Cribbs a Holdout? - NFL.Com

[Fooleeze]

http://blogs.nfl.com/2009/07/10/cribbs-not...rrent-contract/

 

Cribbs not planning to play under current contract

 

Cleveland wide receiver/kick returner Joshua Cribbs does not plan to play a game for the Browns under the terms of his current contract. But Cribbs, who has four years remaining on a six-year, $6.7 million contract, hopes a deal can be worked out by the start of the regular season, according to a person with knowledge of the situation.

 

Cribbs’ representatives are expected to meet with Browns coach Eric Mangini and general manager George Kokinis next week to discuss reworking the contract. What transpires at that meeting could dictate Cribbs’ next course of action. A holdout, trade demand or leaving training camp at some point are all possibilities, but reaching a compromise on a new contract before things get to those points are the goal, the source said.

 

Cribbs is one of the NFL’s top kick returners and a versatile offensive weapon who can play wide receiver or come out of the backfield. The Browns also have experimented with using him some at safety during offseason workouts.

 

Cribbs said that the previous regime of Phil Savage and Romeo Crennel promised to re-do his contract, but they were fired. Mangini and Kokinis said they are not beholden to any commitments made by the prior administration.

 

– Steve Wyche

 

 

[Dan in Florida]

Looks to me like an OLD STORY re-printed.

[Vegasdogg]

Not sure Dan. I think what is new about the information coming out is that he is willing to sit out training camp and the season - or so he says. The bummer is he signed the contract recently, and yeah he's probably deserving of more money.

 

I think what pisses off Cribbs the most is that he was promised a re-structure. Lets face it man these guys cannot play forever. Better get it while you can.

 

And while I agree with all that, he did sign the contract. I say look fella - want to sit out? Go ahead, sit out.

[Vegasdogg]

The Browns also have experimented with using him some at safety during offseason workouts.

Cribbs is one of those classic throwbacks. Play him on offense and defense I say. Get him 25 plays a game on all three teams. On a team void of playmakers and probowlers, I say lets grind everything we can out of him. Put him in coach, he's ready to play.

[daddybull1]

Reality check time.. Josh signed a contract to give him some financial security, $6.7 million ain't chump change...

 

He's not a secret anymore and teams are game planning him in the kicking game... Kick it out of bounds and his threat is somewhat minimized... On kickoffs, put it deep in the end zone and most of the time you'll be able to contain him....

 

His role in the offense is intriging but to date it hasn't produced anything for us.... He hasn't played a down on defense so his value there is mere speculation... He's a beast on special teams but then again he's highly compensated for that ability ($6.7mil)...

 

The Browns could let him sit out for the next few years and his security blanket would be wiped out... The current FO has no obligations to honor any verbal deals struck by those who have been fired.....

 

I want Cribbs on my team, I think he's special but Cribbs also was the one who signed on the dotted line painting himself into a corner... This team doesn't need the distractions and a holdout would only diminish his value to the team not increase his value....

 

peace

 

T.Dawg

[lemosley01]

In all fairness, the contract he signed was for his then-current role. Now he is both looking and being asked to do more, so I don't blame him for trying to get a new contract.

 

The only way I'd make it new would be to add performance-based bonuses if he meets goals in these new, expanded role. The current contract terms for his work as a KR/PR stay the same.

 

No way I just give the guy a bigger contract based on the fact he 'might' play defense and offense, though.

[next2nothing]

With the right coach Cribbs could be a dangerous weapon and I think Mangini fits the role.

 

I don't think he deserves a bigger contract yet but I hope they can get something worked out.

[ballpeen]

With the right coach Cribbs could be a dangerous weapon and I think Mangini fits the role.

 

I don't think he deserves a bigger contract yet but I hope they can get something worked out.

 

 

I agree. As a special team player he is paid well. It isn't like he is a Hester who also caught 50 passes for the team.

 

Play this year in a expanded role, then see where the contract numbers go.

 

I would point blank tell him and his agent we won't change the numbers at this point, he won't be traded, so he can play or sit...the choice is his. Negotiations over.

 

[Canton Mike]

I agree. As a special team player he is paid well. It isn't like he is a Hester who also caught 50 passes for the team.

 

Play this year in a expanded role, then see where the contract numbers go.

