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Gordon has to be untouchable, he's too good of a football player to just trade away.

dab7291993

By dab7291993
in THE BROWNS BOARD

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dab7291993 Newbie

dab7291993

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I understand that. The problem is his actions hurt the team this year. As far as i am concerned we lost those two games because of him.

 

I don't think he tries to be a screw up. It just happens. Hangs with the boy's, forgets what he is doing, smokes a little of this or that.

 

If the guy didn't have a history, no way I'd trade him. He is a super player. Based on his previous actions, I don't want to gamble on him. Face it, if he screws up again it is a year off. We will simply cut him. I would rather some other team have to face that reality.

And we get a fourth rounder and a hole at WR which is unlikely to be filled? No, taking risks is something you have to do in the NFL.

 

Look at Honey Badger ballin', look at Vontaze Burfict as a productive player on a playoff caliber team(on pace for 150 tackles), look at all the NFL players who succeeded because a team stuck with him.

 

Gordon needs our faith in him as much as we need his talent.

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jcam222 Enthusiast

jcam222

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HA!

 

good one. no man those days are long gone.

 

i only did that crap back in the day so it would keep me awake so i could drink more. now i don't need that waste of money. got a great tolerance for booze. must be the excellent diet i'm on.

 

booze.

Been there, done that and paid the $28K rehab bill lol. Mik I would agree that someone who smokes a little weed from time to time doesn't qualify as an addict. It really isn't even as much what they do as opposed to the results of what they do.I'd say its safe to assume that somewhere between the weed and the codeine Josh has seen a few other substances as well. Someone with a golden ticket like Josh that fails multiple tests in college, multiple tests in the NFL and is risking his income and quality of life for it.......thats a different story. Anyone who takes those kind of risks over and over despite the fact they risk losing millions of dollars isnt just stupid. It is close to impossible to be that stupid. He simply is out of control.

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TopDawg31 Newbie

TopDawg31

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So he's an addict cuz he smokes cannabis? Some people need a reality check. Alcohol is far more dangerous...

I would bet that almost half the league smokes weed occasionally. They are just smart enough to not get caught.

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PoeticG Explorer

PoeticG

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It's probably still against league policy.

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slowburn Newbie

slowburn

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I think it's going to be tough for any FO to offer fair market value for Gordon with his baggage. His positive piss tests and other travails are just the tip of the iceberg in a substance abusing lifestyle. I hope he is able to keep his shit in one sock but the odds are against him. The Browns will be his home for the long or short term. He has the skills to help the Browns win games but the real struggle for him will be off the field.

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jcam222 Enthusiast

jcam222

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So he's an addict cuz he smokes cannabis? Some people need a reality check. Alcohol is far more dangerous...

 

Try reading my post. I think its pretty clear i understand smoking weed once and awhile isn't indicative of being an addict. As I said its not as much what you do its what the results. If you ate nuts and they put you in the hospital with a severe allergic reaction it can happen. If you did it several more times despite knowing the risk you likely have some friggin issues.

 

Not being able to follow the rules as it relates to cannabis and risking million dollar salaries YES that would indicate addictive behavior or pure stupidity you choose. I will take a wild guess that maybe you enjoy it occasionally (just a guess not an indictment). If I am right could you refrain from it in order to protect a million dollars?

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ballpeen Mentor

ballpeen

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'Peen- I understand your concern- but we have to roll the dice on this guy. Right now, he's our only legit offensive threat. As others have said we wouldn't get fair value in a trade on top of it. You think the Broncos should trade Von Miller because he has drug issues?

I don't give a shit about the Broncos, they can do what they want....I only care about the Browns.

 

 

I am not saying i know the right course. All I am saying is i would ship him for the right offer.

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jcam222 Enthusiast

jcam222

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Wasn't he suspended for not officially going through the NFL, notifying them of his prescription for medicine with codeine in it?

 

He failed drug tests TWICE last year. The first is not made public and carries a warning and some counseling. The second is a four game suspension. Because he did have a doctors prescription it was reduced to two games. If he had reported the prescription to the league when it was given he would have been clear.

