Frantz Joseph & Lee Robinson

[Guest Aloysius]

Florida Atlantic ILB Frantz Joseph is wowing people at the Texas vs. The Nation practices.

 

Frantz Joseph(ILB-Florida Atlantic) - Joseph is flat out fun to watch. He plays with a natural violence that would fit in with players like Ray Lewis and Jack Lambert, and he’ll blow up running backs and offensive lineman with the same zest and effectiveness. He looked good against the pass today, using body position to cover faster RBs, and breaking well on the ball in flight and timing his breakups to avoid penalties.

That's really good to hear; I've liked this guy as a Day Two 3-4 ILB prospect ever since I saw him dominate the Motor City Bowl.

 

 

Here's a scouting report on Joseph:

 

Positives: Very physical at the line, throws his body into the hole. ... Gets very low in his ready stance. ... Will not win any track events, but seems to get to every play with good football speed. ... Attacks the line with great ferocity. ... Runs through the ballcarrier on tackles -- behind the line or after hustling to the sideline on quick screens. ... Swarms to the ball downfield, plays through the whistle. ... Possesses one of the most ferocious punches in the country; slams the pads of linemen when attacking the run. ... Can also slip through traffic to hit a back in the hole. ... Rarely gets knocked to the ground on cut blocks. ... Uses his hands to get off blocks near the line and at the second level from full-grown guards. ... Should be a fine special teams player due to his aggressiveness and sure tackling.

 

Negatives: A two-down player. ... Only adequate size and muscle development for an inside linebacker. ... Lacks great lateral speed to corral quick backs and receivers. ... Little coverage ability, although he can level a receiver coming into his zone. ... Not very fast in his drop and comes out of his stance too early, but he still manages to cover enough ground to stop middle routes short of the first down.

I think the size concerns were pretty much eliminated by his weighing in at 243 lbs. at Texas vs. The Nation.

 

Both scout and nfldraftscout have Joseph ranked higher than Worrell Williams and Jasper Brinkley, two other Day Two 3-4 ILB prospects. According to nfldraftscout, Joseph is expected to be drafted in the 5th Round.

[BrownsFan17]

Good stuff, Aloy. You are truly a wealth of draft prospect knowledge.

 

I would absolutely love to see us acquire some hard hitting/ferocious players. We will need them to compete in this division.

[JewDago]

if he isn't already, joseph definitely should be a guy on the radar. he's got instincts and a feel for the position. he looked great avoiding blockers and making his way to the RB, a definite plus, and he also looked good in coverage.

 

by comparison, i like brinkley mostly because of his size, not because anything on his highlight reels has particularly wowed me. brinkley is monstrously huge, but joseph looks like a better player, someone who will make more plays because he's instinctive. also, jospeh isn't small at 6-2, 243, he's just not the ridiculous frankenstein that brinkley is.

 

with bell on the roster, would it be a complete overkill to want to come out of the draft with both joseph and brinkley?

[Guest Aloysius]

Considering our other needs, I don't think we can use both of our Day Two picks on ILB's. If you really want depth, you can sign FA Pat Thomas and draft one of these guys.

 

Another guy who's emerging as an interesting Day Two 3-4 ILB prospect is Alcorn State's Lee Robinson. Like 99.9% of people, I've never actually seen him play, but he seems to have been the big winner of the Texas vs. The Nation practices:

 

Texas vs The Nation, Monday: Alcorn State linebacker Lee Robinson is all of 6-2, 249 and appears destined to be a 3-4 inside linebacker to use his strength and athleticism.

Texas vs. The Nation, Tuesday: Lee Robinson, a linebacker from Alcorn State, continues to impress with his athleticism. Even at 249 pounds, he has the ability to track running backs in the flat and get to receiver in short zones. He's a guy who looks like Tarzan -- and plays like him, too. Of this week's participants, Robinson should be one of the first players drafted.

Texas vs. the Nation, Wednesday: OLB Lee Robinson (Alcorn State, 6-2, 249): He could challenge [san Jose State CB Christopher] Owens as the top pick from this game because he's a physical specimen, and he can really play. Scouts value a guy like Robinson who can hold up a pulling guard in space but run with backs in coverage down the sideline.

[JewDago]

sounds like we have a lot of options at ILB, which is definitely a good thing. robinson sounds like he's got a world of potential but likely lacks some of the polish that joseph has. however, given that joseph's a bit of a developmental guy, too, how much would we sacrifice in going after robinson?

