Braylon rumors?

[lemosley01]

Disagree. Most receivers don't hit their stride until year 3, which is when he blew up. Last year there were so many problems both on the field and off that I can hardly hold his performance against him. If he's traded then so be it, but I'd like to see him around because I know he can get it done after he sheds that mental block.

 

We have a guy who is known for dropping a LOT of footballs.

 

Even in 2007, he dropped a lot of footballs.

 

2007 is the abberation. What did we see this year? Lack of concentration, sloppy route-running, lack of effort.

 

Seems just like his first few years in the league. He shouldn't be regressing in those areas at year 4.

 

I stand by me assertation that 05/06/08 are representative of Edwards, not 2007.

[Guest Masters]

True that Edwards is a sloppy route runner. I have harped on it since the day CLE drafted him. But he, just like so many good WRs can get away with it. He had 12 drops in 2007 with 80 catches. That ain't dropping a lot. Especially compared to guys like TO.

 

Edwards got gator arms after getting hung out to dry to many times. If he can get that out of his head, he'll be right back to the 2007 form.

 

[choco]

thats alot of confidence in a guy that thinks we dont like him for his alma mater.....

[YtownBrownsBacker]

True that Edwards is a sloppy route runner. I have harped on it since the day CLE drafted him. But he, just like so many good WRs can get away with it. He had 12 drops in 2007 with 80 catches. That ain't dropping a lot. Especially compared to guys like TO.

 

Edwards got gator arms after getting hung out to dry to many times. If he can get that out of his head, he'll be right back to the 2007 form.

 

Edwards has dropped balls at every level and will keep on dropping balls. Fact is that if you keep him you live with the drops and hope he has more circus catches.

[Guest Masters]

Edwards has dropped balls at every level and will keep on dropping balls. Fack is that if you keep him you live with the drops and hope he has more circus catches.

 

Yup. When he wasn't hearing the foot steps his first 3 years, that was the case. Put him with a QB that doesn't hang him out to dry all day, he'll be right back to doing that.

[sisky fringo]

and no one factors in the circus-catching ability 90% (98%?) of the league doesn't even have. w/ them he almost makes up for the drops.

he's young and might play for ten more years. (!) this guy gets a looong leash w/ me.

 

why is it the rest of the league doesn't seem to think it's a big deal? CLE is leading the charge on the Bray-hate.

[Geech]

...I'll try and dig up some info...

 

-Al

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d5d8...mp;confirm=true

 

 

Posted 10 months ago

 

Uncapped years would actually limit free agency

By Pat Kirwan | NFL.com

Senior Analyst

 

Now that NFL owners have voted unanimously to end their agreement with the players' union in 2011, they still have all of 2008 and 2009 to negotiate a new CBA before the "trigger" points that are in place to encourage negotiations would fire and things wouldn't be as we know them today.

 

The one factor fans have heard the most about is that 2010 and 2011 would be "uncapped" years. But there are three main trigger points that will go off in 2010 if there isn't a new CBA in place, and they may offset the fear of life with no salary cap. They are: 1) free agency will require six years of service (instead of four years in 2010 and five years in 2011); 2) teams will have three tags to use to restrict free agents instead of one tag, as they do now; and 3) teams that go deep in the playoffs could have some spending restrictions.

 

Let's take a look at the practical side of these three concepts to get a better understanding of just what they mean to the players and the clubs:

Longer to hit free agency

 

To get a clearer picture, let's see what this year's free-agency period would have looked like if players needed more than four years of service to reach the open market.

 

Let's start with the Tennessee Titans. They lost defensive ends Travis LaBoy (Arizona) and Antwan Odom (Cincinnati) as well as guard Jacob Bell (St. Louis). The three players signed for a combined total of $87.5 million ($32 million guaranteed). If the extension on time to free agency was in place, none of these players would have been free. All of them had just four years of service and would have remained Titans for upwards of two more years. The Titans would have probably changed their draft strategy and not gone after defensive linemen Jason Jones or William Hayes and could have taken a receiver or a corner.

 

Other players that never would have seen a big payday: Michael Turner, who signed a $34.5 million deal ($15 million guaranteed) with Atlanta, would still be LaDainian Tomlinson's backup in San Diego; Gibril Wilson would still be a Giant; D.J. Hackett a Seahawk.

 

Teams have gotten very smart about the type of players they pay in free agency. They target young players four or five years removed from college that are approaching the big second contract in their careers. That group would be eliminated if teams vote not to continue the current CBA and it gets to an uncapped year in 2010 and 2011.

