Switch To 3-4

[cribbs is the man]

As Im sure most of you have heard, there is a big possibility that our defense moves to a 3-4 or at least a "hybrid" 3-4/4-3 in the words of Chud. Personally, I am not thrilled about starting over a bit in a promising defensive season but I want to hear about what you all think about our personnel if we move to a 3-4.

 

RE: P. Taylor, J. Hughes

NT: A. Rubin, P. Taylor

LE: F. Rucker, B. Winn (or vice versa)

 

D-line looks pretty good in the 3-4 to me, we have a plethora of D-linemen with size and athleticism. Just the change in the system is the only thing I have a problem with.

 

OLB: Sheard, ???, J. Parker?

ILB: Dqwell, JMJ, Gocong

 

Again as we saw with Mangini and Crennel's 3-4, the LB corp is huge in the system. It is really unfortunate that this is the weakest part of our team IMO. Can Sheard make the transition? Is he (and Parker) quick/athletic enough to make the shift? Man, Jarvis Jones sounds pretty sweet at #6 now...

 

DBs: not really changed much in the 3-4 (at least not that I am aware of). We still need another CB. Maybe a FS.

 

What are your guy's thoughts on the possible change?

[CLEVELANDwantsPLAYOFFS]

As Im sure most of you have heard, there is a big possibility that our defense moves to a 3-4 or at least a "hybrid" 3-4/4-3 in the words of Chud. Personally, I am not thrilled about starting over a bit in a promising defensive season but I want to hear about what you all think about our personnel if we move to a 3-4.

 

RE: P. Taylor, J. Hughes

NT: A. Rubin, P. Taylor

LE: F. Rucker, B. Winn (or vice versa)

 

D-line looks pretty good in the 3-4 to me, we have a plethora of D-linemen with size and athleticism. Just the change in the system is the only thing I have a problem with.

 

OLB: Sheard, ???, J. Parker?

ILB: Dqwell, JMJ, Gocong

 

Again as we saw with Mangini and Crennel's 3-4, the LB corp is huge in the system. It is really unfortunate that this is the weakest part of our team IMO. Can Sheard make the transition? Is he (and Parker) quick/athletic enough to make the shift? Man, Jarvis Jones sounds pretty sweet at #6 now...

 

DBs: not really changed much in the 3-4 (at least not that I am aware of). We still need another CB. Maybe a FS.

 

What are your guy's thoughts on the possible change?

 

if we were in the 3-4 Big Phil would be great at NT, but with the amount of depth we have it would make sense to trade someone away. And for defensive end? I feel that billy Wynn is surprisingly quick so maybe him.. but we certainly need upgrades at the end and outside linebacker spot.

[FairHooker11]

I can see a hybrid system work, hell- we see versions of it everywhere now in the league

 

what I dont want to see is a Crennel style experiment like that of Kam Wimbley, a DE at Fla STate

 

drafted #1 and put in at OLB - it didnt work

 

just as long as we dont hang our hat on a 3-4 that is exclusive and wont utilize what could be a bull rush from

 

what we now have at 4 down linemen....

 

besides Dquell Jackson thrived in this system.....

[cribbs is the man]

I can see a hybrid system work, hell- we see versions of it everywhere now in the league

 

what I dont want to see is a Crennel style experiment like that of Kam Wimbley, a DE at Fla STate

 

drafted #1 and put in at OLB - it didnt work

 

just as long as we dont hang our hat on a 3-4 that is exclusive and wont utilize what could be a bull rush from

 

what we now have at 4 down linemen....

 

besides Dquell Jackson thrived in this system.....

 

But that's pretty much exactly what we'd be doing with Sheard.

[Browns149]

The coach will get the players required to properly execute the system. Those who don't fit will be gone at the frop of a hat.

 

Cribbs is history as well. Shit player. Shit human being.

Mangini tried that philosophy, and look were it got him.

[nickers]

The coach will get the players required to properly execute the system. Those who don't fit will be gone at the frop of a hat.

 

Cribbs is history as well. Shit player. Shit human being.

 

 

 

I think thats going way overboard...because Cribbs has done alot in the community...Kids look up to him..yeah,the pouting to the media about certain issues was wrong but...I still think Cribbs is a class act.