 

seeing as how these are guys trying to play their way into the draft, even if robinson is the week's big winner, there's no way he goes before the fourth. if he's there in the sixth, i say we trade next year's fifth to go after him, definitely an unpopular move around these parts, but i think a good one. it's a fifth-round pick, after all, and one late hole in a slate of draft picks won't kill a draft.

[Guest Aloysius]

There are still a lot of questions about Robinson. It still needs to be explained why a guy so physically gifted ends up at Alcorn State. Maybe he was really lanky come out of high school (like Aaron Curry, Clay Matthews, and Alex Hall), or it could be that he's just not very smart.

 

Both he & Joseph aren't immediate starter types, but I have to think that Robinson's more of a raw product, given the level of competition he faced in college.

 

And I agree that there's some interesting Day Two talent at ILB. The problem, as WPB mentioned in another thread, is that there's gap in the draft between the Round 1 guys (Curry, Maualuga) and everybody else. If we don't go ILB high, we better have brought in a FA that's capable of starting.

 

The most likely guy is Eric Barton, but I'm not sure we'd be too happy with him starting at SILB.

[JewDago]

this is where i think the fans really need to have patience with the team. it looks like next year's going to be a wash, anyway, even though we're not switching much on defense or offense. however, after the year we had this year, i think it's not unreasonable to expect something between 5-11 and 9-7 from this team, with 9-7 being an extreme scenario in which tons of things go in our favor.

 

a developmental guy who will learn on the job fits perfectly into that scenario. he'll have holes in his game, get taken advantage of and hit the rookie wall, but he'll do it in a season that's likely not going anywhere anyway.

 

there is a huge gap between the first rounders and the later guys, for sure. you either get someone who's ready to play right now or someone who really needs to be brought along and will either blossom or flop, likely depending on how well they fit the system they're being asked to play in.

 

that's why i think joseph may be the best later round option for us, then brinkley. robinson was 6-2, 218 coming out of high school and ran a 4.5. that's a fully grown prospect who's more or less already started to add college weight and is still blazing fast. however, he majored in animal science in college. this all says to me that this dude is not too bright and won't do well in a system where he has to think. he's leon williams in the sixth round instead of the third (or fourth - i'm not wasting time looking up where we drafted him).

 

joseph is more developed and, while he might not have the ceiling that robinson does, he doesn't have the floor, either.

[Guest Aloysius]

Here's another report from Sigmund Bloom, one of the Draft Guys:

 

Frantz Joseph is absolutely a 3rd or 4th rounder. I wouldn't be surprised to see him get in the first day. He's an excellent character kid, crazy hard worker, and he just has that natural violence you love to see in LB's. He was also much better in one on one and zone coverage than we expected. Like Curtis Lofton, everyone is writing him off as anything more than a 2 down LB, but at least he'll be a thumper for those two downs, and he's got a better shot than people think of hanging in pass coverage.

[Guest Aloysius]

FAU's Joseph shines as Nation beats Texas, 27-24

 

EL PASO, Texas (AP) -Florida Atlantic's Frantz Joseph returned an interception 26 yards and a fumble 32 yards to set up scores and the national team won the Texas vs. The Nation All-Star Game 27-24 on Saturday.

 

Texas trailed 20-17 after a 27-yard field goal from UTEP's Jose Martinez on the first play of the fourth quarter. But Joseph returned an interception to the Texas 31 on the next Texas possession. Purdue's Chris Painter then threw a 9-yard scoring pass to San Jose State's Yonus Davis for a 27-17 lead.

 

With 37,054 watching at the Sun Bowl, the Nation scored two touchdowns and a field goal off three Texas turnovers in the third annual game, which pits collegiate players with Texas ties against the rest of the U.S. and Canada.

 

Tulsa's David Johnson threw two touchdown passes for the Texas team.

 

Texas closed to 27-24 with 1:08 left on a 22-yard pass from Johnson to Northwestern (La.) State's Dudley Guice, but the Nation recovered the onside kick.

 

Joseph's fumble return helped give the Nation a 6-0 lead when UAB's Swayze Waters made the second of his two field goals on the first play of the second quarter.

 

Florida Atlantic's Howard Schnellenberger coached the winning team, and his player, Joseph, was the defensive MVP.

[JewDago]

welcome to the top of the third round, frantz. we have to either get a third or or make a ridiculous reach for him at the top of the second. looks like we might not get this guy.

[Guest Aloysius]

Yeah, it looks like he may need a poor combine performance to end up a Brown. Here's to hoping he runs a 4.8+ 40.

[Gips]

JD is right its a shame he has a nose for the ball and would be a good developement project for sure...

