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6 GAMES FOR WATSON....I'LL TAKE IT


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14 minutes ago, MDDawg said:

Great day for true Browns fans. Nearly all the commentators are ignoring the NFL's own rule book on punishment guidelines. He was not charged with an offence so he can only be disciplined 4-8 games. If Gooddell challenges this he'll be humiliated by the NFLPA.

I wouldn't call enabling a Sexual Predator a great day... However, For the sake of the team... I hope he learns his lesson and does well for us... I'm not a huge LBJ fan... But he came back and did what was asked of him... And we got our first Larry O'Brien...

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Not to bring a somber note into all of this... I just wonder how Gipper would've thought about this and approached it with his years of experience on the bench... Would've been great to hear his take on this...

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23 minutes ago, hoorta said:

It would look real bad for Goodell to agree with the NFLPA on having an independent arbitrator hear disciplinary cases, and then right out of the gate say- six games isn't enough.  

Maybe he'll drop it down to four. 🤗💃

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38 minutes ago, nickers said:

Not to bring a somber note into all of this... I just wonder how Gipper would've thought about this and approached it with his years of experience on the bench... Would've been great to hear his take on this...

For starters, I think he would accepted the arbitrators version of the facts over the Media and the Court of Public Opinions version of the facts.

 

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1 hour ago, nickers said:

I wouldn't call enabling a Sexual Predator a great day... However, For the sake of the team... I hope he learns his lesson and does well for us... I'm not a huge LBJ fan... But he came back and did what was asked of him... And we got our first Larry O'Brien...

He lost 6 game checks how is that enabling him? How much did the Texans lose proportionately given that they were the real enablers? All professional sports are tainted, occasionally the mask slips off to expose the darkness that it really underlies it let's not fool ourselves.

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It is important to let this play out.

Things to note:

The owners are not subject to the CBA which this falls under.

The gambler is not subject to the Personal Conduct Policy which this falls under.

The PED user is not subject to the Personal Conduct Policy which this falls under.

The ball deflator is not subject to the Person Conduct Policy which this falls under.

All those comparisons are not applicable in this instance.

However, all of those comparisons are applicable in the court of public opinion.

The MOST notable legitimate comparisons are Big Ben (1 accusation - 6 games) and Zeke Elliot (1 accusation - 6 games)

Sue Robinson's quote "Egregious misconduct"

I think this will be upped by 2-6 games and he will be fined and he will be required to attend counseling (which he should do regardless).

 

The NFL won't want to look weak, but will not want this drawn out all season again.  So they won't go for the full season, but they will increase it. But not by so much as to draw appeals from the NFLPA.

8-12 games.

IMHO

 

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I keep hearing and see the number of allegations as the basis for a longer suspension.

Why didn’t the Grand Jury hear all 25 allegations?

More importantly, Why did the NFLs disciplinary hearing only start with 5 cases and actually ended up taking into account just 4? This is the kind of question that may solicit an answer that the Court of Public Opinion may not want to hear. 
 

Let’s just keep eating up the headlines and bold print on this one and not ask the tough questions. 

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53 minutes ago, MDDawg said:

He lost 6 game checks how is that enabling him? How much did the Texans lose proportionately given that they were the real enablers? All professional sports are tainted, occasionally the mask slips off to expose the darkness that it really underlies it let's not fool ourselves.

What makes you think he'll stop doing these "sessions" ?... He very well could've gotten a year and deserved it... They gained 3 1st rnd draft picks and an albatross off their necks... The only difference now is the magnifying glass increased 10x's

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For the guys playing the 'well he was already suspended for a year in texas' card, I don't believe he was suspended. I believe he sat out because he was demanding a trade. I don't know exactly what that has to do with his unhappiness with some of the coaching or front office hires.

For what it's worth.

WSS

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3 hours ago, Canton Dawg said:

Sounds like the NFL wants to limit who’s performing the “rub-n-tug” on our franchise QB. 😂🤣

C18AF17F-78BC-447E-9FB2-54F9BF0975E5.jpeg

Well that ends DW's massage sessions if the NFL club approved therapists are all males.

Although I was surprised to learn that the majority of massage therapists were indeed women.

“Seventy percent of spa-goers are female, and there are more female therapists, so it makes sense that this would be the preference,” she said. Indeed, 85 percent of massage therapists in the United States are women, according to the American Massage Therapy Association. But culture and nationality also play a role"

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2 hours ago, crstphr2 said:

It is important to let this play out.

Things to note:

The owners are not subject to the CBA which this falls under.

The gambler is not subject to the Personal Conduct Policy which this falls under.

The PED user is not subject to the Personal Conduct Policy which this falls under.

The ball deflator is not subject to the Person Conduct Policy which this falls under.

All those comparisons are not applicable in this instance.

However, all of those comparisons are applicable in the court of public opinion.

The MOST notable legitimate comparisons are Big Ben (1 accusation - 6 games) and Zeke Elliot (1 accusation - 6 games)

Sue Robinson's quote "Egregious misconduct"

I think this will be upped by 2-6 games and he will be fined and he will be required to attend counseling (which he should do regardless).

