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Trump announces steel and aluminum tariffs, stock markets take a tumble

jbluhm86

By jbluhm86
in POLITICAL DISCUSSION

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calfoxwc Grand Master

calfoxwc

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1 hour ago, TexasAg1969 said:

The president of Mexico won't even talk to Trump anymore and our ambassador to Mexico just quit. So explain to me exactly in what universe will Mexico pay for the wall?

Tariffs, and we send back their uneducated criminals so THEY can refill their jails and give THEM welfare.

the whole trade deficit was designed to help the world globally, The demcommunists decided that

"we are the world".

American companies like above, they come back. Guess who doesn't make money off them anymore?

Oh, hell yeah. They pay bigtime for that.

No, we are AMERICA. Build the Wall. Send all mexican gangs back there. Charge them 25 dollars for each one we send back,

and that can help build the wall. That is about 25-50 million right there, plus the enormous cost of MEXICO paying to deal with the dregs of their own making.

Oh, they are going to pay alright.

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htownbrown Collaborator

htownbrown

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20 minutes ago, MLD Woody said:

Remembers Ag, the payment is metaphorical now

So true because I remember when Trump said, "we're going to send dumptrucks and those Mexicans are going to fill them with pesos at gunpoint."  Good catch!!

You're going to make a good Chuck Schumer one day.

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jbluhm86 Enthusiast

jbluhm86

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9 hours ago, calfoxwc said:

nah, the drug cartels would figure out a way to cut through it.

Make it out of steel. And in that, Mexico WILL end up paying for the wall. We told ya.

--->These countries have been taking away our companies for decades.<---

It HAD TO STOP.

MAGA !

You know, this will be the third time i've posted this, but it doesn't seem to be sinking in. Perhaps I should break it down into easily digestible chunks and highlight key points in bright colors; maybe then it'll click:

Quote

Except...the US steel industry isn't in that bad of shape at all:

1. The American Steel Industry Is Doing Well. In 2016, the steel industry boomed thanks to dramatically increased car sales

2. Nucor, the nation’s leading steel manufacturer, did $16 billion in sales that year. And last year, it’s net earnings increased 65%. The average salary at the company is $80,000; most job loss has occurred thanks to technological advances, not thanks to foreign trade. Nucor’s stock price in 2000 was around $12; today it’s $65.

3. US Steel boomed in 2017; in Q4 of 2016, net earnings were $47 million, but by Q4 of 2017, net earnings were $136 million.

4.Steel Dynamics showed an operating income of $1.1 billion.

5. American production of raw steel has been more or less steady since approximately 1980.

6. As CATO Institute trade lawyer Scott Lincicome points out, U.S. producers control 70% of the steel market, U.S. steel production rose 5% last year, there are already 160 duties on steel imports,

7. --->China ranks 11th in steel importation into the United States<---, we have no defense need for tariffs to preserve the steel industry.

 

 

1 hour ago, calfoxwc said:

Tariffs, and we send back their uneducated criminals so THEY can refill their jails and give THEM welfare.

the whole trade deficit was designed to help the world globally, The demcommunists decided that

"we are the world".

American companies like above, they come back. Guess who doesn't make money off them anymore?

Oh, hell yeah. They pay bigtime for that.

No, we are AMERICA. Build the Wall. Send all mexican gangs back there. Charge them 25 dollars for each one we send back,

and that can help build the wall. That is about 25-50 million right there, plus the enormous cost of MEXICO paying to deal with the dregs of their own making.

Oh, they are going to pay alright.

National Review: Tariffs Are Taxes: Trump Tariffs Hurt Steel and Aluminum Users and Consumers:

"...President ‎Donald Trump genuinely believes that his steel and aluminum tariffs will save thousands of blue-collar jobs. And we know from our interactions with him that he truly cares about these workers in Pennsylvania, Ohio, and other Rust Belt states. We do, too, and we don’t want factories to shut down.

But even if tariffs save every one of the 140,000 or so steel jobs in America, they put at risk 5 million jobs in industries that use steel. These producers now have to compete in hyper-competitive international markets using steel that is 20 percent above the world price and aluminum that is 7 to 10 percent higher than the price paid by our foreign rivals.

Steel and aluminum may win in the short term, but steel-and-aluminum users and consumers lose.

