joedawg69 Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 I have read and heard a lot of speculation about this year's draft. Most people seem to think that this years draft is deep on the defensive side; but, how good are they really? My opinion is that this was not a very talented year in college which is why there were so many upsets and ranked teams falling back; while, unranked teams passed them up. The DBs looked good this year but is it because they were that good or because the receivers and quarterbacks they played against were not as good as years before this last year. I still think that DB is one of the deepest and most skilled for this draft; but, their competition makes me worry if they will do as well at the pro level. What do you think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 Near the top. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballpeen Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 There is plenty of talent in this draft and most of the best is on the defensive side of the ball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 Consensus I've heard is the talent is on D, specifically corner and pass rusher, and somewhat at safety. Less so at linebacker (except those 3-4 edge). On O, there are some good rushers with Cook and Fournette but after that as standard pick the guy that fits your scheme and he'll be fine. Receivers look deep. Quarterbacks not so much from most places, in terms of instant starters. OL isn't special, and tackles particularly are lacking. Interior is maybe OK with a few decent centers. There's probably a punter somewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 I call it now, Garrett will be Corey Brown. I assume you mean Courtney Brown? I am not saying Garrett will be Courtney Brown....but he could be. Or he could be Von Miller. All Johnny lovers who have hung on here think the latter. I am not saying that Trubisky will be Aaron Rodgers...but he could be Or he could be Joey Harrington. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 I still think that DB is one of the deepest and most skilled for this draft; but, their competition makes me worry if they will do as well at the pro level. What do you think? When you consider that 4 or 5 DBs are on the field every play, drafts should be deep in them every year. Same should be said for the OL, but this year's class looks pretty bad. One position with limited participation that stands out this year is RB. There's real quality projected for every round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjp28 Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 This is fallacy. The level of talent has absolutely nothing to do with upsets and disappointments, etc..... Every draft year represents graduates who have risen to the very highest level of performance. Thousands and thousands of players from pee-pee leagues, from all over America, from the best schools, with the best coaches....all God's creation...... .....No talent? Bullshit. The shortage is with people who know how to assess a man, a human being first, and the player second. Not true. Like all relative things some year's graduation classes are clearly better, nearly the same or worse than others either in the numbers of truly excellent players who will be future HOF candidates or the just the overall numbers of good serviceable players or maybe the unusually high numbers of totally bad players at any particular position. Just look at the 1983 QB class as compared to this year's QB class just as one example and that goes for any other position over time. All classes (like all people) are not equal some are just better than others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjp28 Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 From nfl.Com their top 10 draft classes of all time. http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-draft/0ap3000000650115/Top-10-NFL-draft-classes-of-all-time Yes, most things in life are relative and often quantifiable and measurable. ....edit add, their #4 class 1957 included a guy named Jim Brown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 The 2013 class was awful, while 2011 was excellent The picks 1. Cam Newton..........Eric Fisher 2. Von Miller...............Luke Joeckel 3. Marcel Dareus.......Dion Jordan 4. AJ Green...............Lane Johnson 5. Patrick Peterson....Ziggy Ansah 6. Julio Jones............Barkevious Mingo 7. Aldon Smith...........Jonathan Cooper 8. Jake Locker...........Tavon Austin 9. Tyron Smith...........Dee Milliner 10. Blaine Gabbert....Chance Warmack 11. JJ Watt................DJ Fluker Apart from reaching on a couple of QBs that 2011 draft has probably at least Julio, Peterson, Watt, Smith as HOF calibre guys, maybe even the likes of Green, Miller and Newton depending on what happens next in their careers. Compared to 2013...oh dear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poplarbluffman Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 I have read and heard a lot of speculation about this year's draft. Most people seem to think that this years draft is deep on the defensive side; but, how good are they really? My opinion is that this was not a very talented year in college which is why there were so many upsets and ranked teams falling back; while, unranked teams passed them up. The DBs looked good this year but is it because they were that good or because the receivers and quarterbacks they played against were not as good as years before this last year. I still think that DB is one of the deepest and most skilled for this draft; but, their competition makes me worry if they will do as well at the pro level. What do you think? wr, te and cb..crazy talent this year...lot of solid backup rb's awful at OT and QB below avg dt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjp28 Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 Per NFL.Com Best classes of all time: 1. 1983 naturally 2. 1989 3. 1961 4. 1957 5. 1964 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 From nfl.Com their top 10 draft classes of all time. http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-draft/0ap3000000650115/Top-10-NFL-draft-classes-of-all-time Yes, most things in life are relative and often quantifiable and measurable. ....edit add, their #4 class 1957 included a guy named Jim Brown. Interesting, perhaps controversial. 1983 the best? Arguable. 1957 and 1964 had more HOF players. I had not thought about 2007 and 2011. Maybe a bit premature? What about 2004? Excellent at the Top: Rivers/Eli/BR. plus Vince Wilfork, Larry Fitzgerald. Jared Allen. It falls off from there, so maybe not as deep. 2007? Well, it had a poor beginning: Jamarcus Russell. But Patrick Willis, Revis, JT, Adrian Peterson do some good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 The 2013 class was awful, while 2011 was excellent The picks Compared to 2013...oh dear. Best of 2013 likely : Leveon Bell. Also Eddie Lacy....and...Jamie Collins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjp28 Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 Yes any "best of" list has to stand the test of time so the 21st century guys need some time. But 1983, yes I'd take it as #1...in a subjective topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 Per NFL.Com Best classes of all time: 1. 1983 naturally 2. 1989 3. 1961 4. 1957 5. 1964 I would not say "naturally". 1983 had the QBs, but: 1957 also had 2 HOF QBs: Dawson, Jurgenson. Plus it had boderliners: John Brodie, Jack Kemp, Milt Plum Plus these other HOFs: Jim Brown Don Maynard Henry Jordan Gene Hickerson Jim Parker Tommy McDonald Paul Hornung Plus other very good players: Jack Pardee, Bill Glass, Billy Ray Smith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 Yes any "best of" list has to stand the test of time so the 21st century guys need some time. But 1983, yes I'd take it as #1...in a subjective topic. And 1964 had these HOF players: Carl Eller Paul Krause Paul Warfield Roger Staubach Mel Renfro Charley Taylor Bob Hayes Bob Brown Dave Wilcox Leroy Kelly Plus...in 1964, that was the draft that gave us the immortal Dick Shiner! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjp28 Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 I would not say "naturally". 1983 had the QBs, but: 1957 also had 2 HOF QBs: Dawson, Jurgenson. Plus it had boderliners: John Brodie, Jack Kemp, Milt Plum Plus these other HOFs: Jim Brown Don Maynard Henry Jordan Gene Hickerson Jim Parker Tommy McDonald Paul Hornung Plus other very good players: Jack Pardee, Bill Glass, Billy Ray Smith. Well 1983 was always my favorite and was led by the game's glamour boys, the QBs but these debates could go on and on, 1983 might be someone else's 2-5? I like it because guys like Darrel Green was picked right after Marino. That was an exciting if not controversial day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjp28 Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 Interesting, perhaps controversial. 1983 the best? Arguable. 