Ohio gun store owner declines rifle sale

[Legacy Fan]

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/03/28/cops-gun-store-owner-stopped-would-be-campus-shooter.html

 

Paraphrasing: Owner didn't feel good about the potential purchaser's intentions and current state of mind and chose not to sell the rifle to him. Passed the background check. Went with his gut. Good for him. Turns out there was a prior involuntary mental health hospitalization.

 

 

But "too many clips" "scary" "full auto" are the problems.

[Legacy Fan]

Not going to speculate about "stopping a mass shooting" as the article title suggests

[Westside Steve]

Thank you hipa laws for making any kind of background check useless.

 

WSS

[LogicIsForSquares]

Thank you hipa laws for making any kind of background check useless.

 

WSS

That is at the heart of why background checks fail when it comes to mental health history. Those who scream the loudest about better background checks also would raise hell about HIPAA violations.

[Clevfan4life]

There's an easy fix for that. I don't think anybody would advocate allowing a gun store owner to peruse someone's mental health records and come to their own conclusion. All that needs to happen is that someone with a history of mental health disorders be put on the list. That list needs to be appealable unless there's some severe violent past on there....but all that needs to happen is that the gun store owner see's that the individual is on the do not buy list. Problem solved for the most part. There might be people on there that feel they got put on there unfairly cause they were depressed at some earlier stage in their lives and went in for medication....those people need an avenue of appeal obviously.

[calfoxwc]

Sorry, Cleve, but I ran out of "thumbs ups" or I would have done three in a row....

 

good posts.

 

The problem, is that with the left, everything turns into a political weapon. Of course,

people with serious mental problems, officially designated as such, should be on the list.

 

The trouble is, the left will use that for devious political advantage. So many of the left

would have the "no buy list" become a farce for political advantage. And that, sadly,

is why so much doesn't get accomplished to solve problems.

 

Just one example, ObaMao style:

 

http://lexingtonlibertarian.blogspot.com/2012/04/global-warming-deniers-are-mentally-ill.html

 

Global Warming Deniers Are Mentally Ill Says Professor

 

If you can't win the debate with facts - and in science isn't that the scientific method, with proven facts - then you trash your opponents and declare them to be off their rocker. That's where we are now with the man made Global warming debate.

 

As we know, the great global warming alarmism Ponzi scheme is looking extremely vulnerable at the moment. Global warming has stopped. There's a growing public backlash against eco-taxes, ugly flickery lightbulbs, higher energy bills, bat chomping eco-crucifixes and all the other paraphernalia of the environmental religion. And unfortunately, as we saw in '44 and '45, what these kind of people do when they get backed into a corner is not surrender but get nastier and more devious.

We've seen this recently in the Fakegate affair. And in Leo Hickman of the Guardian'scontemptible "expose" of one of the hitherto anonymous donors of the Global Warming Policy Foundation. And in the Planet Under Pressurecomedy conference staged last week by comedy organisations including the Royal Society, mainly in order to try to breathe new life into the stagnant, green-tinged corpse of climate alarmism.

 

One of the speakers at Planet Under Pressure claimed – in apparent seriousness – that climate scepticism was an illness that needed to be treated.

Scepticism regarding the need for immediate and massive action against carbon emissions is a sickness of societies and individuals which needs to be "treated", according to an Oregon-based professor of "sociology and environmental studies". Professor Kari Norgaard compares the struggle against climate scepticism to that against racism and slavery in the US South.

 

Prof Norgaard holds a B.S. in biology and a master's and PhD in sociology.

"Over the past ten years I have published and taught in the areas of environmental sociology, gender and environment, race and environment, climate change, sociology of culture, social movements and sociology of emotions," she says.

[bbedward]

I always wondered how they made these determinations.

 

When you buy a gun or get CHL they ask you stuff like if you've ever been committed to a mental institution and such. But they certainly don't have any way to verify it if you just check "No" right?

[Clevfan4life]

You're not entirely wrong on this....but you can leave out the global warming analogy because it has no place here.

 

Sorry, Cleve, but I ran out of "thumbs ups" or I would have done three in a row....

 

good posts.

 

The problem, is that with the left, everything turns into a political weapon. Of course,

people with serious mental problems, officially designated as such, should be on the list.

 

The trouble is, the left will use that for devious political advantage. So many of the left

would have the "no buy list" become a farce for political advantage. And that, sadly,

is why so much doesn't get accomplished to solve problems.

 

Just one example, ObaMao style:

 

http://lexingtonlibertarian.blogspot.com/2012/04/global-warming-deniers-are-mentally-ill.html

 

Global Warming Deniers Are Mentally Ill Says Professor

 

If you can't win the debate with facts - and in science isn't that the scientific method, with proven facts - then you trash your opponents and declare them to be off their rocker. That's where we are now with the man made Global warming debate.

