People who always have excuses annoy me.

[TheBestPlayersPlay]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/trainingcamp...&id=4388546

 

 

Derek Anderson said the radio receiver in his helmet wasn't working Sunday, so he had to work with hand signals. Anderson said Brady Quinn, who was quarterbacking the White team, schooled White defenders on those hand signals, which made it harder for Anderson to work a drive filled with short passes.

 

 

 

BEREA, Ohio -- Details, details, details. Cleveland Browns coach Eric Mangini is a master of getting down to the details of pro football.

 

On Sunday, he turned the Brown and White Scrimmage into a simulated Sunday at Cleveland Stadium. How detailed was Mangini's game plan? He had NFL officials count off TV timeouts. He had replay challenges, pregame officials meetings and postgame news conferences.

 

 

AFC North blog

ESPN.com's James Walker writes about all things AFC North in his division blog.

 

• Blog network: NFL Nation

 

 

Educated in the Bill Parcells-Bill Belichick coaching tree, Mangini has gathered teaching tools for years, and continues to fine-tune what he teaches his players and what he does for schemes. The Browns are Mangini's team now. Owner Randy Lerner is letting Mangini run the Browns his way. Players are schooled in technique and how those techniques fit within particular plays.

 

Coming off a 4-12 season, the Browns obviously have a lot to work on. Derek Anderson said the radio receiver in his helmet wasn't working Sunday, so he had to work with hand signals. Anderson said Brady Quinn, who was quarterbacking the White team, schooled White defenders on those hand signals, which made it harder for Anderson to work a drive filled with short passes. Details, details, details.

 

1. Who will be the QB? The Quinn-Anderson starting quarterback battle is too close to call, and Mangini insists the job is wide open, even though most people figure Quinn is the favorite. Quinn opened the scrimmage by hitting Lance Leggett on a 51-yard touchdown pass after he drew in deep coverage with a perfect play-action fake. Anderson showed some improvement on his short and intermediate throws, a problem that has nagged him over the past two years. Because Anderson has such a strong arm, he tends to throw fastballs in the short and intermediate range that are hard to catch. Once those problems were noted, Anderson started to hesitate before making the throw. Now, he's not hesitating, and that has improved his efficiency. Anderson made one fatal mistake Sunday by throwing into double coverage at the goal line; linebacker D'Qwell Jackson intercepted his throw. After the game, Quinn tried to dismiss thoughts that he's making a big effort to throw deep. Anderson is the long-ball specialist on the Browns, but Quinn can complete deep throws when he executes play-action fakes. Years of weightlifting have made Quinn one of the most "ripped'' quarterbacks in the league. His forearms are masses of swelling muscles, and his upper body looks more like a linebacker's. Surprisingly, Quinn said he spent more time running than lifting during the offseason, which allowed him to enter camp at 230 pounds, eight pounds lighter than last year.

 

2. The Browns will run: Because Mangini is a coach who believes in details, you get the feeling the Browns will be more of a running team at the start of the season. Mangini believes in learning the basics before trying to do the tricky things. For example, he won't let his defensive linemen do more than play their gap responsibilities until they show they've mastered the technique. He wants his offensive linemen heavier, which hints that the plan is to run the ball more. That works. Jamal Lewis looks trim at 240 pounds, and he's motivated to have a good season. He's happy Mangini kept fullback Lawrence Vickers and plans to keep the fullback on the field to help with the run. Lewis does his best work when he runs behind a fullback. At age 29 with 10 years in the league, this is an important season for Lewis. The Browns lost powerful guard Rex Hadnot for several weeks because of a knee sprain, but they still have Eric Steinbach and enough veterans to have a quality group of starting blockers.

 

3. Edwards is fired up: Braylon Edwards is excited about the 2009 season. He should be. He's in the last season of his contract, and he just watched fellow wide receivers Roddy White and Greg Jennings get contracts worth slightly less than $9 million a year. But football is a team game, and there are some serious concerns about the Browns' receiving corps. One of the most noticeable problems Sunday and throughout camp has been dropped passes. Edwards had a horrible time with dropped passes last season, but the rest of the receiving corps has to show it can catch the ball as well. Mike Furrey could help. He's a solid slot receiver. The Browns have two promising draft choices -- Mohamed Massaquoi and Brian Robiskie. Massaquoi caught three passes Sunday and seems to be a little ahead of Robiskie. If the rookies aren't ready to start, the Browns could try David Patten at the flanker spot. Furrey works better out of the slot, but the Browns have to find a flanker who can take some double coverage away from Edwards. What encourages Edwards is that the current coaching staff should do a better job with game adjustments on offense. Edwards felt the Browns didn't make adjustments on offense as games progressed last season.

