Our D

[Nero]

6 minutes ago, wargograw said:

 But don’t say “they don’t make a stop when you need them to” when with the game on the line, they did.

When?

What I am saying is that you have a unit that is better than the other, and the worse unit gets going and scores and sustains drives, it's really frustrating that the defense plays worse. Maybe it's that they don't sync, but the same argument about defense being gashed after long rival possesions could be made the other way: they should be more rested when the offense steps up.

[wargograw]

When we were down 7 with a few minutes left and our defense got a stop only to get screwed by the refs. 

[The Gipper]

49 minutes ago, roach said:

 

Maybe.  I don’t know what a codger is.

i know this.  My memory goes back to Johnson,  Kanicki, Houston, Beach , Parish, Fiss Kellerman, and others.

i know that in 1999 I bought 12 PSL’s and my buddies bought their season ticket from me.  i’m down to 2.  Myself and my son.  He drives in from Milwaukee to sit with me every game.  

I know this. Frank Minnifield is the best CB that I’ve ever seen play the game.

i know this. This defense is awful.  

I know this.  This is not an emotional response, but one based on my observations.

I know this.  This is a lot of typing for an old codger (whatever that is)

Codger Roach...is just a way to say that you are a cranky old motherfuhucker.

Now...tell us if there is any inaccuracies in that statement?  

[Nero]

14 minutes ago, wargograw said:

When we were down 7 with a few minutes left and our defense got a stop only to get screwed by the refs. 

True that. Awful call. 

I forgot about that. 

[Unsympathetic]

Schobert has been one of the best run-stop LB's in the league

Garrett made the D team of the week

[Clevfan4life]

3 minutes ago, Unsympathetic said:

Schobert has been one of the best run-stop LB's in the league

Garrett made the D team of the week

I was wondering whst schobs rank at certain things was. I still think we may need to draft or sign some mlb'er depth in case he doesnt keep progressing. But u can see why we were highly ranked at run d with a healthy schob, collins and kirk

[Nero]

1 minute ago, Clevfan4life said:

I was wondering whst schobs rank at certain things was. I still think we may need to draft or sign some mlb'er depth in case he doesnt keep progressing. But u can see why we were highly ranked at run d with a healthy schob, collins and kirk

Yeah. I like Schobert. I think the LBs aren't that good covering, don't you think so? Or maybe it is because they don't have a lot of help by the safeties/cornerbacks in the underneath zone...

[thenew23]

Points per game does not tell the whole story. Starting field position, time of possession, points per drive... all more telling and better indicators of a good D. As I posted before, our D is in the top half of the league in almost every category that matters, except forcing turnovers.

Its hard to fault a D that has to stop a team who is starting almost every drive near midfield,  especially when most of those drives were held to FGs...

Can they get better? Of course. Are they the worst weve had? Not even close. Actually, last year was historically bad...

[Clevfan4life]

9 minutes ago, thenew23 said:

Points per game does not tell the whole story. Starting field position, time of possession, points per drive... all more telling and better indicators of a good D. As I posted before, our D is in the top half of the league in almost every category that matters, except forcing turnovers.

Its hard to fault a D that has to stop a team who is starting almost every drive near midfield,  especially when most of those drives were held to FGs...

Can they get better? Of course. Are they the worst weve had? Not even close. Actually, last year was historically bad...

I dont understand why people think changing defenses weekly like its seasonal ward drobe, is one if these days gonna work out for us. I mean i wouldnt be "livid" if another 4-3 guy with a sim system to williams comes in.....but at some point u gotta wonder when the good coaches absolutely start avoiding clev. Like complete blacklisting. Its kind of tacitly already going on but it could get very public very vocal very quickly. Like coaches just flat out refuse to even interview. Not even cfl coaches are gonna come to these caustic merry go round

[Mark O]

1 hour ago, wargograw said:

When we were down 7 with a few minutes left and our defense got a stop only to get screwed by the refs. 

And even after the shitty call.  Cincinatti had the ball at the 25 yard line.  How did our defense step up after a bad call?

1-10-CLV 25 (3:51) (Shotgun) A.Dalton pass incomplete short left to A.Green (J.McCourty).
2-10-CLV 25 (3:48) J.Mixon right guard to CLV 11 for 14 yards (J.Peppers). R22
1-10-CLV 11 (3:02) J.Mixon left end for 11 yards, TOUCHDOWN.

