The Gipper Posted May 8, 2017 Report Share Posted May 8, 2017 Many of you remember Paul McDonald no? 6'2" 200 lb. QB out of USC for the Browns. Started a full year for the Browns after Sipe, and before Kosar. Many thought he could be the left handed Brian Sipe...similar build...southern California boys. Both with "weakish" arm talent. But he was not...by any means like Sipe as it turned out. Now we have Cody Kessler. Similar size to both Sipe and McDonald 6'1 220 lbs. (current weight training and nutrition adds 20 pounds to guys these days). Another USC/SoCal lad. Also with what is considered a "weakish" arm. So, is Cody going to be the right handed Paul McDonald...or the second coming of Brian Sipe? Just FYI, McDonald's career stats, most, but not all with Browns: 8-13 as a starter 411/767 5269 career yards, 24 career TDs. So far, Cody is 0-8 as a starter, 128/195 with 6 TD passes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted May 8, 2017 Author Report Share Posted May 8, 2017 Again, just FYI....Sipe's numbers, all with Browns (USFL not included) 57-55 as a starting QB 1944/3439 23,713 yards 154 career TD passes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob806 Posted May 8, 2017 Report Share Posted May 8, 2017 From what I saw last year,Kessler is better than McDonald, mainly because he didn't turn the ball over a ton. While I'm not too sure he is the answer to the QB puzzle, he looked competent and not overwhelmed (we've all seen 3rd stringers struggle). Paul McDonald took over the QB spot when Sipe left for the USFL. If I recall, McDonald had 3 or 4 pick 6's alone in 1984,most of them in the 4th quarter. McDonald's best work was with USC, handing off to Charles White as it turned out. Sipe was lured to the USFL with big money, and the Browns didn't match it. On the bright side of the McDonald "era," it lead to the hiring of Marty, brought Kosar & Danielson here, and exciting (yet ultimately disappointing) times back in the 80s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
runyon27 Posted May 8, 2017 Report Share Posted May 8, 2017 I remember McDonald, he was awful in the games I can recall seeing him play. I think Kessler can be a solid #2 QB in the NFL, I don't know yet if he can be the guy, I think he is more of a game manager type not a guy who elevates everyones play. Kessler has played better then many of the guys we drafted to be the guy like Weeden, McCoy, Manziel, Quinn etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orion Posted May 8, 2017 Report Share Posted May 8, 2017 Look at the situation Kessler walked into. A depleted OL with a QB who switched to receiver, in his first games as a receiver, as his best weapon. ...no clue what Kessler will become.....if I had to guess, our backup...but that's being harsh on him based on last year. Remember, his 1st pass in an NFL game (pre season) was for a TD. (he later blindly ran out the back of the end zone for a safety) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Browns1216 Posted May 9, 2017 Report Share Posted May 9, 2017 Poor Kessler. I hope he is able to gut it out and become the Browns' franchise QB, but this reminds me a bit of Colt McCoy's situation. McCoy came in and did the best he could with what he had to work with, he had one year of Peyton Hillis but no receivers (MoMass and Greg "Stonehands" Little did him no favors), and repeatedly got clobbered. I hope he finds success some day. Kessler did decent but again, there was a lack of offensive (and defensive) weapons. Since the Browns were always playing from behind due to the poor defense, other teams knew the Browns had to rely on Kessler's arm to score points. They just had to blitz every time and since the Browns did not have a running back or TE who could block, it was easy to overwhelm the O-line and destroy Kessler. Kessler held on to the ball too long, but his receivers could not get open a lot of the time. Hopefully things will change this season. I'd much rather let Kessler lead than Osweiler. Osweiler has too slow of a windup and makes too many dumb decisions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted May 9, 2017 Report Share Posted May 9, 2017 Poor Kessler. I hope he is able to gut it out and become the Browns' franchise QB, but this reminds me a bit of Colt McCoy's situation. McCoy came in and did the best he could with what he had to work with, he had one year of Peyton Hillis but no receivers (MoMass and Greg "Stonehands" Little did him no favors), and repeatedly got clobbered. I hope he finds success some day. Kessler did decent but again, there was a lack of offensive (and defensive) weapons. Since the Browns were always playing from behind due to the poor defense, other teams knew the Browns had to rely on Kessler's arm to score points. They just had to blitz every time and since the Browns did not have a running back or TE who could block, it was easy to overwhelm the O-line and destroy Kessler. Kessler held on to the ball too long, but his receivers could not get open a lot of the time. Hopefully things will change this season. I'd much rather let Kessler lead than Osweiler. Osweiler has too slow of a windup and makes too many dumb decisions. What you said about the Ostrich also may apply to Kizer. We shall see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted May 9, 2017 Author Report Share Posted May 9, 2017 From