mopaji Posted December 24, 2009 Report Share Posted December 24, 2009 Like everybody else I am excited about the hire. But once I step back and look at it, its kind of scary. It seems like Lerner paid a king's ransom to a guy who really doesn't have a good draft history or an excellent overall win/loss record as a coach. It also seems like nobody else in the league thought he was worth all of that money and Lerner got his tunnel vision again and didn't interview anybody else for the job. He put all of his eggs in one basket and the basket has a few loose threads that kind of concern me. Maybe Lerner fell in love with the name and in his usual "I'm not sure how to do this" fashion, and he made an uninformed decision. Anybody who has read my posts should know that I'm not a cynical Brown's fan by any means. I reckon I'm pretty reasonable in fact. But this hire seems a little fishy to me. Who gets a 10 year $50 million dollar deal to work in an office? And if he is expected to get involved in the on-the-filed product more, then, is he really that qualified? Its not like its Jeff Fischer or Bellichek here. Its a guy who had Brett Favre in his prime and some really good targets to throw to. Also, I don't think he even put that roster together in Green Bay. Then, he did a mediocre job in Seattle who played in the worst division in football. And his successful years came with Shaun Alexander. I'm not sure if you guys remember him but he was an absolute monster in his day. Mr. Primetime right? How many 4 TD games did he have? Anyways, I'll give it to him he did put a pretty nice defense together there. But when the wheels starting coming off, how did he adjust? Not so well actually as he managed only to muster up a few mediocre seasons there at the end. And he was in complete control of what was put on the field on Sundays. When he left, the team was in pretty bad shape so its not like he restructured for year or two and set up for the future. All of these things concern me. At first I was like everybody else, I fell in love with the big name but now I have had time to step back and evaluate a little bit more and there are some causes for concern. But then again, he may be all he is billed to be and actually stabilize this franchise. I do feel better about him being in charge instead of Lerner, that guy is completely unqualified to run a football team. Regardless, we'll know what we have really soon. As soon as he starts making decisions, we'll know what his vision is and what he wants to do with this franchise. Then, we will either start crafting a statue in his honor, or begin digging a grave for the Browns to sleep in for another 10 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Speedyd900rr Posted December 24, 2009 Report Share Posted December 24, 2009 talk about a buzz kill lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keylime Posted December 24, 2009 Report Share Posted December 24, 2009 actually I think Seattle drafted a lot better under Holmgren than they did under Ruskell. Holmgren's problem was handling the draft and coaching at the same time, not necessarily recognizing guys who were good and fit his system. I mean, he couldn't have been that bad of a GM considering how good Seattle was under Mike when they hit their peak, going to a super bowl and all under Hasselbeck, Alexander, and a very good young defense in 2005. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gips Posted December 24, 2009 Report Share Posted December 24, 2009 I really love holmgren as a coach 17 years experience and a winner ,he understands fans and is a solid PR guy and thats something this organization needs ,however when we start talking GM/personnel department other than QBs he isnt that accomplished ,but as the president it will be more important that he puts the right GM/personnel in place that are very good at drafting and overseeing personnel in general ,along with the ability to choose a capable coach that shares the vision that holmgren and his GM share and i think the walrus really qualifies here and imho thats where its going to count the most for him to be successful.. He will have a lot of hard choices to make but bob lamonte has a full stable of capable people and holmgren has the football knowledge and experience to know what he wants and needs to do in order to turn things around ,i think he will do just fine as long as he gets good draft/personnel people and doesnt butt into that process to much.. Im assuming of course that holmgren will let his GM hire/fire the coaches and stuff as well ,with the GM merely needing to obtain his approval to finalize decisions ,mangini will likely be a special case handled directly by holmgren to assure the new regime gets off on the right foot... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DawgTracker Posted December 25, 2009 Report Share Posted December 25, 2009 I have doubts about Homgren myself. If he is a micromanager this will not work. If he is willing to let the coach and gm do their jobs they could build a formidable team. I think that he should be the tie breaker between the coach and GM. I would not necessarily give the GM full control of the roster. If the coach and gm cannot reach agreement then they meet with Holmgren. Holmgren is a smart guy and smart people like to be surrounded by other smart people. IT probably increases the chance of getting a good GM. Holmgren knows a lot of people and has info on many others who haven't been GMs yet. If Holmgren hired someone with great upside who was a little inexperienced it wouldn't be a problem. I would expect Holmgren will evaluate every step of the talent evaluation process as a start. He can certainly attend practices to get a feel for the coaching staff along with the last three games. We will probably not have a GM until the contract year ends for current GMs and their employees. Let's hope that the current talent evaluation process is very, very good so that the scouting can be relied upon for a great draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterbell Posted December 25, 2009 Report Share Posted December 25, 2009 I think it could be a dynomite combination..Mangini and Holmgren ..what Shall we call this Holmgini...Mangren.. Holman..Manhol..lol..I think Holmgini Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beefjerky Posted December 25, 2009 Report Share Posted December 25, 2009 I like Holmgini, to the OP I had similar concerns, I actually posted about the same thing, so I hope things work out and that Mangini is kept. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alendor Posted December 25, 2009 Report Share Posted December 25, 2009 this si the first time we have someone with expierience on the team. regardless of how good he is at his job, it is a definite upgrade Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steel88 Posted December 25, 2009 Report Share Posted December 25, 2009 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballpeen Posted December 25, 2009 Report Share Posted December 25, 2009 Like everybody else I am excited about the hire. But once I step back and look at it, its kind of scary. It seems like Lerner paid a king's ransom to a guy who really doesn't have a good draft history or an excellent overall win/loss record as a coach. It also seems like nobody else in the league thought he was worth all of that money and Lerner got his tunnel vision again and didn't interview anybody else for the job. He put all of his eggs in one basket and the basket has a few loose threads that kind of concern me. Maybe Lerner fell in love with the name and in his usual "I'm not sure how to do this" fashion, and he made an uninformed decision. Scary?? Here is the bottom line. Holmgren has a good track record of turning teams around, and in the end, who else would YOU have hired that would be less 'scary"?? Nothing is guaranteed he will be the magic pill....but he is less scary than nearly anyone else I can think of who was available. I appreciate the message board banter, but I think you are just trying to sensationalize. The hire was as good as could be hoped....again..rather than sit there and just question Holmgrens credentials, why not give us some examples of people who would have put you more at ease?? And get off this office worker kick....it makes you sound foolish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lodilobo Posted December 25, 2009 Report Share Posted December 25, 2009 Like everybody else I am excited about the hire. But once I step back and look at it, its kind of scary. It seems like Lerner paid a king's ransom to a guy who really doesn't have a good draft history or an excellent overall win/loss record as a coach. It also seems like nobody else in the league thought he was worth all of that money and Lerner got his tunnel vision again and didn't interview anybody else for the job. He put all of his eggs in one basket and the basket has a few loose threads that kind of concern me. Maybe Lerner fell in love with the name and in his usual "I'm not sure how to do this" fashion, and he made an uninformed decision. Anybody who has read my posts should know that I'm not a cynical Brown's fan by any means. I reckon I'm pretty reasonable in fact. But this hire seems a little fishy to me. Who gets a 10 year $50 million dollar deal to work in an office? And if he is expected to get involved in the on-the-filed product more, then, is he really that qualified? Its not like its Jeff Fischer or Bellichek here. Its a guy who had Brett Favre in his prime and some really good targets to throw to. Also, I don't think he even put that roster together in Green Bay. Then, he did a mediocre job in Seattle who played in the worst division in football. And his successful years came with Shaun Alexander. I'm not sure if you guys remember him but he was an absolute monster in his day. Mr. Primetime right? How many 4 TD games did he have? Anyways, I'll give it to him he did put a pretty nice defense together there. But when the wheels starting coming off, how did he adjust? Not so well actually as he managed only to muster up a few mediocre seasons there at the end. And he was in complete control of what was put on the field on Sundays. When he left, the team was in pretty bad shape so its not like he restructured for year or two and set up for the future. All of these things concern me. At first I was like everybody else, I fell in love with the big name but now I have had time to step back and evaluate a little bit more and there are some causes for concern. But then again, he may be all he is billed to be and actually stabilize this franchise. I do feel better about him being in charge instead of Lerner, that guy is completely