Damn...that's stepping up.  25 yards in two running plays.    Looked more like swiss cheese than stepping up.   But some of you enjoy the losses and think its positive to be 0-11 and 1-26 and 4-44 and our head coach is like 2-30 in his last 32 games. 

 

[D Bone]

4 hours ago, wargograw said:

2016 Rams-9th in total D

2017 Rams-17th in total D

Don’t tangle with me. 

Bout what I expected. 

Yep, figures you are one of those yardage stat dweebs. 

There's a coach that used to coach the Browns - probably before you were hatched, who now coaches in New England and has repeatedly stated that the only stat he considers relevant is of course wins and losses, but when pressed further he has said that points scored and points allowed are the only stats he considers relevant, so I guess I'll hang with him.... bout what you expected? 

 

[Mark O]

4 hours ago, wargograw said:

2016 Rams-9th in total D

2017 Rams-17th in total D

 

 

2016 Rams  4-12   Last Place

2017 Rams 8-3  First Place

New head coach...new defensive coordinator (got rid of the guys some of you are blowing around here as a fucking saint).

Which stats are more important?  Your worthless total defense stat or the standings and wins and losses, you know those things they count to determine who makes the playoffs?

[flyingfooldoug]

5 minutes ago, D Bone said:

Yep, figures you are one of those yardage stat dweebs. 

There's a coach that used to coach the Browns - probably before you were hatched, who now coaches in New England and has repeatedly stated that the only stat he considers relevant is of course wins and losses, but when pressed further he has said that points scored and points allowed are the only stats he considers relevant, so I guess I'll hang with him.... bout what you expected? 

 

Vince Lombardi said about the same thing.  Winning isn't everything, it's the only thing.

The NFL trophy is named for him too....go figure.

[The Gipper]

5 minutes ago, Mark O said:

 

2016 Rams  4-12   Last Place

2017 Rams 8-3  First Place

New head coach...new defensive coordinator (got rid of the guys some of you are blowing around here as a Shmucking saint).

Which stats are more important?  Your worthless total defense stat or the standings and wins and losses, you know those things they count to determine who makes the playoffs?

OK,...but compare their offenses.  That is where the big difference is on that team.

[Mark O]

1 minute ago, The Gipper said:

OK,...but compare their offenses.  That is where the big difference is on that team.

Yep..they fired their inept head coach and brought in someone who can make a difference.  Something the Browns should consider doing.

[Clevfan4life]

5 minutes ago, Mark O said:

Yep..they fired their inept head coach and brought in someone who can make a difference.  Something the Browns should consider doing.

Ok ur not entirely without a point dude. But did u digest at allwhat gip said? They have a serious fukking running game and jared goff is on par with wentz now. That offense makes opponents offenses have to play differently. If goff gets out in front of teams quick what do u think the opposing teams have to do? Run the clock out as much as possible with a bunch of short up the middle runs? No....they have to pass. This forces their hand and the rams def benefits

[Mark O]

1 minute ago, Clevfan4life said:

Ok ur not entirely without a point dude. But did u digest at allwhat gip said? They have a serious fukking running game and jared goff is on par with wentz now. That offense makes opponents offenses have to play differently. If goff gets out in front of teams quick what do u think the opposing teams have to do? Run the clock out as much as possible with a bunch of short up the middle runs? No....they have to pass. This forces their hand and the rams def benefits

Great...and what changed?  Goff looked like a total bust last season...they fired their coaching staff including your boy Williams.   You can't discount the improvements when the majority of the team stayed the same and the coaching staff changed.  Goff and Gurley were on that 4-12 team last season, now they're 8-3.  What changed for them?  Could it be a better coaching staff?

[Nero]

27 minutes ago, D Bone said:

There's a coach that used to coach the Browns - probably before you were hatched, who now coaches in New England and has repeatedly stated that the only stat he considers relevant is of course wins and losses, but when pressed further he has said that points scored and points allowed are the only stats he considers relevant, so I guess I'll hang with him.... bout what you expected? 

 

That coach is going nowhere, surely he's a loser and isn't going to get a ring in his entire life...

I can't add pink ink when posting with my mobile.

[Clevfan4life]

19 minutes ago, Mark O said:

Great...and what changed?  Goff looked like a total bust last season...they fired their coaching staff including your boy Williams.   You can't discount the improvements when the majority of the team stayed the same and the coaching staff changed.  Goff and Gurley were on that 4-12 team last season, now they're 8-3.  What changed for them?  Could it be a better coaching staff?

