bestplayer52 Posted September 30, 2009 Report Share Posted September 30, 2009 Art Modell didn't screw this city out of a SB Championship, he moved and it took 4 years of drafting and hiring coaches under AN OWNER who wanted to win. 1996 Ravens finished 4-12 and they went to work rebuilding. The Ravens drafted and hired the right people to win on Sundays and won a Super Bowl in 2000. By selling the Browns , Modell created the economic reality of building a Super Bowl winner in 4 years. Could he have done it in Cleveland? NO. because the city would not support a new stadium which they needed to compete. The city of Cleveland did not understand basic FOOTBALL ECONOMICS. The Browns were sold but not many of the original Browns players on that team have a Super Bowl Ring. What happened is that the Ravens built from scratch and won under Modell who might be despised in Cleveland but is loved in Baltimore. What is the difference today as the Ravens lead the AFC North and played in the AFC Championship last year? HIS FOOTPRINT ON WINNING and Lerner has tiny footprints compared to Modell. We can hire all of the Mangini's and Crennels we want but when an owner wants to win he wins or comes damn close! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemosley01 Posted September 30, 2009 Report Share Posted September 30, 2009 Art Modell didn't screw this city out of a SB Championship, he moved and it took 4 years of drafting and hiring coaches under AN OWNER who wanted to win. 1996 Ravens finished 4-12 and they went to work rebuilding. The Ravens drafted and hired the right people to win on Sundays and won a Super Bowl in 2000. By selling the Browns , Modell created the economic reality of building a Super Bowl winner in 4 years. Could he have done it in Cleveland? NO. because the city would not support a new stadium which they needed to compete. The city of Cleveland did not understand basic FOOTBALL ECONOMICS. The Browns were sold but not many of the original Browns players on that team have a Super Bowl Ring. What happened is that the Ravens built from scratch and won under Modell who might be despised in Cleveland but is loved in Baltimore. What is the difference today as the Ravens lead the AFC North and played in the AFC Championship last year? HIS FOOTPRINT ON WINNING and Lerner has tiny footprints compared to Modell. We can hire all of the Mangini's and Crennels we want but when an owner wants to win he wins or comes damn close! I don't understand the football economics of how a new stadium helps the team compete. Can you elaborate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vegasdogg Posted September 30, 2009 Report Share Posted September 30, 2009 We don't need a history lesson from a ratbird fan. That is most certainly NOT how the deal went down, so quiet yourself, boy. Go back to your crack and whores. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bestplayer52 Posted September 30, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 30, 2009 The Ravens won a Super Bowl 4 years after leaving Cleveland..How can you say you hate them? They didn't steal a Super Bowl winner. They invited an owner who wanted to win to play football for their city.. The Browns have had 10 years to build a winner. Don't blame others for your shortcomings. Ravens did it in 4 years and now have built a Monster in the AFC.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blowe Posted September 30, 2009 Report Share Posted September 30, 2009 This guy has a good point if you put your emotions aside. Owners who WANT to win often do win. Take the Cavs for example. Dan Gilbert has said to Danny Ferry he is willing to spend because he wants to win. Now the Cavs are one of the deepest teams in the NBA. I'm not trying to defend Modell in any way, I'm just saying owners who want to win, usually win Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bestplayer52 Posted September 30, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 30, 2009 well I guess the only question is: Why was Modell the only owner to get the Browns competing for Super Bowls? 10 years is a decade and the Browns still seem lost without him. Drafting and coaching have been putrid and irresponsible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZBrowns Posted September 30, 2009 Report Share Posted September 30, 2009 well I guess the only question is: Why was Modell the only owner to get the Browns competing for Super Bowls? 10 years is a decade and the Browns still seem lost without him. Drafting and coaching have been putrid and irresponsible. Modell took a team that was winning championships pre-Super Bowl era, decided to fire Paul Brown and the team didn't appear in the NFL's championship game (Now called the Super Bowl) until he took a devil's ransom to move to Baltimore. I think it's funny how Ravens fans pretend to know the whole story when they didn't even care about Art Modell before 1995. The only stories you guys have to go off of are the ones your cute little media outlets tell. They don't tell about how Modell botched his deal for facilities at the Gateway complex not once, but twice. They don't talk about how all Modell wanted was a refirbished stadium for the longest time, but when Baltimore came crawling with the dough, it wasn't enough for him. They don't talk about the years Municipal Stadium sold out and the Browns selling tons of merchandise and making tons of profit but Modell somehow operated in the negative during the end of the original Browns era. . This isn't like the Colts move where Baltimore was having trouble filling half the seats before the Colts