Guest mz. Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 Just watch Errol Morris doc Standard Operating Procedure instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicopee John Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 Just watch Errol Morris doc Standard Operating Procedure instead. Obama is doing the right thing, IMHO. Not interested in watching the video. This is WAR and it isn't supposed to be pretty or fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mz. Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 Hilarious. Why is it those who support the use of torture never have the temerity (or balls) to actually look at it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicopee John Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 Hilarious. Why is it those who support the use of torture never have the temerity (or balls) to actually look at it? I know that extreme tactics are used by all parties. I don't believe we should sit out the dance. Gentlemen play croquet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mz. Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 But why not see what's going on before making a judgment on what should or shouldn't be taking place? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicopee John Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 But why not see what's going on before making a judgment on what should or shouldn't be taking place? I like Hot Dogs, mz the pussy, but I don't care to see how they are made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mz. Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 I like Hot Dogs, mz the pussy, but I don't care to see how they are made. You might not care how they're made, but seeing how they're made might help you to be able to make a more informed decision on whether you should continue eating them or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicopee John Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 You might not care how they're made, but seeing how they're made might help you to be able to make a more informed decision on whether you should continue eating them or not. I said that I don't care to SEE how they are made. I have a pretty good idea, though. Good enough for me. Pass the Stadium Mustard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mz. Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 Good enough for me. That's the exact qualifier I was looking for. Me, I need to know. That's how I can decide what works best for me. Not so much with the hot dog, which is relatively unimportant when compared to detainee torture, you know... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicopee John Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 That's the exact qualifier I was looking for. Me, I need to know. That's how I can decide what works best for me. Not so much with the hot dog, which is relatively unimportant when compared to detainee torture, you know... Give me a good Nathan's any day of the week. PS The huge Kobiashi vs. Chestnut challenge for the Coney Island Championship is this Saturday. Tune in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osusev Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 mz the pussy let me preface this post by stating I am not supporting the use of "torture". The concept of using "leverage" and "incentives" is very broad and GREY...... Moral based ideologies are very difficult to judge and depending upon the perspective very hard to nail down. I have a hypothetical situation: a 5 year old child is kidnapped by a group of pedophiles, you capture one and know that by using intimidation and physical punishment you can get the location of the innocent 5 year old. If the only leverage that will garner that information is "physical" torture is it the right choice to not use that because it would undermine your personal code? Or is it wrong NOT to use that sort of leverage and let the child be victimized by a group of pedophiles? Depending on your perspective their does not exist a "right" answer to me.. which is basically the conundrum faced by our nation right now. For me I have traveled and lived in a few different continents and find that as a species we are quite savage. In some cases certain humans only respond to savage methods.... IF it serves to save some innocents in some cases you have to use what is available to you. IF you dont than you are party to innocents being victimized..... IT is a difficult line for me to choose how i want to walk it and live by but.... I can gaurantee you IF any of MY children or any child could be saved by my personal use of "aggressive" tactics I would not hesitate nor feel any remorse. I know that is a savage part of myself and wish the world was a different place, but it is what it is and my hope for a more utopian species is a pipe dream. I will play with the cards I am dealt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mz. Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 I hear ya, sev, but it goes way beyond WHAT they did, but also WHO they did. There are tales (and these are the soldiers who worked Abu Grahib talking) of rounding up any and all "fighting-age males" and torturing them, whether they were "suspicious" or not. This is a component of this situation that gets severly overlooked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osusev Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 mz the pussy DEFINATELY there are cases of "round ups" that overextend any sort of broad definition of intelligence gathering. I do support punishment for those who ORDERED it and those who did not have the intestinal fortitude to report or abstain from behavior to those who were clearly innocent. I understand the chain of command and taking orders, however there are personal choices irregardless of the personal ramifications it may have for me that I would not cross. There are people who use the EXCUSE "i was ordered" and therefore my free will means nothing and excuses my personal actions. There are definately high ranking military and civilian personnel that need to be held accountable. I HIGHLY doubt they ever will because our leadership just wants to move on for its own personal agenda. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mz. Posted July 1, 2009 Report Share Posted July 1, 2009 And they were held accountable and had great remorse. Many discuss serving prison time. These were the folks interviewed for the film (Lyndie England et al). Just a sad and awful situation all around. I couldn't recommend viewing this film any more strenuously... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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