 

I would point blank tell him and his agent we won't change the numbers at this point, he won't be traded, so he can play or sit...the choice is his. Negotiations over.

 

 

Exactly right. Show the team he is worth "beyond" his now excellent special teams money this season, THEN negotiate.

Mike

[NW Ohio Brownie]

I agree. As a special team player he is paid well. It isn't like he is a Hester who also caught 50 passes for the team.

 

Play this year in a expanded role, then see where the contract numbers go.

 

I would point blank tell him and his agent we won't change the numbers at this point, he won't be traded, so he can play or sit...the choice is his. Negotiations over.

 

I agree with most of what you've said, 'peen. However, let me disagree with you on the point about Hester. He is every bit of Hester.

 

Let me explain: 1) As a return man, he is on par with Hester. 2) There is no way Cribbs had as many touches as Hester did in the Bears offense.

 

Now there are two schools of thought on this: 1) Cribbs wasn't good enough to get on the field for the Browns OR 2) The Browns coaches underutilized Cribbs on offense.

 

I choose to believe in #2. Add that to the fact that Hester got paid and there was a supposed promise for Cribbs to see a new payday and there you go.

 

When the smoke clears with this one, I think that Cribbs will be in camp on the existing contract with assurances that he'll have an opportunity to prove himself on the field (offense, ST, defense?) to earn a higher salary.

[nickers]

Cribbs is a baller...when push comes to shove I expect Cribbs to be in camp and ready to play....A true baller plays regardless of contract status because "they love the game"...Yes I know todays athlete is vastly different...However...no one likes sitting out and not getting paid regardless of the sum accrued...That being said...I really dont think theres much to worry about...No one player is the team....

[Sez.EJ]

I don't like whiners who "threaten" to hold out. Your selling our your teamates. You signed a contract. Be a man an honor it. I understand asking for more.. Most teams are reasonable and will at least sit down with your agent and discuss things (which from the article the Browns are going to do next week). If you deserve it, things are usually worked out. But when you draw a line in the sand by saying " I won't play" .. I do not blame the team for saying .." screw me? no screw you!" and not budging on the contract in play.

Cribbs has made his wishes known. Come to play, kick ass, and trust the team will set things right. That's what real men/real teamates do. But I have no sympathy for guys who threaten the team. Everyone is replaceable. my job, your job, and Cribbs job too.

[DawgTracker]

Depending upon what is in his contract I would certainly be willing to sweeten the incentives and maybe give him a slight increase in guaranteed salary. I agree about adding incentives for him becoming a positional player

[NebBrownsFan]

I agree with most of what you've said, 'peen. However, let me disagree with you on the point about Hester. He is every bit of Hester.

 

Let me explain: 1) As a return man, he is on par with Hester. 2) There is no way Cribbs had as many touches as Hester did in the Bears offense.

 

Now there are two schools of thought on this: 1) Cribbs wasn't good enough to get on the field for the Browns OR 2) The Browns coaches underutilized Cribbs on offense.

 

I choose to believe in #2. Add that to the fact that Hester got paid and there was a supposed promise for Cribbs to see a new payday and there you go.

 

When the smoke clears with this one, I think that Cribbs will be in camp on the existing contract with assurances that he'll have an opportunity to prove himself on the field (offense, ST, defense?) to earn a higher salary.

 

Whether its option 1 or option 2, the fact of the matter is that Cribbs has not put the numbers up on offense to warrant a redo on the contract. Hester didn't get his new deal until AFTER he proved he can play WR, and from some reports I have seen, the Bears expect him to be the #1 this season. Cribbs is wanting to be paid based on EXPECTED role expansion, which may or may not happen. I totally agree with your last statement.

[hammertime]

Its been discussed before, but i'm pretty sure his wondurlic score was pretty low.

 

He may have a hard time with picking up the offense.

 

just sayin.

[medicineman]

Look I like Cribbs on our team, But we won 4 games last year! Im not saying by any means that it was his fault but when a team only wins 4 games no player should think he should get more money. somebody wrote on here in the past that this team needs a kick in the ass!

[YtownBrownsBacker]

Depending upon what is in his contract I would certainly be willing to sweeten the incentives and maybe give him a slight increase in guaranteed salary. I agree about adding incentives for him becoming a positional player

 

What bothers me is that he signed a contract with a lot of up front money and now wants a new contract because his current salary is lower then most in his situation. It sort of rubs me the wrong way when they talk about him only making $1+ million this year and he is worth more then that. They seem to want to forget what he got up front counts as part of his salary.