left. Get a clue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZBrowns Posted September 30, 2009 Report Share Posted September 30, 2009 Oh and it took longer than four years to build. You do realize the team was still the browns when they made a deal with the 49ers that allowed the Niners to draft JJ Stokes, right? In return the Browns got a first-rounder from the niners in the following draft - That pick turned out to be the Ravens second ever NFL draft selection - Ray Lewis. The pieces were already there for you. The announcement of the move itself plummeted the team so bad that it went from being considered a Super Bowl contender to allowing the Ravens to select Jonathan Ogden with their first pick. So yeah, you can pretty much than the Browns for helping you build a Super Bowl team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemosley01 Posted September 30, 2009 Report Share Posted September 30, 2009 I don't understand the football economics of how a new stadium helps the team compete. Can you elaborate? Since you must have missed my question, please explain how building a new stadium helps make a team competitive when that team is already raking in money hand-over-fist. It's one thing when it increases revenues, allowing a team to acquire players they couldn't have because of money, but the Browns were not in that situation. In fact, no team in the NFL is in that position - they simply can't sign everyone they want because of the cap, not because they don't have enough money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 88fingerslewy Posted September 30, 2009 Report Share Posted September 30, 2009 I'm sure if balt. didn't get the Browns that this ravens guy would be SOOOO understanding when the INDIANAPOLIS COLTS won the super bowl. Naw, there wouldn't be any hard feelings I'm sure....pfffft I guess he's either too young or has developed amnesia about what it feels like when your team leaves town. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geech Posted September 30, 2009 Report Share Posted September 30, 2009 F You Baltimore! WARNING: Contains Profanity -Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bestplayer52 Posted September 30, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 30, 2009 Oh and it took longer than four years to build. You do realize the team was still the browns when they made a deal with the 49ers that allowed the Niners to draft JJ Stokes, right? In return the Browns got a first-rounder from the niners in the following draft - That pick turned out to be the Ravens second ever NFL draft selection - Ray Lewis. The pieces were already there for you. The announcement of the move itself plummeted the team so bad that it went from being considered a Super Bowl contender to allowing the Ravens to select Jonathan Ogden with their first pick. So yeah, you can pretty much than the Browns for helping you build a Super Bowl team. Ray Lewis was drafted by Baltimore. The Browns would have passed on Ray Lewis like they passed on Adrian Peterson, Big Gay Ben, etc.. The Browns were not going to any Super Bowls soon so Modell took a group of guys elsewhere and won.. Don't blame a winner because the Browns have been 10 year losers.. 10 years is a long time to keep making excuses. Get over Modell and wise up already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZBrowns Posted October 1, 2009 Report Share Posted October 1, 2009 Ray Lewis was drafted by Baltimore. The Browns would have passed on Ray Lewis like they passed on Adrian Peterson, Big Gay Ben, etc.. The Browns were not going to any Super Bowls soon so Modell took a group of guys elsewhere and won.. Don't blame a winner because the Browns have been 10 year losers.. 10 years is a long time to keep making excuses. Get over Modell and wise up already. I didn't say Ray Lewis wasn't drafted by Baltimore, I said the Browns set that pick up for you and if you truly don't think they did then I have some ocean property in Yuma that you would love. I can see that B-more education lacks the teaching of reading comprehension. Perhaps if I wrote on the back of a bottle of antibiotics or a crack pipe you could undeerstand it more. And don't forget douchebag, you started this thread. Don't tell us to get over it. you're the one who is on the board and riding the jock of one pathetic franchise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrownsFan17 Posted October 1, 2009 Report Share Posted October 1, 2009 Ozzie Newsome (the former Brown) - not Modell - is the reason that the Ravens made it to the Super Bowl and continue to do well .... which, by the way, would have happened if the Browns stayed in Cleveland so don't give me that line if crap about how the team only won because they moved to Baltimore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairHooker11 Posted October 1, 2009 Report Share Posted October 1, 2009 Modell took a team that was winning championships pre-Super Bowl era, decided to fire Paul Brown and the team didn't appear in the NFL's championship game (Now called the Super Bowl) until he took a devil's ransom to move to Baltimore. I think it's funny how Ravens fans pretend to know the whole story when they didn't even care about Art Modell before 1995. The only stories you guys have to go off of are the ones your cute little media outlets tell. They don't tell about how Modell botched his deal for facilities at the Gateway complex not once, but twice. They don't talk about how all Modell wanted was a refirbished stadium for the longest time, but when Baltimore came crawling with the dough, it wasn't enough for him. They don't talk about the years Municipal Stadium sold out and the Browns selling tons of merchandise and making tons of profit but Modell somehow operated in the negative during the end of the original Browns era. . This isn't like the Colts move where Baltimore was having trouble filling half the seats before the Colts left. Get a clue. AZ is this why Fart reasoned that he was "shut out" of the stadium deal and left for Bwhore with his ultimatum? [which he never allowed for Cleveland to compete?] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrownsFan17 Posted October 1, 2009 Report Share Posted October 1, 2009 Ray Lewis was drafted by Baltimore. The Browns would have passed on Ray Lewis like they passed on Adrian Peterson, Big Gay Ben, etc.. The Browns were not going to any Super Bowls soon so Modell took a group of guys elsewhere and won.. Don't blame a winner because the Browns have been 10 year losers.. 10 years is a long time to keep making excuses. Get over Modell and wise up already. Ray Lewis was drafted by Ozzie Newsome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bestplayer52 Posted October 1, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 1, 2009 Ozzie Newsome (the former Brown) - not Modell - is the reason that the Ravens made it to the Super Bowl and continue to do well .... which, by the way, would have happened if the Browns stayed in Cleveland so don't give me that line if crap about how the team only won because they moved to Baltimore. No way the browns did the same thing as the Ravens FOUR YEARS later. Nope. Your argument is moot. The Browns Hired horrible people under new ownership and drafted like crap. Al Lerner hired Carmen Policy and Dwight Clark and Chris Palmer. The Hired Butch Davis. Then Hired Romoe Crennel and Phil Savage. Then hired Mangini. Would this have happened under Modell's watch? NO! The Browns were sold because another city saw a Super Bowl and had the plan in place to get there. 10 years of crying = not much to talk about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosar_For_President Posted October 1, 2009 Report Share Posted October 1, 2009 F You Baltimore! WARNING: Contains Profanity -Al OMG I am still laughing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob806 Posted October 1, 2009 Report Share Posted October 1, 2009 Bestplayer52- Go away, & root for your Ratbirds. You are sorely uneducated on Art Modell & his dealings here in Cleveland. It took Steve Biscotti's $$ and Ozzie Newsome's brilliance to help your franchise turn around. Art Modell tried, but was in way over his head in managing a business. He was a meddling owner long before guys like Jerry Jones & Dan Snyder, and had to be in the limelight at all times while he was here (that's a big reason why he fired Paul Brown). Baltimore got the shaft from Irsay, then the shaft from the NFL when the NFL expanded into Carolina & Jacksonville. Art jumped all over the opportunity to get the Baltimore market, and his buddies in ownership welcomed it (with the exception of Rooney & Ralph Wilson). Art botched business in a football mad city/region- that is really hard to do. Those are the cliff notes...if you need more info, I suggest you read "False Start," "The Paul Brown Story, " and other books pertaining to the move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bestplayer52 Posted October 1, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 1, 2009 you drafted Tim Couch #1 Brady Quinn first round Winslow first round. passed on Rothelisberger passed on Adrian Peterson It is no one's fault you cannot draft. you passed on too many players and now are drafting linemen who don't have a QB, RB, or receivers and not to mention a marshmellow defense. Is this Modell's fault because he won a Super Bowl 10 years ago and is the dominant AFC team today? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrownsFan17 Posted October 1, 2009 Report Share Posted October 1, 2009 you drafted Tim Couch #1 Brady Quinn first round Winslow first round. passed on Rothelisberger passed on Adrian Peterson It is no one's fault you cannot draft. you passed on too many players and now are drafting linemen who don't have a QB, RB, or receivers and not to mention a marshmellow defense. Is this Modell's fault because he won a Super Bowl 10 years ago and is the dominant AFC team today? Let me simplify this: It is Modell fault because he moved the team. If the team was still here, we would still have Ozzie Newsome and thus all the brilliant draft choices and managerial decisions that have made your team good and brought you a SB. Really, what part of that don't you understand? It isn't rocket science. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bestplayer52 Posted October 1, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 1, 2009 Ozzie Newsome is irreplaceable? Is he the king? How do other teams turn it around and win Super Bowls without Ozzie? The Patriots never employed Ozzie. The Steelers never did The AZ Cardinals didn't and they turned it around quickly Did the Colts have Ozzie? no. They have been steller for 10 plus years. How about Miami? The Jets? Are they crying about ten years ago? Only the Browns cry and whine and bellyache. TEAMS TURN IT AROUND AND WIN. They become competitive not complacent and certainly not blubbering 8th graders who stomp their feet and have to stand in the corner because they can't figure out how to put a jigsaw puzzle together. The Ravens have accomplished more since 2000 than your cub scout troop who gets embarrassed every weekend. But hey - blame Modell for your