Guest Aloysius Posted July 20, 2009 Report Share Posted July 20, 2009 In case you missed it, here's the most interesting part: To parents -- to parents, we can't tell our kids to do well in school and then fail to support them when they get home. (Applause.) You can't just contract out parenting. For our kids to excel, we have to accept our responsibility to help them learn. That means putting away the Xbox -- (applause) -- putting our kids to bed at a reasonable hour. (Applause.) It means attending those parent-teacher conferences and reading to our children and helping them with their homework. (Applause.) And by the way, it means we need to be there for our neighbor's sons and daughters. (Applause.) We need to go back to the time, back to the day when we parents saw somebody, saw some kid fooling around and -- it wasn't your child, but they'll whup you anyway. (Laughter and applause.) Or at least they'll tell your parents -- the parents will. You know. (Laughter.) That's the meaning of community. That's how we can reclaim the strength and the determination and the hopefulness that helped us come so far; helped us make a way out of no way. It also means pushing our children to set their sights a little bit higher. They might think they've got a pretty good jump shot or a pretty good flow, but our kids can't all aspire to be LeBron or Lil Wayne. (Applause.) I want them aspiring to be scientists and engineers -- (applause) -- doctors and teachers -- (applause) -- not just ballers and rappers. I want them aspiring to be a Supreme Court Justice. (Applause.) I want them aspiring to be the President of the United States of America. (Applause.) I want their horizons to be limitless. I don't -- don't tell them they can't do something. Don't feed our children with a sense of -- that somehow because of their race that they cannot achieve. Yes, government must be a force for opportunity. Yes, government must be a force for equality. But ultimately, if we are to be true to our past, then we also have to seize our own future, each and every day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy Fan Posted July 20, 2009 Report Share Posted July 20, 2009 In case you missed it, here's the most interesting part: Great speech. Agree with every line but the last paragraph. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicopee John Posted July 20, 2009 Report Share Posted July 20, 2009 In case you missed it, here's the most interesting part: Obama gets accolades and Bill Cosby gets the 'Uncle Tom' moniker. Go figure. Any way, I believe this was a great message. However, who was 'we'? If it was members of the NAACP, then it might have been a case of singing to the choir. You have to start somewhere and I give Obama credit for making this plea (again). However, there are huge deficits in the Black community when it comes to fatherhood, values, etc. Maybe virtually all can be laid at the feet of irresponsible fathers (and mothers). Change will not come quickly but it needs to occur. I'd love to see this mantra become as common as any slogan coming out of the Black community. It needs to be woven into the quilt of life. It cannot exist as a bumper sticker, alone. Let's hope and help as much as we can - all people but, most importantly, Black fathers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballpeen Posted July 21, 2009 Report Share Posted July 21, 2009 Thanks for that. If president Obama can motivate the bulk of the Africans to aspire for more, to motivate them to be more than they have achieved in the last 100 years, to turn them away from crime, to stick by and help raise their families, to meld in to main steam society, to have pride in America, to be valuable members of society rather than a dredge, I am all for it!!! He is right...there are no excuses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. T Posted July 21, 2009 Report Share Posted July 21, 2009 I like the charge of being responsible to the parents, so many times today parents neglect to take charge in raising their children and end up showing them a world without consequences. I can remember when I first moved to Wilmington NC my daughter was new to HS, the wife and I went to the parents teachers conference, we were their with just a handful of parents and only about half of the teaching staff was was at hand. When I asked where everybody was the dean told me that the parents dont come to these things so most of the teachers dont bother coming back after school. We were able to meet with just one of her teachers. It was a bad day non the less, It was the same when we tried to get tutoring for her in algebra, she would show up and the teacher wouldn't stay after making the appointment to be there. after the the 3rd day straight of this behavior we went to the principal and demanded to know what was going on, he simply stated the teacher has tenure and nothing could be done. pretty sad. And this is the same HS that produced the M. Jordan that we all know how to hate. I would say the teachers need to take up the same resoponsibility as what is asked of the parents. And as far as the last sentence in the quote, to seize??? does he mean to take or grab with government assistance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Aloysius Posted July 21, 2009 Report Share Posted July 21, 2009 Agree with every line but the last paragraph. And I don't think you actually disagree with it, if you think of it in a way other than endorsing specific Obama policies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy Fan Posted July 21, 2009 Report Share Posted July 21, 2009 And I don't think you actually disagree with it, if you think of it in a way other than endorsing specific Obama policies. Perhaps an "aid" and not a "force." The latter, I believe, is very representative of some of his policies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosar_For_President Posted July 21, 2009 Report Share Posted July 21, 2009 Geez Louise, Obama basically summed up what I was shouting about 3 months ago in regards to the black community and the problems that I was told were "merely anecdotal" You should run for city council. