The Gipper Posted November 13, 2017 Report Share Posted November 13, 2017 On another thread there was a discussion about the Buffett takeover of Pilot/Flying J....and whether he would have any say in anything about the Browns. I don't think Buffet is a pro football fan....or a sports fan in general. Except for maybe Nebraska football? He could have bought a team many times over if he were interested. And As I understand it, the sale of Pilot/Flying J will have nothing to do with the Browns. Buffet apparently just has no interest. Same with Bill Gates.....no sports fan. On the other hand, Gate's partner in crime, Paul Allen is a big fan. Owns the Seahawks and the Portland Trailblazers I believe. In fact, here are the 25 richest people in America, according to Forbes: 1. Bill Gates 2. Jeff Bezos 3. Warren Buffett 4. Mark Zuckerberg 5. Larry Ellison 6. Michael Bloomberg 7. Charles Koch 8. David Koch 9. Larry Page 10. Sergey Brin 11. Jim Walton 12. Robson Walton 13. Alice Walton 14. Sheldon Adelson 15. Steve Ballmer 16. Jacqueline Mars 17. John Mars 18. Phil Knight 19. George Soros 20. Michael Dell 21. Paul Allen 22. Len Blavatnick 23. Lauren Jobs 24. James Simon 25. Ray Dalia. ONLY Allen and Ballmer to my recollection own professional sports team. If anyone else is aware if any of the others own any, let us know. Phil Knight as CEO of Nike of course is heavily involved in sports...but I don't know that he actually owns any team.....likely a conflict of interest for him? I know that Sheldon Adelson was somehow going to be involved in bringing the Raiders to Las Vegas....but that he was only involved in the financing deal...not with team ownership. Here is the link to the list of the Top 100 richest people in America: https://www.forbes.com/sites/chasewithorn/2016/10/04/forbes-400-the-full-list-of-the-richest-people-in-america-2016/#268a816422f4 Beyond the Top 25, I do believe that the following Top 100 do own some teams: #58T Stephen Ross....Dolphins #58T Stan Kroenke...several teams including Rams #61 Mickey Arison...Miami Heat....I believe #70 Shahid Khan....Jaguars #88 Richard DeVos...Orlando Magic #94 Jerry Jones (and his entire wealth is the value of the Cowboys) Let us know if any of the other Top 100 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nero Posted November 13, 2017 Report Share Posted November 13, 2017 In Europe, soccer teams are being bought by sheiks, arabs and even chinese... Is any of that happening in America? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted November 13, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2017 48 minutes ago, Nero said: In Europe, soccer teams are being bought by sheiks, arabs and even chinese... Is any of that happening in America? I would have to check. Here is the list of NFL owners, and not one of these would apply to what you say, except maybe Shahid Khan...and I don't think he does: Edit note: Khan is of Pakistani origin...but has been in the US since age 16, and has been a US citizen since 1991. Franchise Owner Year Arizona Cardinals Bill Bidwill 1972 Atlanta Falcons Arthur Blank†1 2004 Baltimore Ravens Steve Bisciotti†1 2004 Buffalo Bills Kim and Terry Pegula 2014 Carolina Panthers Jerry Richardson2 1993 Chicago Bears Virginia Halas McCaskey†‡3 1983 Cincinnati Bengals Mike Brown‡3 1991 Cleveland Browns Jimmy Haslam 2012 Dallas Cowboys Jerry Jones 1989 Denver Broncos Pat Bowlen†6 (Bowlen Family Trust) 1984 Detroit Lions Martha Ford†[1] 2014 Green Bay Packers Green Bay Packers, Inc. (governed by a Board of Directors)5 1923 Houston Texans Robert C. McNair†2 1999 Indianapolis Colts Jim Irsay‡ 1997 Jacksonville Jaguars Shahid Khan 2012 Kansas City Chiefs Clark Hunt‡3 2006 Los Angeles Chargers Alex Spanos† and family1,6 1984 Los Angeles Rams Stan Kroenke1 2010 Miami Dolphins Stephen M. Ross† 2008 Minnesota Vikings Zygi Wilf† 2005 New England Patriots Robert Kraft 1994 New Orleans Saints Tom Benson 1985 New York Giants John Mara (50%)4 Steve Tisch (50%) 2005 New York Jets Robert Wood Johnson IV 2000 Oakland Raiders Carol and Mark Davis (mother and son)†‡ 