Bottom going up

[Babernakle]

It's been a long three years.... and the browns suck.  But from what I see it looks like better days are ahead.  I can say the defense looks really good in the front seven with just a few pieces in the back to make them a top ten d. As for the offense it's a lock there picking a qb first. Darnold I hope I think he fits better and looks more rugged but Rosen also looks good.  With the addition of a qb and a few piece on the offensive line and with Gordon back the weapons really take shape Colman Gordon njoku.  Our running back are middle of the pack but with upgrades at the line and a healthy pass game I feel it looks good.  And honestly watching the games there were only a few games the browns were out of this year.  The rest were lost due to turnovers and worst yet red zone turn overs.  So I feel the future is bright and I hope they keep hue around another year and the improvement will happen 

[nickers]

 

[BrownPile]

Only three long years?

[wargograw]

So the current Browns are something to be optimistic about, just as long as Sashi’s not GM? Lol. 

[Dutch Oven]

2 hours ago, wargograw said:

So the current Browns are something to be optimistic about, just as long as Sashi’s not GM? Lol. 

So, so bitter.

[LogicIsForSquares]

47 minutes ago, Dutch Oven said:

So, so bitter.

Very salty indeed.

[jiggins7919]

There's a part of me that really wants Hue Jackson back as well.  I'm very interested to see if there's any growth with our offense...especially if Josh Gordon can somehow make it back and we actually sign a viable free agent WR.  

What scares me is the defense.  Watching that Green Bay was torture, and it hurt to see what we ALL knew was coming...actually happen.  We just gave up completion after completion, and the play that REALLY bothers me was the 4th and 1 where our DB gave the WR a 5 yard cushion.  How does that happen on 4th and 1?  Are you just hoping the guy DROPS IT?  Here's a stat for you:  Hundley only completed ONE pass that traveled over 10 yards in the air, and that was the blown coverage TD.  His other 33 completions ALL traveled less than 10 yards down the field.  At what point do you play more press coverage and force Hundley to make a tougher pass down the field?

And why does our special teams coach Chris Tabor keep getting a pass?  I'm tired of having awful special teams.  

[TexasAg1969]

7 minutes ago, jiggins7919 said:

There's a part of me that really wants Hue Jackson back as well.  I'm very interested to see if there's any growth with our offense...especially if Josh Gordon can somehow make it back and we actually sign a viable free agent WR.  

What scares me is the defense.  Watching that Green Bay was torture, and it hurt to see what we ALL knew was coming...actually happen.  We just gave up completion after completion, and the play that REALLY bothers me was the 4th and 1 where our DB gave the WR a 5 yard cushion.  How does that happen on 4th and 1?  Are you just hoping the guy DROPS IT?  Here's a stat for you:  Hundley only completed ONE pass that traveled over 10 yards in the air, and that was the blown coverage TD.  His other 33 completions ALL traveled less than 10 yards down the field.  At what point do you play more press coverage and force Hundley to make a tougher pass down the field?

And why does our special teams coach Chris Tabor keep getting a pass?  I'm tired of having awful special teams.  

Funny that some complain that Garrett is not getting to the QB, yet teams have learned to throw the short, quick passes on our porous secondary. You can't get a true pass rush unless the secondary is fixed. Priority #1 for this D.

[Nero]

4 minutes ago, TexasAg1969 said:

Funny that some complain that Garrett is not getting to the QB, yet teams have learned to throw the short, quick passes on our porous secondary. You can't get a true pass rush unless the secondary is fixed. Priority #1 for this .

Agreed. The 'bend but not break' defense makes rivals throw short passes and that way is difficult to get any pressure on the QB. I would like to know how many seconds do rival QBs average before throwing a pass. 

Also, I'm sure that's a way to rise rival quaterbacks' QB rating, as you allow more passes and more completions. 

I hope this defensive strategy was chosen due to our secondary problems, as we could easily have some blown up coverages with such a young team. If we could get a good FS and a good CB, defense shouldn't worry that much about their back, teams would have to try deeper routes and pass rush would benefit from that.

[Ghoolie]

11 hours ago, Babernakle said:

It's been a long three years.... and the browns suck.  But from what I see it looks like better days are ahead.  I can say the defense looks really good in the front seven with just a few pieces in the back to make them a top ten d. As for the offense it's a lock there picking a qb first. Darnold I hope I think he fits better and looks more rugged but Rosen also looks good.  With the addition of a qb and a few piece on the offensive line and with Gordon back the weapons really take shape Colman Gordon njoku.  Our running back are middle of the pack but with upgrades at the line and a healthy pass game I feel it looks good.  And honestly watching the games there were only a few games the browns were out of this year.  The rest were lost due to turnovers and worst yet red zone turn overs.  So I feel the future is bright and I hope they keep hue around another year and the improvement will happen 

You do realize that what you just said can be said by every fan or every team. Your optimism is nothing to be ashamed of or get bashed for, after all, that is a part of being a fan. You are simply a fan with dialed up optimism. However, your optimism is not realistic. In discussuion, this annual.."we aren't that bad, let's add up the positives and see that we are only a few pieces away" mantra, is, honestly, not based in reality.

1) Greg Williams offense is no better than Horton's was, it is simply more aggressive and blitz happy. It still has just as many dumb penalties, missed tackles and blown coverages. It always is gassed and lets us down in the 4th quarter. They have had many opportunities to close out games and have without exception failed. Williams must go with Hue.