[Guest Aloysius]

And here's a report on the other ILB prospect mentioned in this thread, Alcorn State's Lee Robinson:

 

Robinson is a BEAST. He's 6'2" 250 and moves scarily fast. He stayed with [Wyoming RB Devin] Moore and [Abilene Christian RB Bernard] Scott step for step in pass coverage drills, and he explodes out of his stance. As an OLB, he was quick enough to get around blocks and blow up plays, and he definitely has the heft to hang as an ILB in a 3-4. I heard whispers about intelligence, but physically, he's one of the most ideal LB prospects in the draft. I would be surprised if any of the blue chip LB prospects test out better physically than Robinson.

[JewDago]

looks like robinson might be our prime target at this point. he's at least in the sixth right now, but it sounds like he'll have a strong combine that will push him into the fifth, possibly into the late fourth.

 

it looks like getting the guys we want will largely depend on whether or not we can trade some of the guys we have.

[Guest Aloysius]

The DraftGuys have posted their Texas Vs The Nation Confirmations and Surprises. A lot of interesting stuff there; I recommend checking it out.

 

Here are a few snippets:

 

Frantz Joseph(LB-Florida Atlantic) - Joseph capped off a great week of practice by doing what he did all week during the game. Joseph had an interception on a deflected pass, and he also was a force against the run. Joseph was a wall when he met runners, and he also displayed the ability to shed a blocker and make the tackle. He hit with a thud on 243 pound RB/FB Frank Summers and turned into a heat seeking missile once he had the correct read on a running play. One weakness was exposed when Joseph did look sluggish in space chasing down an offensive player, but he was a stud when he was playing downhill.

 

Lee Robinson(OLB-Alcorn State) - You can see Robinson’s superior athleticism/size combo out there even if you’re not looking for it. He didn’t make huge plays like Joseph, but his burst off the snap, ability to fight through blocks, and one play where he easily threw an opponent to the ground all amounted to a good closing argument in the case he built to be a mid-round pick in the draft during the week in El Paso.

 

Rulon Davis(DL-California) - Davis, like Potter, got his arms up instinctively to disrupt passing lanes when he was kept from the QB, and he put on a show of handfighting technique rushing the passer. He’s a useful player who might not be good enough to start, but he’ll be a terrific rotation player, probably as an end in a 3-4.

 

Zach Potter(DT-Nebraska) - Potter isn’t sudden, and he isn’t strong, but he makes plays with his long frame and motor - including one sack when Drew Willy broke the pocket to run, and a batted down pass (which was his signature play in practice). Potter still gets beaten soundly when a lineman gets their hands into his body, and he was stoned way too easily by Stanford RB Anthony Kimble, but he could blossom if he can add 20 pounds of good weight and the accompanying strength in an NFL weight training program.

 

Will Johnson(DT-Michigan) - Like Zach Potter, Johnson has a slight lower body to hold up at the point of attack against the run, but his instincts and motor serve him well. He also projects as a quality 3-4 end, and he showed killer closing speed when he got a sniff of the QB on his sack. He handfought Roger Allen successfully, a guy he’s giving up at least 30-40 pounds to, and he also blew up a run play in the backfield. Johnson looks like he’ll be a quality rotational player in the NFL.

 

Stephen Hodge(S/LB-TCU) - Hodge doesn’t fit in NFL defenses - playing with a linebacker’s mentality at safety, but being a little small for an LB and lacking the coverage skills of a defensive back. Still, he was always around the ball, and flew in like a hawk when he had the read on a play. Hodge impressed by blowing up a Brannan Southerland screen pass - giving the lead blockers nothing to hit - and by coming up to force an outside run back into traffic. If Hodge goes by the wayside like recent LB/S tweeners Darnell Bing and Ernest Shazor, it won’t be for a lack of aggressiveness.

[Guest Aloysius]

Here's DraftGuy Sigmund Bloom on whether the Browns may be interested in Joseph & Robinson:

 

I think Joseph is a lot like Beau Bell, so I'm not sure if your Brownies need two thumpers. Still he'd be a great pick for any team, and I wouldnt be shocked if they took him.

 

Robinson is more athletic and maybe a better fit as an OLB in a 3-4, but he does have the size to play inside too. He could be a Leon Williams versatile type.

Robinson was invited to the Combine, but Joseph wasn't. Kind of makes sense: Robinson is the one with freakish athleticism, whereas Joseph is more of an instincts & toughness guy.

 

Still, this could put a ceiling on Joseph's draft stock. As the guys at DraftDaddy recently noted, the majority on non-Combine invites are taken after Round 4. And Heck's noted that 40 times tend to be highly determinative of a linebacker's draft stock.

 

If Joseph falls to us in the 6th Round, I won't be too upset.