[Harry Buffalo]

We need to look OLB first and foremost. The only person on the roster who might be able to play OLB in a 3-4 is Sheard and that is a very solid maybe. He would have to lose a bit of weight. We would be set on NT and DE. You take the quicker of Rubin and Taylor and put them into a DE spot and then start Billy Winn at the other open spot. We got Jackson, JMJ, Gocong, and Miavia in the middle. Just no depth for OLB.

[cribbs is the man]

We need to look OLB first and foremost. The only person on the roster who might be able to play OLB in a 3-4 is Sheard and that is a very solid maybe. He would have to lose a bit of weight. We would be set on NT and DE. You take the quicker of Rubin and Taylor and put them into a DE spot and then start Billy Winn at the other open spot. We got Jackson, JMJ, Gocong, and Miavia in the middle. Just no depth for OLB.

 

So who would you want for OLB? Obviously Jarvis Jones is a candidate, Mingo from LSU? Who else from the draft? Is it too early to talk about 2013 OLB free agents? I think Anthony Spencer for Dallas is a free agent, dont know much about him.

[Represent]

I think thats going way overboard...because Cribbs has done alot in the community...Kids look up to him..yeah,the pouting to the media about certain issues was wrong but...I still think Cribbs is a class act.

 

 

I agree, class act all the way around good guy and def had his moments in a Browns uni.

[blitzz2]

How about J.Jones in 1st and John SImon in 3rd if available.

[DanInNYC]

Here is how I see it:

 

DE: Phil Taylor/Hughes

NT: Aytabu Rubin/Kitchen

DE: Rucker/Winn

 

Jack: Sheard-Essentially 4th DL but can help in coverage in passing downs

Mike: DQ-Essentially your MLB in 4-3 and leader

Buck: JMJ/Gocong-Run support primarily and some pass coverage

Will: ??Roberston/Fort-Various responsibilities including pass rush and coverage

 

Our biggest weakspots are obviously in the LB corps most glaringly the Will LB and lack of depth. It might not be as painful as I previously thought, but with our holes in the secondary, it would take some work to get all of the personnel needed to fill in at CB, FS, and get a Will LB and LB depth. I am not sure how Sheard would do as the Jack LB but he did spend some of this season standing up and dropping into coverage if you watched closely.

[Harry Buffalo]

So who would you want for OLB? Obviously Jarvis Jones is a candidate, Mingo from LSU? Who else from the draft? Is it too early to talk about 2013 OLB free agents? I think Anthony Spencer for Dallas is a free agent, dont know much about him.

 

I wouldn't touch Jones sooner than the 2nd if I were picking for any team in the NFL. He has the talent, I have no doubt about his ability. My issue is his spinal problem. Hurts his back again he could be done. I would go with Moore or trade back and pick up Mingo.

[bringbackbrownie2]

Here is how I see it:

 

DE: Phil Taylor/Hughes

NT: Aytabu Rubin/Kitchen

DE: Rucker/Winn

 

Jack: Sheard-Essentially 4th DL but can help in coverage in passing downs

Mike: DQ-Essentially your MLB in 4-3 and leader

Buck: JMJ/Gocong-Run support primarily and some pass coverage

Will: ??Roberston/Fort-Various responsibilities including pass rush and coverage

 

Our biggest weakspots are obviously in the LB corps most glaringly the Will LB and lack of depth. It might not be as painful as I previously thought, but with our holes in the secondary, it would take some work to get all of the personnel needed to fill in at CB, FS, and get a Will LB and LB depth. I am not sure how Sheard would do as the Jack LB but he did spend some of this season standing up and dropping into coverage if you watched closely.

 

Our sack leader (Sheard) should only be put in for PASS COVERAGE? You are out of your mind..

[MLD Woody]

I agree, class act all the way around good guy and def had his moments in a Browns uni.

 

Like him and Dawson single handedly winning us games? Lol

[PoeticG]

Phil Taylor -

 

Rubin -

 

Sheard -

 

Billy Winn -

 

John Hughes -

 

DQ Jackson -

 

Kaluka -

 

GoCong -

 

Eight... That's 8 guys on the interior that I can think of off the top of my head that are worth keeping on the roster in some way. There are a couple of other guys that have potential but have yet to solidify a spot or step away from the crowd. Guys like Robinson, Fort, "the other Jackson", and Acho still have a lot to prove.