 

It is also safe to assume the doc was a "friend" of Josh's. Unless its just me I have actually had strep about 7 times and have never been prescribed codeine cough syrup.

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jcam222 Enthusiast

jcam222

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I don't give a shit about the Broncos, they can do what they want....I only care about the Browns.

 

 

I am not saying i know the right course. All I am saying is i would ship him for the right offer.

I totally get the concern. Hell there is a high probability he will be an issue. We will never however get anywhere near his talent value in trade. He is a first round talent. I think you have to roll the dice

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dab7291993 Newbie

dab7291993

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He failed drug tests TWICE last year. The first is not made public and carries a warning and some counseling. The second is a four game suspension. Because he did have a doctors prescription it was reduced to two games. If he had reported the prescription to the league when it was given he would have been clear.

 

It is also safe to assume the doc was a "friend" of Josh's. Unless its just me I have actually had strep about 7 times and have never been prescribed codeine cough syrup.

He said it was medicine with codeine in it.

 

Let's not act like Josh Gordon is getting DUI's and fighting in night clubs.

 

If he doesn't learn, we cut him loose..and if he does..we have a possible Top 10 WR in the league.

 

I take that risk 10 out of 10 times if that's my reward.

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JAFBF Mentor

JAFBF

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He failed drug tests TWICE last year. The first is not made public and carries a warning and some counseling. The second is a four game suspension. Because he did have a doctors prescription it was reduced to two games. If he had reported the prescription to the league when it was given he would have been clear.

 

It is also safe to assume the doc was a "friend" of Josh's. Unless its just me I have actually had strep about 7 times and have never been prescribed codeine cough syrup.

 

I'm pretty sure the failed tests were while he was still under College rules and not an NFLer yet, otherwise he'd have been out some games like Haden was.

 

I've had Codeine Cough syrup prescribed a few times for a cough, probably more of a Doctors' preference in how they treat or how bad it (cough) is.

 

 

This last issue doesn't concern me as bad since the NFL actually reduced the penalty, but Josh not reporting or going through the proper channels is more of a concern.

Of course he was a Rookie and came in late (Supplemental Draft), so he didn't get the Rookie orientation like the other Rookies.

 

Still, I can see concern, but there also seem to be circumstances.

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flyingfooldoug Newbie

flyingfooldoug

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He said it was medicine with codeine in it.

 

Let's not act like Josh Gordon is getting DUI's and fighting in night clubs.

 

If he doesn't learn, we cut him loose..and if he does..we have a possible Top 10 WR in the league.

 

I take that risk 10 out of 10 times if that's my reward.

Very good point. It's not like he has the "Thug" attitude. Hell, some teams stick with knife murderers!

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ballpeen Mentor

ballpeen

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I totally get the concern. Hell there is a high probability he will be an issue. We will never however get anywhere near his talent value in trade. He is a first round talent. I think you have to roll the dice

Maybe.......just some of my experience talking here.....most of my best trips to Vegas were when I was up several thousands and decided a show and dinner were best and I didn't throw dice.

 

 

I rolled out of town up 22k and 15k another because I refused to walk in to a casino with over a five hundred the pocket the last day. The point is if you can get lucky, you can get unlucky faster. I won't mention the times my 5k steak was gone real quick.

 

 

Just saying.

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sisky fringo Newbie

sisky fringo

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jcam222 is on the right track.

 

clinical definition of abuser vs addict:

 

you can do as much of whatever you want and as long as there are no problems in your life from it your qualified as an abuser.

 

if your substance use creates problems in your life--any problems--(late for work, lie to cover-up, puke on kid's math book, get dui, get violent and hurt peeps, slut it up and get disease etc etc etc) and it doesn't make you stop...your qualified as an addict.

 

everything is good until trouble. they say when those without addictive behavior run into trouble they are like "fuck this, i'm done!"

...whereas addicts just keep on rollin (see Von Miller).

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miktoxic Newbie

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Maybe.......just some of my experience talking here.....most of my best trips to Vegas were when I was up several thousands and decided a show and dinner were best and I didn't throw dice.

