hoorta Posted October 18, 2017 Report Share Posted October 18, 2017 20 hours ago, Harry Buffalo said: I think one of the most screwed up things this season, and I like Hue and I may be wrong, but I think Kessler is the most talented QB on the roster right now and Hue is refusing to use him because his skills don't mesh with how he wants to run the offense. This is my biggest reason for wanting Hue to have an OC and its because he will not talor his offense to the talent he has on hand. I mean Hogan isn't much different from Kessler, he doesn't have a rocket arm and he doesn't have any real talent out there to throw to, and he designed the game plan like Derek Anderson was running the show. Other than the win lose record last year, Kessler had great stats for a rookie, but Hue was very open about the fact that he wanted the ball pushed downfield and Kessler couldn't do it. Exactly- if Hue is married to his "system" and can't modify it to fit the talent he has on the roster, he should be gone. He's flip flopping from winning games to developing talent. Just hope Kizer develops enough to win a game or two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted October 18, 2017 Report Share Posted October 18, 2017 5 hours ago, Tour2ma said: I care that it's MKC! If she wants to take a victory lap over something she said last December, so be it. But after a ten month silence, it carries little weight with me... no matter the writer. And then there's this pearl: "I wrote it last December and I'm repeating it here: A personnel trio devoid of anyone who's ever assembled a winning football team isn't going to fly." We've had supposed assemblers of "winning football teams" heading up our org. They failed. Assemblers of winning football teams tend to stay employed by the orgs for whom they've built winners. Tour- there's this little tidbit from the MKC article that gets to the bottom of a lot of fan's grief. "There's no way the Browns (edit: insert any other team) should be 1-21 after having 24 draft picks in the last two seasons and more cap space than they know what to do with. They never expected to go 1-15 last season, and they certainly never envisioned 0-6 this year." OK, maybe she's fanning the flames of a fed up fanbase already on a short fuse ready to explode. But LOL, that guy you have on ignore could have written the article- in fact he was preaching it way before Mary Kay got around to it. Yeah- I hate the way he spouts off his messages- but you can certainly see he's not alone anymore with his POV. Of course hindsight is always 20\20. MHO? The only hope of keeping this regime intact is for Kizer to stop producing turnovers faster than a Pepperidge Farm Bakery. We might actually win a game or two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted October 18, 2017 Report Share Posted October 18, 2017 16 minutes ago, hoorta said: Tour- there's this little tidbit from the MKC article that gets to the bottom of a lot of fan's grief. "There's no way the Browns (edit: insert any other team) should be 1-21 after having 24 draft picks in the last two seasons and more cap space than they know what to do with. They never expected to go 1-15 last season, and they certainly never envisioned 0-6 this year." OK, maybe she's fanning the flames of a fed up fanbase already on a short fuse ready to explode. But LOL, that guy you have on ignore could have written the article- in fact he was preaching it way before Mary Kay got around to it. Yeah- I hate the way he spouts off his messages- but you can certainly see he's not alone anymore with his POV. Of course hindsight is always 20\20. MHO? The only hope of keeping this regime intact is for Kizer to stop producing turnovers faster than a Pepperidge Farm Bakery. We might actually win a game or two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D Bone Posted October 18, 2017 Report Share Posted October 18, 2017 1 hour ago, Marc1971 said: That draft cannot be underestimated in terms of how important it is. It should make or break the current regime. If it doesn't work crooked Jimmy should sell up. You're far more patient than I am, as I see the 2 previous drafts as cracking, if not breaking them already.... but yea, next year's draft will either be the nail in all of their coffins, or the beginning of a turn around..... finally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hempman Posted October 18, 2017 Report Share Posted October 18, 2017 Hue Jackson looks toast(and by his extension, Berry, since Hue had a large part of his coming to Cleveland). I think his poor coaching decisions and poor development has pissed the FO off. They didn't expect to win 10 games in the first 2 years, but he can't even barely get a win and whines about his failures. He wasn't the analytics guys choice in the first place. He sweet talked Jimmy with his BS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted October 18, 2017 Report Share Posted October 18, 2017 29 minutes ago, Hempman said: Hue Jackson looks toast(and by his extension, Berry, since Hue had a large part of his coming to Cleveland). I think his poor coaching decisions and poor development has pissed the FO off. They didn't expect to win 10 games in the first 2 years, but he can't even barely get a win and whines