 

All you have to do to realize how lean the free agent market will be is go back and look at all the players from the 2005 draft who signed five-year deals, all the players from the 2006 draft who signed four-year deals and even players from the 2007 draft who signed four-year deals. None of these players, under the non-CBA trigger points, would be eligible for unrestricted free agency when their originals contracts expire. Here are some examples of whom it might affect if the owners choose not to continue the current CBA and a new CBA isn't negotiated:

 

Second-round picks from 2006 such as DeMeco Ryans, D'Qwell Jackson, Rocky McIntosh, Thomas Howard, Deuce Lutui, LenDale White, Cedric Griffin, Marcus McNeill, Greg Jennings, and Tarvaris Jackson should be the core of the free-agent market in 2010, but unless they have the ability to "void" their contracts, they will not be free as planned. They would stay with their teams as restricted free agents and it might mean two more years of service before they experience the big payday.

 

The 2007 draft, especially in the second and third rounds, already has a number of budding stars such as Justin Blalock, Trent Edwards, Eric Wright, James Jones, Tony Ugoh, Samson Satele, Sidney Rice, Steve Smith, David Harris, Zach Miller, LaMarr Woodley, Brandon Mebane, and Arron Sears, to name a few. All are scheduled to be free in 2011, but all would fall short of the five years of service required under the trigger points.

 

There are at least another 30 to 50 quality young players from later rounds of the '06 and '07 drafts who will not see free agency -- players such as Elvis Dumervil, Willie Colon, Dawan Landry, and Antoine Bethea from 2006, and Marshal Yanda, Kevin Boss, Michael Bush, Cliff Ryan, and Tanard Jackson from '07.

Three tags instead of one

 

Currently, a team can put either a franchise tag (average of the top five salaries at his position) or a transition tag (average of the top ten salaries at his position) on any one player on the club to protect the team from losing the unrestricted free agent. If the NFL gets to an uncapped year in 2010 and 2011, teams will have use of one franchise tag and two transition tags. So not only would none of the young players with less than six years of service be free, but now the top three players who are eligible for free agency on a roster can be protected.

 

If this situation existed in 2008, a team like Pittsburgh -- which used a transition tag to retain OT Max Starks -- could have also tagged Alan Faneca with either a transition or franchise tag if it so desired. If every team in the league used one or two tags, not even the three they would possess, it could take another 40 quality free agents off the market.

 

There is speculation teams would not overuse this trigger because so many of their quality younger players would not be free to depart.

Playoff restrictions

 

If the league gets to the point of an uncapped year, people are afraid that deep-pocket owners such as Jerry Jones and Daniel Snyder will come in and buy a championship. If the aggressive owners already have playoff teams, there will be restrictions on how much money they can spend. The formula may slide with the number of players they lose in free agency, but the plan is designed to not let teams buy a championship. The truth is, the first two triggers aren't going to leave too many players available to acquire anyway.

 

Time will tell, but I think the NFL and the NFLPA will negotiate a new CBA before we ever get to 2010. I also believe a number of the players looking at the prospect of 2010 and 2011 being uncapped and preventing them from being free agents will try to sign long-term extensions with their teams in the near future.

 

And don't think all the trigger points favor the clubs, because there are other things -- like the end of the NFL draft in 2011 -- which the league doesn't necessarily want to see. And the emergence of a new league could complicate matters. If the owners decide not to continue the CBA this week, all is not lost. There is time, and there are triggers in place, to get this solved.

 

-Al

[Erie Dawg]

Im starting to wonder if we are all watching the same browns? Now we have the excuses that he gets hung out to dry all the time, piss poor Qb trowing the ball, and gator arms.

Am I the only one that seen plenty of catches hit his hands with the defender a few yards behind or go through his hands and hit him in the face mask? Sure there were some uncathable but

His JOB is to CATCH the ball. Not all throws by any QB are right between the numbers on every pass but other wide outs seem to make the catch or take the hit for the team. The way some here talk it makes me wonder if I watched the same 16 games last year as the rest.

 

[Guest Masters]

Im starting to wonder if we are all watching the same browns? Now we have the excuses that he gets hung out to dry all the time, piss poor Qb trowing the ball, and gator arms.

Am I the only one that seen plenty of catches hit his hands with the defender a few yards behind or go through his hands and hit him in the face mask? Sure there were some uncathable but

His JOB is to CATCH the ball. Not all throws by any QB are right between the numbers on every pass but other wide outs seem to make the catch or take the hit for the team. The way some here talk it makes me wonder if I watched the same 16 games last year as the rest.

 

Not saying he was still getting hung out this year. He wasn't. Of course the majority of his and DA's game together was taken away since late last season. But last season, he made the big catches, but also got hung out to dry a ton by DA (BE, Winslow, and JJ really). To the point all 3 of those guys were shaking their heads after plays. All I am saying is all those hits have gotten in BE's head and likely led to his gator arms in 2008 (he did not show that trait in 2007).

 

Now gator arms are not the only reason for every drop (and I never said it was). BE has concentration lapses an above average amounts of time. It's who he is.

