Zombo Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 Seriously, he should've been 9 of 10 with a TD. He should have been ... but he threw an interception in the end zone instead. It happened. Look, if you want to go the "getting over an injury" route, "learning a new system" route, or the "Braylon dropped the ball" route ... then the Anderson Camp has the same excuses. If every Braylon drop is counted as a catch, and all ensuing turnovers after a drop are erased and replaced with TDs ... then what is Anderson's rating last year? I understand Quinn moved the ball, says the right things and had some nice practices ... I just want him to show me a little more on gamedays. Like a touchdown or something. When he goes out and looks like he is fully in command of this offense and that we are going to score a lot of points under his command ... then he will be named the starter and I will be really happy. Can we just wait until he does it first? Zombo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammertime Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 He should have been ... but he threw an interception in the end zone instead. It happened. Look, if you want to go the "getting over an injury" route, "learning a new system" route, or the "Braylon dropped the ball" route ... then the Anderson Camp has the same excuses. If every Braylon drop is counted as a catch, and all ensuing turnovers after a drop are erased and replaced with TDs ... then what is Anderson's rating last year? I understand Quinn moved the ball, says the right things and had some nice practices ... I just want him to show me a little more on gamedays. Like a touchdown or something. When he goes out and looks like he is fully in command of this offense and that we are going to score a lot of points under his command ... then he will be named the starter and I will be really happy. Can we just wait until he does it first? Zombo I'm so pumped for our first TD!!! Sorry, i can't even fake excitement at this point. Let the guy start and get this holy hell of a preseason and rebuilding phase over with. My joy af RAC being gone has faded, i need more ammo and regular season is a ways away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vegasdogg Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 I just want him to show me a little more on gamedays. Like a touchdown or something. When he goes out and looks like he is fully in command of this offense and that we are going to score a lot of points under his command ... then he will be named the starter and I will be really happy. First, why don't you give him a chance to show you on gamedays? You've seen what - 2 1/2 games worth? He did go out and score TD's or something. Second, we are not going to score a lot of points this year. Our D needs to make up for some young mistakes and it won't, and our running game needs a ton of yards which it won't get. But expecting a lot of points? You're setting yourself up for disappointment with those crazy expectations. Start simple: Run the ball and stop the run first. Then build the team off of that. The last thing we want is for our young QB to chuck it down the field left and right - that is not who he is right now, and that is not who we are right now. Not yet. I just want competance at the position: Run the offense, move the chains, lead the team, make some plays. DO NOT try to be a savior. DO NOT try to put it all on your shoulders. DO NOT take stupid chances to make a play. DO NOT think more of your arm than what it is. DO play within yourself. DO take what the defense gives you. DO study your ass off. DO be patient in your development. Quinn does not have to be any other QB than who he is. I am not looking for the next Ryan or Flacco or Sanchez or Stafford. I am looking for Quinn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombo Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 Z- I agree, but in order to see those things happen he has to play, he has to start, he has to be given the keys to the offense and told to go after em'. Which will happen. And then we will watch Quinn flourish or flounder. The rubber will meet the road, and that will be that. I told Lumnuts the same thing with DA last offseason about how DA will perform, and I was right. DA shit the bed for the most part. Yeah you can give him some excuses for SOME of his play, but by and large DA was a huge disappointment. Add in the fact that he's a 6th round pick that we grabbed off of Baltimores practice squad it's just makes sense to see what the 1st rounder we picked can do. You don't give a 6th round pick multiple seasons. You just don't. It doesn't matter where they were drafted anymore, Mankock didn't draft them. Mangini wants one guy to beat out the other guy. And I totally understand, and agree with, his thinking. Quinn isn't going to be handed, or annointed, anything. No one on Mangini's Browns will. This is the year, and the camp, that Mangini makes his statement and sets the tempo for future seasons. Quinn has had mini-camps, the off-season, training camp, a scrimmage and a preseason game to pull ahead of Anderson ... and we still have three practice games to go. Plenty of time to prove you are the better QB. Prove yourself to the coach, prove yourself to your teammates. Hey, if Anderson goes out the next couple of weeks and looks sharp and scores a ton of points and quinn struggles ... then Anderson deserves the job. That's the way it is. I still think Quinn will do it. But I, and obviously Mangini ... want to see him do it. Zombo --I don't know who posted that "Taking The Bull By Horns" painting with Ben Stiller from Dodgeball ... but that is some pretty funny shit ... and it should be our theme for this training camp. Nothing like overused cliches in pro sports... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombo Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 If Braylon doesn't drop the touchdown, the interception doesn't happen. Doesn't mean I don't think the interception was a gaffe -- it was -- I'm just putting some numbers behind my opinion that he looked really good. That's all. That's fine. But we have to re-adjust all of Anderson's stats from last year. No one got Brayloned like he got Brayloned. Zombo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmac12 Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 DA was worst at completing short passes last year, Quinn was worse just in fewer games. DA had the worst pass completion, Quinn was worse, just in fewer games. At least 2 of the passes that BE dropped were game changers that would had been easy TDs and one was against Baltimore that if he did not drop BQ would not had gotten the start against Denver. Stop giving reasons why DA should not start and stick with the reasons that BQ should start. Stick with his performance this year, stick with he has played slightly better than DA in practice and had a much better preseason game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmac12 Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 And he has not been bad for 18 games. He has had several good games inside that 18, just not nearly enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombo Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 First, why don't you give him a chance to show you on gamedays? You've seen what - 2 1/2 games worth? He did go out and score TD's or something. I am giving him a chance to show me. Jury is definitely still out. Show me. He looked good in 07 preseason. He looked ok in 08 preseason. He looked less than stellar in 08 regular season. He has looked less than stellar so far 09 preseason. But I understand it is early, he is talented, and he will likely perform much better. I just am going to hold back my praise until he actually does it, that's all. I look forward to seeing it. I really do ... not being a dick here. Second, we are not going to score a lot of points this year. Why not? We scored a lot of points in 07, and if anything, we have upgraded the talent on the offense, with the possible exception of Winslow, depending on how you feel about him. And the one or two games last year when we were hitting on all cylinders, we were scoring points. I'm not ready to sell this team, or this offense short. We've got some talent. I want some points. I think if the QB starts clicking this can be a good offense. Zombo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vegasdogg Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 I just am going to hold back my praise until he actually does it, that's all. I look forward to seeing it. I really do ... not being a dick here. I've always knew where you stood and I understand it. It is logical. Show me. I don't know if he has it, I just know DA can't overcome something. Not sure what it is, but it is a downer. Too many WTF drives, throws and games from him. And lets be honest if Quinn does the same thing we'll just let him take DA's spot while we look for yet another savior. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drunkandstoopid Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 If Braylon doesn't drop the touchdown, the interception doesn't happen. Doesn't mean I don't think the interception was a gaffe -- it was -- I'm just putting some numbers behind my opinion that he looked really good. That's all. If Braylon doesn't drop the touchdown, the interception doesn't happen.... and the Browns win the Baltimore game in week 9 of '08 and the Browns are sitting at 4 and 4 with likely wins coming up over Denver and Buffalo....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mz. Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 Shep I do like the 'few' posts you make and the 'occaisional' thread here and there. But in order to keep my dinner down, i may need to put you on ignore till regular season begins. If i had my dead horse icon handy, it would be sizzling hot at this point. Dano- carry on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmac12 Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 Cmac, you need to come back to reality: Quinn had one healthy start. That's it. Then he broke the index finger on his passing hand, which is just about as bad as it gets this side of an amputation. One game, passer rating of 104. That's all we got on the guy we drafted with a first AND second pick. Hmmmm... think we should play him for a while? It's a no brainer unless the other guy led the league in passing last year. He did precisely