about his failures. He wasn't the analytics guys choice in the first place. He sweet talked Jimmy with his BS. Who exactly was the analytics fags choice then? Do u even remember how bad last offseason was with all those coaches going somewhere, anywhere, else but cleveland? No one wanted to come gere. We were astounded that jackson agreed. And the only DC that agreed to come here was a retread from the one year chudzinski era. No one wants to come here dude. Im not in the mood for another new coach announcement where we go "who"? The last guy we hired who i knew right away who he was, was mangini. Shurmur, chud, pettine.....i was like who the Shmuck is this now? Please, enough. I just hope to god haslem has the balls to ignore the Retarded section of the cleveland fan base.....for once. He's caved now what....2-3 times? With disastrous results? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darren15 Posted October 18, 2017 Report Share Posted October 18, 2017 Maybe the quarterback whisperer needs to start shouting instead Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gumby73 Posted October 18, 2017 Report Share Posted October 18, 2017 1 hour ago, hoorta said: Exactly- if Hue is married to his "system" and can't modify it to fit the talent he has on the roster, he should be gone. He's flip flopping from winning games to developing talent. Just hope Kizer develops enough to win a game or two. I want to be the fly on the wall between SB & Huie if and when AJ McCarron does become a FA..A guy that does know hue's system with no modification Vs. The 3 blind mice picking another rookie QB..stay tuned Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hempman Posted October 18, 2017 Report Share Posted October 18, 2017 QB play is overrated when the offensive design is flawed in the first place. Hue's ego has killed him again. He will be replaced and I won't cry a tear. All QB's will look bad. All the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D Bone Posted October 18, 2017 Report Share Posted October 18, 2017 1 hour ago, darren15 said: Maybe the quarterback whisperer needs to start shouting instead I was literally thinking about typing this exact sentence during breakfast today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc1971 Posted October 19, 2017 Report Share Posted October 19, 2017 11 hours ago, D Bone said: You're far more patient than I am, as I see the 2 previous drafts as cracking, if not breaking them already.... but yea, next year's draft will either be the nail in all of their coffins, or the beginning of a turn around..... finally. Believe me I'd love to blow it all up now, get all these losers out of our Browns. Problem is that we're in such a bad situation that next man up isn't going to improve anything. Might as well let the Hue-Sashi-Baseball train ride all the way to its final destination, whether that's gonna be a crash or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ibleedbrown Posted October 19, 2017 Report Share Posted October 19, 2017 I've been sick of regime changes since the Romeo o Romeo days, and that was like 10 years ago. Even after 2 crappyish seasons l was relieved they gave him a third year, and waddya know, we won 10 games that year. I agree all the losing sucks balls, but l'm willing to ride this out a little longer. I like some aspects of the plan, like creating a foundation on each side of the ball by addressing the line and moving outward. O line improved, D line improved, and then build outward from there with skill players on offense and the secondary on defense. If they want to throw another mind or 2 into the shot callers mix, that's fine, but the last thing l wanna see is another overhaul. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wargograw Posted October 19, 2017 Report Share Posted October 19, 2017 12 hours ago, Marc1971 said: Believe me I'd love to blow it all up now, get all these losers out of our Browns. Problem is that we're in such a bad situation that next man up isn't going to improve anything. Might as well let the Hue-Sashi-Baseball train ride all the way to its final destination, whether that's gonna be a crash or not. You’re learning Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted October 19, 2017 Report Share Posted October 19, 2017 On 10/18/2017 at 11:35 AM, DieHardBrownsFan said: She nailed it in that article. Fessup... you have a thing for her don't you, you oversexed sexagenarian... On 10/18/2017 at 12:14 PM, darren15 said: All those picks in 2018 ...we need someone with football knowledge to make the picks...not an executive with no footballing background and a baseball guy .... You're baiting me, aren't you? On 10/18/2017 at 3:17 PM, Hempman said: (Hue) wasn't the analytics guys choice in the first place. He sweet talked Jimmy with his BS. Praytell, who was the FO's first choice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted October 19, 2017 Report Share Posted October 19, 2017 On 10/18/2017 at 3:58 PM, gumby73 said: I want to be the fly on the wall between SB & Huie if and when AJ McCarron does become a FA..A guy that does know hue's system with no modification Vs. The 3 blind mice picking another rookie QB..stay tuned 23 hours ago, Hempman said: QB play is overrated when the offensive design is flawed in the first place. Hue's ego has killed him again. He will be replaced and I won't cry a tear. All QB's will look bad. All the time. Hey... HEMPHEAD! Answer the fooking question! 