 

I don't know the figures anymore and really don't even care to look them up.

 

1. He signed the contract before his original rookie contract expired because he felt he outplayed it. How many times can you keep doing that.

 

2. The team won 4 games last year. suck it up until you contribute to a winner.

 

3. The team has some cap problems and needs to sign their draft picks and make some moves to shed some salary (like Fraley or Shaun Smith). He needs to chill and be the team player he says he is.

 

4. He is a special teamer and hasn't proved he is anything else yet. How much is a special teamer worth? Come back and ask for more money when you prove you can contribute on offense and/or defense.

 

If anybody deserves a new contract it would be Jackson before Cribbs. He is still playing under his rookie contract. Let's get him signed to an extension first. Sorry Josh, but if you are a team player, let them take care of business and they will get to you..................stop whinning and live up to your word, which is the contract you willingly signed for what you deemed was security for your family.

[WPB Dawg Fan]

Sounds like Cribbs is backtracking a bit on the holdout statements:

 

Joshua Cribbs and Steve Heiden to be Ready for the Start of Training Camp

 

by ChrisPokorny on Jul 20, 2009 10:15 PM EDT

Cleveland Browns KR Joshua Cribbs indicated that he will be in attendance for when veterans report to training camp July 31. Cribbs made the indication when he was interviewed on WKNR recently:

 

"No. 16 will be on the field, proudly."

 

...

 

"I'm going to still play as hard as I can," he said. "I don't know any other way to play. I don't want to go anywhere else, I want to stay in Cleveland. I'm going to do everything I can physically and business-wise to stay in Cleveland because this is where I want to be. If something else happens, I don't think it's on me.

 

"I can't make every person understand my point of view and a lot of fans just don't understand the nature of football and the contract situations and everything. I'm just going to keep playing and I don't mind any fan express any point of view to me and I will respectfully converse with them. I want to see us win big and be a part of that when it happens. Hopefully that happens this year and I'm on that team."

 

 

Jason La Canfora of NFL.com reported that Cribbs' representatives were scheduled to talk with the Browns today in an effort to set up a full face-to-face meeting. Jason states that Cribbs isn't looking for a huge contract upgrade, but wants it to be recognized that he is "out-performing his contract".

 

Another person who should be in training camp is TE Steve Heiden, who tore his ACL and MCL last season. Pro Football Weekly's Mike Wilkening reported the following on Saturday:

 

[Heiden] expects to be cleared to practice when Browns veterans take the field on July 31, his agent, Jack Wirth, recently told PFW. "He’s made great progress," Wirth said, noting that Heiden has told him the only limitation he could have in training camp is that he might be limited to one practice a day.

 

That is very encouraging, especially since I'm not overly thrilled about Robert Royal being our featured tight end. Although some believe Royal has the starting role already, I wouldn't bank on that just yet.

 

Finally, don't forget to check out Terry Pluto's Sunday column, where he relays an executive's thoughts on various Browns topics, among other things.

 

There is a link for the entire 20 minute interview here: Cribbs Interview

[Gips]

I would find it really hard to believe either cribbs or heiden would holdout both are team players and couldnt live with the idea their team needs them and they arent there..

 

Many fans myself included believe Cribbs deserves a big ol raise and he signed a really bad deal but mangini deserves the right to determine his worth in his scheme and with the wedge banned we dont know how this will effect cribbs or if it will at all i think with patience both sides will get what they want....

[LCDawgFan13]

I agree. As a special team player he is paid well. It isn't like he is a Hester who also caught 50 passes for the team.

 

Play this year in a expanded role, then see where the contract numbers go.

 

I would point blank tell him and his agent we won't change the numbers at this point, he won't be traded, so he can play or sit...the choice is his. Negotiations over.

 

While I agree with the notion that he is paid well as a special teams player, I cannot agree with the Hester reference. Hester got his new contract before he made 50 catches for the Bears. He did not do that until this past season, in which he was already playing for his new hefty salary. He got paid that big salary for doing what he did as a return man. Cribbs does just as much as a return man for the Browns as Hester did for the Bears. Now, Cribbs has already been assured an expanded role. He also has already stated that he will not hold out of training camp. He hopes to get something done by the start of the regular season. I believe that shows good faith on his part.