 

The NFL won't want to look weak, but will not want this drawn out all season again.  So they won't go for the full season, but they will increase it. But not by so much as to draw appeals from the NFLPA.

8-12 games.

IMHO

 

No fkg way.

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2 hours ago, Westside Steve said:

For the guys playing the 'well he was already suspended for a year in texas' card, I don't believe he was suspended. I believe he sat out because he was demanding a trade. I don't know exactly what that has to do with his unhappiness with some of the coaching or front office hires.

For what it's worth.

WSS

Correct and it obviously didn’t diminish his earning capacity. He was on what was essentially Paid Leave. 
 

I read the entire 13-14 page ruling I’m doing some work now but I wanted to share some thoughts on it. 

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1 hour ago, DieHardBrownsFan1 said:

No fkg way.

The nfl has to play tough like they actually are pro woman.  They can just say...the nflpa said no...

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Four and a half months after making the trade, thousands of posts, fights, arguments and we end up right where we originally figured...

Six game suspension. 

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1 minute ago, Dutch Oven said:

Four and a half months after making the trade, thousands of posts, fights, arguments and we end up right where we originally figured...

Six game suspension. 


Well hold on…I’ve heard “for now” by every talking head with an agenda. 

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57 minutes ago, SdBacker80 said:


Well hold on…I’ve heard “for now” by every talking head with an agenda. 

The NFL has three days to start the appeal process, if they want to, correct?

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5 hours ago, crstphr2 said:

It is important to let this play out.

Things to note:

The owners are not subject to the CBA which this falls under.

The gambler is not subject to the Personal Conduct Policy which this falls under.

The PED user is not subject to the Personal Conduct Policy which this falls under.

The ball deflator is not subject to the Person Conduct Policy which this falls under.

All those comparisons are not applicable in this instance.

However, all of those comparisons are applicable in the court of public opinion.

The MOST notable legitimate comparisons are Big Ben (1 accusation - 6 games) and Zeke Elliot (1 accusation - 6 games)

Sue Robinson's quote "Egregious misconduct"

I think this will be upped by 2-6 games and he will be fined and he will be required to attend counseling (which he should do regardless).

 

The NFL won't want to look weak, but will not want this drawn out all season again.  So they won't go for the full season, but they will increase it. But not by so much as to draw appeals from the NFLPA.

8-12 games.

IMHO

 

I see your points, but I respectfully disagree.  The NFL "may" try to lengthen the suspension to appease certain women's groups that would want nothing less than a  lifetime ban and castration. 

BUT.. as Ms. Arbitrator wrote in her opinion,  the Personal conduct policy agreed on in the player's contract says 6 game max for a violation.  You can't change the rules retroactively.  Take it to the bank if Goodell and the NFL TRY to add more games, the NFLPA is going to raise an unprecedented holy stink about it. It could drag out in Federal courts for months. 

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6 hours ago, crstphr2 said:

The NFL won't want to look weak, but will not want this drawn out all season again.  So they won't go for the full season, but they will increase it. But not by so much as to draw appeals from the NFLPA.

8-12 games.

If I were an owner, and Roger GoToHell disregarded what Sue Robinson had ruled and upped the penalty, I'd have to ask, "Then what the hell are we paying Robinson for!?"

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7 minutes ago, Orion said:

If I were an owner, and Roger GoToHell disregarded what Sue Robinson had ruled and upped the penalty, I'd have to ask, "Then what the hell are we paying Robinson for!?"

Even if the player has an owner who gave him a fully guaranteed contract, which as a fellow owner you want nothing to do with?

I bet you might think differently, in that hypothetical situation. 

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3 minutes ago, Dutch Oven said:

Even if....

What.  My question is something you wouldn't ask?  If you were an owner?  I mean, put aside what you think about Haslem.  You wouldn't be asking your buddies, "So then, why did we bring in that chick judge?"    I mean, I can picture the Steelers front office after they hear that GoToHell changed the suspension to a full season, "Yeah!!!  Fuck them Browns!!!  But...not for nothin' guys, what's that Robinson chick good for?"  

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Ruling on Deshaun Watson was Never Going to be Satisfying

https://www.si.com/nfl/browns/browns-maven-features/unsatisfying-deshaun-watson-ruling

 

The only guarantee with a resolution to Deshaun Watson's investigation by the NFL is it would be unsatisfying, dispiriting. Coming up with an adequate punishment for a series of charges with little proof was an impossible needle to thread, but the league was once again exposed for how ill equipped they are to deal with violence and mistreatment of women, despite countless opportunities to form a policy.   Sports leagues are never going to be an effective substitute for the criminal justice system and even though they are operating based on the preponderance of evidence as opposed to innocent until proven guilty, it was a system fraught with problems before Watson getting to the NFL was a consideration...