22 hours ago, D Bone said: I was literally thinking about typing this exact sentence during breakfast today. So you wake up like this? Geez, Bud... ride a bike or something... 7 hours ago, boo fagley said: I would interview every Super Bowl GM out of work. Shirley, you do see the paradox... 50 minutes ago, wargograw said: You’re learning That's learning? Oy vey... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaineDeSoulis Posted October 19, 2017 Report Share Posted October 19, 2017 i'm hearing Amy Trask may be an option Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dutch Oven Posted October 19, 2017 Report Share Posted October 19, 2017 8 hours ago, boo fagley said: Great football players dont always make great GMs. I would interview every Super Bowl GM out of work. Mike Tannenbaum too if he is between jobs. Different sport, but I doubt anyone would argue that Isiah Thomas and Michael Jordan were all-time great basketball players. They've been shitty running organizations. I think Peyton would be a great QB coach or Offensive Coordinator. Could be a great head coach. But being a GM or President of a team is a different animal. Once again, I'm not saying he couldn't be good at it, but man the Browns would be rolling the dice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wargograw Posted October 20, 2017 Report Share Posted October 20, 2017 7 hours ago, Tour2ma said: That's learning? Oy vey... Hey, baby steps, right? Btw, the "quote this" feature when you highlight part of someone's post is awesome. In the past I would have just ignored your post because I didn't feel like editing out everything other than the one line I was responding to. Great website. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc1971 Posted October 20, 2017 Report Share Posted October 20, 2017 5 hours ago, boo fagley said: So, you are saying that a GM that built a team good enough to reach a Super Bowl would be someone not to interview because they are not employed. Makes sense. What about John Dorsey? Drafted Rodgers and Mathews in Green Bay and built the Chiefs into a contender. KC let him go so he must be no good by your logic. Yeah, bring in some up and coming hotshot with no experience or track record and then in 3 years realize the guy is all hat and no cowboy. The point of it all is for the Browns to hire a GM and HC with several years of experience. Screw the on-the-job- training way of doing things. John Dorsey would be an excellent choice for Browns GM. Mike Tannenbaum and Rex Ryan would win a lot of games for Cleveland. Rex started losing in NY once Mangini's picks were phased out and he had brought his own in. Plus he nearly destroyed a solid Bills D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted October 20, 2017 Report Share Posted October 20, 2017 5 hours ago, boo fagley said: So, you are saying that a GM that built a team good enough to reach a Super Bowl would be someone not to interview because they are not employed. Makes sense. What about John Dorsey? Drafted Rodgers and Mathews in Green Bay and built the Chiefs into a contender. KC let him go so he must be no good by your logic. Yeah, bring in some up and coming hotshot with no experience or track record and then in 3 years realize the guy is all hat and no cowboy. The point of it all is for the Browns to hire a GM and HC with several years of experience. Screw the on-the-job- training way of doing things. John Dorsey would be an excellent choice for Browns GM. Mike Tannenbaum and Rex Ryan would win a lot of games for Cleveland. I understand your "point... When it comes to the FO, I simply could not disagree with it more. HC? TBD... You seemingly labor under the impression that GM's are the "superscout-decider" totally responsible "for building a Super Bowl winner"... and nothing else. In truth they are executives in an organization. They depend on others. They are responsible to others. Dorsey is a great example. No one denies that he has an eye for talent. Also not denied? That he does not work and play well with others. Something KC learned over time. In the end they decided his "talent" was not worth the toll he inflicted on their organization. I'd consider hiring Dorsey as a scout. I would not hire him in any supervisory capacity at any level of my organization. Browns did something similar when Sashi and Berry hired Ryan Grigson, who was installed as a direct report to Berry with no staff reporting Ryan. As for OJT... your short-term thinking is showing... and that is what is "screwy". You hire a guy to get good and you are as good as that guy is for as long as he is there. You build an organization, a learning organization and it can be sustained indefinitely. It is not as if the scouts hired have no experience in scouting... just not scouting in this organizational structure... a structure you apparently do not understand, let alone know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted October 20, 2017 Report Share Posted October 20, 2017 9 minutes ago, Marc1971 said: Rex started losing in NY once Mangini's picks were phased out and he had brought his own in. Plus he nearly destroyed a solid Bills D. Rex was just a barb intended to get under my skin... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gumby73 Posted October 21, 2017 Report Share Posted October 21, 2017 On 10/20/2017 at 7:22 AM, boo fagley said: What about John Dorsey? Drafted Rodgers and Mathews in Green Bay and built the Chiefs into a contender. KC let him go so he must be no good by your logic. The point of it all is for the Browns to hire a GM and HC with several years of experience. Screw the on-the-job- training way of doing things. John Dorsey would be an excellent choice for Browns GM. Mike Tannenbaum and Rex Ryan would win a lot of games for Cleveland. How would you like to be the guy that lights a fire under your QB's a$$ (Smith) with drafting MaHolmes, than follows ups by drafting Kareem Hunt? Than gets Fired, pretty much by Andy Reid imo? Dorsey & Gettleman bring far to much bull head-ness to a conscious "Good Camper" FO..Gettleman got fired for not wanting to extend Thomas Davis & Greg Olsen as veterans that Dave thought would take a $ hit to improve rest of roster..Now that part fits this office.What is your thoughts of Charlie Weis (ND/Pats) as Hues OC? a good listen on radio show now, but is he done in the Saunders, LeBeau Dayes? 19 hours ago, Tour2ma said: Dorsey is a great example. No one denies that he has an eye for talent. Also not denied? That he does not work and play well with others. Something KC learned over time. In the end they decided his "talent" was not worth the toll he inflicted on their organization. I'd consider hiring Dorsey as a scout. I would not hire him in any supervisory capacity at any level of my organization. Browns did something similar when Sashi and Berry hired Ryan Grigson, who was installed as a direct report to Berry with no staff reporting Ryan. Pre-Verbal "Nailed It".. Full Power people won't fit this FO even though Depo nor Grigson are not on my favorites list...Surely you read the Bill Polian rumors? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaineDeSoulis Posted October 21, 2017 Report Share Posted October 21, 2017 Well considering the team is built on what Hue sold rather than what hue plays I would say significantly better with correct matching scheme Its kinda like judging Barry Sanders only by his ability to bulldoze people in between the tackles. Its a correct assesment but also a waste Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted October 21, 2017 Report Share Posted October 21, 2017 13 hours ago, boo fagley said: You telling a someone from Massachusetts about building an organization. Only because it's obvious that I had to... As for the rest of your reply... any answers are already in the quote box above your queries. But give you props for quoting multiple bits... good use of the new quote feature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted October 21, 2017 Report Share Posted October 21, 2017 On 10/20/2017 at 7:22 AM, boo fagley said: So, you are saying that a GM that built a team good enough to reach a Super Bowl would be someone not to interview because they are not employed. Makes sense. What about John Dorsey? Drafted Rodgers and Mathews in Green Bay and built the Chiefs into a contender. KC let him go so he must be no good by your logic. Yeah, bring in some up and coming hotshot with no experience or track record and then in 3 years realize the guy is all hat and no cowboy. The point of it all is for the Browns to hire a GM and HC with several years of experience. Screw the on-the-job- training way of doing things. John Dorsey would be an excellent choice for Browns GM. Mike Tannenbaum and Rex Ryan would win a lot of games for Cleveland. You want a proven GM but then you go and mention Rexy as a HC? Rather self defeating argument there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted October 21, 2017 Report Share Posted October 21, 2017 1 hour ago, boo fagley said: Charlie Weis is a terrific OC. He brought the spread offense to the NFL and college game. Uhhh.... nope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted October 21, 2017 Report Share Posted October 21, 2017 Boo did u really just suggest footboy as HC? First off, he doesnt win games...check his record. Second, u can tear up the defense again because he runs a 3-4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted October 22, 2017 Report Share Posted October 22, 2017 You do realize that you only support your assertions with more assertions... and insults... Don't you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted October 22, 2017 Report Share Posted October 22, 2017 7 hours ago, boo fagley said: Rex had 2 losing seasons out of 7. How many winning seasons have the Browns had lately? Jamie Collins came from a 3 - 4. Danny Shelton is the proto typical NT. And how good was that 3-4 llast year with those two? And the year before and the year befire that? Yeah thats what i thought.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nero Posted December 11, 2017 Report Share Posted December 11, 2017 On 16/10/2017 at 5:09 AM, Suomi said: John Dorsey. Props to Suomi for the prediction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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