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted July 21, 2009 Report Share Posted July 21, 2009 Perhaps an "aid" and not a "force." The latter, I believe, is very representative of some of his policies. And IMO, nullifies the positive aspects of the bulk of the speech. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. T Posted July 21, 2009 Report Share Posted July 21, 2009 He didn't write that speech, do you really think he gives a crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heckofajobbrownie Posted July 21, 2009 Report Share Posted July 21, 2009 I find it interesting that we can't even get you guys to agree that government should be a force for opportunity and equality. I'm wondering what you'd prefer it be a force for. I'd think that line would be entirely uncontroversial, especially when it's just stating the premise in the abstract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heckofajobbrownie Posted July 21, 2009 Report Share Posted July 21, 2009 I don't think you're talking about what he's talking about. We have laws about equality and against discrimination that the government enforces. The government is also in charge of a lot of things that promote opportunity, namely schools, but also things like economic stability and growth, public safety, etc. Don't you think this is what he's referring to? As for finding a government in history that was a force for good, I'd say ours was, wouldn't you? I'd point you to the Bill of Rights for starters. As for your point that the government can't make people successful, isn't that his point? Isn't this whole excerpt about the responsibility of parenting and self-reliance? "Yes, government must be a force for opportunity. Yes, government must be a force for equality. But ultimately, if we are to be true to our past, then we also have to seize our own future, each and every day." To me that's him saying that government should and must set the stage for equal opportunity and equality, but the rest is up to you. No? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted July 21, 2009 Report Share Posted July 21, 2009 "Yes, government must be a force for opportunity. Yes, government must be a force for equality. But ultimately, if we are to be true to our past, then we also have to seize our own future, each and every day." To me that's him saying that government should and must set the stage for equal opportunity and equality, but the rest is up to you. No? Actually it sounds like he's speaking to a group who favors some government policies that address their perception of past and present injustice. Affirmitive action, set asides, hate crime legislation etc. It sounds like an ambiguous way of reassuring them that those things still have a place in his plans though self reliance is also important. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heckofajobbrownie Posted July 21, 2009 Report Share Posted July 21, 2009 Ah, the code. Wink, wink. Devious. So how does he mention opportunity and equality and mean opportunity and equality? Or is that impossible? It's a pretty bland statement, fellas, one that any president would make. If anything, this is a traditionally conservative message. Try not to lose your shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosar_For_President Posted July 21, 2009 Report Share Posted July 21, 2009 He didn't write that speech, do you really think he gives a crap. Really, you mean every president before Obama wrote all their own speeches? Huh... He says something that I know for a fact you agree with and you still can't agree. Dude you and Cal, and I am saying this seriously, have something wrong in your brain. There is something in there that you can't get past the childish bipartisan bullshit. A traumatic event must of happened in your life at the exact time you saw Democrat speak on TV or saw a Jimmy Carter bumper sticker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heckofajobbrownie Posted July 21, 2009 Report Share Posted July 21, 2009 It's also a bit odd to suggest that someone who has written two books (which are very well-written) and is a Constitutional law professor at one of the nation's leading law schools, was editor of the Law Review at Harvard, is somehow who is also too dumb to write a speech. As Kosar said, this is what is called "hating." Also as Kosar said, every president has a speechwriting team. Because we don't want our presidents spending most of every day writing their speeches. And presidents play a varying role in crafting the speeches. Obama, for one, plays a very large role, mostly because he's an extremely talented writer and communicator in his own right. Honestly... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choco Posted July 21, 2009 Report Share Posted July 21, 2009 and to bang on obama for speaking, which is something dubya couldn't pull off WITH a teleprompter, like every other president in recent technological times is pretty weak sauce. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy Fan Posted July 21, 2009 Report Share Posted July 21, 2009 I don't think you're talking about what he's talking about. We have laws about equality and against discrimination that the government enforces. The government is also in charge of a lot of things that promote opportunity, namely schools, but also things like economic stability and growth, public safety, etc. Don't you think this is what he's referring to? As for finding a government in history that was a force for good, I'd say ours was, wouldn't you? I'd point you to the Bill of Rights for starters. As for your point that the government can't make people successful, isn't that his point? Isn't this whole excerpt about the responsibility of parenting and self-reliance? "Yes, government must be a force for opportunity. Yes, government must be a force for equality. But ultimately, if we are to be true to our past, then we also have to seize our own future, each and every day." To me that's him saying that government should and must set the stage for equal opportunity and equality, but the rest is up to you. . No? That's why I said "aid" instead of "force." Do we need a new Bill of Rights? I think the one we've got is holding up pretty well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. T Posted July 22, 2009 Report Share Posted July 22, 2009 Which was my point as well. We're talking about the connotations of the words and people's reactions to them. "Force" generally has a negative connotation when speaking about governments. And Mr T will slam Obama at every opportunity regardless or not if the slam is logical. I'm pretty sure he's well aware that all presidents had speeches written for them with their oversight. At least I hope he is.... HA HA!!! You know it, this guy is not presidential material. The New and Improved Jimmy Carter. Brought to you buy Chicagoland politics and Big Ole Oprah, lets not forget Obama's Pastor, Rev. Jeremiah Wright the biggest racist of them all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy Fan Posted July 22, 2009 Report Share Posted July 22, 2009 We're talking about the connotations of the words and people's reactions to them. "Force" generally has a negative connotation when speaking about governments. Exactly. Particularly when we are discussing Equality. Separate but Equal ring any bells? Heck, remind me again how long it took our government to get that equality thing worked out, 200-250 years? I don't know about you, but I personally don't have that kind of time when it comes to my childrens' education, the laughable ROI that this stimulus, (TARP included), that my children & their children will inherit. I'm guessing it will be measured in Kelvin rather than percentages. This admin has re-written the way unemployment figures are measured, and Kelvin is the only way we can reach absolute zero (and not have to use negative signs!!! Yay!!!) Healthcare? Ha! I honestly believe our Federal government is the only entity that can out-scumbag an insurance company. No thanks. (And by the way, it's the large regional hospital conglomerates that are dictating how insurance companies behave, not the other way around, and certainly not prescription drug companies.) You want a slice of socialized medicine (ignore the connotations "Socialized" has achieved on this board)? Head to one of those places and watch how long your Doctor sees you. And when they cheat you out of your paycheck, get back to me, and I'll tell you how much they spend on painting their waiting room, exam rooms, bathrooms, etc. How much they spend on wall-paper, their "design team" and administration. Public safety? The gang up in New Haven are doing a bang-up job. My hometown had a similar stink in regards to the police force acceptance/placement. The 4th grade math on the academy testing was being re-examined to accommodate a more diverse force. And they carry guns!!! Doing work for the government? A QP1 certification carries a $20k fee, just to get the certificate, certifying that your company is qualified to paint highly specialized steel structures (bridges, off-shore oil rigs, chemical plants, etc.) Not to mention the cost of maintaining a full time office person to administer a safety program and the cost of creating and implementing that program (requirements of QP1). So, in a 300+ page painting specification, is a QP1 certification necessary to paint a dorm facility (basically a 4-story motel) on a Navy base? Nope. Is it in the spec? Yup. Kind of limits the number of contractors and increases the price they pay for a basic job. And this is only one facet (and perhaps one of the most basic) of the construction trade. And you wouldn't believe the on-site ding-a-lings that come out and micro-manage government work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choco Posted July 22, 2009 Report Share Posted July 22, 2009 out-scumbag an insurance company..... thats awesome..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted July 22, 2009 Report Share Posted July 22, 2009 It's also a bit odd to suggest that someone who has written two books (which are very well-written) and is a Constitutional law professor at one of the nation's leading law schools, was editor of the Law Review at Harvard, is somehow who is also too dumb to write a speech. As Kosar said, this is what is called "hating." Also as Kosar said, every president has a speechwriting team. Because we don't want our presidents spending most of every day writing their speeches. And presidents play a varying role in crafting the speeches. Obama, for one, plays a very large role, mostly because he's an extremely talented writer and communicator in his own right. Honestly... Honestly. Heh. Look Heck the guy read a speech meant to reassure a particlular group that their concerns were being tended. Politicians pander. All of them. It's not "losing one's shit" to admit that. It is swooning to angrily claim that the current president is above it. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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