 

4. Familiarity breeds success: Mangini made sure he brought in players who knew his defense. The acquisition of defensive end Kenyon Coleman was interesting because the Browns traded a second-round choice a year ago to acquire end Corey Williams. Williams is running the second team this summer; Coleman is starting. Eric Barton and David Bowens were brought over from the Jets to beef up the linebacker corps. Abram Elam will start at safety. That's four probable starters from the Jets who know Mangini's system. Cornerback Hank Poteat and defensive lineman C.J. Mosley will be key backups coming from the Jets. Even though former coach Romeo Crennel taught the Browns the Belichick system, Mangini has added his own variations. These six acquisitions should speed up the adjustment.

 

5. Less may be more: Rookie center Alex Mack should have a tough time in practices going against nose tackle Shaun Rogers. That was quite noticeable during Sunday's scrimmage. Mack was drafted to anchor the offensive line in the same manner Nick Mangold did for Mangini in New York. Rogers abused him Sunday, which shouldn't be a surprise, because Rogers is basically unblockable. There were times last season that Rogers was triple-teamed and still got into the backfield. It still amazes me that Rogers was so dominant at nose tackle last season but the Browns surrendered 151 yards a game on the ground. One of the problems apparently was that Rogers was playing too much. He played 82 percent of the snaps, leaving him vulnerable to wearing down later in the game. Jets nose tackle Kris Jenkins played 55 percent of the snaps last season and was equally dominating. Expect a slight cut in the number of plays for Rogers so he can provide better production later in games.

[ballpeen]

If that was the case, it would clearly put his side at a disadvantage...no??

[Guest Masters]

If that was the case, it would clearly put his side at a disadvantage...no??

 

I'd ask the question, why isn't he leading his team and doing the same for his D?

[TheBestPlayersPlay]

If that was the case, it would clearly put his side at a disadvantage...no??

 

 

So what? Every time DA fails he has an excuse, if he's not blaming the head-set, he's blaming Brady Quinn teaching people, or throwing the O-line under the bus, or throwing his recievers under the bus. Weak.

[Drunkandstoopid]

If DA came out for an interview, made that statement and walked, you'd have a real argument that he's making excuses. If it was one line out of an interview and numerous questions, you might not. I'd like to know the setting before making the judgement.

[Riffer X]

DA wasn't making excuses he just said it happened is all.

 

DA is not a bad dude guys, let's not hammer himfor anything than being a subpar QB.

 

Tomorrow on WKNR they are going to ask Mangie if he scripted the radio going off. Very well could be in the realm of possibility to see how the QB's react in that given situation.

[Greythan]

Fair point D&S and lord knows everything remotely related to the QB's is under the microscope here, me included.

 

That said, DA needs someone close to him to work on his press-work. You simply can't leave ANY impression as THE leader of the offense that a mis play call in the red zone leading to an INT is anything OTHER than your fault. Even if it isn't. Its just not "leader like".

[Guest SoupDawg]

They're different. And that stripe on the side [of the white pants] prohibits mobility. They're not as loose as these pants. So maybe DA should blame the pants [laughing]."

 

It's about time Quinn fired back at flippen horsenuts.

 

I am getting fed-up with Anderson's attitude. He's not a leader.

[dawgpound3]

It's about time Quinn fired back at flippen horsenuts.

 

I am getting fed-up with Anderson's attitude. He's not a leader.

 

Yeah. I agree. I loved Quinn's witty remark about DA.

[Flugel]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/trainingcamp...&id=4388546

 

I don't know - Loverboy has had me on the deck laughing a couple times over his Mother Nature excuses for Dumb Ass. One time it was the Cincy winds, another it was the overwhelming snowflakes vrs Buffalo and of course there's Hurrican Ike vrs Pittsburgh, which was my alltime favorite. Okay, the Hawaiian wind gusts marked a reason DA couldn't take advantage of his own offensive system vrs no blitzes to showcase his 10 for 27 performance with an all star lineup.