 

...Vague guidelines allow the league to protect its owners while being able to punish players inconsistently and often more harshly. In this case, it came back to haunt them. The same rules that enabled them to avoid any meaningful punishment for New England Patriots owner Robert Kraft, caught on camera soliciting prostitution in Florida, allowed Robinson to default to the same punishment for Watson as Ben Roethlisberger and Ezekiel Elliott despite 24 women accusing him of sexual assault and misconduct.

The NFL has allowed Washington Commanders owner Daniel Snyder to operate almost with impunity despite accusations that have been piling up for a decade which includes sexual assault. Until the league is willing to put pen to paper on a real policy that outlines punishments for both players and owners, they will continue to get what they view as unsatisfying results in cases like Watson.

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3 hours ago, hoorta said:

I see your points, but I respectfully disagree.  The NFL "may" try to lengthen the suspension to appease certain women's groups that would want nothing less than a  lifetime ban and castration. 

BUT.. as Ms. Arbitrator wrote in her opinion,  the Personal conduct policy agreed on in the player's contract says 6 game max for a violation.  You can't change the rules retroactively.  Take it to the bank if Goodell and the NFL TRY to add more games, the NFLPA is going to raise an unprecedented holy stink about it. It could drag out in Federal courts for months. 

 Six games for "a" violation?  Hmmm... 6 games X 24 violations = 144 games.

I'd say he got off with less than a slap on the wrist but rather a pat on the head saying "now run along and be a good boy Deshaun."

Interesting. It's likely he would have received the same punishment had he only been accused of misbehaving one time. That doesn't seem right.

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20 hours ago, FY56 said:

 

Dear Lord I can't believe people still aren't getting it.

Two grand juries would not indict him because he did nothing ILLEGAL, not that he didn't do anything wrong.

From the NFL personal conduct policy:

Everyone who is part of the league must refrain from “conduct detrimental to the integrity of and public confidence in” the NFL. This includes owners, coaches, players, other team employees, game officials, and employees of the league office, NFL Films, NFL Network, or any other NFL business.

It is not enough simply to avoid being found guilty of a crime. We are all held to a higher standard and must conduct ourselves in a way that is responsible, promotes the values of the NFL, and is lawful.

The perv had not been railroaded and deserved what he got.

More than that..you're downplaying it. i worked for a criminal defense attorney for 7 years after I left law school. .a grand jury will indict ANYONE...as the saying goes a ham sandwich. Ask Tyson...3 years in prison, no DNA, girl came to his hotel room alone at 1 am, had proven to falsely scream rape before....Watson was in TEXAS. The Freedom project which is young attorneys getting people out of prison who are falsely convicted exists because grand juries are little more than the prosecutor's fan club. Find 1 case where someone was facing more than just 10 charges and not 1 stuck. Watson had 22.....saw twice. Something was greatly wrong with their testimony(s)

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18 hours ago, hoorta said:

It would look real bad for Goodell to agree with the NFLPA on having an independent arbitrator hear disciplinary cases, and then right out of the gate say- six games isn't enough.  

Especially given how piss poorly he handled the Sexual Harassment issues at Daniel Snyder's work place. 

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9 hours ago, Orion said:

What.  My question is something you wouldn't ask?  If you were an owner?  I mean, put aside what you think about Haslem.  You wouldn't be asking your buddies, "So then, why did we bring in that chick judge?"    I mean, I can picture the Steelers front office after they hear that GoToHell changed the suspension to a full season, "Yeah!!!  Fuck them Browns!!!  But...not for nothin' guys, what's that Robinson chick good for?"  

In so many words, she did a great job of pointing out that her ruling could not exceed the precedent.  

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It would send a message of why even bother with the arbitrator.

 

I do get why the NFLPA went with this set up.  If goodell does overrule, in court they will have a much easier time hammering that the commish imposes penalty with prejudice and isn't unbiased in his dealings with players and owners. 

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13 hours ago, FY56 said:

 Six games for "a" violation?  Hmmm... 6 games X 24 violations = 144 games.

I'd say he got off with less than a slap on the wrist but rather a pat on the head saying "now run along and be a good boy Deshaun."

Interesting. It's likely he would have received the same punishment had he only been accused of misbehaving one time. That doesn't seem right.

Yeah, some folks IMHO pushing the "Me Too" agenda would rather see their team in the shitter for years, instead of realizing the opinion of an independent arbitrator (and former Federal judge)- this is what it is. Couldn't hand out a longer suspension, because it's in the CBA. Should Goodell & Company try for a lengthier time out, the NFLPA will take it to  Federal Court faster than you can say "Deshaun Watson". Count on it. 

The other side wanted NO suspension at all.  Said it earlier, I'm OK with six games. 

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54 minutes ago, hoorta said:

Yeah, some folks IMHO pushing the "Me Too" agenda would rather see their team in the shitter for years, instead of realizing the opinion of an independent arbitrator (and former Federal judge)- this is what it is.

I can tell you without a moment of hesitation that I'd rather watch shitty football than win with Watson. I'll always be a fan of the Browns, but any success associated with Watson will feel like a tarnished crown to me. I just don't how on Earth I'll be able to cheer, or even be happy, assuming he has success playing the position. 

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