2011 Philadelphia Eagles Jeffrey Lurie and Christina Weiss Lurie 1994 Pittsburgh Steelers Art Rooney II4 (60%) and family (12%)3,4 2017 San Francisco 49ers Jed York‡1 2009 Seattle Seahawks Paul Allen 1997 Tampa Bay Buccaneers Bryan Glazer, Edward Glazer, Joel Glazer and Darcie Kassewitz‡ 2014 Tennessee Titans Susie Smith, Amy Strunk, Susan Lewis 3 Barclay and Kenneth Adams IV‡4 2013 Washington Redskins Dan Snyder† 1999 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted November 13, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2017 Here are the NBA owners; Franchise Principal Owner(s) Operating Entities Owned Since Atlanta Hawks Tony Ressler, Grant Hill, Steven Price, Rick Schnall, Sara Blakely, Jesse Itzler Hawks Basketball, Inc. 2015 Boston Celtics Wyc Grousbeck Boston Basketball Partners 2002 Brooklyn Nets Mikhail Prokhorov ONEXIM Sports and Entertainment Holding USA, Inc. 2010 Charlotte Hornets Michael Jordan Hornets Sports & Entertainment, Hornets Basketball Holdings, LLC 2010 Chicago Bulls Jerry Reinsdorf Chicago Professional Sports Limited Partnership 1985 Cleveland Cavaliers Dan Gilbert 2005 Dallas Mavericks Mark Cuban Dallas Basketball Limited 2000 Denver Nuggets Ann Walton Kroenke Kroenke Sports & Entertainment, Denver Nuggets Limited Partnership 2000 Detroit Pistons Tom Gores Palace Sports & Entertainment, Detroit Pistons Basketball Company 2011 Golden State Warriors Joe Lacob (majority), Peter Guber GSW Sports LLC 2010 Houston Rockets Tilman Fertitta Fertitta Entertainment 2017 Indiana Pacers Herbert Simon Pacers Sports & Entertainment, Pacers Basketball, LLC 1983 Los Angeles Clippers Steve Ballmer[1] LAC Basketball Club, Inc. 2014 Los Angeles Lakers Jeanie Buss, Jim Buss and Johnny Buss, along with siblings in the Jerry Buss family trust.[2] The Los Angeles Lakers, Inc. 1979 Memphis Grizzlies Robert J. Pera, Daniel E. Straus, Steven Kaplan Memphis Basketball LLC 2012 Miami Heat Micky Arison Miami Heat Limited Partnership 1995 Milwaukee Bucks Marc Lasry and Wesley Edens Milwaukee Bucks, Inc. 2014 Minnesota Timberwolves Glen Taylor Minnesota Timberwolves Basketball Limited Partnership 1995 New Orleans Pelicans Tom Benson New Orleans Pelicans NBA Limited Partnership 2012 New York Knicks James Dolan The Madison Square Garden Company, New York Knicks, Inc. 1997 Oklahoma City Thunder Clay Bennett Professional Basketball Club LLC 2006 Orlando Magic Richard DeVos RDV Sports, Inc., Orlando Magic, Ltd. 1991 Philadelphia 76ers Joshua Harris, Adam Aron, David Blitzer, Martin J. Geller, David B. Heller, Travis Hennings, James Lassiter, Marc Leder, Michael Rubin, Will Smith, Jada Pinkett Smith, Art Wrubel, Handy Soetedjo, Erick Thohir, Kevin Hart Philadelphia 76ers, Inc. 2011 Phoenix Suns Robert Sarver Suns Legacy Partners, LLC 2004 Portland Trail Blazers Paul Allen Vulcan Inc., Trail Blazers, Inc. 1988 Sacramento Kings Vivek Ranadivé,[3] Paul E. Jacobs, Gary E. Jacobs, Hal Jacobs, Jeffrey A. Jacobs[4] Sacramento Kings Partnership Group (operating entity yet to be named) 2013 San Antonio Spurs Peter Holt Spurs Sports & Entertainment, San Antonio Spurs LLC 1993 Toronto Raptors Larry Tanenbaum Maple Leaf Sports & Entertainment, Toronto Raptors Basketball Club 1998 Utah Jazz Gail Miller Larry H. Miller Sports & Entertainment, Jazz Basketball Investors, Inc. 1985 Washington Wizards Ted Leonsis Monumental Sports & Entertainment 2010 References[edit] None of these appear to fit that category.....though there is the one Russian guy, owner of the Nets, plus one of the partners is an Indian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted November 13, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2017 Here are the Major League Baseball owners: Team Principal owner(s) Operating entities Purchase price Year Arizona Diamondbacks Ken Kendrick AZPB LP, AZPBI Inc. $130,000,000 1995 Atlanta Braves Liberty Media Atlanta National League Baseball Club Inc. $450,000,000 [a] 2007 Baltimore Orioles Peter Angelos Baltimore Orioles LP, Baltimore Orioles Inc., Baltimore Baseball Club Inc. $173,000,000 1993 Boston Red