Louisville Slugger Posted January 12, 2018 Report Share Posted January 12, 2018 2 hours ago, hoorta said: Sorry if I'm not feeling the Cousins love..... Yes, about as unreal as Kansas City fans thinking they can get two first round picks for Alex Smith. Flipping picks with the Giants nets you a second- max. The Giants will have no incentive to trade up- they'll just take the QB we don't. Or they'll know we aren't realistically taking a QB with Kirk on board. What's not to like about Cousins( says the guy from kentucky) at worst he's an above average QB. We need to stablize this franchise and he would give is the best opportunity to do so. If the Giants fall in love with one of them they will give us whatever we want Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted January 12, 2018 Report Share Posted January 12, 2018 46 minutes ago, Louisville Slugger said: 1) What's not to like about Cousins( says the guy from kentucky) at worst he's an above average QB. We need to stabilize this franchise and he would give is the best opportunity to do so. 2) If the Giants fall in love with one of them they will give us whatever we want I ain't from Kentucky- you have to go at least 50 miles south of Dayton to be considered that, and Louisville? You should know what's north or south of the Ohio River by now. So regarding "stabilization" do you want 2-3 years out of Smith, or 5-6 out of Cousins? The stats are equal, that you've ignored. 1) An above average QB and you want to make him the highest paid QB in the NFL? Been drinking too much of that Kentucky moonshine? I've said it a bunch of times already- one of the guys I regularly discuss football with is an assistant manager at my Friday night hangout- The Pine Club. Happens to be a lifelong and serious Redskins fan- watches all the games, and his opinion is Cousins is overrated, and not worth anywhere near the money he's been commanding. Kirk has one thing going for him- he has the best agent in the biz. His "interest" in the Browns is only to drive up his market value- because he damn well knows the Browns have more available cash than anyone. He's also expressed his interest in remaining with the Redskins. Cousins is a (relatively) short term fix- at absolute top dollar. At the detriment of drafting a guy- who could easily be "the guy" for the next 10-12 years. I'll say this- I'm pushing 70 on the age meter, and I'm not old enough to remember Otto Graham ever playing for the Browns. It's way overdue for the Browns to draft, not back the Brinks up for a 5 year fix. About the time the Browns at the current rate they've been going will be ready to challenge for the Super Bowl- will be same time Cousins is going downhill fast. As Canton Mike just posted- Cousins hasn't shown HOF potential yet with a mediocre W\L record, but some of you want to pay him like Tom Brady +. 2) No they won't. There's even some chatter if we take Rosen\Darnold they may take Saquon Barkley. They'll be more than happy to sit at #2 (assuming we draft a QB) and take the one we don't want. If we don't take a qb, they have it made in the shade. Go look at the draft value chart- http://walterfootball.com/draftchart.php the Giants second round pick is more than enough to flip picks with the Browns, even taking into account the "QB premium". PS- in that scenario- I make that trade (pun intended) in a New York minute. We get Darnold or Rosen- the top two picks in the second round, with five overall on day two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louisville Slugger Posted January 13, 2018 Report Share Posted January 13, 2018 I was making fun of my owns states reputation for kissing cousins. I'm nit saying Cousins is worth the money for any other team but we really need to turn this thing around. We have to get competent quarterback play and if we have to over pay for it so be it. We need a culture change in the worst way Alex Smith isn't on the same planet. He is on a great team and he is a system guy. I promise he will look like a turd in a browns uniform. If the Giants think one of the 2 are their guy than they will throw the draft sheet out the window. They'll get in a bidding war with denver5, Jets6 or someone else. well ask for 3 1st round picks like Washington got and well settle for 2 and move back a spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wargograw Posted January 13, 2018 Report Share Posted January 13, 2018 22 hours ago, hoorta said: Here come the excuses- he played on a better team... I'm glad you're not Dorsey- because we ARE drafting a QB. The Cousins crowd has their minds made up, not much sense arguing any further. . This is my last thought on Kirk. HIs window of opportunity is going to be a lot shorter than Smith + rookie @ #1 overall. Are you guys assuming that he's going to be an anomaly like Tom Brady and be able to play at a Pro Bowl level for the next 10 years? I sure as hell wouldn't bet on that. Plus- Cousins best season to date has been 9-7. My peanut gallery POV is the odds of Cousins winding up in Cleveland are on the level of Chiefs fans dreaming they're going to get two first round picks for Alex Smith. & speaking of- the Redskins (just to make life difficult for the Browns) could slap the non-exclusive franchise tag on Cousins. Sorry guys- we're not giving up two first round picks for Kirk. That would include this years #1 overall. Yeah some pimple faced college kid is a much safer pick than a playoff QB.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted January 13, 2018 Report Share Posted January 13, 2018 3 hours ago, wargograw said: Yeah some pimple faced college kid is a much safer pick than a playoff QB.... Ha, go wish and hope your one year wonder can do the same with the Broncos. 7-9 $150 million. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted January 14, 2018 Report Share Posted January 14, 2018 NOT the FQOTF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted January 20, 2018 Report Share Posted January 20, 2018 Reasonable article on Cousins that more or less sums up my take... Scot McCloughan on Redskins quarterback Kirk Cousins: ‘I don’t see special’ By Scott Allen January 19 at 1:36 PM https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/dc-sports-bog/wp/2018/01/19/scot-mccloughan-on-redskins-quarterback-kirk-cousins-i-dont-see-special/?utm_term=.600ccc3e1bfb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcam222 Posted January 20, 2018 Report Share Posted January 20, 2018 On 1/11/2018 at 6:14 AM, jiggins7919 said: Washington won't let him go. It's nice to HEAR this kind of thing because we're all sick and tired of hearing how people WON'T play for us, but I don't expect Cousins to be available. It's still Alex Smith time. Washington is going to have a very tough time keeping Cousins. The exclusive tag will cost them $34M for this coming season. They can transition tag him and a team like us will take him with a front loaded deal they can't match. They cannot use the non exclusive tag to protect as he's not elegible for that tag per the link explanation below. He's on the move https://www.hogshaven.com/2017/12/2/16700962/the-5-oclock-club Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orion Posted January 20, 2018 Report Share Posted January 20, 2018 .....whenever I see this thread: Cousins would "seriously consider" the Browns ...I think to myself, "Yeah....'cos that's always been good for a QB's future". ...and our roster! Our best player is our 3rd down RB. - and a druggie WR who's always one toke away from being banished from the NFL. - and we CAN'T really do much to pretty up the roster to entice a FA until free agency is upon us. I just can't get by thinking that a 'normal' person, a sought after veteran QB, would want to go somewhere where he has at least a remote chance of playing in a super bowl someday. - and I don't buy the bit about a veteran coming here to be proud of being a part of turning a team around. BullS#it. ( 1-31 ) We would be a last resort. Player agents know us. They see that we have an owner that's not known for making good decisions regarding his football team. His last regime played moneyball so he could save money so he could pay out millions to a ton of customers of his company Pilot Flying J because he was ripping them off. - but it's the 0-16 parade that would really scare away a FA - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted January 20, 2018 Report Share Posted January 20, 2018 29 minutes ago, jcam222 said: Washington is going to have a very tough time keeping Cousins. The exclusive tag will cost them $34M for this coming season. They can transition tag him and a team like us will take him with a front loaded deal they can't match. They cannot use the non exclusive tag to protect as he's not elegible for that tag per the link explanation below. He's on the move https://www.hogshaven.com/2017/12/2/16700962/the-5-oclock-club Nice article J. If the Redskins were able to use the the non-exclusive tag (they can't per the article) that would have caused an abrupt loss of interest by the Browns. It would have cost Cleveland the #1 overall, and a first round next year? No thanks. Hmmm, would the Bills with 2 relatively low first round picks this year be interested? They have the cap room, and Cousins would be a serious upgrade over Tyrod Taylor. The other problem is the $34 million Cousins would be owed under any tag. MHO is I wouldn't pay a healthy Tom Brady that on a one year rent-a-player deal. Best option is for Washington to work out a long term contract with KIrk. Looks like they just let him walk, they get nothing in return. Other option is a sign and trade. Per the article Tour posted, serious doubts Cousins would be interested in the Browns, we're not exactly the model of a stable franchise he