Josh Rosen?

[LogicIsForSquares]

1 hour ago, calfoxwc said:

and it isn't just me. and I don't think these two scouts are "violently assuming". have a nice day.

https://www.bigblueview.com/2017/11/10/16633680/scouts-assess-top-qbs-in-2018-nfl-draft-ny-giants-eli-manning-davis-webb-sam-darnold-josh-rosen

Rosen, from UCLA, might be the most purely talented of all the quarterbacks in this class in terms of physical ability to deliver the football accurately and into the smallest windows. As Chris indicated, we know Giants’ Vice President of Player Evaluation Marc Ross has personally scouted Rosen.

There is, though, a huge red flag with Rosen. Two veteran scouts dropped the “a-word” when I asked about him.

One said simply “biggest a——— on the planet.” The other compared him to Jay Cutler and said “He isn’t a “character” guy, he’s an a———. Is smarter than everyone in the room and lets you know it. Has some entitlement to him.”

Decide for yourselves if that’s what you want as the Giants’ quarterback of the future.

That same article says the guy you want (Allen) needs to return to school. So should we trust that article and avoid Rosen and Allen?

[The Gipper]

12 hours ago, Tour2ma said:

If only your standards were half as high for picking a President...

I heard somewhere that Rudolf is #1.

 

It goes week by week.  One week it was Rudolph....the next someone else...the next someone else.

[SD_Tom]

15 hours ago, stillmotion said:

It's no more absurd than comparing Mayfield to Manziel. 

https://nflspinzone.com/2017/06/30/2018-nfl-draft-josh-rosen-smear-campaign/

On the Rich Eisen Show recently, UCLA coach Jim Mora heaped tremendous praise on Rosen but also said he has asked Rosen if he wants to be more like 

Johnny Manziel or Tom Brady. The implication is clear. Maybe Rosen should tone it down.

 

So let me think for a second, his own college coach compared him to Manziel on the record but we shouldn't?

 

http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/05/22/jim-mora-on-josh-rosens-fk-trump-cap-flap-youre-heading-towards-johnny-manziel/

 

After his junior year of High School, he was invited to the Elite 11 quarterback camp. It is a huge honor to be selected. The best high school quarterbacks in the country go and are tutored about how to get to the next level by ex and current NFL quarterbacks.

Rosen went to the camp and thought he knew everything already. He did not pay attention during film sessions, and was outright rude to the veteran quarterbacks there. Trent Dilfer who ran the camp had a number of quotes about Josh. The least offensive of which was “My bigger thing was he thinks he knows more than he knows.”

He is the son of two wealthy, Ivy-League educated parents. He is very smart…but most people can’t stand him.

His dream school was Stanford. Even though he was the #1 high school recruit in the country, after doing a background check on him, Stanford wanted nothing to do with him and did not offer him a scholarship. USC did not recruit him hard for the same reason.

Rosen has a tremendous upside, but many articles and sources indicate, he is also an arrogant jerk.

That is not a comparison to Brady or Manziel. 

Context again.... This was prior to his sophomore season and was meant as a warning to focus on football.  I'm not sure how you can infer anything different

[stillmotion]

26 minutes ago, SD_Tom said:

That is not a comparison to Brady or Manziel. 

Context again.... This was prior to his sophomore season and was meant as a warning to focus on football.  I'm not sure how you can infer anything different

The amount of negative backlash to Mayfield compared to Rosen is absurd. Rosen wasn't even good enough to beat USC, what makes you think he can lead an NFL team to the playoffs? By all means, he could very well be the least liked QB of all time. If you were hiring someone, would you want the guy that did awesome that everyone loved to be around, or the guy that everyone hated, couldn't stand being around, and made everything toxic for everyone but was great at his job?