 

As we know, the great global warming alarmism Ponzi scheme is looking extremely vulnerable at the moment. Global warming has stopped. There's a growing public backlash against eco-taxes, ugly flickery lightbulbs, higher energy bills, bat chomping eco-crucifixes and all the other paraphernalia of the environmental religion. And unfortunately, as we saw in '44 and '45, what these kind of people do when they get backed into a corner is not surrender but get nastier and more devious.

We've seen this recently in the Fakegate affair. And in Leo Hickman of the Guardian'scontemptible "expose" of one of the hitherto anonymous donors of the Global Warming Policy Foundation. And in the Planet Under Pressurecomedy conference staged last week by comedy organisations including the Royal Society, mainly in order to try to breathe new life into the stagnant, green-tinged corpse of climate alarmism.

 

One of the speakers at Planet Under Pressure claimed – in apparent seriousness – that climate scepticism was an illness that needed to be treated.

Scepticism regarding the need for immediate and massive action against carbon emissions is a sickness of societies and individuals which needs to be "treated", according to an Oregon-based professor of "sociology and environmental studies". Professor Kari Norgaard compares the struggle against climate scepticism to that against racism and slavery in the US South.

 

Prof Norgaard holds a B.S. in biology and a master's and PhD in sociology.

"Over the past ten years I have published and taught in the areas of environmental sociology, gender and environment, race and environment, climate change, sociology of culture, social movements and sociology of emotions," she says.

 

 

[LogicIsForSquares]

I always wondered how they made these determinations.

 

When you buy a gun or get CHL they ask you stuff like if you've ever been committed to a mental institution and such. But they certainly don't have any way to verify it if you just check "No" right?

Yeah it is the honor system. The criminal background is checked but they can't get access to medical records to confirm whether or not the applicant is lying.

[Westside Steve]

Actually in case anybody thought background checks were actually worth anything they could be done this way:

A person wishing to purchase a firearm would go to a government office sign over his authority to look at any and all medical misdemeanor and criminal records and be issued a permit without specifics. That way the gun shop proprietor or private citizen would never know whether or not the guy beat the fuck out of his wife or anything that came close to but didn't exactly bar him from buying a gun.

 

WSS

[LogicIsForSquares]

Actually in case anybody thought background checks were actually worth anything they could be done this way:

A person wishing to purchase a firearm would go to a government office sign over his authority to look at any and all medical misdemeanor and criminal records and be issued a permit without specifics. That way the gun shop proprietor or private citizen would never know whether or not the guy beat the fuck out of his wife or anything that came close to but didn't exactly bar him from buying a gun.

 

WSS

A domestic abuse charge will get your right to own a firearm taken away. That said, I think the background check just says someone is excluded and nothing of what caused the exclusion. If they eased HIPAA laws, the same thing could be done. The only person who would know if Jimbo used to smear poop in his hair and run in traffic would be his mental health professional.

[Westside Steve]

So a domestic misdemeanor bumps you off the list? How about public urination which will get you listed as a sex offender? How about antidepressant use? Nervous breakdown? Restraining orders? Public intoxication? Disturbing the peace like participating in a brawl. How much leeway is there?

 

WSS

[LogicIsForSquares]

So a domestic misdemeanor bumps you off the list? How about public urination which will get you listed as a sex offender? How about antidepressant use? Nervous breakdown? Restraining orders? Public intoxication? Disturbing the peace like participating in a brawl. How much leeway is there?

 

WSS

Of that list, only the public intox will not end up in a denial for purchase of a firearm haha.

[jbluhm86]

 

If you have the time, I highly recommend listening to this podcast with Scotty Reitz. They go over guns, gun violence, gun training, and police training. It was really informative and they had a great discussion about gun control.

 

"In this episode of the Waking Up podcast, Sam Harris speaks with Scott Reitz about guns, gun control, police violence, and related topics.

Scott Reitz is a thirty-year veteran of the Los Angeles Police department. He worked in the elite Metropolitan Division and finally as a member of ‘D’ platoon (SWAT). He remained there for ten years until he became the primary firearms and tactics instructor for the whole of Metro Division and all LAPD advanced in-service firearms/tactics training. In addition to his work with the LAPD, Reitz has worked with U.S. Department of Energy, US Marine Corps, U.S. Army Delta, Naval Special Warfare’s Team 6 and Air Task Force assets that support special operations. He is also one of a very few firearms instructors who is a Federal and Superior Court qualified expert in deadly force, training, safety, and police tactics. Reitz has testified in the defense of police, F.B.I., U.S. Secret Service, and B.A.T.F., and consulted in many high profile cases. Reitz is also the author of The Art of Modern Gunfighting: The Pistol (Volume 1)."

For more information please visit his website: www.internationaltactical.com

[One Post]

Then how in the heck did bbedward get one?

[bbedward]

Then how in the heck did bbedward get one?

I got my CHL too

[One Post]

I got my CHL too

:/