Tariffs are really tax hikes. Since so many of the things American consumers buy today are made of steel or aluminum, a 25 percent tariff on these commodities may get passed on to consumers at the cash register. This is a regressive tax on low-income families.

Meanwhile, up to 5 million jobs will be put in harm’s way. And if U.S. steel-and-aluminum-using industries sell less to foreigners, the trade deficit goes up, not down..."

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calfoxwc Grand Master

calfoxwc

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the new buyers will be American, etc. but Obamao had his war on coal: WV and others were getting ruined by obaMao policies,

made us more dependent yet for overseas steel etc. Now that is reversed. In the long term, they will benefit bigly.

New EPA Rules Show Obama's No Longer Hiding War on Coal | Time

time.com › Politics › White House
 
Jun 1, 2014 - For five years, the coal industry and its fossil-fueled allies in the Republican Party have accused the Obama Administration of waging a war on coal. They claim the administration's new plan to limit carbon emissions at existing power plants is really about carbon emissions at existing coal plants. They see ...
 

Trump and the end of Obama's bitter 'war on coal' | TheHill

thehill.com/opinion/energy.../353232-trump-and-the-end-of-obamas-bitter-war-on-co...
 
Sep 30, 2017 - Obama imposed regulations limiting coal mining near streams and on mountain tops, allowed cities to block the expansion of coal export terminals and rail lines, and enacted limits on carbon-dioxide emissions, including many that were not justified by any reasonable calculation of ...
 

'The war on coal is over': EPA boss to roll back Obama's clean power ...

Oct 9, 2017 - Scott Pruitt says he will sign rule on Tuesday withdrawing policy that imposed restrictions on emissions from coal-fired power stations.
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jbluhm86 Enthusiast

jbluhm86

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7 minutes ago, LogicIsForSquares said:

It is going to kill WV. Coal from this state has primarily been staying afloat due to the sale of metallurgic coal to foreign steel producers. If no here wants to buy the foreign steel due to the increase in price, foreign steel producers will not be buying WV coal.

But, why are you even complaining about that? We're gonna save 140,000 steel and aluminum jobs. Who cares is millions of others lose their jobs in the process and our economy tanks due to trade wars? It's simple economics, my good fellow.

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htownbrown Collaborator

htownbrown

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1 minute ago, jbluhm86 said:

But, why are you even complaining about that? We're gonna save 140,000 steel and aluminum jobs. Who cares is millions of others lose their jobs in the process and our economy tanks due to trade wars? It's simple economics, my good fellow.

 

That certainly is a possibility. However, I suppose if the government can become self sufficient or close to it by tariff from being the largest consumers, and it's not even close, I would imagine a massive tax cut across the board to help business survive.  That's probably the glass half full approach though.  And some industry just won't make it anyhow, I'm sure.  However, i think we need to remember this is an attempt to persuade others not to tariff us.  Maybe the market will move in the response to threat.  If so, that would be victory. 

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jbluhm86 Enthusiast

jbluhm86

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7 minutes ago, htownbrown said:

 

That certainly is a possibility. However, I suppose if the government can become self sufficient or close to it by tariff from being the largest consumers, and it's not even close, I would imagine a massive tax cut across the board to help business survive.  That's probably the glass half full approach though.  And some industry just won't make it anyhow, I'm sure.  However, i think we need to remember this is an attempt to persuade others not to tariff us.  Maybe the market will move in the response to threat.  If so, that would be victory. 

If that is the intended result of his tariff announcement, then it is more than likely going to backfire on him:

Financial Times: EU considers imposing ‘safeguard’ import tariffs in response to US

Reuters: Europe targets U.S. bourbon, bikes, blue jeans for trade riposte

 

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htownbrown Collaborator

htownbrown

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7 minutes ago, jbluhm86 said:

If that is the intended result of his tariff announcement, then it is more than likely going to backfire on him:

Financial Times: EU considers imposing ‘safeguard’ import tariffs in response to US

Reuters: Europe targets U.S. bourbon, bikes, blue jeans for trade riposte

 

No argument here.  It very well could.  

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TexasAg1969 Veteran

TexasAg1969

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4 hours ago, MLD Woody said:

Remembers Ag, the payment is metaphorical now

Oh so the fake Trump news now says they are paying with fake money? Got it.