Sox John W. Henry Boston Red Sox Baseball Club LP, Fenway Sports Group LLC $660,000,000 2002 Chicago Cubs Thomas S. Ricketts Chicago National League Ball Club Inc. $845,000,000 2009 Chicago White Sox Jerry Reinsdorf Chicago White Sox Ltd., Chisox Corp. $20,000,000 1981 Cincinnati Reds Bob Castellini Cincinnati Reds LLC $270,000,000 2005 Cleveland Indians Larry Dolan Cleveland Indians Baseball Co. LP $323,000,000 1999 Colorado Rockies Charlie Monfort Colorado Baseball Partnership, Colorado Rockies Baseball Club Ltd. $95,000,000 1992 Detroit Tigers Christopher Ilitch Olympia Entertainment, Detroit Tigers Inc. $82,000,000 1992 Houston Astros Jim Crane Crane Capital Group, Houston Astros Inc., Houston Astros, LLC $615,000,000 2011 Kansas City Royals David Glass Kansas City Royals Baseball Corp. $96,000,000 2000 Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim Arturo Moreno Angels Baseball LP, Moreno Baseball LP $184,000,000 2003 Los Angeles Dodgers Mark Walter Guggenheim Baseball Management, Los Angeles Dodgers, Inc. $2,000,000,000 2012 Miami Marlins Bruce Sherman Miami Marlins LP, Miami Marlins Inc., Miami Marlins Baseball Ltd. $1,300,000,000 2018 Milwaukee Brewers Mark Attanasio Milwaukee Brewers Baseball Club, Milwaukee Brewers Holdings LLC $223,000,000 2005 Minnesota Twins Jim Pohlad Minnesota Twins, MTI Partnership LLP $44,000,000 1984 New York Mets Fred Wilpon Sterling Doubleday Enterprises LC, Mets Partners Inc. $391,000,000 2002 New York Yankees Hal Steinbrenner Yankee Global Enterprises $8,700,000 [1] 1973 Oakland Athletics John J. Fisher Oakland Athletics Limited Partnership [2] $180,000,000 2005 Philadelphia Phillies David Montgomery The Phillies $30,000,000 1981 Pittsburgh Pirates Robert Nutting Pittsburgh Associates LP, Pittsburgh Baseball Inc. $92,000,000 1996 San Diego Padres Ron Fowler The Padres Group, Padres LP, Padres Inc. $800,000,000 [c][3] 2012 San Francisco Giants Charlie Johnson San Francisco Baseball Associates LP, SF Giants Baseball Club $100,000,000 1992 Seattle Mariners John W. Stanton Baseball Club of Seattle LP, Baseball of Seattle Inc. $106,000,000 1992 St. Louis Cardinals William DeWitt, Jr. St. Louis Cardinals LLC, St. Louis National Baseball Club Inc. $150,000,000 1995 Tampa Bay Rays Stuart Sternberg Tampa Bay Devil Rays Ltd. $130,000,000 1995 Texas Rangers Ray Davis Rangers Baseball Express, Texas Rangers Baseball Club $593,000,000 2010 Toronto Blue Jays Rogers Communications Rogers Blue Jays Baseball Partnership, Toronto Blue Jays Baseball Ltd $140,000,000 2000 Washington Nationals Lerner Enterprises Washington Nationals Baseball Club LLC $450,000,000 2006 Again...nothing like what you say....though a few companies are involved...and I don't know about there makeup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted November 13, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2017 Franchise Principal Owner(s) Operating Entities Year Purchased Anaheim Ducks Henry Samueli Anaheim Ducks Hockey Club LLC 2005 Arizona Coyotes Andrew Barroway IceArizona Acquisition Co., LLC 2014 Boston Bruins Jeremy Jacobs Boston Professional Hockey Association, Inc 1975 Buffalo Sabres Terrence Pegula Hockey Western New York, LLC; Pegula Sports and Entertainment 2011 Calgary Flames N. Murray Edwards Calgary Sports and Entertainment 1980 Carolina Hurricanes Peter Karmanos, Jr. Gale Force Sports And Entertainment, LLC; Carolina Hurricanes Hockey Club 1994 Chicago Blackhawks Rocky Wirtz Chicago Blackhawk Hockey Team, Inc. 1954 Colorado Avalanche Ann Walton Kroenke Kroenke Sports & Entertainment; Colorado Avalanche, LLC 2000 Columbus Blue Jackets John P. McConnell Colhoc Limited Partnership, The Columbus Blue Jackets Hockey Club 2000 Dallas Stars Tom Gaglardi Dallas Stars LP 2011 Detroit Red Wings Estate of Mike Ilitch Ilitch Holdings Inc.; Olympia Entertainment; Detroit Red Wings, Inc. 1982 Edmonton Oilers Daryl Katz Rexall Sports Corporation; Oilers Entertainment Group 2008 Florida Panthers Vincent Viola Sunrise Sports and Entertainment; Florida Panthers Hockey Club, Ltd. 2013 Los Angeles Kings