I think that this season should be played under the existing contract but with added incentives for the extra work he is being asked to put in. To tell the guy flat out that he can play or sit..."Negotiations over" does not look good to other players around the league...future free agents. Why would anyone in the future be eager to sign in Cleveland if they already know that, should they far exceed expectations, there will never be any type of negotiations for compensation? The way the NFL works is a little one sided. Teams can cut up a player's contract and not pay him just because they want to save cap-space...but a player has to honor the contract or not get paid. What are the repercussions for teams that violate a signed, legal contract? NOTHING!

[Vegasdogg]

What are the repercussions for teams that violate a signed, legal contract? NOTHING!

Legal contract? I do think the CBA punishes a team for that. There is no getting off scott free, I can say that. It does favor the owners, but lets be honest - the NFLPA agreed to give stupid ass salaries and contract to players - unproven - coming out of the draft. They have some blame to bear as well. They wanted Free Agency, and with it came certain things they needed to give up.

[LCDawgFan13]

Legal contract? I do think the CBA punishes a team for that. There is no getting off scott free, I can say that. It does favor the owners, but lets be honest - the NFLPA agreed to give stupid ass salaries and contract to players - unproven - coming out of the draft. They have some blame to bear as well. They wanted Free Agency, and with it came certain things they needed to give up.

 

What does free agency have to do with team owners not having to honor a players contract? The owners wanted a salary cap...they got it! There's the trade off for free-agency! Where is the job security for the players? As far as rookie salaries....I completely agree! Rookies are HIGHLY overpaid! They have proved nothing except that they can play well against other college students who, more often than not, will never play a down of pro football. But, again, what does that have to do with teams honoring player contracts. Players have to honor their sides, or not get paid. Owners can release a player and it won't hurt their wallets! The MLB has that part right. If you sign a contract, it needs to be honored by both sides!

[NebBrownsFan]

What does free agency have to do with team owners not having to honor a players contract? The owners wanted a salary cap...they got it! There's the trade off for free-agency! Where is the job security for the players? As far as rookie salaries....I completely agree! Rookies are HIGHLY overpaid! They have proved nothing except that they can play well against other college students who, more often than not, will never play a down of pro football. But, again, what does that have to do with teams honoring player contracts. Players have to honor their sides, or not get paid. Owners can release a player and it won't hurt their wallets! The MLB has that part right. If you sign a contract, it needs to be honored by both sides!

 

You seriously don't think the contracts are written in such a way that allows for the teams to "legally" get out of the contract? That's why there are signing bonuses and roster bonuses, etc. Its all a trade-off.

[LCDawgFan13]

You seriously don't think the contracts are written in such a way that allows for the teams to "legally" get out of the contract? That's why there are signing bonuses and roster bonuses, etc. Its all a trade-off.

 

Understood...But where is the "legal" way for a player to get out of the contract when he is clearly underpaid per league standards? The trade-off is a little lopsided there!

[NebBrownsFan]

Understood...But where is the "legal" way for a player to get out of the contract when he is clearly underpaid per league standards? The trade-off is a little lopsided there!

 

How is he underpaid? He's making a mill a year to be a STer. He's wanting Hester type money without currently doing what Hester does. Hester got his money AFTER becoming a bigger part of the Bears offense. Lastly, no one forced him to sign the deal. If he was really worried about being underpaid two years after signing it, maybe his agent should have gotten a clause or two for incentives thrown in.

[WPB Dawg Fan]

How is he underpaid? He's making a mill a year to be a STer. He's wanting Hester type money without currently doing what Hester does. Hester got his money AFTER becoming a bigger part of the Bears offense. Lastly, no one forced him to sign the deal. If he was really worried about being underpaid two years after signing it, maybe his agent should have gotten a clause or two for incentives thrown in.

Hester signed his contract on 7/27/2008. Prior to that he had only 20 receptions on the offense. Cribbs already has 16 receptions. And Cribbs has a much bigger role as the QB in the Browns WildDawg....so not sure where you get that.