Apparently the argument that he has huge character issues, didn't pay attention during Dilfer's QB camp and messed around, and is well disliked by many people in UCLA doesn't phase any of you. How are his veteran teammates going to play hard for him if they don't like him? If he's too Socky and gets rocked by ignoring what the coach says, I'm sure you'll all be defending him too. There's some major hard-on praise for Rosen, who hasn't proved anything and hasn't lead his team to any type of championship. He's an overrated spoiled brat "original quote by a friend at UCLA", and had years to lead UCLA to a 10 win season, and didn't even come near it. Defend him all you want, and criticize Mayfield all you want, but Rosen will be another forgotten Ryan Leaf in 5 years, and Mayfield will be a pro-style QB. Mayfield has bigger drive and leadership then Rosen could ever dream for, and Rosen will fail, simply because he's an a$$hole, and doesn't know how to relate to people, how to connect with them, or how to truly lead a team to win. The kid is a spoiled rich kid who has no backbone, and someone who's truly worked hard and overcame adversity will be a much better leader, and winning qb, then someone who doesn't even have the drive to work for it and talks back to Trent Dilfer at his freaking camp.

[stillmotion]

2 hours ago, calfoxwc said:

sorry, don't take it personally, but the point is, the qb has no business going into the media and raising hell vs the fans.

fans buy tickets to games - some of them don't make a whole lot of money, either. "violently assuming"... lol,]

never heard that one before. I didn't say he got Mora fired, I said if he was so great, why didn't he just use his magic twanger and make everybody around him great and they would win all their games, like you portend to believe happens? Don't take being disagreed with so hateful. When a mouthy qb has a hot tub in his room, he knows the rules. That's a red flag. Running his mouth about poor kids in Africa, fans who want the coach fired, poor families of players, ... he is ignoring the fact that they get free tuition, and housing, and food, and travel, and uniforms, and health care and whatever else they get free.

 but this idiot prima donna ignores all that, and says they should be paid. And all that is fine - I just would not select him in the draft.I would find a qb that was not going to divide a lockeroom, divide a fan base, criticize coaches, refs, the NFL, other teams, fans even from other cities.... that is what is possible. I just wouldn't take the chance, and there are other experts in the NFLwho feel the same way.

dude, There's no point in arguing with people who have confirmation bias towards a certain quarterback. If Rosen beat up a girl or robbed a grocery store, they'd still probably say it's not his fault. But if Baker Mayfield did that, you'd never hear the end of it. I've learned to accept that those who love Rosen, love Rosen, and those who love Mayfield love Mayfield. Those who hate Mayfield hate Mayfield, and those who think character isn't important, and that being an pooper can't make you impossible to work with, are just being naive.

Let's hope Dorsey makes the right decision 

[Clevfan4life]

Can someone explain to me why cal thinks rosen is an pooper for his well nuanced analysis of the collegiate sports academic dilemma? 

[Clevfan4life]

The more facts cal posts about rosen make it more and more clear rosens the guy

[Mark O]

5 minutes ago, Clevfan4life said:

The more facts cal posts about rosen make it more and more clear rosens the guy

That and the fact that Josh Allen isn't the guy.

[LogicIsForSquares]

42 minutes ago, stillmotion said:

dude, There's no point in arguing with people who have confirmation bias towards a certain quarterback. If Rosen beat up a girl or robbed a grocery store, they'd still probably say it's not his fault. But if Baker Mayfield did that, you'd never hear the end of it. I've learned to accept that those who love Rosen, love Rosen, and those who love Mayfield love Mayfield. Those who hate Mayfield hate Mayfield, and those who think character isn't important, and that being an pooper can't make you impossible to work with, are just being naive.

Let's hope Dorsey makes the right decision 

I think you are exaggerating a little. I think everyone's gripe with Mayfield is skill. I personally have a severe allergy to Big 12 QBs. They put up video game numbers and fall flat in the pros.