Philip Anschutz and Edward P. Roski Anschutz Entertainment Group, The Los Angeles Kings Hockey Club LP 1995 Minnesota Wild Craig Leipold Minnesota Sports and Entertainment; Minnesota Wild Hockey Club, LP 2008 Montreal Canadiens Molson Family Club de hockey Canadien, Inc. 2009 Nashville Predators Thomas Cigarran Predators Holdings LLC 2007 New Jersey Devils Joshua Harris New Jersey Devils LLC 2013 New York Islanders Jon Ledecky and Scott D. Malkin New York Islanders Hockey Club, LP 2014 New York Rangers James L. Dolan The Madison Square Garden Company, New York Rangers Hockey Club 1997 Ottawa Senators Eugene Melnyk Capital Sports Properties; Ottawa Senators Hockey Club Limited Partnership 2003 Philadelphia Flyers Brian L. Roberts Comcast Spectacor; Philadelphia Flyers, LP 1996 Pittsburgh Penguins Ronald Burkle and Mario Lemieux Lemieux Group LP 1999 San Jose Sharks Hasso Plattner Sharks Sports and Entertainment; San Jose Sports & Entertainment Enterprises; San Jose Sharks, LLC 2002 St. Louis Blues Tom Stillman SLB Acquisition Holdings LLC; St. Louis Blues Hockey Club, L.P. 2012 Tampa Bay Lightning Jeffrey Vinik Lightning Hockey LP 2010 Toronto Maple Leafs Larry Tanenbaum Maple Leaf Sports & Entertainment, Ltd.; Kilmer Sports, Inc. 1996 Vancouver Canucks Francesco Aquilini Canucks Sports & Entertainment 2004 Vegas Golden Knights Bill Foley Black Knight Sports & Entertainment, Hockey Vision Las Vegas 2016 Washington Capitals Ted Leonsis Mounumental Sports and Entertainment 1999 Winnipeg Jets Mark Chipman True North Sports & Entertainment, Ltd. 2011 And here is Hockey....all Americans and Canadians except one German guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted November 13, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2017 Here are the MLS owners.....but just FYI.....this soccer league is not considered one of the North American "Major Leagues"...there are just the Big Four for now. (maybe someday in the future it will achieve what is considered ""major" status) Major League Soccer Ownership Franchise Owner(s) Atlanta United FC Arthur Blank (AMB Sports and Entertainment Group) Chicago Fire Andrew Hauptman (Andell Holdings) Colorado Rapids Stan Kroenke (Kroenke Sports & Entertainment) Columbus Crew Anthony Precourt (Precourt Sports Ventures LLC) D.C. United Erick Thohir Jason Levien William Chang (D.C. United Holdings) FC Dallas Clark Hunt Houston Dynamo Gabriel Brener Jake Silverstein Ben Guill Oscar De La Hoya (Golden Boy Promotions) Los Angeles FC Henry Nguyen Peter Guber Tom Penn Ruben Gnanalingam Vincent Tan Will Ferrell Magic Johnson Nomar Garciaparra Mia Hamm Garciaparra Tony Robbins Allen Shapiro Bennett Rosenthal Brandon Schneider Chad Hurley Harry Tsao Irwin P. Raij Jason Sugarman Kirk Lacob Larry Berg Mike Mahan Mark Leschly Paul Schaeffer Rick Welts Los Angeles Galaxy Philip Anschutz (AEG) Minnesota United FC William W. McGuire Montreal Impact Joey Saputo New England Revolution Robert Kraft New York City FC Sheikh Mansour (City Football Group) Ruigang Li (City Football Group) Hal Steinbrenner (Yankee Global Enterprises) Hank Steinbrenner (Yankee Global Enterprises) New York Red Bulls Dietrich Mateschitz (Red Bull GmbH) Orlando City SC Flavio Augusto da Silva Phil Rawlins Philadelphia Union Keystone Sports & Entertainment, LLC Portland Timbers Merritt Paulson (Peregrine Sports, LLC) Real Salt Lake Dell Loy Hansen San Jose Earthquakes Lewis Wolff (Earthquakes Soccer, LLC) John Fisher (Earthquakes Soccer, LLC) Seattle Sounders FC Joe Roth Paul Allen Adrian Hanauer Drew Carey Sporting Kansas City Sporting Club Toronto FC Maple Leaf Sports & Entertainment Vancouver Whitecaps FC Greg Kerfoot Steve Luczo Jeff Mallett Steve Nash I see there is one here that fits what you say: the New York city Club.....who are partners in it with the owner of the New York Yankees. I also see where several NFL owners own shares in some of these teams: Arthur Blank, owns the Atlanta Falcons Paul Allen, owner of the Seahawks Robert Kraft owns the Patriots Clark Hunt owns the Chiefs Kroenke owns the