 

But folks, when you take away the defense and put a red practice jersey on him LOOKOUT!

 

It looks like Dumb Ass thinks he's playing a game of Marco Polo out there on Sundays.

 

- Tom F.

[dawgpound3]

I don't know - Loverboy has had me on the deck laughing a couple times over his Mother Nature excuses for Dumb Ass. One time it was the Cincy winds, another it was the overwhelming snowflakes vrs Buffalo and of course there's Hurrican Ike vrs Pittsburgh, which was my alltime favorite. Okay, the Hawaiian wind gusts marked a reason DA couldn't take advantage of his own offensive system vrs no blitzes to showcase his 10 for 27 performance with an all star lineup.

 

But folks, when you take away the defense and put a red practice jersey on him LOOKOUT!

 

It looks like Dumb Ass thinks he's playing a game of Marco Polo out there on Sundays.

 

- Tom F.

 

I agree. His excuses are just stupid. Just man up, DA!

[Jason J]

If that was the case, it would clearly put his side at a disadvantage...no??

 

 

There has been some scuttlebutt that Mangini orchestrated the radio silence. It's been well documented that Derek has had a problem dealing with high stress situations, including at least one incident involving an outage with his helmet receiver. It's theoretically an extension of the (music at practice, running plays in the rain, etc.) stress tests that Mangini is so fond of.

 

This is purely ESPN850 conjecture at the moment, but a fun thought nonetheless.

 

-jj

[Guest Aloysius]

Brady Quinn, who was quarterbacking the White team, schooled White defenders on those hand signals, which made it harder for Anderson to work a drive filled with short passes.

How Belichickian of him.

 

I love it.

[Sez.EJ]

There has been some scuttlebutt that Mangini orchestrated the radio silence. It's been well documented that Derek has had a problem dealing with high stress situations, including at least one incident involving an outage with his helmet receiver. It's theoretically an extension of the (music at practice, running plays in the rain, etc.) stress tests that Mangini is so fond of.

 

This is purely ESPN850 conjecture at the moment, but a fun thought nonetheless.

 

-jj

This is exactly the thing a good coach does. You place the player into a situation he struggles with and see how they have learned If shutting down the headset induces a little more stress.. and mangini wants to see how DA adapts , adjusts, and hopefully overcomes..then DA passes.. If he does not adapt, adjust and overcome..then he fails..Those are the kind of thing Mangini is looking for when he talks about leading the team. games are full of ups, downs and adversity you must overcome..leaders do that.. Not sure if Mangini did this on purpose..but certainly it gives him another point to evaluate DA...

[Guest Masters]

There has been some scuttlebutt that Mangini orchestrated the radio silence. It's been well documented that Derek has had a problem dealing with high stress situations, including at least one incident involving an outage with his helmet receiver. It's theoretically an extension of the (music at practice, running plays in the rain, etc.) stress tests that Mangini is so fond of.

 

This is purely ESPN850 conjecture at the moment, but a fun thought nonetheless.

 

-jj

 

I missed that on 850 today, but I came home a little early. If that is why it happened, I say tip of the cap to Mangini. As you said, DA has struggled with this, and Mangini was trying to make this a game like situation.

 

If I assume that is the case, my response would remain the same, in that I more read into the comment about Quinn telling his sides D what the hand signals meant, and it being "unfair". Maybe it's me, but I'd want my "leader" doing that. If DA wasn't enough of a team leader to try and coach up D to try and win, do I want him as my QB? To me it is the old thinking that a QB is the leader of a team, not just the O. Or of course the baseball player/fan in me says "if you ain't cheating, you ain't trying to win" (like stealing signals). I want my QB trying to win in any way he can help his team. It's what leaders do imo.

[ballpeen]

I'd ask the question, why isn't he leading his team and doing the same for his D?

 

 

Because the other sides radio worked and they didn't use hand signals??