[stillmotion]

55 minutes ago, LogicIsForSquares said:

I think you are exaggerating a little. I think everyone's gripe with Mayfield is skill. I personally have a severe allergy to Big 12 QBs. They put up video game numbers and fall flat in the pros.

dude you're completely generalizing everything about him.....

he's crushing damn near every opponent. he's going to beat alabama and win the national championship. rosen can't even beat USC yet you all put him on such a high horse, his nickname, "the rosen one" already sticks. Sure, many Big 12 QB's have sucked, but it's still generalizing to completely compare Baker on what everyone else did. Manziel, Big 12 Qb's, everyone, while anyone who questions Rosen's character is immediately shunned simply because Baker is smaller, a Big 12 QB, and got in trouble once, and because Rosen is the prototypical NFL qb and makes quick reads.

Why didn't Stanford or USC want Rosen? Was he that much of an a$$hole? Stanford was him dream school and he was the #1 prospect out of high school, yet they didn't want him, but you think the Browns should take him #1.

I don't question his skill or talent, just his intangibles and character, which apparently mean everything to me after the manziel fiasco, and mean absolutely nothing to you. If we choose him and he busts because of his character, I'm sure everyone would still say we "made the right call".

The amount of people from UCLA talking negatively about him is staggering. Don't blame me for playing devil's advocate when everyone I know at his college is trying to convince me he's the younger, football version of Kenny Powers.

[SD_Tom]

Intangibles and character are concerns for guys like jameis winston... Not rosen

 

 

[Mark O]

6 minutes ago, SD_Tom said:

Intangibles and character are concerns for guys like jameis winston... Not rosen

 

 

They're a concern for every player in the draft.   QB's most importantly.    Not sure if the questions about Rosen are truly a red flag or not.....I lean towards the not side of that  question at this point.

[LogicIsForSquares]

2 hours ago, stillmotion said:

dude you're completely generalizing everything about him.....

he's crushing damn near every opponent. he's going to beat alabama and win the national championship. rosen can't even beat USC yet you all put him on such a high horse, his nickname, "the rosen one" already sticks. Sure, many Big 12 QB's have sucked, but it's still generalizing to completely compare Baker on what everyone else did. Manziel, Big 12 Qb's, everyone, while anyone who questions Rosen's character is immediately shunned simply because Baker is smaller, a Big 12 QB, and got in trouble once, and because Rosen is the prototypical NFL qb and makes quick reads.

Why didn't Stanford or USC want Rosen? Was he that much of an a$$hole? Stanford was him dream school and he was the #1 prospect out of high school, yet they didn't want him, but you think the Browns should take him #1.

I don't question his skill or talent, just his intangibles and character, which apparently mean everything to me after the manziel fiasco, and mean absolutely nothing to you. If we choose him and he busts because of his character, I'm sure everyone would still say we "made the right call".

The amount of people from UCLA talking negatively about him is staggering. Don't blame me for playing devil's advocate when everyone I know at his college is trying to convince me he's the younger, football version of Kenny Powers.

You are super sensitive about this because I haven’t chimed in about a damn thing. You are attributing things to me that haven’t happened at all.

I am anti-Mayfield due to Big 12. No thanks. That doesn’t mean I must like Rosen.

[LogicIsForSquares]

I haven’t watched enough of the QBs to make a call on who I would prefer.

[jrb12711]

It won't let me quote but Jesus how many times can I say the same thing that you won't listen to stillmotion?

-Mora and his teammates have noted they respect him and he turned a corner this season. I literally quoted the dude as much, did you care not to read That? Stop being a baby and overreacting to the amount of people talking bad about him. The word shocking is just a balled faced lie. The only people I care about who need to like him are coaches and teammates, who have said they do. 

-he hasn't had any conflict all season. Could it possibly be a 20 year old grew up some? Shocker!

-to say a QB alone should elevate a team to 10 plus wins is absurd and plainly dumb. Come the fudge on with that crap. It shows you haven't watched the ucla games if you think he could do much more than he did.

 

That s not blinders, that's facts. You should really examine who has the blinders on friend.

[calfoxwc]

1 hour ago, jrb12711 said:

It won't let me quote but Jesus how many times can I say the same thing that you won't listen to stillmotion?