And since we are charging them $25 a head they will then pay that with fake credit cards too.

And the fake tariffs will be on the fake steel they don't provide us instead of on the real oil they send.

Yep-Canada is paying for the Mexican wall but fake news will claim it's really Mexico because they don't speak English and they are browner than Canadians. That'll fool everyone as usual with the Trump shell game.

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htownbrown Collaborator

htownbrown

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24 minutes ago, TexasAg1969 said:

Oh so the fake Trump news now says they are paying with fake money? Got it.

And since we are charging them $25 a head they will then pay that with fake credit cards too.

And the fake tariffs will be on the fake steel they don't provide us instead of on the real oil they send.

Yep-Canada is paying for the Mexican wall but fake news will claim it's really Mexico because they don't speak English and they are browner than Canadians. That'll fool everyone as usual with the Trump shell game.

Annnnnnnddddddd.......the race card.  Of course.

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Westside Steve Grand Master

Westside Steve

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On 3/3/2018 at 7:30 PM, MLD Woody said:

Yeah... My company makes our product out of steel. And the cost was already going up. Our product going up in price will hurt infrastructure development

But if it's true that it will cut way down on the use of coal across the world it's a small sacrifice to save the planet isn't it Woody?

WSS

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MLD Woody Grand Master

MLD Woody

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45 minutes ago, Westside Steve said:

But if it's true that it will cut way down on the use of coal across the world it's a small sacrifice to save the planet isn't it Woody?

WSS

Oh no! You got me! Your "well why bother doing anything" attitude towards climate change wins again!

I've never been for crippling an economy. Not to mention I'm not sure your assumption is correct. 

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calfoxwc Grand Master

calfoxwc

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ah. then why didn't the libs go apecrap over obaMao and what he did to china?

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/03/02/if-trump-thinks-hes-taking-steel-tariff-war-to-china-hes-wrong.html?recirc=taboolainternal

Obama administration hit Chinese steel hard in 2016

Prior to this announcement, the U.S. had already implemented trade taxes on different types of imported steel from China. In 2016, the Obama administration imposed duties on some Chinese steel imports by more than 500 percent, causing Chinese imports to the U.S. to drop by almost two-thirds.

According to Yan Tong, Chief Business Development Officer at Shagang International, one of China's largest steel mills, the U.S. has been moving in this direction for years. "Trump's action just accelerated it," she said. "It doesn't affect us that much because we don't export to U.S., anyway."

 

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Westside Steve Grand Master

Westside Steve

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1 hour ago, MLD Woody said:

Oh no! You got me! Your "well why bother doing anything" attitude towards climate change wins again!

I've never been for crippling an economy. Not to mention I'm not sure your assumption is correct. 

Well that's true. I guess you probably know it but don't want to say I'm right, but no, there's no reason to waste years and resources on things that won't work.

And hit the reaction to every single issue on the table is coming through the prism of I hate Trump or I love Trump then what's the difference?

WSS

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jbluhm86 Enthusiast

jbluhm86

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So, what could go wrong with Trump's proposed tariffs?

WSJ: Gary Cohn Resigns as White House Economic Adviser After Losing Tariffs Fight

Barron's: Markets Now: Dow Set for 300 Point Drop as Cohn Resignation Crushes Stocks

Marketwatch: EU leader responds to Trump’s tariff plan: ‘We can also do stupid’

OtBZnfd.jpg

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jbluhm86 Enthusiast

jbluhm86

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CBS News: Trump tariffs exempt Canada and Mexico

So, who exactly are the top 10 countries that the US imports steel from?:

5aa38ad0a714b_steelimports2.JPG.cab58801cc6291122b81d4acfacc2769.JPG

5aa38ae7e8950_steelimports.JPG.87b9f74c6ef240184417ba474b6b1c30.JPG

 

The top 2 exporters of steel to the US are...Canada and Mexico....who are exempt from the new tariffs.

And where does China, who Trump claims is taking away American steel jobs, rank? 

11th. And outside the top 10 sources,  U.S. imports from 11th-ranked China actually went down 5% in 2017.

 

So, what exactly do these tariffs actually accomplish?

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