Rams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nero Posted November 14, 2017 Report Share Posted November 14, 2017 5 hours ago, The Gipper said: Here are the MLS owners.....but just FYI.....this soccer league is not considered one of the North American "Major Leagues"...there are just the Big Four for now. (maybe someday in the future it will achieve what is considered ""major" status) Major League Soccer Ownership Franchise Owner(s) Atlanta United FC Arthur Blank (AMB Sports and Entertainment Group) Chicago Fire Andrew Hauptman (Andell Holdings) Colorado Rapids Stan Kroenke (Kroenke Sports & Entertainment) Columbus Crew Anthony Precourt (Precourt Sports Ventures LLC) D.C. United Erick Thohir Jason Levien William Chang (D.C. United Holdings) FC Dallas Clark Hunt Houston Dynamo Gabriel Brener Jake Silverstein Ben Guill Oscar De La Hoya (Golden Boy Promotions) Los Angeles FC Henry Nguyen Peter Guber Tom Penn Ruben Gnanalingam Vincent Tan Will Ferrell Magic Johnson Nomar Garciaparra Mia Hamm Garciaparra Tony Robbins Allen Shapiro Bennett Rosenthal Brandon Schneider Chad Hurley Harry Tsao Irwin P. Raij Jason Sugarman Kirk Lacob Larry Berg Mike Mahan Mark Leschly Paul Schaeffer Rick Welts Los Angeles Galaxy Philip Anschutz (AEG) Minnesota United FC William W. McGuire Montreal Impact Joey Saputo New England Revolution Robert Kraft New York City FC Sheikh Mansour (City Football Group) Ruigang Li (City Football Group) Hal Steinbrenner (Yankee Global Enterprises) Hank Steinbrenner (Yankee Global Enterprises) New York Red Bulls Dietrich Mateschitz (Red Bull GmbH) Orlando City SC Flavio Augusto da Silva Phil Rawlins Philadelphia Union Keystone Sports & Entertainment, LLC Portland Timbers Merritt Paulson (Peregrine Sports, LLC) Real Salt Lake Dell Loy Hansen San Jose Earthquakes Lewis Wolff (Earthquakes Soccer, LLC) John Fisher (Earthquakes Soccer, LLC) Seattle Sounders FC Joe Roth Paul Allen Adrian Hanauer Drew Carey Sporting Kansas City Sporting Club Toronto FC Maple Leaf Sports & Entertainment Vancouver Whitecaps FC Greg Kerfoot Steve Luczo Jeff Mallett Steve Nash I see there is one here that fits what you say: the New York city Club.....who are partners in it with the owner of the New York Yankees. I also see where several NFL owners own shares in some of these teams: Arthur Blank, owns the Atlanta Falcons Paul Allen, owner of the Seahawks Robert Kraft owns the Patriots Clark Hunt owns the Chiefs Kroenke owns the Rams. I have heard that MLS is a minor league. I think that NFL owners having MLS teams has to do with the soccer teams being less expensive to maintain and if you already have the facilities for an NFL team, well, a soccer team needs less facilities overall (there's way less people in a soccer team). My guess is that arabs and asiatics get into european soccer because it is a sport already popular in their countries, so it is an easy way to become popular. Also, economically I'd bet that european teams in some countries have more problems economically than in the US (at least in Spain) and soccer teams are not as expensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted November 14, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2017 There was a big discussion about this very subject this morning on Mike and Mike. Their contention is that some of these Billionaires purchase sports teams because, even though they have big money....that alone does not bring them fame and adulation....whereas being the owner of a sports franchise does just that for many. And I think there is some truth in that. Who ever heard of Jimmy Haslam before he bought the Browns? Well, his brother is governor of Tenn....which brought his brother fame. Maybe Jimmy wanted some of that. The biggest publicity seeker of them all is Jerry Jones. In fact, this arrogant asswipe went so far as to call himself the "ranking" owner in the NFL. People on the radio were trying to figure out what that meant. While his team may be the most valuable, he is far from the wealthiest. See the list above. A half dozen other owners are worth more. He certainly is NOT the