jiggins7919 Posted August 31, 2016 Report Share Posted August 31, 2016 http://www.espn.com/blog/cleveland/post/_/id/1892/paul-krugers-release-leaves-browns-with-three-career-sacks-from-their-outside-linebackers 1. Next men up: Paul Kruger had only 2.5 sacks in 2015, his third year with the Browns. But those are still almost equal to the career sack total left at the position of outside linebacker. Nate Orchard’s 3 sacks as a rookie are the only ones turned in by the Browns’ roster of outside linebackers. Orchard likely will be joined by second-round rookie draft pick Emmanuel Ogbah as the starting edge rushers. The backups are also unproven -- rookie fourth-round pick Joe Schobert of Wisconsin, and Cam Johnson, a 2015 practice squad pickup who technically is in his third NFL season. Ogbah now will be returned to outside linebacker – the position for which he was earmarked and trained during the minicamp season – after spending most of training camp at 3-4 defensive end. “I was actually still studying the plays, so it won’t be that hard a transition to go back to outside linebacker,” Ogbah said. (Famous last words. The transition from college defensive end to 3-4 outside linebacker has challenged so many before him. Having been switched twice already would seem to complicate his learning process.) Anyway, they say the truest indicator of an NFL sack artist is his college production. Orchard led the nation with 18.5 his last year at Utah and Ogbah was fourth his last year at Oklahoma State with 13. “Obviously, guys are bigger, faster, but at end of the day, where you come from is who you are,” Orchard said. “You have to fine-tune techniques, things like that. But it’s something you shouldn’t look away from and shy from even if you have a season of three sacks like myself (as a rookie).” 2. Predictable reaction: Orchard, Ogbah and veteran cornerback Joe Haden all used the same word to describe the reaction in the locker room to Kruger’s release – shock. Rookies like Ogbah are only getting introduced to the business of the NFL. They’ll learn more after the final cuts. Orchard, who said Kruger was a mentor to him since Orchard joined the team last year, said, “At end of day, I think it’s surprising to all of us to see him go. It was shocking.” Haden’s reaction was insightful. “It was a shock. But this business, I’m telling you, it never surprises me. You always have one or two every year that you kind of scratch your head over, a dude you thought would be part of the change. It’s a tough business. Paul is one of my best friends on the team. It just happened to go that way. It was definitely a surprise.” Haden doesn’t think the move was made solely to clear the way for the younger players. “It just shows guys, you’ve got to be making plays. It’s a what have you done for me lately business. If you’re not making plays, anybody can be gone. It’s about making plays, it’s about winning. That’s the thing they’re talking about all the time. It just shows being friendly with coach or having a personal relationship doesn’t matter. It’s all about what are you doing on that field.” Uhhhhh...guys. I knew we didn't have much, but did I just read that we now have three career sacks among our most important pass-rushing position?! I would actually love to see a comparison of who the next team is regarding this stat. I'm assuming we HAVE to be last in the league, right? Listen, Kruger looked awful for a while now. Even though he's Mud's favorite player, his performance did not match up to his salary. Problem is, we have to have people that can step in and get to the QB. I'm not saying that because we lost Kruger and some other guys that we're now going to suck. That's not the point because I'm pretty confident that this season will be...uh...challenging regardless. Ray Horton LOVES to blitz, that much I remember. Hopefully Horton can adjust to the personnel we have because if he blitzes the guys we have now, we're going to get TOASTED. I realize it was preseason, but when I saw us blitz against the Bucs...it looked like we just got swallowed up and it didn't make an impact. The sky isn't falling, I don't hate this team, and I'm not trying to be negative, I'm just trying to figure out WHO THE HELL is going to make plays for us on defense? Maybe this is what people mean when they say, "It will take time to turn around this franchise." Our issue with THAT is we've heard that crap for how many years? Time to dial up the patience once again and hope beyond hope that we have multiple guys who REALLY step it up and play better than they ever have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted August 31, 2016 Report Share Posted August 31, 2016 So the over/under for Krug's LOLB slot is 2.5 sacks? Put me down for the over. Loved Haden's quotes: "... a shock... but never surprises me." "... best friend... (but) being friendly with coach or having a personal relationship doesn’t matter. It’s all about what are you doing on that field.