 

 

I rolled out of town up 22k and 15k another because I refused to walk in to a casino with over a five hundred the pocket the last day. The point is if you can get lucky, you can get unlucky faster. I won't mention the times my 5k steak was gone real quick.

 

 

Just saying.

 

and that sir is why i'm not joining you all at the tail gate this weekend. i know i'd piss away (literally) a grand at the bar(s) the night before and probably end up in east cleveland hanging on on some corner and getting shoved into a body bag before game time.

 

the cost of travel, the melee that would be a saturday afternoon into a saturday night into a sunday morning etc. strippers and hookers. i'd be lucky to afford to get a one way bus ticket back to NY.

 

i prob saved myself 3k, easy.

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sisky fringo Newbie

sisky fringo

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obviously i am a huge JG fan. been waiting on his return and he didn't disappoint.

 

dude makes putting up epic numbers look ridiculously easy. burns defenses like AD. gets open by 5 yards regularly.

 

if he fucks up i'll be devastated. he singlehandedly makes Greg Little viable.

 

without him it's their #1CB on our #2WR, their #2CB on our #3WR etc. it all starts w JG.

 

he is without a doubt the lynchpin.

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jcam222 Enthusiast

jcam222

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He said it was medicine with codeine in it.

 

Let's not act like Josh Gordon is getting DUI's and fighting in night clubs.

 

If he doesn't learn, we cut him loose..and if he does..we have a possible Top 10 WR in the league.

 

I take that risk 10 out of 10 times if that's my reward.

I am with you on taking the risk. I would keep him around for sure. Don't minimize his screwed up behavior though. He burned through two colleges because he couldn't follow the rules. he sat out a full year due to his issues. He DID fail two drug tests as a Cleveland Brown last year. The policy on rec drugs is essentially a warning with no suspension on the first fail and a four game suspension on the second. He was given a reduction to 2 games. Keep in mind the suspension policy is a bit different between rec and ped's.

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jcam222 Enthusiast

jcam222

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jcam222 is on the right track.

 

clinical definition of abuser vs addict:

 

you can do as much of whatever you want and as long as there are no problems in your life from it your qualified as an abuser.

 

if your substance use creates problems in your life--any problems--(late for work, lie to cover-up, puke on kid's math book, get dui, get violent and hurt peeps, slut it up and get disease etc etc etc) and it doesn't make you stop...your qualified as an addict.

 

everything is good until trouble. they say when those without addictive behavior run into trouble they are like "fuck this, i'm done!"

...whereas addicts just keep on rollin.

Thanks for explaining it quite a bit clearer than I was. You are right on the money. His suspensions in college and NFL clearly fall into the problems. Anyone that can't see that is simply in denial.

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slowburn Newbie

slowburn

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and that sir is why i'm not joining you all at the tail gate this weekend. i know i'd piss away (literally) a grand at the bar(s) the night before and probably end up in east cleveland hanging on on some corner and getting shoved into a body bag before game time.

 

the cost of travel, the melee that would be a saturday afternoon into a saturday night into a sunday morning etc. strippers and hookers. i'd be lucky to afford to get a one way bus ticket back to NY.

 

i prob saved myself 3k, easy.

You could get one of your buddies from the Browns Board to keep you in line.

 

Well, on second thought..........

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Tour2ma Contributor

Tour2ma

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It looks like we were the ones putting him out there, not the other way around.

 

Not what I heard... up to the point when we said we had an interested party.

 

It's basically what I told T2M in another thread- there are untouchables on any team- or this team- and not just Gordon. I would put Joe Thomas and Joe Haden in that category.

 

Rumor was the Donkeys dialed up the Browns about Thomas' availability after Clady went down for the year- and were told to take a backwards run down a ski jump in Breckenridge.

 

So now we can disagree in two threads... ;)

 

I like Josh. Love his potential, but he is not an untouchable IMO. Not saying give him away, but...

 

Ya gotta take the calls...

 

I think it's going to be tough for any FO to offer fair market value for Gordon with his baggage.

 

The baggage is part of the value determination...

 

I agree we won't get offerred what he showed Sunday he is worth if he plays.

 

It's a tough call... tougher than the TR decision by far...

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