1957 and 1964 had more HOF players. I had not thought about 2007 and 2011. Maybe a bit premature? What about 2004? Excellent at the Top: Rivers/Eli/BR. plus Vince Wilfork, Larry Fitzgerald. Jared Allen. It falls off from there, so maybe not as deep. 2007? Well, it had a poor beginning: Jamarcus Russell. But Patrick Willis, Revis, JT, Adrian Peterson do some good. Definitely some immortal players! But for overall draft must look beyond just HOF players because of their small overall numbers but check out these names most all 1st round picks: 1983 John Elway, QB, Stanford 1st Round (1st overall) by Baltimore Colts Eric Dickerson, RB, Southern Methodist - 1st Round (2nd overall) by Los Angeles Rams Bruce Matthews, OL, Southern California - 1st Round (9th overall) by Houston Oilers Jim Kelly, QB, Miami (FL) - 1st Round (14th overall) by Buffalo Bills Dan Marino, QB, Pittsburgh - 1st Round (27th overall) by Miami Dolphins Darrell Green, CB, Texas A&I - 1st Round (28th overall) by Washington Redskins Richard Dent, DE, Tennessee State - 8th round (203rd overall) by Chicago Bears 1989 Troy Aikman, QB, UCLA - 1st round (1st overall) by Dallas Cowboys Barry Sanders, RB, Oklahoma State 1st Round (3rd overall) by Detroit Lions Derrick Thomas, LB, Alabama - 1st round (4th overall) by Kansas City Chiefs Deion Sanders, CB (also KR/PR), Florida State - 1st round (5th overall) by Atlanta Falcons 1961 Mike Ditka, TE, Pittsburgh - 1st Round (5th overall) by Chicago Bears (Also drafted in 1st round of 1961 AFL Draft by the Houston Oilers.) Jimmy Johnson, CB, UCLA - 1st Round (6th overall) by San Francisco 49ers (Also drafted in 4th round of 1961 AFL Draft by the Los Angeles Chargers.) Herb Adderley, HB, Michigan State - 1st Round (12th overall) by Green Bay Packers (Also drafted in 2nd round of 1961 AFL Draft by the New York Titans.) Bob Lilly, DT, Texas Christian - 1st Round (13th overall) by Dallas Cowboys (Also drafted in 2nd round of 1961 AFL Draft by the Dallas Texans.) Billy Shaw, G, Georgia Tech - 2nd Round by Buffalo Bills (Also selected in the 14th round - 184th overall - of 1961 NFL Draft by the Dallas Cowboys.) Fran Tarkenton, QB, Georgia - 3rd Round (29th overall) by Minnesota Vikings (Also drafted in 5th round of 1961 AFL Draft by the Boston Patriots.) David "Deacon" Jones, DE, South Carolina St., Mississippi Vocational - 14th Round (186th overall) by Los Angeles Rams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 Definitely some immortal players! But for overall draft must look beyond just HOF players because of their small overall numbers but check out these names most all 1st round picks: That is why I say that 1957 and 1964 stack up well vs. 1983. 10 HOF in '64 9 in '57 only 7 in '83 Plus, for 57 particularly...look at that list of Non-HOF guys. Kemp...2 time champ. Brodie...outstanding QB. Interesting. Good stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 1953 also had 7 HOF: 1953Doug Atkins, DE, Tennessee - 1st Round (11th overall) by Cleveland BrownsJohn Henry Johnson, FB, St. Mary's, Arizona - 2nd Round (18th overall) by Pittsburgh Steelers (Played in the Canadian Football League in 1953. Negotiating rights were traded to San Francisco 49ers before the 1954 season.)Bob St. Clair, T, San Francisco, Tulsa - 3rd Round (32nd overall) by San Francisco 49ersStan Jones, G/DT, Maryland - 5th Round (54th overall) by Chicago Bears (Drafted as a future selection.)Jim Ringo, C, Syracuse - 7th Round (79th overall) by Green Bay PackersJoe Schmidt, LB, Pittsburgh - 7th Round (85th overall) by Detroit LionsRoosevelt Brown, T, Morgan State - 27th Round (321st overall) by New York Giants Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 67 and 68 8 each 1967Bob Griese, QB, Purdue - 1st Round (4th overall) by Miami DolphinsFloyd Little, RB, Syracuse - 1st Round (6th overall) by Denver BroncosAlan Page, DT, Notre Dame - 1st Round (15th overall) by Minnesota VikingsGene Upshaw, G, Texas A&I - 1st Round (17th overall) Oakland RaidersLem Barney, CB, Jackson State - 2nd Round (34th overall) by Detroit LionsWillie Lanier, LB, Morgan State - 2nd Round (50th overall) by Kansas City ChiefsRayfield Wright, T, Fort Valley State - 7th round (182nd player overall) by Dallas CowboysKen Houston, S, Prairie A&M - 9th Round (214th overall) by Houston Oilers 1968Ron Yary, T, Cerritos Jr. College, USC - 1st Round (1st overall) by Minnesota VikingsClaude Humphrey, DE, Tennessee State - 1st round (3rd overall) by Atlanta FalconsLarry Csonka, FB, Syracuse - 1st Round (8th overall) by Miami DolphinsCurley Culp, DT, Arizona State - 2nd round (31st player overall) by Denver BroncosKen Stabler, QB, Alabama - 2nd Round (52nd overall) by Oakland RaidersCharlie Sanders, TE, Minnesota - 3rd Round (74th overall) by Detroit LionsElvin Bethea, DE, North Carolina A&T - 3rd Round (77th overall) by Houston OilersArt Shell, Maryland State-Eastern Shore - 3rd Round (80th overall) by Oakland Raiders Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 The absolute worst class was 1974...for the simple fact that they were nearly all Steelers from that class. 