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrb12711 Posted August 31, 2016 Report Share Posted August 31, 2016 The sky isn't falling, I don't hate this team, and I'm not trying to be negative, I'm just trying to figure out WHO THE HELL is going to make plays for us on defense? Maybe this is what people mean when they say, "It will take time to turn around this franchise." Our issue with THAT is we've heard that crap for how many years? Time to dial up the patience once again and hope beyond hope that we have multiple guys who REALLY step it up and play better than they ever have. That's the thing, we don't know but there's plenty of young guys who can prove themselves. I guarantee somebody on this team can match the production of Kruger, hell I'd bet $100 on that. All we can do at this point is wait and see right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unsympathetic Posted August 31, 2016 Report Share Posted August 31, 2016 Kruger was the ultimate LOL backer.. in that he was laughable. Because he sucks, you see! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiggins7919 Posted August 31, 2016 Author Report Share Posted August 31, 2016 That's the thing, we don't know but there's plenty of young guys who can prove themselves. I guarantee somebody on this team can match the production of Kruger, hell I'd bet $100 on that. All we can do at this point is wait and see right? Yep, and that's what drove the deal. Can we save $5 million a year and play our young guys that probably will match or possibly exceed Kruger's performance? Mud has been clamoring for this for A WHILE, and when you really watch Kruger play lately, you saw what he was talking about. I hate to agree with someone like Mud, but there you have it! (hehe, j/k bro) What this defense is absolutely DYING FOR is a breakout player. Someone that just all of the sudden "gets it", and the lights turn on. Problem for us is, we need that to happen at several positions. People on this board probably know that I am not a Danny Shelton fan (as of now). Yes, he's young, but I haven't seen much that tells me he should've been drafted where he was, and I haven't seen any progress made from last year. Not getting production out of our top picks is one of the very top reasons are team has struggled for so long. But can we have someone like Orchard turn into a beast? Can we have that rookie that explodes onto the scene? (ahem, Ogbah/Nassib). Can a player like Kirksey blossom into a consistent force in the middle? The good news is, we knew we needed pass rushers, and we drafted two of them. Our team addressed the need, and as the previous poster said, now we wait and see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hx214 Posted August 31, 2016 Report Share Posted August 31, 2016 How many games did Bryant end up getting suspended for? 4? or is it more? If his dumb ass can stay out of trouble, he should be able to produce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombo Posted August 31, 2016 Report Share Posted August 31, 2016 Oggie and Orchard will get after the QB better than Kruger and will cover and tackle better too ... so... Nassib and Schobert will bring the heat too, and if Bryant goes back in there after 4 games it'll be a big boost, he plays mean. Did having Paul Kruger starting really give comfort to anybody? He was just in these guys' way. Paul gave good effort, I'm not going to beseech him for that. But he was unproductive on a bad contract ... you guys know how the NFL works, right? Zombo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiggins7919 Posted August 31, 2016 Author Report Share Posted August 31, 2016 I didn't mention Armonty Bryant because I honestly don't know what his status is. The last I heard was that he is serving a four game suspension BUT it could be extended pending the outcome of his criminal proceedings. Now that his case is officially closed, I don't remember if his suspension was addressed. If/when we DO get him back, he can definitely bring some heat to the QB. I have no idea what kind of shape he's in or anything like that, but here's to hoping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted August 31, 2016 Report Share Posted August 31, 2016 Armonty is done as an nfl player. And even if he was here for camp and at 100% he wasnt give but maybe one or teo more sacks then kruger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted August 31, 2016 Report Share Posted August 31, 2016 http://www.espn.com/blog/cleveland/post/_/id/1892/paul-krugers-release-leaves-browns-with-three-career-sacks-from-their-outside-linebackers 1. Next men up: Paul Kruger had only 2.5 sacks in 2015, his third year with the Browns. But those are still almost equal to the career sack total left at the position of outside linebacker. Nate Orchard’s 3 sacks as a rookie are the only ones turned in by the Browns’ roster of outside linebackers. Orchard likely will be joined by second-round rookie draft pick Emmanuel Ogbah as the starting edge rushers. The backups are also unproven -- rookie fourth-round pick Joe Schobert of Wisconsin, and Cam Johnson, a 2015 practice