[ballpeen]

I missed that on 850 today, but I came home a little early. If that is why it happened, I say tip of the cap to Mangini. As you said, DA has struggled with this, and Mangini was trying to make this a game like situation.

 

If I assume that is the case, my response would remain the same, in that I more read into the comment about Quinn telling his sides D what the hand signals meant, and it being "unfair". Maybe it's me, but I'd want my "leader" doing that. If DA wasn't enough of a team leader to try and coach up D to try and win, do I want him as my QB? To me it is the old thinking that a QB is the leader of a team, not just the O. Or of course the baseball player/fan in me says "if you ain't cheating, you ain't trying to win" (like stealing signals). I want my QB trying to win in any way he can help his team. It's what leaders do imo.

 

 

I think you guys are reading this wrong.

 

DA wasn't saying it was unfair or Quinn did something wrong...he was just saying the problems his side had in getting the plays.

 

Of course Quinn should have told the signals...we wanted his side to win....and they almost did.

 

[Gips]

I have also noticed that Da has been showing occasional signs of pressure from the competition and has given off some rather frustrated displays in word and action at times and no DA has never been the type of guy to totally man up and take the whole blame there always seems to be something else that happened...

 

I dont know how mangini looks upon these things that a quarterback says or does under competitive pressure but we do know he is looking and listening...

 

BQ seems to always say the right things and is football smart but he needs to start showing us and mangini why he should be the starter by taking control on the field and leading the charge not just giving us sweet lip service...

 

 

Both guys are feeling the heat BQ looks fidgety and looks like he is trying to hard to be safe and smart with the ball and DA looks desperate and even frustrated when things dont go 100% the way he planned in his mind upon release...hehehehe

 

The thing we have to keep in mind is both these guys are young and relative newcomers to the sport i pretty much discount last year and realize with time DA can be at very least a very good qb but old habits seem to die hard with him coach being honest with him and making him stay off the field until he corrects a few things is the way to get DA working harder...

 

BQ we cant really say what he brings to the table yet as a benchrot pro in a new offense until he gets some real playing time...

[choco]

ya mean like the folks using queen's finger as the reason for his suckitude?

 

h-y-p-o-c-r-y-t-e-s....

[Guest Masters]

Try throwing a football with a swollen finger on your throwing hand. Better yet, go break your index finger and damage tendons in it, then try and throw a spiral. Let me know how that works out for you.....

 

People would be hypocrytes if they didn't give DA the same slack if he was injured and then threw badly. That's not the case.

[Lumbergh]

Try throwing a football with a swollen finger on your throwing hand. Better yet, go break your index finger and damage tendons in it, then try and throw a spiral. Let me know how that works out for you.....

 

People would be hypocrytes if they didn't give DA the same slack if he was injured and then threw badly. That's not the case.

 

According to Chud, Anderson actually dislocated a finger on his throwing hand in the Indy game.

 

But the trainer popped it back in and he kept playing.

 

Never heard him bitch about it at all.

 

And he certainly didn't throw it out as an excuse a'la the Tragic Quinnie Fingertip story.

 

No wonder teammates prefer DA.

[Guest Masters]

According to Chud, Anderson actually dislocated a finger on his throwing hand in the Indy game.

 

But the trainer popped it back in and he kept playing.

 

Never heard him bitch about it at all.

 

And he certainly didn't throw it out as an excuse a'la the Tragic Quinnie Fingertip story.

 

No wonder teammates prefer DA.

 

*sigh*

 

Which finger was it?

 

Where is this quote from Chud (and yeah, it's usually the OC that talks about an injury...)

 

You do know the difference between breaking a finger, along with tearing tendons, and dislocating a finger don't you?

 

Quinn never used it as an excuse.

 

Who are these teammate who prefer Quinn or DA exactly?

[Lumbergh]

You do know the difference between breaking a finger, along with tearing tendons, and dislocating a finger don't you?

 

yeah reportedly Quinn's boo boo was basically a dull persistent soreness and Anderson's dislocation probably hurt like a mother effer.

[Guest Masters]

yeah reportedly Quinn's boo boo was basically a dull persistent soreness and Anderson's dislocation probably hurt like a mother effer.

 

LMFAO...a dull persistent soreness that required surgery by Dr. James Andrews.

 

As usual, way to hind from everything else in the post.

