JoeSixPat Posted December 28, 2009 Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 I'm not sure if the Orange & Brown Report is considered credible around here but they certainly didn't pull any punches when calling on Holmgren to objectively assess Mangini even in the light of wins against Powerhouse NFL teams like the Chiefs, Raiders and Bills http://cle.scout.com/2/932642.html It is somewhat interesting that Rob Ryan got the Gatorade bath on Sunday and not Mangini... and that for the second game in a row Randy Lerner was no where to be found in the vacinity of the stadium. Makes you wonder whether he knows something we don't. Passan: A Memo to Mike -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Rich Passan theOBR.com Dec 28, 2009 How should Holmgren see the Browns: As a team on a three-game tear, or as a 1-11 disaster? Rich Passan has his take on things, and it doesn't involve fashionable bandwagon jumping. Memo to Mike Holmgren: First of all, welcome to Cleveland, where the best fans in the National Football League reside despite what you might have heard elsewhere. Yes, even in Seattle where the famed 12th man (self proclaimed, of course) resides. You are about find out where the real 12th man lives. Now then, let’s get to the task at hand. That, of course, would be your newest challenge since you accepted Randy Lerner’s invitation to move back to the Midwest. You no doubt noticed the Browns now own a three-game winning streak after losing 11 of their first 12 games. Considering that start, many fans are beyond thrilled with all this winning. You see they’re not used to much of it since the team returned in 1999. So you really can’t blame them for feeling more than a little giddy today after beating the Oakland Raiders soundly Sunday afternoon. Don’t be fooled, Mike. This is not a good football team. Far from it, in fact. Yeah, that probably sounds dumb in the face of a three-game winning streak. That requires an explanation. You’ve probably been watching the team the last few weeks since you made up your mind Cleveland would be your next stop. And you’ve noticed the club is winning despite a rash of injuries that has crippled both sides of the football. Normally, the head coach would be in line for many of the plaudits for such a streak. But when that coach is the same guy who guided them to a 1-11 start, one has to wonder. A large number of Eric Mangini fans will argue that the club is playing its best football of the season and relatively speaking, they would not be incorrect. How can you argue winning three games in a row? A lot of people are beginning to jump on the Mangini bandwagon now. Many of them had hopped off midway through the season. But again, everything is relative, Mike. Granted one of those victories was against the hated Pittsburgh Steelers. Points for Mangini. But it doesn’t take much to beat the Kansas City Chiefs and Oakland Raiders these days. So please take the following into consideration when going through the thought processes regarding who will coach this club next season. Right now, the players are not playing for the head coach, although they seemed to play for defensive coordinator Rob Ryan Sunday. Did you notice Ryan received a Gatorade shower following the Raiders victory? Probably because he coached the Oakland defense the last five seasons before arriving in Cleveland. Even so, few coordinators are accorded such an honor. These guys, for the most part, are playing for themselves. The pride factor kicked in after game 12. Enough was enough, they seemed to be saying with their body language the last three games. It’s more than a coincidence that the Browns are winning with starters Jamal Lewis, D’Qwell Jackson, Eric Barton, Brodney Pool, Shaun Rogers, Steve Heiden and Brady Quinn and significant contributors C.J. Mosley and Ryan Tucker on IR. This team is winning with sizable contributions from the likes of Jerome Harrison, Brian Robiskie, Ahtyba Rubin, Jason Trusnik, Mike Adams, Evan Moore, Corey Williams, Marcus Benard and Matt Roth (the one terrific waiver pickup by Mangini). These guys did not factor heavily in the team’s plans as recently as a month ago, except maybe for Rubin, who had been solid as Rogers’ backup before the big guy went down. Harrison grabbed a lot of bench – and a few stunning trips to the inactive roster on game day – before Lewis was finally shut down a few weeks ago. Good thing or else Harrison might not have been given the opportunity to rip off 434 yards the last two weeks So the big question becomes: If the Browns can win three straight games with a starting lineup filled with journeymen supposedly not good enough to be in that lineup, how did they lose 11 of their first 12 games with a healthier and supposedly more talented club? And: Why did Mangini and his offensive coaches stick with Lewis at running back when it was more than obvious the veteran was ineffective and bogged down the running game? Conspiracy theorists would suggest it was all part of Mangini’s grand plan to save his job by playing a well rested Harrison. You certainly have to wonder, Mike, when you sit down and begin to evaluate Mangini, why were the Browns the laughingstock of the NFL in the first three months? Could they have possibly been badly mismanaged? Rhetorical question. Sometimes, coaches – and quarterbacks – get too much credit for winning and too much blame for losing. But when analyzing Mangini’s entire body of work in Cleveland, do not lose sight of the fact that, while he’s not a player’s coach like his predecessor, his totalitarian tendencies rubbed many players the wrong way. Don’t let this strong finish deceive you. I’d like to think you’re wise enough to see the roster you are about to inherit is pock marked with a lot of holes. And the talent quotient needs more than just a tweaking. Think overhaul. But most of all, remember that the man responsible for putting this team together is the same man taking credit for winning the last three games. And the same man accountable for the first 12 games. He is not a better coach now than he was on Sept. 13 against the Minnesota Vikings. Sure, it’s going to look strange to let go of a coach who wins his last four games if he can beat Jacksonville next Sunday. In fact, he might even become a sympathetic figure if that’s what you ultimately decide to do. You have said it would not be fair to fire a coach after only his first season. Fair or not, you’ve got to hold firm because that’s exactly what needs to be done if this franchise is to awaken from its deep slumber under your stewardship and finally reward the fans with the kind of team it deserves. 