Gun safety survey

[Westside Steve]

I don't care what side of the issue you are on and I would hope that everybody can refrain from just throwing shit at the others.

You are the president you have both houses they will write whatever bills you want and you can sign them. They may or may not be necessarily constitutional but we can worry about that in another discussion.

You can have whatever gun policies you want written into law. And you get one bite of the apple.

Give me your short list of new roles and tell me how and how much they will make things better. Thanks.

WSS

[Vambo]

I'd like for you to add how any of the changes will stop criminals from being bad, how will you keep guns from criminals?

You can pass all the laws you want only LAW ABIDING CITIZENS will follow them!

[DieHardBrownsFan1]

[The Cysko Kid]

There's over 300 million guns loose in this country and God knows how many in Mexico. "Common sense gun laws" will do exactly nothing. The genie is already out of the bottle and has been for a long long time. 

[Westside Steve]

1 hour ago, Vambo said:

I'd like for you to add how any of the changes will stop criminals from being bad, how will you keep guns from criminals?

You can pass all the laws you want only LAW ABIDING CITIZENS will follow them!

I did say tell me how and how much it will help. That's not what I want to talk about just wondering what everybody wants for this constitutional or not. I'm guessing some will say it probably won't help but it's a step in the right direction. And I hope they remember I said that they get one bite of the Apple.

WSS

[Vambo]

3 minutes ago, Westside Steve said:

I did say tell me how and how much it will help. That's not what I want to talk about just wondering what everybody wants for this constitutional or not. I'm guessing some will say it probably won't help but it's a step in the right direction. And I hope they remember I said that they get one bite of the Apple.

WSS

You have to get rid of lax liberal laws and liberal prosecutors, look how much violence has increased since the Democrats have been in power.

[hammertime]

I require every citizen of legal age to own a weapon and be qualified to use.

 

 Thanks 

[MLD Woody]

19 minutes ago, The Cysko Kid said:

There's over 300 million guns loose in this country and God knows how many in Mexico. "Common sense gun laws" will do exactly nothing. The genie is already out of the bottle and has been for a long long time. 

So we might as well not do anything ever because it won't completely solve the problem right now...

[The Cysko Kid]

6 minutes ago, MLD Woody said:

So we might as well not do anything ever because it won't completely solve the problem right now...

We could seize all the guns by force. And then, you know, close off the border. That wouldn't solve the problem right now but it might in a couple decades. 

[The Cysko Kid]

What you're proposing is putting a bandaid on a sucking chest wound. You've either got to treat the sucking chest wound or let the patient die. You can't put a band-aid on it and then go "yay I did something! I took action" 

The action also has to be effective. 

[MLD Woody]

21 minutes ago, The Cysko Kid said:

What you're proposing is putting a bandaid on a sucking chest wound. You've either got to treat the sucking chest wound or let the patient die. You can't put a band-aid on it and then go "yay I did something! I took action" 

The action also has to be effective. 

Effectiveness != Complete resolution

[The Cysko Kid]

Nothing would resolve the problem of violence and shootings effectively in the short term. The most effective would be a total seizure of weaponry but even that is going to lead to an unprecedented amount of bloodshed before it's completed. Some of these people out here are crazy enough to die for their convictions. 

[The Cysko Kid]

You keep advocating for this nebulous plan and rather than act like I'm just trolling you like some of our fellow posters why don't you tell me what, exactly, your common sense gun laws are and how you imagine they will be effective. 

[Canton Dawg]

Let’s see…in Woody’s Utopia, there would be no guns.

No tasers, no BB guns, no squirt guns, no sling shots.

And anyone caught with a knife or pointy object such as a toothpick will get you a mandatory 10 years in jail.

In the meantime, we have people getting mowed down on the sidewalk by cars and trucks.

But I’m sure if those vehicles are electric, all is good.

[FairHooker11]

2 minutes ago, The Cysko Kid said:

You keep advocating for this nebulous plan and rather than act like I'm just trolling you like some of our fellow posters why don't you tell me what, exactly, your common sense gun laws are and how you imagine they will be effective. 

zing!

[FairHooker11]

 

 

too soon? 

[Westside Steve]

I really wasn't looking for all the bulshit you can put that on the other post. As for myself , no, I don't think there's really anything that could be done. Not without Draconian measures. Still  I've got no problem with registering guns I've got no problem with waiting. I've got no problem with background checks. I think the laws that are on the books should be enforced. I especially have no problem with violent or crazy criminals being in jail for their whole f****** life or get the chair rather than some scumbag lawyer getting them back out on the street or letting them go once they've been caught. But I assume the attorneys 2 Trend Democrat have a Lobby bigger than the NRA so there's that.