 

As well, in the secondary there are many spots 'up in the air'. Free Safety, CB #2, 3, and 4.

 

The point of a defense is to stop the offense.. I don't care if it's a 3-4, 4-3, 4-6 or a 2-5 - just find a way to stop the offense. Get the best players and put them out there. STOP SOMEBODY. Don't get caught in the trap of comformity, use what you're given in a creative way and stop them.

[PoeticG]

Put Cribbs back at the Free Safety position and watch the magic happen.

 

Let Cribbs run a complete series from time to time.

 

Let him run or pass, that is what makes it deadly. Then sprinkle in the Wildog from time to time.

 

So what if he goes 3-in-out or causes a turnover... our Starting QB and WR's do that shit all the time, let the "kid" play!

 

Cribbs has left so much out there because our Head Coaches can't or will-not think outside the fucking box.

 

Put Cribbs back there with Richardson and Colt, who's getting the ball... HMMM?- IT'S A FUCKING HEAD-SCRATCHER, RIGHT?

[Mark O]

 

 

Put Cribbs back there with Richardson and Colt, who's getting the ball... HMMM?- IT'S A FUCKING HEAD-SCRATCHER, RIGHT?

 

Colt is done with the Browns. The head coach wants a vertcle attacking offense. Colt can't throw the ball out of his own shadow, he's done in Cleveland.

[thenew23]

Switching to the 3-4 base would be dumb. Taking a player off the field from our deepest position and putting one our weakest in just doesn't make sense.

 

IF Sheard is able to adjust to OLB (and thats a big if) then maybe, but DQ was not good in 3-4 and neither was Gocong. Hopefully our new DC and Chud are able to recognize what works and not try to force a square peg in a round hole. We have athleticism at LB just not sure theres enough size, strength, or talent.

[BadNewsBrowns]

Well it's not like we were fielding the second coming of the 85 Bears this past season anyhow.

 

The D was decent but not great, you never know, Sheard may excel in a 3-4.

[DanInNYC]

Our sack leader (Sheard) should only be put in for PASS COVERAGE? You are out of your mind..

 

Please actually read what I write before responding and calling me crazy. Or at least google Jack LB and learn what the responsibilities of that position are. This reminds me of the saying: I am only responsible for what I say, not what you hear.

 

Phil Taylor - Rubin -Sheard - Billy Winn - John Hughes - DQ Jackson -Kaluka -GoCong - Eight... That's 8 guys on the interior that I can think of off the top of my head that are worth keeping on the roster in some way. There are a couple of other guys that have potential but have yet to solidify a spot or step away from the crowd. Guys like Robinson, Fort, "the other Jackson", and Acho still have a lot to prove. As well, in the secondary there are many spots 'up in the air'. Free Safety, CB #2, 3, and 4.The point of a defense is to stop the offense.. I don't care if it's a 3-4, 4-3, 4-6 or a 2-5 - just find a way to stop the offense. Get the best players and put them out there. STOP SOMEBODY. Don't get caught in the trap of comformity, use what you're given in a creative way and stop them.

 

I am a fan of keeping Gocong around for run stopping support depth, depth, and veteran leadership, but Maiava is very underwhelming. He is too small and rarely makes plays. I am much higher on JMJ than him. I think Kitchen has shown flashes this year as well, and deserves mention. Paker and Rucker have been decent additions too. They were solid role players this year, especially once Big Phil and Aytaba were both healthy in the middle of the line.

[Harry Buffalo]

Please actually read what I write before responding and calling me crazy. Or at least google Jack LB and learn what the responsibilities of that position are. This reminds me of the saying: I am only responsible for what I say, not what you hear.

 

 

 

I am a fan of keeping Gocong around for run stopping support depth, depth, and veteran leadership, but Maiava is very underwhelming. He is too small and rarely makes plays. I am much higher on JMJ than him. I think Kitchen has shown flashes this year as well, and deserves mention. Paker and Rucker have been decent additions too. They were solid role players this year, especially once Big Phil and Aytaba were both healthy in the middle of the line.

 

Ok, so your saying that you want to put Sheard in at Jack LB, which you are saying is the side that normally is reserved for pass coverage? Regardless it is a stupid idea. BTW Maiava did well his rookie season the games he played at MLB. There is a huge difference between his play in a 4-3 on the outside and his play in the 3-4 on the inside.