1974Lynn Swann, WR, USC - 1st Round (21st overall) by Pittsburgh SteelersDave Casper, WR, Notre Dame - 2nd Round (44th overall) by Oakland RaidersJack Lambert, LB, Kent State - 2nd Round (46th overall) by Pittsburgh SteelersJohn Stallworth, WR, Alabama A&M - 4th Round (82nd overall) by Pittsburgh SteelersMike Webster, C, Wisconsin - 5th Round (125th overall) by Pittsburgh Steelers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 "Weak" NFL draft classes in terms of number of players drafted that made the HOF...since WWII: 1992...NONE (perhaps best players that year were: Jimmy Smith WR and DB Troy Vincent) 1947....1: Dante Lavelli 1954: 1: Raymond Berry 1955: 1. Johnny Unitas 1959: 1. Dick Lebeau 1972: 1. Franco Harris 1977: 1. Tony Dorsett. 1986: 1. Charles Haley (note: the latest draft class in which someone is now in the HOF is the 1997 class: Orlando Pace and Walter Jones 1998 will have Peyton, Charles Woodson, Randy Moss, Alan Faneca. 1999 best bets are Champ Bailey, Donovan McNabb and Edgerrin James. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wargograw Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 I call it now, Garrett will be Corey Brown. I assume you mean Courtney Brown? I am not saying Garrett will be Courtney Brown....but he could be. Or he could be Von Miller. All Johnny lovers who have hung on here think the latter. I am not saying that Trubisky will be Aaron Rodgers...but he could be Or he could be Joey Harrington. We heard you the first 196 times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted February 24, 2017 Report Share Posted February 24, 2017 We heard you the first 196 times. And we heard that you were a Garrett fag the first 9196 times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjp28 Posted February 25, 2017 Report Share Posted February 25, 2017 That is why I say that 1957 and 1964 stack up well vs. 1983. 10 HOF in '64 9 in '57 only 7 in '83 Plus, for 57 particularly...look at that list of Non-HOF guys. Kemp...2 time champ. Brodie...outstanding QB. Interesting. Good stuff. I personally would have no problem bumping up '57 and '64 but then again I might be a bit prejudiced there because I grew up watching those guys instead of 1989 when I was already out of grad school...different passions maybe and many more games watched. One thing too all of the HOF guys are good, great or excellent we'll see how this year's bunch shakes out in maybe 15-20 years....if we're still here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orion Posted February 25, 2017 Report Share Posted February 25, 2017 Hopefully there's no Mike Junkin's, Clifford Charlton's or Mingo's out there this year. (perhaps we're just not qualified to draft LB'er early in the draft) In general, I want the biggest, fastest, strongest, shiftiest son's of bitches out there...so long as they don't wear blond wigs and call themselves Billy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wargograw Posted February 25, 2017 Report Share Posted February 25, 2017 And we heard that you were a Garrett fag the first 9196 times. But you haven't. Back to your lying ways? Quote me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted February 25, 2017 Report Share Posted February 25, 2017 Hopefully there's no Mike Junkin's, Clifford Charlton's or Mingo's out there this year. (perhaps we're just not qualified to draft LB'er early in the draft) In general, I want the biggest, fastest, strongest, shiftiest son's of bitches out there...so long as they don't wear blond wigs and call themselves Billy. Billy is resurrecting in the NFL Spring League this April. Could provide some nice relief for football starved fans just before the draft with 6 total games among 4 teams. Player bios are supposed to be posted by the end of this Month according to their website. All 32 teams will have scouts at the games/practices. https://www.thespringleague.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted February 25, 2017 Report Share Posted February 25, 2017 No, I meant Corey Brown You know, it really is good to be me. Fuck man, I am a one man party. Never a dull moment in my life. I can always make myself laugh. http://fox6now.com/tag/corey-brown/ Nyuck, nyuck, nyuck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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