WSS

[Gorka]

Even as I try to put myself in the shoes of a parent whose child was a victim, I still can't imagine myself pointing to guns and jumping on the ant-gun bandwagon. I just can't. 

My anger would be aimed exclusively at the idiot who did it regardless of if he used a gun, a bomb, or his car.

[Vambo]

We sent $54 billion Ukraine and millions for museums and bailing out Dem cities who mis-spent money etc...we should use that money to put better security / armed guards around schools as they do politicians.

Get rid of Soros prosecutors and bail reform.

Actually use the laws on the books red flag laws.

Don't brush off signs of people needing help with their mental state.

Keep violent offender locked up for their full terms.

Just a couple to think about.

 

[Vambo]

When I went to school there were still guns and laxer gun laws but you never heard of school shootings so what has changed what is causing these kids to want to shoot up schools...this is the long term key to solving this.

[calfoxwc]

whooreta and woodpecker don't really give a damn about kids who die.

Yes, some use guns to kill or commit suicide.

they also use illegal drugs.

which come across out border a LOT. thanks to the dems.

https://www.webmd.com › mental-health › addiction › news › 20191007 › kids-often-use-otc-drugs-in-suicide-attempts

Kids Often Use OTC Drugs in Suicide Attempts - WebMD

In kids 18 and younger, suicide attempts by self-poisoning occurred more during the school months of September through May. This pattern wasn't seen in the 19- to 21-year-old age group.

https://www.huffpost.com › entry › children-poisoning-themse_b_103494

Children Poisoning Themselves with Illegal Psychiatric Drugs

Skin disorders. Cardiovascular disease. Reduced appetite. The brain dysfunction caused by these drugs can lead to serious psychiatric problems: Depression, apathy, sadness and social withdrawal and isolation. Obsessive-compulsive disorder. Suicidal thoughts and behavior. Paranoia, mania and psychosis. Anxiety, nervousness and agitation.

https://www.verywellmind.com › what-is-happening-to-our-children-2606269

Statistics on Teen Suicide, Drugs, and Violence - Verywell Mind

Suicide is the second leading cause of death for people between the ages of 10 and 34. 3. More teens and young adults die from suicide than from heart disease, AIDS, birth defects, pneumonia, influenza, cancer, and lung disease combined. 4. Four out of five teens who attempt suicide give warning signs.

https://www.cdc.gov › nchs › products › databriefs › db282.htm

Products - Data Briefs - Number 282 - August 2017

Of all drug overdose deaths among adolescents aged 15-19 in 2015, about eight in ten (80.4%) were unintentional, 13.5% were suicide, 5.2% were of undetermined intent, and 0.9% were homicide ( Figure 2 ). A higher percentage of male (86.2%) than female (70.1%) overdose deaths in adolescents aged 15-19 were unintentional.

https://www.nimh.nih.gov › news › research-highlights › 2021 › understanding-the-characteristics-of-suicide-in-young-children

Understanding the Characteristics of Suicide in Young Children

Suicidal thoughts or actions, even in very young children, are a sign of extreme distress and should not be ignored. If you or someone you know needs immediate help, contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 1-800-273-TALK (8255) or the Crisis Text Line by texting "home" to 741 741. According to the Centers for Disease Control and ...

https://www.fda.gov › drugs › postmarket-drug-safety-information-patients-and-providers › suicidality-children-and-adolescents-being-treated-antidepressant-medications

Suicidality in Children and Adolescents Being Treated With ...

The risk of suicidality for these drugs was identified in a combined analysis of short-term (up to 4 months) placebo-controlled trials of nine antidepressant drugs, including the selective ...

https://psychcentral.com › news › 2019 › 10 › 08 › common-household-drugs-often-used-by-youth-in-suicide-attempts

Common Household Drugs Often Used By Youth in Suicide Attempts

The two most common substance groups in all age groups were over-the-counter (OTC) painkillers such as acetaminophen, ibuprofen and aspirin, followed by antidepressants. In youth (ages 10-12) and ...

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov › pmc › articles › PMC5101274

Child abuse and the prevalence of suicide attempts among those ...