**********************************************************

Right back at ya smartmouth. We disagree, but you are getting a self-wedgie over it. Just go with it.

 

-Mora and his teammates have noted they respect him and he turned a corner this season. I literally quoted the dude as much, did you care not to read That? Stop being a baby and overreacting to the amount of people talking bad about him. The word shocking is just a balled faced lie. The only people I care about who need to like him are coaches and teammates, who have said they do. 

***********************************************

Yet, he could have toned it down long enough to not hurt his draft status, but let him become ultra-rich, and the real mouth controverial fan-bashing, coach-ignoring a*** will come right back out again. Read up on how Ryan Leaf got millions and REALLY became the bad Ryan Leaf. Here: (now tell me there isn't anything here that has a similarity to the kind of person Rosen is)

http://www.latimes.com/sports/nfl/la-sp-ryan-leaf-20170311-story.html

 

-he hasn't had any conflict all season. Could it possibly be a 20 year old grew up some? Shocker!

-to say a QB alone should elevate a team to 10 plus wins is absurd and plainly dumb. Come the fudge on with that crap. It shows you haven't watched the ucla games if you think he could do much more than he did.

************************************************************

   I just freaking posted it earlier. Rosen bashed fans with signs wanting Mura to be fired. Who wants to pay a multi-million dollar mouth who alienates fans? maybe the media? maybe half his locker room? That was a conflict. This year.

 

That s not blinders, that's facts. You should really examine who has the blinders on friend.

*******************************************************

     The irony here is really great. LOL

 

[stillmotion]

1 hour ago, jrb12711 said:

-Mora and his teammates have noted they respect him and he turned a corner this season. I literally quoted the dude as much, did you care not to read That? Stop being a baby and overreacting to the amount of people talking bad about him. The word shocking is just a balled faced lie. The only people I care about who need to like him are coaches and teammates, who have said they do. 

Mora has to say that because he was his damn coach. You don't throw a twenty some year old under the bus.

1 hour ago, jrb12711 said:

-he hasn't had any conflict all season. Could it possibly be a 20 year old grew up some? Shocker!

 

Doesn't mean he isn't an immature pooper either. Maybe if one person I knew met him didn't have something bad to say about him, I'd like his character a bit more.

1 hour ago, jrb12711 said:

 

-to say a QB alone should elevate a team to 10 plus wins is absurd and plainly dumb. Come the fudge on with that crap. It shows you haven't watched the ucla games if you think he could do much more than he did.

True great QB's find ways to win close games. Maybe he's matured slightly, but i'd rather have someone who everyone who's supposed to be a fan of doesn't hate. When's the last time you've heard of all of your friends from a college, literally hate the starting college quarerback? That's literally unheard of.... When's the last time you've heard a college professor of his say "that kid sucks"? He's a twenty something yuppie who was spoonfed and told he was great his whole life. He talks backs to pro QB's like trent dilfer, brings a hot tub in his dorm and can't get a girlfriend in his own state. If he didn't treat Dilfer with respect, he sure as hell wouldn't treat you with respect. Do you think he'd treat Browns fans with respect? He'd probably pull an Elway, and then you'd defend him saying, "He had to do it, he did whats best for him and I respect it!"

You sound like a Rosen fanboy now defending him. He couldn't even beat USC. ever. Make excuses for him all you want, but the kid isn't a leader. He's a good quarterback, but very likely to be a locker room cancer and definitely not a leader.

They all say Hundley was LIGHT YEARS better than him. newsflash, I never heard over 60 of my friends say a bad word about Hundley.

You say, "oh you overreact to people saying bad things about him", but maybe it's you who fails to see the fatal flaw in him.

[calfoxwc]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000827405/article/mora-had-productive-talk-with-rosen-about-controversial-remarks

Mora discussed his conversation with Rosen in the aftermath of the controversy on Wednesday's Dan Patrick Show.