the opposite, finishing 32nd. You keep coming back to one healthy start. Well if his hand was so bad then why was he still playing? Or is it possible it just got worse by game 3. You say one healthy game because if you took his whole sample size then it does not support your position. I understand that, and that is why I choose to not count DAs first 3 games last year when looking at him. And I don't care that BQ was a LATE first round pick that the previous regime that you your self have called not the brightest drafted. All I say is stop using that ONE game as BQs only sample size because it is not his only sample size. In all 4 games that BQ has played he has completed LESS than 50% of his passes and has completed a lower percentage of short passes than DA has. BQ started two preseason games last year and got lots of playing time in 3 preseason games. He did not show anything special in any of those three games, but an arguement in your favor for BQ is that from the highlights I saw of his time in the one preseason game this year he looked better than last preseason even though he did not get results. I also always see you and others say that DA had 18 bad weeks and that is plain and simply not true. He did have SEVERAL bad games in that 18 weeks but he also had many good games and one great game. But overall in his last 18 starts he has not done as well as anybody would like. I believe his overall record is 9 and 9 in those starts 6 -3 in 2007 and 3 - 6 in 2008. Yes DA was the 32nd rank passer last year, not a great performance. But, if you take out his concussion games then he is closer to a 85 rating which would be middle of the pack. Still not what you are looking for but not as bad as you make it seem. But since DAs concussion games count so do BQs. So BQ had a sample size of 2 1/2 games and a rating of 66.6 and completed a very low 50.6 completion percentage. And you can say one healthy start all you want but that is NOT the only game BQ played and it is not his only sample size NO MATTER how many times you say it. Like I said earlier, stop trying to say why DA should not be the QB. Stick with why BQ should start and please, oh please stop trying to say that BQ only has ONE start to judge him on. You can make enough of an argument on why BQ should start without fixing the stats to one healthy start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flugel Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 the worst D in the stadium that day was the one wearing blue. On another note, there's a question I've been pondering: If Anderson outplays Quinnie this Saturday, will there be a thread titled "DON'T PICK A QB YET!!!!" Unfortunately for you, your boyfriend didn't ace his first 27 auditions - so we have alot of fans wanting an upgrade to the QB position. Here's a reminder of how Dumb Ass started us off on the wrong foot in 2008: 28-10 loss to Dallas followed by 10-6 loss to Pittsburgh followed by 28-10 loss to Baltimore. Looks like the definition of a regressing QB to me, which ultimately led to a regressing offense. DA just isn't taking advantage of his huge edge in starting experience. His best case scenario at Green Bay shouldn't have been the 3 and out but it was. He threw an INT that kept us from moving the chains in another drive. He would finish with a ZERO passer rating. Quinn was far from perfect; but he moved the chains consistently enough to get us in the opponent's red zone twice. One time our FG kicker missed and another time Edwards dropped a TD pass. I refer to these situations as scoring opportunities Dumb Ass wasn't quite capable of. Since it's preseason, I'm just trying to see what guy moves the team better. - Tom F. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flugel Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 I can agree that you might not. But people started coming down on DA long before 20 starts. It was much closer to right after the Seahawk game. In those 8 starts DA went 5 - 3. He did not play well but as I posted earlier 3 - 0 when he "Managed" the game, 0 - 2 when he threw the ball over 40 times which is of course what you should be doing in the middle of winter in the midwest. DA played horrible against Cincy, can't argue with that. But why did he throw the ball over 40 times (those 2 ints at end of half all on DA by way). I agree that it is time to give BQ a shot, I just don't think DA is as bad as many believe. He is still young and with good coaching he will improve. It is now BQs turn to keep DA on the bench. The ball was in DAs court last year and he did not step up, I agree with that. Now it is BQ's turn to step up, lets see how he does over a full season. If there is still a question about who the starter should be next year then it is time to draft a new QB. I see what you are trying to say CMAC but I keep seeing a QB that regressses as the season progresses. In his first year of starts in 06, his 3rd and final start the week of Xmas was 4 INTs vrs the crappy Bucs team we would coin flip for the 3rd overall pick in the next draft. Then in 2007, he starts off with a HOT September and October but in the same Xmas week - he threw 4 INTs at Cincy on a day our running game was good enough for about 136 yards rushing. And