Introduction. As suicide is one of the top 20 causes of death worldwide [], there has been substantial effort to understand, predict, and prevent it.Klonsky and May [] argue that research on risk for suicide has often conflated why people feel suicidal with why they act on suicidal thoughts.In a large international study of almost 85,000 individuals in 17 countries [], approximately one-third ...

https://www.npr.org › 2021 › 07 › 27 › 1021373104 › more-children-are-dying-by-suicide-recently-study-shows

More Children Are Dying By Suicide Recently, Study Shows

Jul 27, 2021A new study shows an increase in suicidality among children as young as five and investigates the shared characteristics among kids who die by suicide. Researchers hope to improve prevention efforts.

https://www.cdc.gov › ncbddd › fasd › features › teen-substance-use.html

Teen Substance Use & Risks | CDC

Parents play a critical role in their children's lives. As their children grow to pre-teens and teens, parents worry about new risks they may experience. One such risk is the use of substances, such as alcohol, marijuana, tobacco, and other drugs. Parents can help by talking to their teen's pediatrician about screening for substance use.

 

 

 

[calfoxwc]

Which, btw, unlike Mr. Steve, I do take serious issue with gun registration.

1. It solves absolutely nothing when it comes to deadly crimes using guns.

2. The left uses gun registration as a weapon. Every time you have registration, they know

where to come and take them, and it happens every? time.

3. In NY, they required gun registration. So, people registered their guns.

    what happened? The newspaper printed the names AND ADDRESSES  of all registrants. including policemen, firemen, everybody.

    Making every single household a target.

[calfoxwc]

Food for thought on that subject:

http://jpfo.org/articles-assd03/kopel-catastrophic-consequences.htm

"

In truth, gun registration would have done absolutely nothing to stop the Sandy Hook murderer who killed his mother and stole her lawfully purchased firearms. Nor would it have stopped the killer who attacked Congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords, or the Virginia Tech murderer, both of whom bought their guns in stores.

But gun registration is very good for one thing -- confiscation. And even more immediately, gun registration is ideal to bolster the quickly growing public persecution of gun owners.

http://jpfo.org/images12/gun-owner-map-150.jpgThe state of New York shows exactly how it's done. There, you may only possess a handgun if you have a license, and the license lists every single handgun you own. In Rockland County, the Journal News used public records to obtain the name and address of every handgun owner in the county. Those names and addresses were then published, in full, by the newspaper and placed on the newspaper's website, where they are now available for everyone to see. The newspaper has been digging into gun registration lists in other counties as well, with plans to publish those records.

The same thing was done to all registered gun owners in New York City in early January. This time, the perpetrator was Gawker.com, one of the most high-traffic sites on the Internet that specializes in salacious gossip and vulgar malice. Gawker absolutely hates guns, gun owners and the NRA.

What does this mean for the people who dutifully complied with New York's gun registration law? It means those who chose not to have their personal information listed in the phone book now have their residences exposed to a worldwide audience on the Internet. It now means that people who kept low profiles and their addresses private because they have been victims of stalkers are now easier targets for stalkers and other sociopaths.

In 1989, actress Rebecca Schaeffer was murdered by a stalker who obtained her home address from California driver's license records. Since then, many states have barred public access to driver's license records. But gun registration records are not necessarily private.

One group pleased with the Rockland Journal News' publication of gun registration data was the felons in nearby state prisons. They've told prison guards who live in Rockland County that now, thanks to the Journal News, the prisoners and their friends on the outside know exactly where the guards' families live. If a prisoner decides he doesn't like a particular guard, it is now a lot easier to find that guard's family.

After the Journal News published gun owner registration information, another paper in the area, the Rockland County Times, asked several former convicts what they thought about the publication of registration information. The convicts all agreed that it would be an outstanding list for burglars to use.

We know that the vast majority of burglars in the United States (unlike in Great Britain or Ireland) try to avoid breaking into a home when someone is there because of the risk of being shot by the homeowner. So the longest part of a burglar's working day is "casing the joint" to ensure nobody is home. Burglars in Rockland County now know which homes to avoid while the occupants are home. And once the occupants are gone, burglars know precisely where they can steal guns to sell on the black market.

Consequently, New York's gun registration program is now being used to help criminals arm themselves.

It's likely that the Rockland Journal News was not intentionally attempting to help criminals; the newspaper was just wanton and reckless about the very foreseeable pro-crime consequences of its actions. Rather, the Journal News, based on its printed justification for its actions, seems to have been motivated by social malice against gun owners.