"(It was) a very, very productive conversation," Mora said. "... When you express these opinions, you create perceptions, you create controversy, there are those who will agree with you, those that won't agree with you, and you have to be willing to live with the consequences. As a college student, a young person, someone who is growing up and maturing, it's important that at every opportunity, we teach them how to manage their lives."

It's not the first time Mora has counseled Rosen about the image the junior has created as a two-year starter for the Bruins.

CFB 24/7 is marking the days to the start of the 2017 season by counting down the top 25 players in college football.

• 
  
• 1. USC QB Sam Darnold
  2. Penn State RB Saquon Barkley
  3. FSU S Derwin James
  4. LSU OLB Arden Key
  5. LSU RB Derrius Guice
  6. Wyoming QB Josh Allen
  7. Boston College DE Harold Landry
  8. Houston DT Ed Oliver
  9. Louisville QB Lamar Jackson
  10. Texas OT Connor Williams
  11. Clemson DL Christian Wilkins
  12. UCLA QB Josh Rosen
  13. Oklahoma QB Baker Mayfield
  14. Alabama DB Minkah Fitzpatrick
  15. Clemson DT Dexter Lawrence
  16. FSU CB Tarvarus McFadden
  17. N.C. State DE Bradley Chubb
  18. Alabama WR Calvin Ridley
  19. Oklahoma OT Orlando Brown
  20. Washington DT Vita Vea
  21. Texas A&M WR Christian Kirk
  22. SMU WR Courtland Sutton
  23. Alabama DT Da'Ron Payne
  24. Alabama RB Bo Scarbrough
  25. Texas LB Malik Jefferson

 

[Dutch Oven]

19 hours ago, Tour2ma said:

If only your standards were half as high for picking a President...

Trust me Tour, the irony has not been lost on me either.

This anti-Rosen crusade by calfox is so laughably agenda-driven by him that Fox News would find it embarrassing.

And I don't even think concern about Rosen's intangibles isn't somewhat legit... I'm still on the fence with him at this point, but come on, man.

[calfoxwc]

https://www.si.com/college-football/2016/08/08/ucla-qb-josh-rosen-bonafide-star-how-will-he-handle-fame

Rosen is nothing if not sure of himself, which he says is why he has clashed with adults and coaches over the years. He also admits he's not the most beloved guy on the UCLA sorority scene. "I have a superiority complex I need to get rid of," he says. "Girls that I am really good homies with tell me about how often they have to defend my image to girls that don't know me." Earlier in the day he described what he's looking for in a future partner: "My wife is going to be a fighter. I need someone to tell me to f‑‑‑ off every once in a while." While noting that the demands of football don't leave him enough time for a girlfriend, he acknowledged, "I'm not mature enough right now."

[calfoxwc]

I had rosen off my list for character reasons long before I found out about the hat thing. Does using that excuse for me

disagreeing with you help you feel better or what? If he wore an "Obama is a marxist war criminal" hat, I'd feel the same way about him - negative attention is good attention to him. because he is an "a****e" LIke I posted, he even admits it to a point. Truth is, you ignore it because you agree with him, and if he had a hat like I noted above, you would be outraged.

[stillmotion]

2 minutes ago, Dutch Oven said:

Trust me Tour, the irony has not been lost on me either.

This anti-Rosen crusade by calfox is so laughably agenda-driven by him that Fox News would find it embarrassing.

This thread is about what's wrong with Josh Rosen.

It's nothing that has to do with his QB play, and everything about his character.

If the kid ends up being an a$$hole beyond Manziel caliber, I expect apologies from all of you who were so naive, you didn't even consider he could bust because of it.

You consider Mayfield might be a bust, but not Rosen, whom even his professors and fans say is an arrogant pr1ck.

We talk about Mayfield being a bust but not Rosen being a bust regarding his character because you're all biased that Rosen will be the golden boy who saves the Browns.

None of you addressed why both Stanford and USC wouldn't let him in even thought he was the #1 Prospect. Just imagine how much of an a$$hole the kid must be.