shortcomings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smalls1129 Posted October 1, 2009 Report Share Posted October 1, 2009 Seriously get the fck out of here. I love how you're basing your hole argument on the premise of how an expansion team drafted. You know, one that was started from scratch you fck tard. I am sure had the BROWNS not become some fcked up image of a Poe poem they would have still drafted from an expansion standpoint. You my enemy for life are an azzhole and need to get off OUR board. B/C not only are you not one of us...but you don't even deserve the respect of a rival fan b/c you're an ignorant piece of sht who is just trying to knock the hornet nest over. I would love to see you even try this disrespectful drivel to any Browns fan face to face...not necessarily saying I would kick your ass but I guarantee you don't have the balls that would in turn be shoved down your throat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bestplayer52 Posted October 1, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 1, 2009 well 4-0 sounds a lot better than 0-4. No arguing with those stats. Leave Modell alone or else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrownsFan17 Posted October 1, 2009 Report Share Posted October 1, 2009 Ozzie Newsome is irreplaceable? Is he the king? How do other teams turn it around and win Super Bowls without Ozzie? The Patriots never employed Ozzie. The Steelers never did The AZ Cardinals didn't and they turned it around quickly Did the Colts have Ozzie? no. They have been steller for 10 plus years. How about Miami? The Jets? Are they crying about ten years ago? Only the Browns cry and whine and bellyache. TEAMS TURN IT AROUND AND WIN. They become competitive not complacent and certainly not blubbering 8th graders who stomp their feet and have to stand in the corner because they can't figure out how to put a jigsaw puzzle together. The Ravens have accomplished more since 2000 than your cub scout troop who gets embarrassed every weekend. But hey - blame Modell for your shortcomings. Correct me if I am wrong but isn't this thread about how Modell screwed the Browns. Not how all of the other franchises like the Pats, Steelers, Colts have become successful. However, if you need me to explain that to you, I will certainly do so. In simple terms, of course, so you can follow along. This, by the way, is neither crying nor bellyaching ... it is stating simple facts. Modell screwed us. Lucky for you, he sold the team before he could screw you too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smalls1129 Posted October 1, 2009 Report Share Posted October 1, 2009 well 4-0 sounds a lot better than 0-4. No arguing with those stats. Leave Modell alone or else. Dumbass, you brought it up...put away your bong and go home; you don't belong here nor are you welcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vegasdogg Posted October 1, 2009 Report Share Posted October 1, 2009 So we casn delete mz the pussy but we can't delete this assclown? Hey look, I am here a lot - give me the God Gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrownieBornNRaised Posted October 1, 2009 Report Share Posted October 1, 2009 well 4-0 sounds a lot better than 0-4. No arguing with those stats. Leave Modell alone or else. What the hell does modell even have to do with this.... ohhhh wait thats right... nothing. He was such a horrible business man. That in order to stay in the positive he had to sell his soul and move a then proud and historic franchise to a dirty, broken down city that the NFL didnt want anything to do with. (thus Carolina and Jacksonville) And again showing his "brilliance" as a business man had to sell the ownership of his team because he again lost money.... how that happened in the first place beats me seeing that even in the "old sub par" Cleveland Municipal Stadium the old browns sold out every game... Art Modell is a rat, and a horrible excuse for a human being will rot in hell for what he did!!!! And mark my words when and i said WHEN our day comes our wins will be so much sweeter cause our team is pure we didnt have to steal our franchise the NFL actually likes Cleveland Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemosley01 Posted October 1, 2009 Report Share Posted October 1, 2009 So we casn delete mz the pussy but we can't delete this assclown? Hey look, I am here a lot - give me the God Gun. Of course not, DD. He hasn't stepped over some invisible line that is randomly 'enforced' by Stan. Since bestplayer52 has ignored my question twice, I'm going to figure he just threw that out there as random spew, and hasn't a clue what he is talking about. Probably heard the adults talking and wanted to play pretend. (isn't this the guy that came on here the other night writing a lot like G H O O L I E?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemosley01 Posted October 1, 2009 Report Share Posted October 1, 2009 Easy fella, you're getting close to criticizing how the board is run, and THAT will get you into hot water with stan. You can say anything you want on this board, but don't you DARE every question the way the board is run or the way rules are enforced, because that is the one rule that cannot be broken. It's quite silly really....whoops....oh shit....I'm probably gonna get a 2 day ban for that line...oh well.... Uhoh. Natives are getting restless again. Of course, the pot has yet again been stirred, but that will be conveniently ignored. Or deleted. But you and I know the truth! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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