Perhaps one of your neighbors hates gun owners. You know from casual conversation with him that he is angry and irrational about guns. To avoid upsetting him, you don't tell him you are a gun owner. When your car leaves your garage on a Saturday morning, he doesn't know that you are driving to the shooting range with a pistol in your trunk.

Or suppose that the guy who hates guns isn't your neighbor; he's your boss. Thanks to gun registration, he now knows that you are one of the people he hates. He may never confront you about the topic. He may never tell you why his written evaluations of you suddenly became so negative. Or why, when your department had to lay off somebody, he decided that somebody would be you.

Gun registration -- what Obama, Biden and Bloomberg euphemistically call "a national database" -- is also a perfect tool for the later confiscation of guns.

 

 

Mayor John LindsayNew York City has experience in this arena. In the mid-1960s, street crime was rising rapidly there as in most of the rest of the nation. The people who were perpetrating muggings in Central Park and robbing liquor stores in Queens were not the decent, law-abiding gun owners of New York City. Nevertheless, the New York City Council and anti-gun Mayor John Lindsay enacted long gun registration. The per-gun fee was just a few dollars. The politicians promised that gun registration could help solve crimes and, even if it didn't, registration was harmless. After all, it was just registering guns, not confiscating them.

 

As registration did nothing to solve crime or stop criminal use of guns, crime continued to get worse in the city. So in 1991, with the city becoming increasingly unlivable, Mayor David Dinkins attempted to make himself think he was tough on crime, this time by pressuring the City Council to enact a ban on so-called "assault weapons" (such as the M1 carbine).

After that, the New York state police used registration lists to conduct home inspections of every individual whose registered gun had been outlawed. The police were ensuring that the registered guns had been moved out of the city or already surrendered to the government."

[MLD Woody]

A few things to start:

A "good guy with a gun" / security doesn't prevent shit. In both the buffalo shooting and Texas shooting there were "good guys with a gun" that didn't stop a mass shooting from happening. That's a cop out suggestion from people that don't want to give up their toys.

You aren't preventing a tyrannical government because you own a few guns. If a modern military wanted you dead you'd get taken out at night by an unmanned drone without a trace. You aren't stopping a modern military. That's fucking laughable

 

 

Some reforms

Create a national registry of guns and gun owners, just like with cars.

Increase the basic level of training needed to fire and own a gun, and increase that level as needed across different styles of guns. Again, just like cars. Stricter license to drive an 18 wheeler. 

Implement a buy back program on firearms

Limit large capacity magazines

Limit the amount of ammo an individual can buy. If they want to shoot for fun, go to a gun range. 

Make illegal any commercially available add on that can make a gun more deadly

Limit where and how guns can be sold

Invest in public healthcare, including mental health

More thorough background checks with longer waiting periods

[DieHardBrownsFan1]

It was on the news today that 18 year olds have been able to buy long guns (rifles) the past 60 years in Texas.  So this just shows the decaying of society due to lack of religion, parenting, etc.

[Vambo]

19 minutes ago, MLD Woody said:

 

 

Some reforms

Create a national registry of guns and gun owners, just like with cars. OK Explain how this would have prevented the school shooting and all the shootings in Chicago?

Will the criminals register their guns if not how do you plan on getting them to?

Increase the basic level of training needed to fire and own a gun, and increase that level as needed across different styles of guns. Again, just like cars. Stricter license to drive an 18 wheeler. There is training for that at most shooting ranges. Explain how this would have prevented the school shooting and all the shootings in Chicago?

Implement a buy back program on firearms Will the criminals sell their guns if not how do you plan on getting them to?

Explain how this would have prevented the school shooting and all the shootings in Chicago?

Limit large capacity magazines Explain how this would have prevented the school shooting and all the shootings in Chicago?

Limit the amount of ammo an individual can buy. If they want to shoot for fun, go to a gun range. Explain how this would have prevented the school shooting and all the shootings in Chicago?

Make illegal any commercially available add on that can make a gun more deadly Explain how this would have prevented the school shooting and all the shootings in Chicago?

Limit where and how guns can be sold Explain how this would have prevented the school shooting and all the shootings in Chicago?

Invest in public healthcare, including mental health This is a good idea.

More thorough background checks with longer waiting periods Do the criminals go thorough background checks with longer waiting periods if not how do you plan on getting them to?