And some of you are so naive, you expect a millionaire spoonfed QB to accept going to the Cleveland Browns and playing in the cold and leading us to championships?

Rosen would either bust, or pull an Elway.

[Dutch Oven]

4 minutes ago, stillmotion said:

This thread is about what's wrong with Josh Rosen.

It's nothing that has to do with his QB play, and everything about his character.

If the kid ends up being an a$$hole beyond Manziel caliber, I expect apologies from all of you who were so naive, you didn't even consider he could bust because of it.

You consider Mayfield might be a bust, but not Rosen, whom even his professors and fans say is an arrogant pr1ck.

We talk about Mayfield being a bust but not Rosen being a bust regarding his character because you're all biased that Rosen will be the golden boy who saves the Browns.

None of you addressed why both Stanford and USC wouldn't let him in even thought he was the #1 Prospect. Just imagine how much of an a$$hole the kid must be.

And some of you are so naive, you expect a millionaire spoonfed QB to accept going to the Cleveland Browns and playing in the cold and leading us to championships?

Rosen would either bust, or pull an Elway.

I've mentioned my concerns about Rosen's character. I've mentioned my concerns about Mayfield's character.

There's a reason I haven't come out and said "SO AND SO IS MY GUY FOR THE #1 PICK".

So at this point, I'm sticking with on-the-field attributes until (hopefully) I can feel confident about the character of whoever.

This being said, on-the-field, I'll take Rosen over Mayfield every day, and twice on Sundays.

[Tim Couch Pulls Out]

Snowflake Republicans don’t like him because he wore a Shmuck Trump bandana on a Trump Golf  Course and because it pains them to see wealthy white Americans vote with their brains instead of their wallets.

Theyll find something to nitpick over but, as always, their arguments are weak and carry no actual water.

Thats all this is.

The guy is the best passer in the draft, he’s succeeded in spite of a pretty awful team, he’s intelligent and he’s not a pussy who’s afraid to speak on what he’s passionate about. He deserves to be the #1 pick. 

 

I just dont know if we’ll be the ones making that pick.

 

[jrb12711]

4 minutes ago, Tim Couch Pulls Out said:

Snowflake Republicans don’t like him because he wore a Shmuck Trump bandana on a Trump Golf  Course and because it pains them to see wealthy white Americans vote with their brains instead of their wallets.

Theyll find something to nitpick over but, as always, their arguments are weak and carry no actual water.

Thats all this is.

 

That was getting around to my next point because it's clear that's the case. Call me crazy, but I just want a damn good QB.

And no still, you self quoting your "friends" isn't going to change my mind. Come on now. All my friends say Rosen is a great dude, and I have over 100. Sounds pretty unbelievable? Yeah..

[calfoxwc]

intestesting, since I posted about Rosen himself admitting he has a bad reputation for being a jerk.

No thanks. A darn good qb - Ryan Leaf? nope. Jimmy Claussen? nope. etc

[Clevfan4life]

Has anyone elses esteem of rosen risen with every cal post? Srsly cal u should stop posting the kids words cause he sounds better and better with every post. He's obviously not a little my sht dont stink weasel. The kid is upfront about deficiencies

[RoyceRolls]

Damn, still motion, mayfield must’ve hit your prostate just right.  

The most amusing part is that you’re railing against Rosen based on character issues that he’s an alleged arsehole, but moan in ecstasy over a guy who got arrested for being a drunkard that ran from the cops. 

[calfoxwc]

The trouble is, one drunken night - just a mistake in partying? just that once?

that isn't a lifetime of being a jerk. But Mayfield's behavior is also bringing about questions.

[Clevfan4life]

Is rosen a pro on and off the field? Does he have any vice's that may take him off the field? Those are the only questions that matter. Brady is a reknowned coksucker too but nobody cares cause he wins. "So far" rosen has to be looked at as the best pure pocket passer coming out since luck.