last year he was 3-6 as a starter. How many of the good QBs in the league have shown the trend of regressing 3 years in a row? Don't the GOOD ones usually demonstrate progress and always make everyone around them better? I like to ask this question as often as I need to because you'll frequently find our BIGGEST rival in this group of opponent: HOW MANY times have you witnessed DA beating teams in the AFC that finished with more than 8 wins? That tells me that once the scouting reports and film replicate around the conference - he's been pretty easy to stop. Brian Sipe was easily my favorite QB to watch play since I became a Browns' fan in the 60s. Understanding this, if DA was playing like the next Brian Sipe - I wouldn't give a rat if Quinn stayed or sprayed. At some point, this franchise has to consider getting past "once upon a time" so we can explore the possibility of "happily ever after." - Tom F. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammertime Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 I do not wear funny pants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmac12 Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 I agree that BQ should start this year. I just disagree on how bad DA really is. I can agree that he has not shown good progression, but I do not think that he has regressed as much as you think. That is pretty much all. I have already posted many times why I feel this way so I will not repeat it again. We can agree on that BQ should start this year to see what he has in the tank and we can agree to disagree on what we think of DA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northshore Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 How about this......since Big Gay Ben is "injured" why don't we "give" DA to the Steelers! This would accomplish two things! With DA as P-burgs quarterback we would have a great chance of winning (2) games in the division and our defense ranking in the area of interceptions and sacks would go up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The333kid Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 HI guys, Long time lurker. What time are the starting lineups announced? Has Mangini announced a starter for today's game? Kid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daddybull1 Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 Sorry to say but if you put DA under center in Pittsburgh the team would be about the same.. The coaches would put him in a position to shine and the defense would save his ass when he made a mistake... The difference between the two teams is the stoolers have playmakers whereas the Browns have only a few.... It's not all about the QB... In my case, I'll reserve judgement on Quinn until I see how he performs against Pittsburgh... Since our rebirth, the only QB that understood the importance of the Stooler game was Tim Couch, to all the others it was just another game.... How Quinn plays against LeBeau will seal the deal for me..... However, IMO Quinn will be the starter come opening day.... Peace T.Dawg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmac12 Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 I think you know I am closer to you than some others in this argument are in our opinions. But can you tell me which games you count as DA's "concusion games"? do you include games after the giants game? The first 3 games of the 2008 season. And I am not sure they are all concussion games, it is just the game I picked. I am positive he was effected in the first game after that I think it is all conjecture. And for the record I thought DA should had been benched after game 3 and BQ put in then against the Bengals. But I am just saying I don't think he is as bad as most say, not that he should still start. And yes DA did play bad against Washington, but he did not play bad against Baltimore II and the Jags. He managed the game well against cincy in week 4 then had a bye week before the Giants where he played really well. Then followed that up with the clunker in Washington, then rebounded against the Jags and had a good game against Baltimore. If BE does not drop that sure TD pass at the end of the third quarter the Browns win that game, but he did and that is reality. But basically I feel that DA played decent to good football in 4 or his last 5 starts before being benched. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TheJokersWILD Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 Thanks mz the pussy now everytime I stop at a stop sign I will hear that song in my head Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flugel Posted August 22, 2009 Report Share Posted August 22, 2009 I agree that BQ should start this year. I just disagree on how bad DA really is. I can agree that he has not shown good progression, but I do not think that he has regressed as much as you think. That is pretty much all. I have already posted many times why I feel this way so I will not repeat it again. Hard to argue with any of that - thanks CMAC! You're not the type that needs to re-post anything. You do an excellent job the first time. - Tom F. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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