata. I haven't been able to find it, but I'm betting Ngata played more snaps as a rookie than Danny has. I don't think we have to worry about Shelton at all. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyin J Posted December 19, 2015 Report Share Posted December 19, 2015 The value of Shelton (or any other NT) cant be found in personal stats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted December 19, 2015 Report Share Posted December 19, 2015 I made a mental note to check up on the numbers at the time, but promptly forgot to do so until one of Tour's comments about Shelton in another thread reminded me of the conversation. The bust label laid on Shelton based on his stats just felt out of place to me based upon what I thought I understood his role to be... a block eater. Good digging... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted December 20, 2015 Report Share Posted December 20, 2015 Shelton.... a block eater. And it looks like he's eaten more than a few , too..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D Bone Posted December 20, 2015 Report Share Posted December 20, 2015 Stats can be misleading, and I'll give a quick example. Say the stats for a RB are 11-58 rushing and 7-56-1TD receiving........ Looks like a very good day, and fans would wonder why he didn't get the ball more. What the stats don't show is that the team was down 31-9 with 8:00 to go in the 4th, and the opposing team went into a soft shell prevent defense, with several 2nd teamers on the field, while the RB's losing team went into a hurry up, no huddle offense, going for it on 4th down twice - one time in their own territory.. In that 8 minutes of "fantasy stats garbage time", the RB caught 6 dump off passes for 50yds, with one of them being a TD to make the score 31-15. He also ripped off a 29yd run on a draw play on 3rd and 17. .........So looking at the stats before garbage time, the RB was 10-29 and 1-6....... Hardly a very good day. So all of that said, you may have derived that I'm not a "stats guy", and you'd be correct - minus the score board stat that is. I have watched Danny all year, and there is no way he has had the impact on our defense as Haloti did for his defense....... Sorry, he just hasn't. Hopefully this offseason he gets himself into a true, professional athlete physical shape, and if he does, that will certainly help and may be what he needs to turn into the monster we all hoped he would be. I wouldn't call Danny a bust yet, but he hasn't had the type of season that I hoped he would when the Browns wrote his name down on the card...... and for the record, Danny was THE ONLY NAME that I agreed with, and would've written down myself if I were GM, of the four 1st round picks that we have had the last two years. I really like Danny the person too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaconHound Posted December 20, 2015 Report Share Posted December 20, 2015 I liked the Shelton pick but to this point think he's under performed. Phil Taylor was better in his rookie campaign. He's not a bust but needs to improve quite a bit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieHardBrownsFan Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 Shelton is a pig. Way out of shape and getting beaten all the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 I liked the Shelton pick but to this point think he's under performed. Phil Taylor was better in his rookie campaign. He's not a bust but needs to improve quite a bit Agree about Big Phil, but that was then... Danny will never have the range Phil once did, but may remain tougher to move for a long time. Regardless, it was nice to see Danny blow up that run early today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaconHound Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 Agree about Big Phil, but that was then... Danny will never have the range Phil once did, but may remain tougher to move for a long time. Regardless, it was nice to see Danny blow up that run early today. And toss the back to the ground like a rag doll Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canton Dawg Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 I liked the Shelton pick but to this point think he's under performed. Phil Taylor was better in his rookie campaign. He's not a bust but needs to improve quite a bit I wanted Shelton as the Browns first pick, but I think he needs some additional strength conditioning. He's certainly got the motor to be successful. Regardless, it was nice to see Danny blow up that run early today.That was awesome! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D Bone Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 Agree about Big Phil, but that was then... Danny will never have the range Phil once did, but may remain tougher to move for a long time. Regardless, it was nice to see Danny blow up that run early today. That was a heck of a play, and one that I expected to see multiple times per game all season long. I'm a little bothered that it took playing back home in Washington to bring it out, but it was good to see nonetheless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbedward Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 Maybe we shouldn't call him a bust yet. Get him the right strength and conditioning program through camp next year and I expect a much better sophomore season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LBC mike Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 I like Shelton. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comeonman Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 Shelton for prez Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiggins7919 Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 That was a pretty impressive tackle for loss he had at the goal line. We got them to 3rd down, but of course we gave up a wide open touchdown pass. Not that it really would've mattered, but we have to be the easiest team to score on in the red zone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 Again another game with flashes and then some rookie moments. Just keep working the finer things of the position, keep that motor running and continue working with NFL S&C coaches while working on maintaining a healthy weight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 Shelton will be fine. A good player who needs to refine his technique after being slightly reliant on superior strength at the college level. We have bigger issues than him. Much like we have bigger issues that QB, or OL, at least talent-wise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted December 21, 2015 Report Share Posted December 21, 2015 Shelton is a pig. Way out of shape and getting beaten all the time. I think he could be a beast with the loss of just a few pound....and by a few I mean like 35-40. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted December 22, 2015 Report Share Posted December 22, 2015 Come on, he can collapse most any pocket, he has a sky high motor, and he can be seen chasing down wr's cutting across field.... and, go back and look - he sent a guy to the ground, and leaped through the air over him like superman and made the tackle for loss. Shelton is one of the last players to bitch about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Opal312 Posted December 22, 2015 Report Share Posted December 22, 2015 Shelton will get better with experience. So will Orchard, Cooper, Gaines and Erving. I heard Erving will take over for Greco. Since we can't get the games I just watch the few televised nationally. I was wondering if Erving will end up as center next year. And what is the status on the cornerback we drafted. His name is too hard to remember but he hasn't played dur to an injury in college. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiggins7919 Posted December 22, 2015 Report Share Posted December 22, 2015 Shelton will be fine. A good player who needs to refine his technique after being slightly reliant on superior strength at the college level. We have bigger issues than him. Much like we have bigger issues that QB, or OL, at least talent-wise. That's a good point. He probably didn't have to rely as much on technique in college due to being so powerful, and that crap doesn't generally work in the NFL. As a fan, it's difficult to temper one's expectations when your team takes a player so high in the draft. I know I was hoping for so much more. A few sacks, some stuffs on 4th down, and so on. That's not realistic for a rookie NT, and not every DT is going to be Aaron Donald (lord I wish we had him). Big Dan will be ok. I don't think he'll ever be Haloti Ngata, but the comparisons exist for obvious reasons. Ngata was superhuman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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