[JewDago]

joseph in the sixth would be an absolute steal, someone i'd be ecstatic to have on the team.

 

remember that we still don't know what we have in bell or how he's recovered from his knee surgeries nor whether it's going to be an ongoing problem or not. there are a lot of question marks surrounding bell, and it's going to be a long offseason of wondering.

 

even with robinson's measurables, there's no way he's off the board before the fourth unless he does something utterly ridiculous at the combine like break 4.45 in the 40 or put up 32+ in the press, and anything below those insane numbers will keep him well into the fifth. however, he could be that fast, as wyoming rb devin moore, with whom he was able to keep up in coverage drills, has been timed at 4.38.

 

if we end up with robinson, let's hope he's nothing like williams, whose only versatility is the ability to suck anywhere on the field.

[Guest Aloysius]

Just read that Joseph's been running 4.7 40's during his pre-pro day training. His 3-cone times (agility) have hovered around 7.00 seconds, which is very good. Also, his shuttle times (short area quickness) have been in the 4.25-4.30 range (solid).

 

The Ravens and Saints are said to be interested in Joseph. If the Ratbirds end up with both Jameel McClain & Joseph, I'm going to be pissed.

[Guest Aloysius]

Recently watched some film of Joseph that made me a little less high on him, but this clip got me excited all over again:

 

[heckofajobbrownie]

Great upper body strength, but looks a bit stiff, like an Abdul Hodge.

[Guest Aloysius]

That's a good comparison. FWIW, nfldraftscout compares him to Desmond Bishop.

 

He wasn't very good in the Troy game - got beat on some cutbacks, didn't look particularly agile, and got engulfed by blockers a few times. But he's looked great every other time I've seen him play.

[Guest Aloysius]

Joseph had a disappointing pro day, running a 4.83 40, only putting up 19 reps of 225, and posting a 27.5" vertical. After that workout, I'd expect him to slide to late day two.

 

One positive sign: the Browns sent representatives to Joseph's pro day. I certainly wouldn't mind seeing us take him in the sixth.

[Guest Aloysius]

Here's the Draft Guys' profile of Lee Robinson:

 

 

Robinson actually put up some pretty poor numbers at the combine: 4.67 short shuttle, 7.57 3-cone, 9'05" broad jump. Because of that, he should be available in the 6th Round; he could even end up being a priority UDFA type.

 

If we accumulate some additional picks, I wouldn't mind seeing us take a flier on this guy late in the draft.

[PlaygroundLegend]

Im all about Frantz Joseph!! I hope we draft him in the 5th!

[Guest Aloysius]

According to TFY Draft, the Browns were one of five teams represented at Lee Robinson's pro day. Of the five, four run a 3-4 defense (Packers, Niners, Pats, and us).

 

Robinson's times were marginally better than the ones he put up at the combine but still unimpressive - 4.71 40, 4.41 shuttle, 7.25 3-cone. He likely remains a late round/undrafted type.

[Oldcrow1945]

According to TFY Draft, the Browns were one of five teams represented at Lee Robinson's pro day. Of the five, four run a 3-4 defense (Packers, Niners, Pats, and us).

 

Robinson's times were marginally better than the ones he put up at the combine but still unimpressive - 4.71 40, 4.41 shuttle, 7.25 3-cone. He likely remains a late round/undrafted type.

 

He may not be fast by he sure seems quick and fluid laterally. His coverage skills aren't bad either.

I loved how he turned his head to look for the ball on the go route.

 

I like Robinson a lot.

[ReggieLanghorne]

Hey folks, thanks to Aloysius for linking to, and to this great community for watching our Draftguys TV profiles. I remain convinced that Joseph will be a starter at the next level, he has too much desire and determination, along with good natural size and strength, to be denied. Robinson is a much better athlete that his tests show, although he might be not be best suited for a complex scheme - he's more of a seek and destroy guy.

 

-Sigmund Bloom

[Guest Aloysius]

According to Scout.com, the Browns have privately worked out Lee Robinson.

[Guest Aloysius]

Joseph, who led the Sun Belt in tackles with 154 last season, is rated the No. 9 inside linebacker by nfldraftscout.com for the upcoming draft. He has run a 4.69 in the 40-yard dash and had 16 NFL teams show up to FAU's Pro Day in late February. The Dolphins, Jaguars, Steelers, Ravens and Browns have all had ongoing conversations with Joseph.

[Oldcrow1945]

Where he falls may not work out well for the Browns...Unless you reach for him at #104.

 

Or do you think the goes there now anyways Aloy? I figured he was 5th round guy...Where the Browns do not own a pick.