[choco]

Try throwing a football with a swollen finger on your throwing hand. Better yet, go break your index finger and damage tendons in it, then try and throw a spiral. Let me know how that works out for you.....

 

People would be hypocrytes if they didn't give DA the same slack if he was injured and then threw badly. That's not the case.

even after that rant, my point still stands. have a look in the mirror....

[Guest Masters]

even after that rant, my point still stands. have a look in the mirror....

 

That was hardly a rant and your point is still flawed. Here are a couple of tidbits for you buddy:

 

Main Entry: hyp·o·crite

Pronunciation: \ˈhi-pə-ˌkrit\

Function: noun

Etymology: Middle English ypocrite, from Anglo-French, from Late Latin hypocrita, from Greek hypokritēs actor, hypocrite, from hypokrinesthai

Date: 13th century

1 : a person who puts on a false appearance of virtue or religion

2 : a person who acts in contradiction to his or her stated beliefs or feelings

 

— hypocrite adjective

 

Main Entry: 1rant

Pronunciation: \ˈrant\

Function: verb

Etymology: obsolete Dutch ranten, randen

Date: 1601

intransitive verb

1 : to talk in a noisy, excited, or declamatory manner

2 : to scold vehemently

transitive verb

: to utter in a bombastic declamatory fashion

 

— rant·er noun

 

— rant·ing·ly \ˈran-tiŋ-lē\ adverb

 

Don't use words whose meaning you don't know or understand.

[Drunkandstoopid]

LMFAO...a dull persistent soreness that required surgery by Dr. James Andrews.

 

As usual, way to hind from everything else in the post.

First off, you'll need to talk to the team, the doctor and BQ about WHY the surgery was done. You're making a big deal about a broken bone in the throwing hand... guess what, broken bones in the hands are very, very common... amongst children. Happens all the time. They usually live with it. We have know idea what kind of break it was, if it was something they'd send everyone in for surgery if they had it, or if they decided it was time for Brady to sit and might as well have the surgery to prevent a re-break come spring training. Unless I missed the quote along the lines that BQ's hand was desperately in need of surgery, we really don't know if it was a break that generally would have been surgically treated.

[Guest Masters]

First off, you'll need to talk to the team, the doctor and BQ about WHY the surgery was done. You're making a big deal about a broken bone in the throwing hand... guess what, broken bones in the hands are very, very common... amongst children. Happens all the time. They usually live with it. We have know idea what kind of break it was, if it was something they'd send everyone in for surgery if they had it, or if they decided it was time for Brady to sit and might as well have the surgery to prevent a re-break come spring training. Unless I missed the quote along the lines that BQ's hand was desperately in need of surgery, we really don't know if it was a break that generally would have been surgically treated.

 

I have no idea what children or the commonality of a broken finger has to do with playing QB in the NFL. You, me, kids playing out side, my dog, etc., then don't have to throw a football at a NFL level.

 

We know it was a break that caused tendon damange and required surgury. So that kind of gives you an idea about how bad it must be, since you just pointed out how must people get broken fingers and just live with it.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3727363

 

and a little extra tidbit from that article "Quinn refused to blame the injury after the game for his poor performance"

 

By the way, I wasn't the one making a big deal out of a broken bone in a finger, the Browns, Brady Quinn, and the doctors did. They shut him down and advised surgery, not me. In this thread I pulled up the broken bone when someone cried hypocracy about the treatment of Quinn vs. Anderson when talking excuses.

[Guest AdaM]

First off, you'll need to talk to the team, the doctor and BQ about WHY the surgery was done. You're making a big deal about a broken bone in the throwing hand... guess what, broken bones in the hands are very, very common... amongst children. Happens all the time. They usually live with it. We have know idea what kind of break it was, if it was something they'd send everyone in for surgery if they had it, or if they decided it was time for Brady to sit and might as well have the surgery to prevent a re-break come spring training. Unless I missed the quote along the lines that BQ's hand was desperately in need of surgery, we really don't know if it was a break that generally would have been surgically treated.

 

 

 

Thanks lum.

[LCDawgFan13]

Why are you even arguing with Lumnuts and a guy who calls himself "Drunkandstoopid"? Just pointless!