Offensively speaking u prob have a point. But we cant know for sure exactlywhat the catalyst is/was. Is goff just matured now and it doesn't matter who the coach is? Or was there some major offensive scheme change? Or did the FO get in a better o line and thats why goff is playing better? So on that thought......go look up the rams ranking on sacks allowed last year vs where they are this year. Maybe tour can tell us if thats a major personnel overhaul and/or blocking scheme change with the same guys. "Something" obviously has clicked with that o line. Compare the 2016 with the 2017 teams. In 16 theres only one o line worse than the rams.......one guess is all u get

[flyingfooldoug]

1 hour ago, Mark O said:

Great...and what changed?  Goff looked like a total bust last season...they fired their coaching staff including your boy Williams.   You can't discount the improvements when the majority of the team stayed the same and the coaching staff changed.  Goff and Gurley were on that 4-12 team last season, now they're 8-3.  What changed for them?  Could it be a better coaching staff?

Did it in one season too. No need for them to go 1-40 first

[roach]

3 hours ago, Mark O said:

And even after the shitty call.  Cincinatti had the ball at the 25 yard line.  How did our defense step up after a bad call?

1-10-CLV 25 (3:51) (Shotgun) A.Dalton pass incomplete short left to A.Green (J.McCourty).
2-10-CLV 25 (3:48) J.Mixon right guard to CLV 11 for 14 yards (J.Peppers). R22
1-10-CLV 11 (3:02) J.Mixon left end for 11 yards, TOUCHDOWN.

Damn...that's stepping up.  25 yards in two running plays.    Looked more like swiss cheese than stepping up.   But some of you enjoy the losses and think its positive to be 0-11 and 1-26 and 4-44 and our head coach is like 2-30 in his last 32 games. 

 

 

[Unsympathetic]

The D wasn't good against the run because that's the result of the loss of Ogbah.  He can't step up.. he broke his foot.

[stillmotion]

22 minutes ago, Unsympathetic said:

The D wasn't good against the run because that's the result of the loss of Ogbah.  He can't step up.. he broke his foot.

Well maybe if we had more depth that wasn't practice squad quality.

[wargograw]

7 hours ago, Mark O said:

And even after the shitty call.  Cincinatti had the ball at the 25 yard line.  How did our defense step up after a bad call?

1-10-CLV 25 (3:51) (Shotgun) A.Dalton pass incomplete short left to A.Green (J.McCourty).
2-10-CLV 25 (3:48) J.Mixon right guard to CLV 11 for 14 yards (J.Peppers). R22
1-10-CLV 11 (3:02) J.Mixon left end for 11 yards, TOUCHDOWN.

Damn...that's stepping up.  25 yards in two running plays.    Looked more like swiss cheese than stepping up.   But some of you enjoy the losses and think its positive to be 0-11 and 1-26 and 4-44 and our head coach is like 2-30 in his last 32 games. 

 

That's what often happens in those heartbreak situations. Buckeyes won a national championship because of a situation like that.

7 hours ago, D Bone said:

Yep, figures you are one of those yardage stat dweebs. 

There's a coach that used to coach the Browns - probably before you were hatched, who now coaches in New England and has repeatedly stated that the only stat he considers relevant is of course wins and losses, but when pressed further he has said that points scored and points allowed are the only stats he considers relevant, so I guess I'll hang with him.... bout what you expected? 

 

Who's the Belichick we need to hire? That's right, you don't know.

7 hours ago, Mark O said:

 

2016 Rams  4-12   Last Place

2017 Rams 8-3  First Place

New head coach...new defensive coordinator (got rid of the guys some of you are blowing around here as a Shmucking saint).

Which stats are more important?  Your worthless total defense stat or the standings and wins and losses, you know those things they count to determine who makes the playoffs?

They replaced him with one of the best defensive coordinators in the history of the league. You have no idea who you want to hire, so stop citing the Rams. Such a stupid comparison.

By your logic a team could win every game 51-48 and you'd say it's the best defense in the league. These arguments are pointless.

[Mark O]

9 hours ago, wargograw said:

Who's the Belichick we need to hire? That's right, you don't know.

They replaced him with one of the best defensive coordinators in the history of the league. You have no idea who you want to hire, so stop citing the Rams. Such a stupid comparison.

By your logic a team could win every game 51-48 and you'd say it's the best defense in the league. These arguments are pointless.

And yet you want to stay the course with the guys who have led us to 1-26.  Who's the next Belichik?   I don't know...but I can be pretty damn sure he ain't on this staff right now.