longest tenured. Think of Families like the Maras, Rooneys, Halas/McCaskey, Mike Brown etc. Much longer tenured. HE calls himself the "ranking" owner because in his own arrogant mind he thinks he is the most important/influential owner, apparently. Well...I am not sure the other owners go along with that. He is in this tussle with Arthur Blank over Roger Goodell's contract...and he is going to lose. He is seen as a guy who is all in favor of things like hammering the Pats for their indiscretions, and having Goodell suspend players for alleged misbehavior.......until and unless it is one of his players who get disciplined. Then he gets all butthurt over it. In other words, he is a hypocrite. And, in one sense, maybe he should be. He is in that tussle with Blank....but did you see what happened when Blank's Falcons met the Cowboys on Sunday....the Falcons hammered the Cowboys. SWEET! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nero Posted November 14, 2017 Report Share Posted November 14, 2017 The problem in european soccer is, as there is no cap salary (I envy NFL for that), if the owner of your team is an association, or a billionaire, makes a huge difference in the team and therefore the competition. For instance, my home team, Osasuna, is owned by the fans, and we don't have a millionaire inverting on it, so it is pretty difficult for a team located in a region with 500,000 inhabitants to even stay in Spanish Primera Division. There are other teams with more numerous fanbases or with more investors and that affects the competition. Anyway, there's a proud feeling of having a team owned by the fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjp28 Posted November 14, 2017 Report Share Posted November 14, 2017 20 minutes ago, Nero said: The problem in european soccer is, as there is no cap salary (I envy NFL for that), if the owner of your team is an association, or a billionaire, makes a huge difference in the team and therefore the competition. For instance, my home team, Osasuna, is owned by the fans, and we don't have a milliona ire inverting on it, so it is pretty difficult for a team located in a region with 500,000 inhabitants to even stay in Spanish Primera Division. There are other teams with more numerous fanbases or with more investors and that affects the competition. Anyway, there's a proud feeling of having a team owned by the fans. Salary caps a good necessary "evil" in sports, without them you end up with the NY YANKEE$. ALSO of the 32 NFL teams 17 show ownership after 2000 and only 5 excluding GB before 1990......new money or at least new financing. Rich people have always owned sports teams, race horses, sailing ships why? Because they are the only ones that can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted November 14, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2017 26 minutes ago, Nero said: The problem in european soccer is, as there is no cap salary (I envy NFL for that), if the owner of your team is an association, or a billionaire, makes a huge difference in the team and therefore the competition. For instance, my home team, Osasuna, is owned by the fans, and we don't have a millionaire inverting on it, so it is pretty difficult for a team located in a region with 500,000 inhabitants to even stay in Spanish Primera Division. There are other teams with more numerous fanbases or with more investors and that affects the competition. Anyway, there's a proud feeling of having a team owned by the fans. The ONLY NFL team that has that distinction is the Green Bay Packers. In fact, the league now has a rule against having a community owned franchise. The NFL wants only greedy rich people with profit motivation to own their teams. Its a fact. (and FYI...the salary cap is instituted to guarantee that each of these greedy owners makes a lot of money. But...on the other hand, most fans feel that is good nevertheless because it promotes parity....and avoids the situation just as you state: that only the wealthy, big market teams take all the good players and all the titles. But, here