[nickers]

Switching to the 3-4 base would be dumb. Taking a player off the field from our deepest position and putting one our weakest in just doesn't make sense.

 

IF Sheard is able to adjust to OLB (and thats a big if) then maybe, but DQ was not good in 3-4 and neither was Gocong. Hopefully our new DC and Chud are able to recognize what works and not try to force a square peg in a round hole. We have athleticism at LB just not sure theres enough size, strength, or talent.

 

 

My problem with the browns D is still line backing and secondary...the Dline could use a speed rusher at end..not sure the Rucker and Sheard are it but perform solidly. We need more speed on the perimeter. I think this is gonna be one of these drafts that no matter what positions we draft for in the first round...Its gonna help...Maybe not instantly...but it will help .

[The Gipper]

Colt is done with the Browns. The head coach wants a vertcle attacking offense. Colt can't throw the ball out of his own shadow, he's done in Cleveland.

 

Rumors are that Chud may even be willing to bring back DA as a backup. Whattaya think of that?

[thenew23]

Rumors are that Chud may even be willing to bring back DA as a backup. Whattaya think of that?

 

Shoot me now!!!

[DanInNYC]

Ok, so your saying that you want to put Sheard in at Jack LB, which you are saying is the side that normally is reserved for pass coverage? Regardless it is a stupid idea. BTW Maiava did well his rookie season the games he played at MLB. There is a huge difference between his play in a 4-3 on the outside and his play in the 3-4 on the inside.

 

OK let's try this again. The Jack LB is essentially a fourth DL (which, again, if you would have taken two seconds to look up in google you would know)except in some passing situations where he would drop into coverage which he already was doing this year at times. Secondly, I never once said that I wanted them to change to a 3-4. I just gave my evaluation of how I see it breaking down and commented that it might not be as painful as I first thought it would be. Reading comprehension in this thread is at an all time low.

[Zombo]

Rumors are that Chud may even be willing to bring back DA as a backup. Whattaya think of that?

 

In the words of Lumbergh: "Backup my ass!"

 

Zombo

[JAFBF]

Back on topic:

 

"Browns targeting John Pagano as their new defensive coordinator, ESPN reports" = 3 - 4 Defense

 

http://www.ohio.com/blogs/cleveland-browns/cleveland-browns-1.270107/browns-targeting-john-pagano-as-their-new-defensive-coordinator-espn-reports-1.364461

[Harry Buffalo]

OK let's try this again. The Jack LB is essentially a fourth DL (which, again, if you would have taken two seconds to look up in google you would know)except in some passing situations where he would drop into coverage which he already was doing this year at times. Secondly, I never once said that I wanted them to change to a 3-4. I just gave my evaluation of how I see it breaking down and commented that it might not be as painful as I first thought it would be. Reading comprehension in this thread is at an all time low.

 

Your right, Sheard who dropped back into coverage about twice a game and had no impact in that regard would be perfect for the position. Fact of the matter is that Sheard does not do well in space which is something that EITHER OLB will need to do in the new 3-4. He would need to lose weight to have any chance and even then I do not think a career 4-3 DE of his athletism, while good enough in a 4-3, will be able to make an impact in the 3-4.

[DanInNYC]

Your right, Sheard who dropped back into coverage about twice a game and had no impact in that regard would be perfect for the position. Fact of the matter is that Sheard does not do well in space which is something that EITHER OLB will need to do in the new 3-4. He would need to lose weight to have any chance and even then I do not think a career 4-3 DE of his athletism, while good enough in a 4-3, will be able to make an impact in the 3-4.

 

Sheard is similar in size (height/weight) to Brian Orakpo and Terrell Suggs for example. It is my opinion that the jury is out on whether or not he can cover in space because we have not seen him do it enough.

[Harry Buffalo]

Sheard is similar in size (height/weight) to Brian Orakpo and Terrell Suggs for example. It is my opinion that the jury is out on whether or not he can cover in space because we have not seen him do it enough.

 

And as mentioned he does not have the athleticism of the two players you just mentioned. This is why I say Taylor can play DE in the 3-4 cause he had the athleticism needed to play there, Sheard does not have enough to play OLB.