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Alo Posted December 28, 2009 Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 Rich Passan is a columnist on the site, not an "insider" who's in the locker room talking to the players. For a more positive take on Mangini, check out the podcast from last week's OBR Radio show. I value Lane Adkins' and John Taylor's takes on Mangini much more than Passan's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dj_illness Posted December 28, 2009 Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 But it doesn’t take much to beat the Kansas City Chiefs and Oakland Raiders these days. tell that to Pitt, Cincy, Philly and the other teams Oakland beat. These guys, for the most part, are playing for themselves. The pride factor kicked in after game 12 really? cuz i DON'T remember seeing this last year. All i remember is dropping serveral games in a row where we had the lead late then lost the game. Funny how the pride factor is now a negative thing. So the big question becomes: If the Browns can win three straight games with a starting lineup filled with journeymen supposedly not good enough to be in that lineup, how did they lose 11 of their first 12 games with a healthier and supposedly more talented club? answer: maybe we really were focusing on fundamentals (tackling, penalities, etc) rather than biting off we could chew with schemes, etc we weren't ready for yet. (and J Lewis is talented, but WAY over the hill). Has anybody else ever seen hard work overcome talent? I have. I’d like to think you’re wise enough to see the roster you are about to inherit is pock marked with a lot of holes. And the talent quotient needs more than just a tweaking. Think overhaul. That's been done, you media douchebag. Go look at the guys mangini cut. Where are they playing now? More and more, I am amazed at the stupidity of the media when it comes to Mangini. Seriously, some of ya'll around here need to be writing/putting out better stuff than these douches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombo Posted December 28, 2009 Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 even in the light of wins against Powerhouse NFL teams like the Chiefs, Raiders and Bills Whoops ... you forgot the defending world Champion Pittsburgh Steelers. You wouldn't have an agenda would you? Mangini took a 4-12 team, purged the roster, dropped some big names, stashed some draft picks and has the team a half-game ahead of last year's more talented, but softer, team with wins over four different AFC opponents. Were you expecting a one-year miracle? We weren't. By the way, it took Belichick his second season to get his first three game winning streak. But don't fret, not everyone can be a Mangenius. Zombo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gips Posted December 28, 2009 Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 I could care less either way rather holmgren keeps or fires mangini ,there is a good case for keeping him and a good case for firing him and in the end only holmgren and or his GM plus lerner get the honors of deciding ,common logic and a little research on holmgren would say he cleans house and builds the browns new regime with bob lamonte's people ,but as a successful coach of 17 years he has somewhat of a soft spot for coaches and understands what mangini is trying to do ,honestly i dont see the genie fitting into the new scheme of things mostly due to his poor way of handling the most important offensive players on the field...the QBs and WRs i see a big gap here that may not be able to be bridged not to mention 2 totally different prospectives on team buildiing in general ,and i cant really see holmgren seeing things mangini's way at all but stranger things have happened...lets just hope whatever the new regime decides its for the benefit and advancement of the organization in the longhaul... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonedawg Posted December 28, 2009 Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 Passan can eat a d!ck. OBR is nothing more than a glorified blog. I would hardly call him part of the "media." He is just some dude who gets paid $10 bucks a pop to put out crap articles like this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieHardBrownsFan Posted December 28, 2009 Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 I'm not sure if the Orange & Brown Report is considered credible around here but they certainly didn't pull any punches when calling on Holmgren to objectively assess Mangini even in the light of wins against Powerhouse NFL teams like the Chiefs, Raiders and Bills http://cle.scout.com/2/932642.html It is somewhat interesting that Rob Ryan got the Gatorade bath on Sunday and not Mangini... and that for the second game in a row Randy Lerner was no where to be found in the vacinity of the stadium. Makes you wonder whether he knows something we don't. I'll bet Mangenious has a restraining order against you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solon16 Posted December 28, 2009 Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 what an idiot....ryan got the bath cause he coached last year....no biggie at all.... as far as the backups winning....Em's scheme and system on both sides are brand new and complex....they are finally getting it...this guys ' grasping bad! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cambridgeho Posted December 28, 2009 Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 Its so comical to see the media trying to rip the guys for playing for they're future paychecks. Isn't that what they are supposed to do. In a matter of 6 weeks the team as a whole looks like a Pro team for once, yes we have a lot of work to do but we are playing better. If we beat the jags Sunday they will make up some other excuse because we won. Who ever is calling to get Mangini fired, you have to be smoking crack. This time last year the team gave up. With a new coach we will have a new system and then another year to get it going properly and when next years team goes 4-12 you will be talking the same shit. Mangini wasn't my first choice as the coach last year, but he has shown me that with time and a bunch of good players "not quitters" they will come through on top. Also MIKE FLORIO NEEDS TO SHUT THE xxxx UP, EVERYTHING HE WRITES IS TRASH AND HE ALWAYS DOWNS THE BROWNS NO MATTER WHAT!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rich4eagle Posted December 28, 2009 Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 what an idiot....ryan got the bath cause he coached last year....no biggie at all.... as far as the backups winning....Em's scheme and system on both sides are brand new and complex....they are finally getting it...this guys ' grasping bad! hang tuff............man.........when a team like INDY LOSES ON PURPOSE to keep the Steelers from getting to the playoffs............... we need to name the league the NCPFL............National Cream Puff Football League Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATENEARS Posted December 28, 2009 Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 hang tuff............man.........when a team like INDY LOSES ON PURPOSE to keep the Steelers from getting to the playoffs............... we need to name the league the NCPFL............National Cream Puff Football League Don't forget that they did it to us in 2007 as well, and we sat home with a 10-6 record. The steelers don't deserve to make it this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrownIndian Posted December 28, 2009 Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 hang tuff............man.........when a team like INDY LOSES ON PURPOSE to keep the Steelers from getting to the playoffs............... we need to name the league the NCPFL............National Cream Puff Football League Indy loses on purpose for the Steelers to be knocked out ? that sounds far fetched ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beefjerky Posted December 28, 2009 Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 OP is the worst poster on the site, I'm serious, in all my years of reading and posting on this site(I had a different username before the board wipe), I have never seen a worse poster than JoeSixPat. You're seriously annoying and have nothing better to do than to push your agenda about Mangini and find every little bad thing about him, while omitting all the positives, you're a big fat sack of crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeSixPat Posted December 28, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 I'll bet Mangenious has a restraining order against you. I have no idea who "Mangenious" is. Would that be someone who thinks they are a "genius" but is too stupid to even spell the word right? But beyond that, don't blame the messenger. I'd think the folks at the Orange and Brown Report might tend to be a bit knowledgable about the Browns is all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieHardBrownsFan Posted December 28, 2009 Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 I have no idea who "Mangenious" is. Would that be someone who thinks they are a "genius" but is too stupid to even spell the word right? But beyond that, don't blame the messenger. I'd think the folks at the Orange and Brown Report might tend to be a bit knowledgable about the Browns is all. Don't get so upset. Take your meds and take a nap. Dream of Mangini. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeSixPat Posted December 28, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 Don't get so upset. Take your meds and take a nap. Dream of Mangini. OK - but who is this "Mangenious" you keep mentioning? Surely you're smart enough to spell "genius" correctly... and can see the hilarious irony of those who use the term but cannot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DawgTracker Posted December 28, 2009 Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 If I were a steeler fan I wouldn't want Mangini coaching the browns either Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Italian DawgPound Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Mangini took a 4-12 team, purged the roster, dropped some big names, stashed some draft picks and has the team a half-game ahead of last year's more talented, but softer, team with wins over four different AFC opponents. ...and gave us the first win against the Steelers in a few years. Which we all appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlin Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 We are a less talented team because of Mangini. His starters are worse than waiver pick-ups and backups. That speaks to his awful talent evaluation abilities. Holmgren`s coach is going to have to be able to add input. Mangini does not know how to operate in a concensus-like fashion. He`s gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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