is an interesting phenomena: The one league that does NOT have a salary cap is baseball. Yet, it is baseball that has had about the most parity of any of the sports. I would have to check on whether any of the other teams in the other leagues are essentially "community owned"....but I doubt that they are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nero Posted November 14, 2017 Report Share Posted November 14, 2017 I found interesting when I saw on your first post that GB was owned by the fans, which I already knew, BUT that it also was founded in 1923... Osasuna was founded in 1920, lol. In Spanish League, anyway, I just recall Real Madrid, Barcelona, Athletic Club de Bilbao and Osasuna. Maybe there are more, but those ones have been a constant mention at least in Primera Division. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted November 14, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2017 12 minutes ago, Nero said: I found interesting when I saw on your first post that GB was owned by the fans, which I already knew, BUT that it also was founded in 1923... Osasuna was founded in 1920, lol. In Spanish League, anyway, I just recall Real Madrid, Barcelona, Athletic Club de Bilbao and Osasuna. Maybe there are more, but those ones have been a constant mention at least in Primera Division. The Packers actually go back further than 1923. They were a "club" team prior to that for years. The NFL formed in 1920. The Packers joined a year later in 1921. (only the Bears and the Cardinals are original 1920 current NFL teams). That 1923 date may have been when there was some corporate reorganization or something.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted November 14, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2017 Curious question: What ever happened to Ted Turner? At one time he owned the Atlanta Braves, the Atlanta Hawks, and the Atlanta NHL team....that eventually moved to Winnipeg. He must have moved on from owning sports teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjp28 Posted November 14, 2017 Report Share Posted November 14, 2017 7 minutes ago, The Gipper said: Curious question: What ever happened to Ted Turner? At one time he owned the Atlanta Braves, the Atlanta Hawks, and the Atlanta NHL team....that eventually moved to Winnipeg. He must have moved on from owning sports teams. He's still around but gone for a decade (+/-) from the Braves, strange dude but I'm forever thankful for TCM which I'm watching now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjp28 Posted November 14, 2017 Report Share Posted November 14, 2017 40 minutes ago, The Gipper said: The ONLY NFL team that has that distinction is the Green Bay Packers. In fact, the league now has a rule against having a community owned franchise. The NFL wants only greedy rich people with profit motivation to own their teams. Its a fact. (and FYI...the salary cap is instituted to guarantee that each of these greedy owners makes a lot of money. But...on the other hand, most fans feel that is good nevertheless because it promotes parity....and avoids the situation just as you state: that only the wealthy, big market teams take all the good players and all the titles. But, here is an interesting phenomena: The one league that does NOT have a salary cap is baseball. Yet, it is baseball that has had about the most parity of any of the sports. I would have to check on whether any of the other teams in the other leagues are essentially "community owned"....but I doubt that they are. MLB is a bit different especially with their farm system expenses compare with the NFL, NBA but you GENERALLY still want to be in the upper echelon of payrolls to be competitive (FORBES opening day payroll, not after the in season dumps): Rk '17Team2017 PayrollRk '162016 Payroll% +/-1 Dodgers$225,553,0871$234,648,955-3.9%2 Tigers$199,750,6003$195,901,4812.0%3 Yankees$195,282,0582$225,228,650-13.3%4 Giants$181,514,4315$173,203,2784.8%5 Red Sox$178,818,0524$190,377,215-6.1%6 Cubs$176,872,3126$170,266,5983.9%7 Rangers$173,114,7308$149,338,55315.9%8 