Explain how this would have prevented the school shooting and all the shootings in Chicago?

You are not giving solutions....You need to explain how your ideas are going to work.

[MLD Woody]

7 minutes ago, DieHardBrownsFan1 said:

There was no cop in  the elementary school.  That was clarified today.  Plus all the doors were open, not locked.  Anyone could have walked into the school.

Two cops were in the area when he arrived and they didn't stop shit

A swarm of cops arrived and positioned themselves around the school, but then didn't go in and didn't stop shit

 

There has been more and more cops in schools and it isn't stopping shit

https://www.edweek.org/leadership/school-resource-officer-sro-duties-effectiveness

 

 

[MLD Woody]

Don't worry, fox news is on the case

 

https://twitter.com/abughazalehkat/status/1529573713976377348?s=20&t=dsPno-G0q1tR6fMwoqOWQw

Oh wait, no they're not. They're pathetic trash taking NRA bucks

 

 

 

 

 

[MLD Woody]

We're a shit hole country. This is fucking pathetic. Lobbyists, politics, vigilante fantasies and not wanting to give up your toys is keeping our country a laughingstock. 

The only thing that's going to slow down school shootings in the near future is summer break...

 

It's all so fucking exhausting

[Westside Steve]

11 minutes ago, MLD Woody said:

A few things to start:

A "good guy with a gun" / security doesn't prevent shit. In both the buffalo shooting and Texas shooting there were "good guys with a gun" that didn't stop a mass shooting from happening. That's a cop out suggestion from people that don't want to give up their toys.

You aren't preventing a tyrannical government because you own a few guns. If a modern military wanted you dead you'd get taken out at night by an unmanned drone without a trace. You aren't stopping a modern military. That's fucking laughable

 

 

Some reforms

Create a national registry of guns and gun owners, just like with cars.

Increase the basic level of training needed to fire and own a gun, and increase that level as needed across different styles of guns. Again, just like cars. Stricter license to drive an 18 wheeler. 

Implement a buy back program on firearms

Limit large capacity magazines

Limit the amount of ammo an individual can buy. If they want to shoot for fun, go to a gun range. 

Make illegal any commercially available add on that can make a gun more deadly

Limit where and how guns can be sold

Invest in public healthcare, including mental health

More thorough background checks with longer waiting periods

Thanks Woodrow. I'd like to point out that before you get to your list of things to do telling us that good guys with guns can't stop anything is pretty much exactly like what pro gun people tell you about registration waiting periods etc etc. And no we are certainly not going to defend ourselves from a tyrannical government. That's one of the reasons the government keeps the gun laws as strict as they are today just for reference. But that aside

1 & 2

I'm with you on both counts. I think everybody that has a gun should be trained to use it. Like you say just the same as cars. On top of registration I wouldn't mind having a ballistics figure print on file.

3 maybe if the buyback program paid more then the local gang Bangers. If a hood rat or a hillbilly owns a gun it's because he wants it for some reason sure if it's laying around the house or if he steals it from his neighbor and get a few bucks for it... I just don't see it as much of a solution

4 & 5

Not particularly effective only because I think crazy people play on this stuff out and they can certainly buy more Philly quickly. But it might actually slow down the berserk guy who's going to Dick's Sporting Goods this morning and planning the attack this afternoon. That automatic weapons are already illegal without the huge rigmarole and I think the capacity limit in Ohio is 30. Don't know about anywhere else I think the add-ons to make guns more deadly are already illegal aren't they? Some wouldn't make much difference like a silencer just because the lunatic that shoots up a crowd already knows he's creating Havoc.

6?

Crackdown on gun shows?  Maybe why not. The places you can legally sell guns are pretty strictly limited as it is but why not. My guns were actually handed down from my father and grandfather except one that I purchased from an enthusiastic who happens to be a friend of mine.

I think Public mental Health services are a complete waste of time and money and that's at best. At worst they are grifters with a psychology degree breaking in money and pretending they have any idea what's going on in people's heads. Or what can or can't be fixed which, in my opinion, is nothing.

Fine with background checks and waiting periods fine. No problem again I don't think these crackpots are going to the store an hour before the shootings but if they were that would slow them down. And not to pick on you but do keep in mind how many people on the left would feel about overturning the HIPAA law so that the hillbilly at the gun shop could call up and find somebody's entire mental and physical health background.

But I appreciate you giving me a straight answer bud.

WSS