wants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flugel Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 On 1/20/2018 at 2:59 PM, jcam222 said: Washington is going to have a very tough time keeping Cousins. The exclusive tag will cost them $34M for this coming season. They can transition tag him and a team like us will take him with a front loaded deal they can't match. They cannot use the non exclusive tag to protect as he's not elegible for that tag per the link explanation below. He's on the move https://www.hogshaven.com/2017/12/2/16700962/the-5-oclock-club What's so tough about not thinking he's been special enough for keeper status 2 years in a row? Did he make anyone sorry for that? Nope, why overpay him here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcam222 Posted January 22, 2018 Report Share Posted January 22, 2018 44 minutes ago, Flugel said: What's so tough about not thinking he's been special enough for keeper status 2 years in a row? Did he make anyone sorry for that? Nope, why overpay him here? Not sure I understand your point....... Bottom line he turns in top 10 QB stats on a team lacking weapons. He's going to get paid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flugel Posted January 22, 2018 Report Share Posted January 22, 2018 28 minutes ago, jcam222 said: Not sure I understand your point? Fair enough. Why do you suppose the team that has had Cousins has refused to lock him up for a long term deal in each of the last 2 years despite the opportunity to do so? Did he lead them to the playoffs this year to make them regret not locking him up long term? No. He's available because he isn't a keeper on a team that wasn't a winner in 2017; but he has those Jay Cutleresque stats for anyone that wants to buy his quick sand. I hope we aim higher for a guy like Alex Smith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcam222 Posted January 22, 2018 Report Share Posted January 22, 2018 10 minutes ago, Flugel said: Fair enough. Why do you suppose the team that has had Cousins has refused to lock him up for a long term deal in each of the last 2 years despite the opportunity to do so? Did he lead them to the playoffs this year to make them regret not locking him up long term? no. He's available because he isn't a keeper on a team that wasn't a winner in 2017; but he has those Jay Cutleresque stats for anyone that wants to buy his quick sand. I hope we aim higher for a guy like Alex Smith. I like Smith a lot too and wouldn't mind at all if we pick him up. He gives a very short window though to hit on and groom a good QB rookie. Relative to why the Skins didn't lock up Cousins, most things I've read consider that a complete failure on the skins part. They are in a bad place now for QB. It's my belief that you give Cousins a fleet of weapons like Gordon, Jarvis Landry, Saquon Barkley , Duke and Njoku and he leads you deep into the playoffs and further for the next 7 years or more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canton Mike Posted January 22, 2018 Report Share Posted January 22, 2018 3 minutes ago, Flugel said: Fair enough. Why do you suppose the team that has had Cousins has refused to lock him up for a long term deal in each of the last 2 years despite the opportunity to do so? Did he lead them to the playoffs this year to make them regret not locking him up long term? no. He's available because he isn't a keeper on a team that wasn't a winner in 2017; but he has those Jay Cutleresque stats for anyone that wants to buy his quick sand. I hope we aim higher for a guy like Alex Smith. Good points Tom. As you know, I am not sold on Cousins either. Stats, such as 4,000 yds per year DO NOT mean success. They can be padded during garbage time, against "prevent Ds", etc........to back me up, Cousins as a starter (began in 2015).....Here are some "stats" for those who love stats...... 2015...4,166 yards, 29 TDs, 11 Ints, 9 fumbles (3 lost).......9-7 record 2016...4,917 yards, 25 TDs, 12 Ints, 9 fumbles (3 lost).......8-7-1 record 2017...4,093 yards, 27 TDs, 13 Ints, 13 fumbles (5 lost).....7-9 record Sound like the guy is worthy of the biggest paycheck in the NFL? My answer is a resounding NO THANKS! I posted this for those of you who think his 4,000 yard seasons are enough to turn us around. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flugel Posted January 22, 2018 Report Share Posted January 22, 2018 2 minutes ago, jcam222 said: I like Smith a lot too. Relative to why the Skins didn't lock up Cousins, most things I've read consider that a complete failure on the skins part. They are in a bad place now for QB. It's my belief that you give Cousins a fleet of weapons like Gordon, Jarvis Landry, Saquon Barkley , Duke and Njoku and he leads you deep into the playoffs and further for the next 7 years or more. Some valid points but did he create any magic with DeSean Jackson in 2016 or T Pryor in 2017? Jordan Reed is a good receiver to tap at TE and I think they also added Vernon Davis that he had some moderate chemistry with. I can't help but feeling like Cousins is getting overrated by some desperation here while I don't get the sense Gruden thinks he's worth fighting for. Nobody has seen more of him than Gruden so I weigh that pretty heavily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dutch Oven Posted January 22, 2018 Report Share Posted January 22, 2018 I think it's pretty smart of Cousins to say he'd consider going to a team that has a TON of cap space and desperately needs a QB. The Browns are a perfect team for him to use to get someone else to up their contract offer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcam222 Posted January 22, 2018 Report Share Posted January 22, 2018 5 minutes ago, Dutch Oven said: I think it's pretty smart of Cousins to say he'd consider going to a team that has a TON of cap space and desperately needs a QB. The Browns are a perfect team for him to use to get someone else to up their contract offer. We are also a team fo him to simply go to, get paid a ton of money and be surrounded by weapons and a team that I believe will get the biggest infusion of talent we have seen since the return. Our use of free agency and the draft is about to be shock and awe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flugel Posted January 22, 2018 Report Share Posted January 22, 2018 11 hours ago, Canton Mike said: Good points Tom. As you know, I am not sold on Cousins either. Stats, such as 4,000 yds per year DO NOT mean success. They can be padded during garbage time, against "prevent Ds", etc........to back me up, Cousins as a starter (began in 2015).....Here are some "stats" for those who love stats...... 2015...4,166 yards, 29 TDs, 11 Ints, 9 fumbles (3 lost).......9-7 record 2016...4,917 yards, 25 TDs, 12 Ints, 9 fumbles (3 lost).......8-7-1 record 2017...4,093 yards, 27 TDs, 13 Ints, 13 fumbles (5 lost).....7-9 record Sound like the guy is worthy of the biggest paycheck in the NFL? My answer is a resounding NO THANKS! I posted this for those of you who think his 4,000 yard seasons are enough to turn us around. Mike Very well said Mike. He reminds me of Junktime Jay Cutler who capitalizes merely on the shortage of veteran QBs for the demand. The team that films every one of his practices since he's been there seems reluctant to commit long term to him. I gotta trust they have their reasons from the eye in the sky and the other Gruden. Were there any WRs or TEs playing at a high level because of him? And, his volumes of fumbles for a team hoping to decrease those significantly from the QB position raises at least 1 eye brow. Unfortunately, beggers can't be choosey since it's not going to be easy getting a veteran QB pumped about joining a 1-31 program. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted January 22, 2018 Report Share Posted January 22, 2018 On 1/12/2018 at 8:57 PM, Louisville Slugger said: If the Giants think one of the 2 are their guy than they will throw the draft sheet out the window. They'll get in a bidding war with denver5, Jets6 or someone else. well ask for 3 1st round picks like Washington got and well settle for 2 and move back a spot. I've said it once- dream on about getting a draft haul like that. Certainly not from the Giants. Second round pick- tops. The only way that happens is in the (unlikely) scenario the Broncos or Jets want to move up to #1 overall. They won't- because the QB class is deep enough they will be able to just sit at their respective spots and still get decent talent. For sure this year we're not trading the #1 down. The #4 flipped to #5 or #6 is a different story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louisville Slugger Posted January 23, 2018 Report Share Posted January 23, 2018 14 hours ago, hoorta said: I've said it once- dream on about getting a draft haul like that. Certainly not from the Giants. Second round pick- tops. The only way that happens is in the (unlikely) scenario the Broncos or Jets want to move up to #1 overall. They won't- because the QB class is deep enough they will be able to just sit at their respective spots and still get decent talent. For sure this year we're not trading the #1 down. The #4 flipped to #5 or #6 is a different story. I disagree. They will decide who the best QB in the draft is and I think they will have no problems giving up their 1st next year to get their guy. QB is a premium position and you don't settle for second best if you don't have to. Not to mention you know the Broncos and jets will be in a bidding war for that pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickers Posted January 23, 2018 Report Share Posted January 23, 2018 Cousins is not the long term solution.. I'd rather go Smith/McCarron , whatever QB we draft.. Put Kizer on the taxi squad... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louisville Slugger Posted January 23, 2018 Report Share Posted January 23, 2018 Why isn't cousins the long term solution? The man is only 29 he can play for 5 maybe 10 more years. I want no part in Smith. He has only played well under reid and he's 34. He doesn't fit the Jackson/Haley model either. My top scenarios go like this Cousins + trade back + middle round guy Bridgewater + Darnold McCarron(If he's a FA) + Darnold Darnold + a ton of money and draft picks on offensive weapons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickers Posted January 23, 2018 Report Share Posted January 23, 2018 9 hours ago, Louisville Slugger said: Why isn't cousins the long term solution? The man is only 29 he can play for 5 maybe 10 more years. I want no part in Smith. He has only played well under reid and he's 34. He doesn't fit the Jackson/Haley model either. My top scenarios go like this Cousins + trade back + middle round guy Bridgewater + Darnold McCarron(If he's a FA) + Darnold Darnold + a ton of money and draft picks on offensive weapons. Yes and 29 means hes gonna be 30.. I just dont think Cousins will get you to a SB.. I would rather take my chance on a younger McCarron... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted January 23, 2018 Report Share Posted January 23, 2018 9 hours ago, Louisville Slugger said: Why isn't cousins the long term solution? The man is only 29 he can play for 5 maybe 10 more years. I want no part in Smith. He has only played well under reid and he's 34. He doesn't fit the Jackson/Haley model either. My top scenarios go like this Cousins + trade back + middle round guy Bridgewater + Darnold McCarron(If he's a FA) + Darnold Darnold + a ton of money and draft picks on offensive weapons. Regarding Smith- he's improved virtually every year he's played. His yards\attempt is among the best in the league. He's a way better option for a year or two (with Darnold or Allen sitting and learning behind him) than backing up the Brinks for Cousins and hoping Kizer is going to "get it". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syd Posted January 23, 2018 Report Share Posted January 23, 2018 also when haley was at K.C didn't he get them to the playoffs with Cassell as Q.B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcam222 Posted January 24, 2018 Report Share Posted January 24, 2018 On 1/21/2018 at 8:19 PM, Canton Mike said: Good points Tom. As you know, I am not sold on Cousins either. Stats, such as 4,000 yds per year DO NOT mean success. They can be padded during garbage time, against "prevent Ds", etc........to back me up, Cousins as a starter (began in 2015).....Here are some "stats" for those who love stats...... 2015...4,166 yards, 29 TDs, 11 Ints, 9 fumbles (3 lost).......9-7 record 2016...4,917 yards, 25 TDs, 12 Ints, 9 fumbles (3 lost).......8-7-1 record 2017...4,093 yards, 27 TDs, 13 Ints, 13 fumbles (5 lost).....7-9 record Sound like the guy is worthy of the biggest paycheck in the NFL? My answer is a resounding NO THANKS! I posted this for those of you who think his 4,000 yard seasons are enough to turn us around. Mike 9 -7 can put you in the playoffs. You also neglected to include his rushing TD's at about 5 per year. Guys that can consistently put up 4200+ yards 30 TD's and a better than 2/1 TD/INT ratio get paid, a lot as a FA. I'm not convinced his contract will be highest paid but it will be hefty and should be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louisville Slugger Posted January 24, 2018 Report Share Posted January 24, 2018 4 hours ago, nickers said: Yes and 29 means hes gonna be 30.. I just dont think Cousins will get you to a SB.. I would rather take my chance on a younger McCarron... Are we really talking superbowl after a winless season? He made the redskins playoff contenders and I think we have better talent than them. Bottom line let's get out cellar and start winning games. We can't win a superbowl if we never get to the playoffs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thenew23 Posted January 24, 2018 Author Report Share Posted January 24, 2018 I can't believe there are so many anti-Cousins guys after what we've trotted out at QB the past 20 years... Is it money? Rather wait for a draft pick to develop? Age? Listen, he's the ONLY win-now option... Unless you are all content with 2-3 more years of crap? ... I don't get it. 4 years with him at QB and we at least get to see some exciting football in that time... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
runyon27 Posted January 24, 2018 Report Share Posted January 24, 2018 5 hours ago, nickers said: Yes and 29 means hes gonna be 30.. I just dont think Cousins will get you to a SB.. I would rather take my chance on a younger McCarron... I am not sure why people love a QB who can't beat out Andy Dalton. Pass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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