what I saw last year,Kessler is better than McDonald, mainly because he didn't turn the ball over a ton. While I'm not too sure he is the answer to the QB puzzle, he looked competent and not overwhelmed (we've all seen 3rd stringers struggle). Paul McDonald took over the QB spot when Sipe left for the USFL. If I recall, McDonald had 3 or 4 pick 6's alone in 1984,most of them in the 4th quarter. McDonald's best work was with USC, handing off to Charles White as it turned out. Sipe was lured to the USFL with big money, and the Browns didn't match it. On the bright side of the McDonald "era," it lead to the hiring of Marty, brought Kosar & Danielson here, and exciting (yet ultimately disappointing) times back in the 80s. Well, here is a thing: ALL QBs back in the 60s/70s and early 80s had TD to INT ratios of about 1:1. It is only since the mid 80s that the TD to Int. ratios have gone way down..or is it up? Here are some of the TD to Int. ratios of HOF QBs from back in that day: Joe Namath 173 TDs 220 Ints Bradshaw 212/210 Jurgenson 255/189 Starr 152/138 Staubach 153/109 Griese 192/172 Tarkenton 342/266 (White Tarkenton, that is) Dawson 239/183 Stabler 194/222 Blanda 236/277 Fouts 254/242 Going back a bit further: Otto Graham 174/135 John Unitas 290/252 Waterfield 97/128 Bobby Layne 196/245 Van Brocklin 173/178 Sammy Baugh 187/203 Sid Luckman 137/132 None of these numbers would be acceptable in this day and age, Fair to say? And look at these: Aikman 165/141 Elway 300/226 Favre 508/336 Kelly 237/175 Marino 420/252 Montana 237/139 Moon 291/233 Kurt Warner 208/128 Steve Young 232/107 Brady 452/152 Eli 320/215 Peyton 539/251 Ben R. 301/160 All recent QBs with fairly significant above 1:1 ratios. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted May 9, 2017 Author Report Share Posted May 9, 2017 Dudes, Kessler is dead man walking. You don't draft Black Tarkenton if you are intending on sticking it out with Cody. Kessler is going to get destroyed this season. Physically AND emotionally. Hue fucked this kid in the ass. OK, now..who is the "Black Tarkenton?" I thought it was supposed to be RGIII.....and now it is someone else? Kizer? Cam Newton? Russell Wilson? DeShaun Watson? In confusing yourself Ghoolie you are also confusing the rest of us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob806 Posted May 10, 2017 Report Share Posted May 10, 2017 Well, here is a thing: ALL QBs back in the 60s/70s and early 80s had TD to INT ratios of about 1:1. It is only since the mid 80s that the TD to Int. ratios have gone way down..or is it up? Here are some of the TD to Int. ratios of HOF QBs from back in that day: Joe Namath 173 TDs 220 Ints Bradshaw 212/210 Jurgenson 255/189 Starr 152/138 Staubach 153/109 Griese 192/172 Tarkenton 342/266 (White Tarkenton, that is) Dawson 239/183 Stabler 194/222 Blanda 236/277 Fouts 254/242 Going back a bit further: Otto Graham 174/135 John Unitas 290/252 Waterfield 97/128 Bobby Layne 196/245 Van Brocklin 173/178 Sammy Baugh 187/203 Sid Luckman 137/132 None of these numbers would be acceptable in this day and age, Fair to say? And look at these: Aikman 165/141 Elway 300/226 Favre 508/336 Kelly 237/175 Marino 420/252 Montana 237/139 Moon 291/233 Kurt Warner 208/128 Steve Young 232/107 Brady 452/152 Eli 320/215 Peyton 539/251 Ben R. 301/160 All recent QBs with fairly significant above 1:1 ratios. Wow on those stats but honestly, I'd take Staubach & Stabler with the game on the line any day. One of my favorite games was when Stabler beat the Dolphins in a 1974 playoff game. And they called Roger "Captain Comeback" for a reason. I'm going to do some digging on Stabler, I wonder if all those INTs piled up after he went to New Orleans and Houston. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickers Posted May 10, 2017 Report Share Posted May 10, 2017 Dudes, Kessler is dead man walking. You don't draft Black Tarkenton if you are intending on sticking it out with Cody. Kessler is going to get destroyed this season. Physically AND emotionally. Hue fucked this kid in the ass. OK, now..who is the "Black Tarkenton?" I thought it was supposed to be RGIII.....and now it is someone else? Kizer? Cam Newton? Russell Wilson? DeShaun Watson? In confusing yourself Ghoolie you are also confusing the rest of us. I think He just likes typing 'Black tarkentons" LOL... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted May 10, 2017 Report Share Posted May 10, 2017 I think He just likes typing 'Black tarkentons" LOL... I'm more inclined to believe it's an assigned, shortcut key by this point... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted May 10, 2017 Author Report Share Posted May 10, 2017 Wow on those stats but honestly, I'd take Staubach & Stabler with the game on the line any day. One of my favorite games was when Stabler beat the Dolphins in a 1974 playoff game. And they called Roger "Captain Comeback" for a reason. I'm going to do some digging on Stabler, I wonder if all those INTs piled up after he went to New Orleans and Houston. And notice that while his contemporaries were below a 1:1 ratio of TDs to Ints, Otto Graham was significantly above that ratio: Otto Graham 174/135 Waterfield 97/128 Bobby Layne 196/245 Van Brocklin 173/178 Sammy Baugh 187/203 Sid Luckman 137/132 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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