Nationals$164,591,08810$147,084,54611.9%9 Orioles$164,261,2999$147,894,71311.1%10 Angels$164,050,8337$166,285,8331.3%11 Mets$155,641,37913$138,871,05712.1%12 Mariners$154,157,72012$142,323,2908.3%13 Cardinals$150,380,00011$144,596,0004.0%14 Royals$145,925,25015$137,318,4776.3%15 BlueJays$143,941,10014$138,063,2284.3%16 Rockies$127,943,57117$113,244,57113.0%17 Braves$126,079,52422$95,371,64832.2%18 Indians$125,808,02927$87,196,40044.3%19 Astros$122,407,23323$94,058,50030.1%20 Marlins$120,191,29728$74,851,29560.6%21Phillies$111,868,37825$91,852,16721.8%22Twins$104,837,50018$104,083,7000.7%23W. Sox$100,054,93716$115,248,667-13.2%24DBacks$93,180,49921$97,266,463-4.2%25Reds$93,026,28624$92,732,3030.3%26Pirates$91,499,17220$98,780,500-7.4%27Athletics$81,738,33426$87,326,233-6.4%28Rays$71,351,61129$67,291,0086.0%29Padres$61,411,78919$102,381,219-40.0%30Brewers$60,810,09030$59,843,4361.6% Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingfooldoug Posted November 14, 2017 Report Share Posted November 14, 2017 1 hour ago, mjp28 said: Salary caps a good necessary "evil" in sports, without them you end up with the NY YANKEE$. ALSO of the 32 NFL teams 17 show ownership after 2000 and only 5 excluding GB before 1990......new money or at least new financing. Rich people have always owned sports teams, race horses, sailing ships why? Because they are the only ones that can. Wasn't Ted Stepien the reason that a salary cap was invented to begin with? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted November 14, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2017 1 hour ago, flyingfooldoug said: Wasn't Ted Stepien the reason that a salary cap was invented to begin with? No. I don't think so. He was responsible for the "Stepian rule", which as far as I know is still in place. That rule says that an NBA team may not trade more than one of its future first round draft picks in a row. Stepian had traded like 4-5 of the Cavs future draft picks in like one year....and only picking up a bunch of mediocre at best players....the likes of Scott Wedman etc. (how is that for a blast from the past?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingfooldoug Posted November 14, 2017 Report Share Posted November 14, 2017 3 hours ago, The Gipper said: No. I don't think so. He was responsible for the "Stepian rule", which as far as I know is still in place. That rule says that an NBA team may not trade more than one of its future first round draft picks in a row. Stepian had traded like 4-5 of the Cavs future draft picks in like one year....and only picking up a bunch of mediocre at best players....the likes of Scott Wedman etc. (how is that for a blast from the past?) I thought he started way overpaying for players like W B Free. Been awhile tho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted November 14, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2017 9 minutes ago, flyingfooldoug said: I thought he started way overpaying for players like W B Free. Been awhile tho. He didn't overpay for World B. Free. World B. Free may have saved this franchise. No....it was for the fact that he stripped the club of any future in return for a handful of magic beans....that were inert. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingfooldoug Posted November 14, 2017 Report Share Posted November 14, 2017 5 minutes ago, The Gipper said: He didn't overpay for World B. Free. World B. Free may have saved this franchise. No....it was for the fact that he stripped the club of any future in return for a handful of magic beans....that were inert. Ok, it seems he had some interesting views on race too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted November 14, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2017 8 minutes ago, flyingfooldoug said: Ok, it seems he had some interesting views on race too. You mean Stepian? Yea...I think he had a kind of plantation mentality. Here was some of his handiwork: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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