[LCDawgFan13]

How is he underpaid? He's making a mill a year to be a STer. He's wanting Hester type money without currently doing what Hester does. Hester got his money AFTER becoming a bigger part of the Bears offense. Lastly, no one forced him to sign the deal. If he was really worried about being underpaid two years after signing it, maybe his agent should have gotten a clause or two for incentives thrown in.

 

To add to what WPB was saying, Cribbs has had more kick return yards and more yards per return than Hester has over the past 3 seasons. All while keeping pace with him in TD's. Yes, Hester has the better punt return numbers, but not by much. And Cribbs has had a huge impact rushing the ball in comparison to Hester.

 

Oh yeah...how many tackles has Hester made on special teams? Cribbs blows him out of the water there too! Cribbs is much more valuable to the Browns than Hester is to Chicago. He does more and his overall stats are better than Hester's. Cribbs deserves more money than he is making, by far. By league standards, based on performance, he deserves at least as much as Hester. And now, the Browns coaching staff is asking him to do even more, by asking him to play on defense too? C'mon...give the guy a raise! They'll regret it if they trade him!

[WPB Dawg Fan]

Honestly, I believe what the Browns may be saying is "get into camp and prove you can be either a WR or a DB and we will pony up....until then you are mainly a ST".

 

That's how I would play it anyway.

[WPB Dawg Fan]

Latest update...sounds like the talks are at least ongoing!

 

Cribbs and the Browns still talking

 

Posted: July 24th, 2009 | Jason La Canfora | Tags: Brady Quinn, Cleveland Browns, contract, Derek Anderson, Eric Mangini, George Kokinis, holdout, Josh Cribbs

 

For the second time this week, officials from the Cleveland Browns and representatives for Pro Bowl return specialist Josh Cribbs held a conference call to discuss the player’s situation. The sides held their second conversation Thursday, according to a source, chatting for roughly three hours. The Browns and Cribbs are still scheduled to hold face-to-face meetings with the player, who has contributed to the team’s WildDawg formation as a quarterback and worked as a receiver and a defensive back. Cribbs did not take part in the conference call himself, sources said.

 

Cribbs, a wide receiver by trade, has been looking for the organization to be open to altering his contract, which has four years remaining, believing he has outperformed his level of compensation. Cribbs has been seriously considering holding out of the start of training camp, and a final decision on whether to report on time will come after the face-to-face meeting with team officials, the source said. The Browns, with a new coach (Eric Mangini) and general manager (George Kokinis), had been unwilling to change Cribbs’ deal. Mangini has a reputation as a hard-line guy, and this is one of many challenges facing him and his team, with the Browns also looking at a quarterback competition between Derek Anderson and Brady Quinn.

 

Cribbs, 26, was a college quarterback at Kent. He is in his fifth year after entering the league as an undrafted free agent.

[ndneighbor]

http://blogs.nfl.com/2009/07/25/cribbs-rep...a-happy-camper/

 

 

 

Cribbs Reporting to Browns, But Not A Happy Camper

 

Josh Cribbs will be in Cleveland this week and taking part in Browns training camp. We know that much in regards to the Pro Bowl return specialist from sources close to the player. Beyond that, however, much remains in limbo.

 

As we’ve reported (Steve Wyche was first on the story), Cribbs is unhappy with his contract and wants the Browns’ new front office and coaching staff to uphold a promise made the previous coach and general manager to re-work the final four years on his contract. That sentiment has not changed, according to sources, with Cribbs’s decision to attend camp not an indication that he’s a happy camper.

 

Cribbs, who made an impact in the WildDawg formation and plays receiver, remains prepared to sit out the start of the regular season barring some resolution regarding his contract, sources said. To this point coach Eric Mangini, who has significant power in that organization, has not been willing to alter Cribbs’s deal. Cribbs’s agents and the Browns spoke several times this week and will begin face-to-face meetings Thursday, sources said. Cribbs is hopeful that at some point between now and September the team will give him some additional incentives, triggers or achievable bonuses to sweeten his deal.

 

Cribbs is not seeking a Devin Hester contract, according to a source, and isn’t fixated on certain figures, but is fixated on procuring some additional compensation in one form or another.

 

So this saga will continue for at least a little while longer. Maybe the sides come to some sort of agreement Thursday that makes Cribbs content, but there is nothing forcing the Browns to do anything contractually in this circumstance, hence the stalemate. Both sides can make strong arguments, and we’ll keep monitoring it.