squad pickup who technically is in his third NFL season. Ogbah now will be returned to outside linebacker – the position for which he was earmarked and trained during the minicamp season – after spending most of training camp at 3-4 defensive end. “I was actually still studying the plays, so it won’t be that hard a transition to go back to outside linebacker,” Ogbah said. (Famous last words. The transition from college defensive end to 3-4 outside linebacker has challenged so many before him. Having been switched twice already would seem to complicate his learning process.) Anyway, they say the truest indicator of an NFL sack artist is his college production. Orchard led the nation with 18.5 his last year at Utah and Ogbah was fourth his last year at Oklahoma State with 13. “Obviously, guys are bigger, faster, but at end of the day, where you come from is who you are,” Orchard said. “You have to fine-tune techniques, things like that. But it’s something you shouldn’t look away from and shy from even if you have a season of three sacks like myself (as a rookie).” 2. Predictable reaction: Orchard, Ogbah and veteran cornerback Joe Haden all used the same word to describe the reaction in the locker room to Kruger’s release – shock. Rookies like Ogbah are only getting introduced to the business of the NFL. They’ll learn more after the final cuts. Orchard, who said Kruger was a mentor to him since Orchard joined the team last year, said, “At end of day, I think it’s surprising to all of us to see him go. It was shocking.” Haden’s reaction was insightful. “It was a shock. But this business, I’m telling you, it never surprises me. You always have one or two every year that you kind of scratch your head over, a dude you thought would be part of the change. It’s a tough business. Paul is one of my best friends on the team. It just happened to go that way. It was definitely a surprise.” Haden doesn’t think the move was made solely to clear the way for the younger players. “It just shows guys, you’ve got to be making plays. It’s a what have you done for me lately business. If you’re not making plays, anybody can be gone. It’s about making plays, it’s about winning. That’s the thing they’re talking about all the time. It just shows being friendly with coach or having a personal relationship doesn’t matter. It’s all about what are you doing on that field.” Uhhhhh...guys. I knew we didn't have much, but did I just read that we now have three career sacks among our most important pass-rushing position?! I would actually love to see a comparison of who the next team is regarding this stat. I'm assuming we HAVE to be last in the league, right? Listen, Kruger looked awful for a while now. Even though he's Mud's favorite player, his performance did not match up to his salary. Problem is, we have to have people that can step in and get to the QB. I'm not saying that because we lost Kruger and some other guys that we're now going to suck. That's not the point because I'm pretty confident that this season will be...uh...challenging regardless. Ray Horton LOVES to blitz, that much I remember. Hopefully Horton can adjust to the personnel we have because if he blitzes the guys we have now, we're going to get TOASTED. I realize it was preseason, but when I saw us blitz against the Bucs...it looked like we just got swallowed up and it didn't make an impact. The sky isn't falling, I don't hate this team, and I'm not trying to be negative, I'm just trying to figure out WHO THE HELL is going to make plays for us on defense? Maybe this is what people mean when they say, "It will take time to turn around this franchise." Our issue with THAT is we've heard that crap for how many years? Time to dial up the patience once again and hope beyond hope that we have multiple guys who REALLY step it up and play better than they ever have. Ha!....preach it brother...preach... And, yeah, Id expect better production from Ogbah, than we got from Kruger....even if Ogbah sucks, because I promise, Kruger sucked hard.... Im hoping for Orchard to have a big year and Kirksey looks like he's progressed(again) and should be pretty solid in the middle... That D line???.....not so sure.....think it'll be another long year.....UNLESS, Shelton starts to play better and create a little havoc.....if that happens, THEN Nassib or Cooper will have a chance.....but think we will see LOTS of growing pains with these 3 guys.....and hopefully, the new rookies step to the plate a little quicker than what Shelton gave us last year.... Im also eager to see Campbell and Kindred getting reps.....they both have a nose for the ball....and even BETTER.....they both know how to tackle....YAY!....SO, maybe with them and Kirksey backing up that woeful line, we will see some? improvement in the run defense.....or maybe not.... 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Tour2ma Posted September 1, 2016 Report Share Posted September 1, 2016 Do I detect a note of optimism? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiggins7919 Posted September 1, 2016 Author Report Share Posted September 1, 2016 It's not so much optimism as it is "reality". We don't have a bevy of talent on defense (total shocker, I know). We're going to need at least another draft and round of free agents before we can start to consistently improve. We need some young bucks to show up in a big way, and show up early. It can happen. I'm not saying it WILL, but it can. Look at the production that Orchard, Ogbah, and Nassib had in college. They can obviously play the game, but they will now have to play it a MUCH higher level. We basically need to nail this recent draft, and if we did, maybe we can play a bit better than many of us think. We always say that the preseason is garbage and you can't take much from what you see, so let's try to keep that in mind. Maybe we were just dogging it in preseason so we can surprise everybody week 1! LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted September 1, 2016 Report Share Posted September 1, 2016 Do I detect a note of optimism? LOL! Mud is slooooooooowwwwwwly catching the first game fever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted September 1, 2016 Report Share Posted September 1, 2016 Do I detect a note of optimism? Well....I certainly dont think "every" player sucks....and I AM STILL A HUGE FAN(hence my anger, instead of apathy).....none the less, it is hope, more than anything.... Campbell & Orchard have had my attention since they were drafted and feel like they'll be OK....Kirksey too, slowly but surely getting better as well......Ogbah wasnt one who excited me before the draft(or anybody else here, I might add), but now that he's a Brown, he will get the same support Ive always given our rookies......as long as he's not an asshole drunken midget, Im good! LOL! Mud is slooooooooowwwwwwly catching the first game fever. I always have game fever......mad or not, wouldnt miss a snap..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob806 Posted September 2, 2016 Report Share Posted September 2, 2016 I'm glad we have a young and hungry LB crew. I think they'll improve every game. Question- do they keep Scooby? I hope so, the guy is a throwback, knows how to tackle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombo Posted September 2, 2016 Report Share Posted September 2, 2016 I'm glad we have a young and hungry LB crew. I think they'll improve every game. Question- do they keep Scooby? I hope so, the guy is a throwback, knows how to tackle. That inside-linebacker room has some tough cuts coming up. Tuggle looked good last night, but I think he is last man out as you gotta keep Scooby for potential and heart, and Carder for experience and special teams. Z Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hx214 Posted September 2, 2016 Report Share Posted September 2, 2016 Armonty is done as an nfl player. And even if he was here for camp and at 100% he wasnt give but maybe one or teo more sacks then kruger. Played pretty well last night. Had two batted down balls in a row. On another note, just read Mingo had two forced fumbles last night.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted September 2, 2016 Report Share Posted September 2, 2016 On another note, just read Mingo had two forced fumbles last night.... I watched much of the game and saw both. To characterize the first as "forced" is a bit generous. NYG runner was going to ground and extended arm and ball away from his body. Mingo's hand brushed the ball as he dove onto the falling RB. Other one was a blindside of NYG QB rolling left, away from Mingo. QB had slowed and was turning to throw when Mingo arrived and cleanly swiped the ball out. Really bad choice by a backup QB that Mingo capitalized on. "Forced" is far more applicable here. Regardless Mingo was hustling like a player who just got a 2nd chance at a career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrownsKidd Posted September 2, 2016 Report Share Posted September 2, 2016 Any see this about Mingo. Two forced fumbles in a row... http://www.patspulpit.com/2016/9/1/12760910/can-t-make-this-up-former-browns-pass-rusher-barkevious-mingo-forces-back-to-fumbles-with-patriots As for our D, it's a live growing experiment right now. We're going to take it on the chin, but hopefully, our Offense will give us something to cheer for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flugel Posted September 4, 2016 Report Share Posted September 4, 2016 Oggie and Orchard will get after the QB better than Kruger and will cover and tackle better too ... so... Nassib and Schobert will bring the heat too, and if Bryant goes back in there after 4 games it'll be a big boost, he plays mean. Did having Paul Kruger starting really give comfort to anybody? He was just in these guys' way. Paul gave good effort, I'm not going to beseech him for that. But he was unproductive on a bad contract ... you guys know how the NFL works, right? Zombo Thatta boy! Doing old school proud since 1999! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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