2) Enough of this horseschidt offensive line garbage already. NOBODY spends more on the OL than the Browns. THe Browns OL has been perfectly fine for the last 10 years. Every stinking year fans talk about the OL needing improvement. The OL improved when Joe THomas got hurt, the OL is fine.

3) You cannot waste high draft picks on schidt like Coleman and Garrett and expect to get better.

4) Gordon is the only offense weapon the team has

5) Unless Hue is fired, what you have is another GM looking to ride the wave and not make waves. This team will not advance unless Dorsey is his own man. If he keeps Hue, it means Haslam, not Dorsey is calling the shots. THAT is the primary obstacle to the team getting better.

[hish747]

12 hours ago, Babernakle said:

from what I see it looks like better days are ahead. 

Sure. One can argue that it's literally impossible for it to get any worse. But what real optimism can you see for Dorsey who #1) seems on board with keeping a historically bad coach and #2) fails to recognize the baggage attached to Hue?

[jiggins7919]

1 hour ago, TexasAg1969 said:

Funny that some complain that Garrett is not getting to the QB, yet teams have learned to throw the short, quick passes on our porous secondary. You can't get a true pass rush unless the secondary is fixed. Priority #1 for this D.

Yeah, that's a very valid point.  I think what's so frustrating is getting beat by OTHER team's stud pass rushers, ya know?  Joey Bosa with the game winning sack-fumble, Clay Matthews with the QB pressure that caused the pick, and so on.  Why can't OUR stud pass rusher make a play that wins the game?  Heck, why can't ANY of our guys make that "one play" that tilts the game our way?  It started out being just bad luck, but now it's something...different.  I mean, how does that Josh Gordon PI call NOT get made?  The 3rd down in OT when he was getting mugged?  The one where the defender had his arm completely held down?  But you just KNOW these type of calls virtually ALWAYS go against us. The fumbles we don't recover, the picks that we drop, the Chargers recovering the fumble in bounds somehow, Njoku dropping that pass but somehow looking like he caught it?  The fact that we've had a million calls JUST LIKE THAT go against us because the refs didn't have "conclusive evidence" and it was called a catch originally, so they couldn't reverse it.  Or how about the few times when we had the PERFECT camera angle to help us out, but a player or ref walked directly in front of the shot so it didn't help us?  That's happened a few times.  Or the best one yet, the fumble against the Redskins where the freaking ref said they had it, but Duke was HOLDING THE FREAKING BALL.  I've never in my life seen that before, but you can bet it probably cost us the game.  What about the 15 yard penalty on Pryor last year when he "threw the ball" at the Ravens?  Now, we were still down at that point, but it really hurt our chances.  Again, never seen it before.

Something is just "off" with our franchise, and it's difficult to put a finger on exactly what it is.  We literally should have a few more games go our way on luck alone.  Like, how many passes have we gotten our hands on this year?  Yet, how many have we picked off?  Now, if somebody hits OUR QB's arm, you can bet your darn butt-cheeks the ball is going to float gently DIRECTLY to the defense, but if WE get a hand on the ball?  Oh yeah, it's going to harmlessly hit the ground.  We get a deflection at the line of scrimmage?  The ball actually goes to the freaking OFFENSE.  Remember when Schobert tipped the pass against the Steelers and Brown caught it and ran for like 60 yards?  Yeah.  

I'm not generally this psycho, and I'm not sure why I'm being such a little ho right now, but something isn't right, man.  We were up 14 when the 4th quarter started, and I knew we had no chance.  

[The Gipper]

 

[Tour2ma]

2 hours ago, TexasAg1969 said:

Funny that some complain that Garrett is not getting to the QB, yet teams have learned to throw the short, quick passes on our porous secondary. You can't get a true pass rush unless the secondary is fixed. Priority #1 for this D.

Wait... just a few months ago wasn't an improved pass rush the secret to improving our secondary???

[TexasAg1969]

2 hours ago, Tour2ma said:

Wait... just a few months ago wasn't an improved pass rush the secret to improving our secondary???

If the secondary would be playing closer than 5 yds away it would help. Apparently no one trusts them to do that or they're just plain dumb. I did not see the last game, but the previous game Garrett hit the QB multiple times just a he got rid of the ball. From the description of this last game it sounds like the plan was for GB's QB to unload very quickly. So why did our secondary not take advantage of that?

[Tour2ma]

Just read where MG has 16 knockdowns in addition to his 5 sacks... in seven games.

Clearly our CBs were playing off as part of the game plan. Pretty much as they have all year. The design of course is to make the opponent string together double-digit drives. There are QBs in this league that will make you pay for that approach. Hundley does not top that list.

[wargograw]

11 hours ago, Dutch Oven said:

So, so bitter.

Answer the question.

[Babernakle]

Fact of the matter is the line is over paid and under performed.  The stats don't lie there bad. Just cause you make a lot does not mean your good.  It's shows poor management, and Joe Thomas is not a top ten left tackle anymore.  The qb sucks we all know that. with more time he would be better but the sheer number of red zone ints shows the game is to fast and poor decision making.  The comments made about baker worry me as it sounds like another trade down coming.  The running backs are serviceable.  But as I said before with Gordon on the field the whole offense is better.  Colman is free to run with single coverage and the back have room to run with him dragging a safety out of the box. The front seven look great top 6 that's something to hang your hat on and as far as the secondary is young and yes there not trusted but that is to be expected.  And I believe hue should get another year from every account I have heard hue has not got any of the players he wanted and his direction for the team did not match that of the front office.  I do believe Haslem and hue have a good relationship.