unqualified to run a football team. Regardless, we'll know what we have really soon. As soon as he starts making decisions, we'll know what his vision is and what he wants to do with this franchise. Then, we will either start crafting a statue in his honor, or begin digging a grave for the Browns to sleep in for another 10 years. A lot of us have the same concerns, but maybe we're just over analyzing the situation due to our dark history of hiring "can't miss people". Holmgren is probably not perfect, but what would be a better alternative?.......really? lerner hired the best guy he could find to do the difficult job of bringing this team back to respectability. At this point, I think the best approach is to not even question Holmgren's tactics as he puts his experience to work, to build a winning team. However....most of us don't have a lot of patience, and we will be bitching if this time next year we are not making a playoff run. If we are looking at another 4- 12 season in 2011....well, then I'll be starting to question Holmgren. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chip Banks Posted December 25, 2009 Report Share Posted December 25, 2009 Who else would YOU have hired that would be less 'scary"?? Ozzie Newsome. Art is now out of the picture in Baltimore, so Ozzie has no loyalty ties. Lerner could have given him an ownership interest in the franchise, like his father did with Policy. Everyone would understand Ozzie jumping ship for that opportunity. We'd have the guy that it has been proven runs the show in Baltimore and knows how to draft 3-4 defensive talent like no other. Not bad in identifying running backs either. We'd have a local legend with instant credibility locally and nationally -- at least equal to Holmgren. So what that we'd have to wait until years end and too late for this draft class for Lerner to make a pitch. I'd give compensatory picks to have Ozzie, who is a proven guy in the position and just seems to be a better fit football philosophy-wise. What's done is done, though. All hail Holmgren! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Earl34 Posted December 25, 2009 Report Share Posted December 25, 2009 I don't really have the concern that Holmgren will be horrible. It's all about how much he takes on himself and what kind of people he surrounds himself. The question of whether he keeps Mangini or not is first on everyone's mind and I am interested to see it. If he keeps Mangini what does that say to you (the fan) about Holmgren and what does it say about Mangini. Obviously, these two have talked or will talk about the direction of the team. If he keeps Mangini, it says to me that these two found enough common ground (when everyone was about to bury the idea because they can't connect the coaching dots) and that speaks highly of both of them. I think it's a steadier course for a team that has been in flux for ten years. If he rids himself of Mangini, then I'm not sure that you can draw as much conclusion out of it because it could be that he wants to clean house just to do so. It could be that they disagreed. There are more variables in that instance. I would worry about bringing in a new coach as it would be the third coach in three years. Then again, I don't get paid to make those decisions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CLEVELandMILIDH Posted December 28, 2009 Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 Holmgren will meet the Cleveland media on Monday Posted by Mike Florio on December 27, 2009 5:58 PM ET Though Mike Holmgren won't officially arrive in Cleveland and take the reins of the Browns until January 4, the team has announced that he'll be available in the team's press room via conference call on Monday at 5:00 p.m. Expect questions to center on whether Holmgren will keep coach Eric Mangini, and whether Holmgren will hire a new General Manager. With the Browns winning their third straight game, there's a chance that Holmgren will declare that Mangini will be back for 2010. As to the G.M. issue, Holmgren is expected to hire one, and the candidates include (per Glazer and ESPN) Randy Mueller of the Chargers, John Schneider of the Packers, and Tom Heckert of the Eagles. (All three also are candidates for the Seahawks G.M. job.) Per ESPN, another candidate is Seahawks director of pro personnel Will Lewis. It will be interesting if Holmgren comments on Mangini's job status going forward. Im hoping he comes out and says Mangini is his guy and put all speculation to rest, but more likely he'll say he will evaluate it in the coming weeks. My personal opinion is getting rid of mangini is a huge mistake, that will set this franchise back atleast 3 more years. Thats not an outcome im willing to settle for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrownIndian Posted December 28, 2009 Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 I dont see him getting rid of EM. Another win against Jaguars will seal EM place for next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DwgPoundMobster Posted December 28, 2009 Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 this si the first time we have someone with expierience on the team. regardless of how good he is at his job, it is a definite upgrade This. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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