They also replaced the guy that some here are telling me is the greatest defensive coach ever and we can't afford to fire a lousy HC because we might lose the DC that the Rams replaced. 

By my logic...a team could win every game 51-48 and no one would care how bad the defense was...you know why?   We'd be 11-0 dipshit and in first place and on our way to home field throughout the playoffs.  

[PKU]

I am on board with letting the entire coaching chain go.  While I would love to see this defense have continuity, give 3G a second year and more new talent (including a FS and coverage LB); it is not a good reason to keep a HC.  I would ABSOLUTELY avoid going back to 3-4 with current personnel though, so hope whomever they hire will keep that in place.

[Tour2ma]

23 hours ago, wargograw said:

Bout what I expected. 

Hey... at least points a a step in the micro direction from W/L... We have to encourage these #BabySteps...

20 hours ago, roach said:

Maybe.  I don’t know what a codger is.

i know this.  My memory goes back to Johnson,  Kanicki, Houston, Beach , Parish, Fiss Kellerman, and others.

It's said in jest...

But your mentioning Kanicki and not Sherk does have me concerned....

18 hours ago, Nero said:

Yeah. I like Schobert. I think the LBs aren't that good covering, don't you think so? Or maybe it is because they don't have a lot of help by the safeties/cornerbacks in the underneath zone...

Joe showed some early ability to take a deep drop... had a couple tipped balls, but has shown no man ability. But more than him, it's Kirk's poor pass D that has me perplexed. Seemed to me he was our "cover ILB" back in his 3-4 days paired with Dansby.

18 hours ago, Mark O said:

But some of you enjoy the losses and think its positive to be 0-11 and 1-26 and 4-44 and our head coach is like 2-30 in his last 32 games.

Just stop... no one "enjoys" the losses. Just that some of us can see beyond them and take a measure of solace in that.

Your inability/unwillingness to do so is not our problem.

[Tour2ma]

18 hours ago, Mark O said:

New head coach...new defensive coordinator (got rid of the guys some of you are blowing around here as a Shmucking saint).

Which stats are more important?  Your worthless total defense stat or the standings and wins and losses, you know those things they count to determine who makes the playoffs?

In determining who makes the playoffs? Have to hand to you and your keen insight.... it's W/L.

In determining team progress, strengths and deficiencies? Pretty sure W/L don't cut it...

18 hours ago, The Gipper said:

OK,...but compare their offenses.  That is where the big difference is on that team.

Bingo for Gippo...

• 2016 Rams O: 32nd in points and Yards
• 2017 Rams O: 2nd in points and 4th in yards.

I don't think there's any debate that McVea has been the reason their O and Goff have emerged.

Also noteworthy is the near autonomy that McV has given Wade Phillips, a/k/a, "the Defense Doctor", who has raised Defenses from the dead time and time again in his NFL career. By comparison to past assignments this lift has been easy for him. Also look at Denver's D one year removed from Wade.

16 hours ago, flyingfooldoug said:

Did it in one season too. No need for them to go 1-40 first

lol... Look back at their prior 12 years of futility, languishing below .500, only achieving it twice offset by twice dipping to 2-14 over that span and get back to me.

[roach]

20 hours ago, The Gipper said:

Codger Roach...is just a way to say that you are a cranky old motherfuhucker.

Now...tell us if there is any inaccuracies in that statement?  

I’ve been watching crappy defenses since 1999.  Yes.  I guess that makes me a cranky old motherfuhucker.

[flyingfooldoug]

3 hours ago, Tour2ma said:

In determining who makes the playoffs? Have to hand to you and your keen insight.... it's W/L.

In determining team progress, strengths and deficiencies? Pretty sure W/L don't cut it...

Bingo for Gippo...

• 2016 Rams O: 32nd in points and Yards
• 2017 Rams O: 2nd in points and 4th in yards.

I don't think there's any debate that McVea has been the reason their O and Goff have emerged.

Also noteworthy is the near autonomy that McV has given Wade Phillips, a/k/a, "the Defense Doctor", who has raised Defenses from the dead time and time again in his NFL career. By comparison to past assignments this lift has been easy for him. Also look at Denver's D one year removed from Wade.

lol... Look back at their prior 12 years of futility, languishing below .500, only achieving it twice offset by twice dipping to 2-14 over that span and get back to me.

12 years of futility? What a bunch of short sighted pussies.