 

It's not just about the last 16 games you watched (and if you watched those you know the whole team underchieved and phoned in most of the season), but about the last 32 games to judge Braylon on. Really to truly evaluate the player, you have to look at every game he played in. When viewing that, BE had an off season in 2008 and can see the difference in how he goes after the ball (or didn't in 2008). Getting lit up a lot very often makes WR start protecting themselves, rather than just focusing on the ball and catch. It's not meant to be an excuse, but it is a reality in the equation.

[Erie Dawg]

It's not just about the last 16 games you watched (and if you watched those you know the whole team underchieved and phoned in most of the season), but about the last 32 games to judge Braylon on. Really to truly evaluate the player, you have to look at every game he played in. When viewing that, BE had an off season in 2008 and can see the difference in how he goes after the ball (or didn't in 2008). Getting lit up a lot very often makes WR start protecting themselves, rather than just focusing on the ball and catch. It's not meant to be an excuse, but it is a reality in the equation.

Here is what I see or saw plain and simple he doesn't look comfortable. He jumps when there is no need to jump looks up field before he makes the catch etc.

Yeah I will agree that most of the team quit and most of that was the coaches fault collectively but w/o a veteran presence in the locker room its hard to reunite a team with a hanging head.

How great would it be to have a Ray Lewis type presence to bitch slap some of these guys when they act like bitches.

[Flugel]

Im starting to wonder if we are all watching the same browns? Now we have the excuses that he gets hung out to dry all the time, piss poor Qb trowing the ball, and gator arms.

Am I the only one that seen plenty of catches hit his hands with the defender a few yards behind or go through his hands and hit him in the face mask?

 

Good question because you seem like the only person that forgets Edwards snagged 17 TD receptions the year before. That being the case, could you remind me how many of our WRs over the past 30 years have done better than that in 1 season? Who's the alternative exciting you more on our roster?

 

Sure he dropped the ball. Let's not be in such a hurry to label him as useless to our passing game as Northcutt. You know why you NOTICE drops more - because our QB wasn't capable of delivering more than 1 or 2 throws conducive to YAC instead of YUCK last year. We always notice the drops most when our QBing isn't up to snuff.

 

Against the NY Giants, Edwards had 5 receptions for 154 yards and 1 TD. I'm sure he dropped 1 that night too but it's amazing when Edwards understands he'll can get 5 more good opportunities to cash in on that game. More games like that from DA and there's NO QB controversy, WR worries and we're all setski. Like it or not, we ask alot of Edwards which requires winning jump balls in traffic and landing safely with them. He blew out his knee as a rookie in 1 of those jump balls; and thew SAME kid was ready to go week 1 the very next season. Remember the 80 yard bomb he scored on vrs the Saints called back for Shaffer holding? I do.

 

Here's the thing, and pay attention because it matters - when Randy Moss had a crappy Oakland QB throwing him passes, he dropped more passes than ever before, lost interest and found the Stallworth hammy excuses (you can only measure by "how are ya feeling?"). Then Moss went to the best QB, best team where he had Wes Welker clearing out people underneathe and minimizing as much attention as possible. He had similar luxuries in Minnesota.

 

Bottom line: the more weapons we put in this offense - the better each prong gets. When St Louis lost the luxury of Marshall Faulk's speed in that offense, the talent levels of Holt and Bruce depreciated pretty quickly. Don't you think not having a WR opposite Edwards increased traffic volumes and contact for Braylon? Like you asked - are we watching the same team?

- Tom F.

[choco]

i think everything can now officially be blamed on DA.

 

 

braylon forgot how to catch because DA sucks. braylon turned into a pussy because DA sucks. winslow was upset because DA sucks. quinn cried in his pants because DA sucks.

 

 

 

its about as old a limberg doggin quinn.

 

 

maybe, just maybe, braylon is a headcase, and had one lucky year. i see nothing different between DA being a one hit wonder and braylon being in the same boat.

[Gips]

i really dont think anyone would give up a 1st rounder for butterfingers

Unfortunately i dont think anyone would give a 1st for butterfingers either..the only guys we have that we can get 1st round picks for is rogers and maybe quinn...cribbs as well but we wont go there!

[Erie Dawg]

Good question because you seem like the only person that forgets Edwards snagged 17 TD receptions the year before. That being the case, could you remind me how many of our WRs over the past 30 years have done better than that in 1 season? Who's the alternative exciting you more on our roster?

 

I Thought this thread was about trade value as of now? What good is he if there is no one else to be the #2? I'm looking past 2009.

 

Sure he dropped the ball. Let's not be in such a hurry to label him as useless to our passing game as Northcutt. You know why you NOTICE drops more - because our QB wasn't capable of delivering more than 1 or 2 throws conducive to YAC instead of YUCK last year. We always notice the drops most when our QBing isn't up to snuff.

I'm not calling him useless I say he has to work harder and maybe he will turn around but are we giong to sit and wait through that?

Like I said earlier "Am I the only one that seen plenty of catches hit his hands with the defender a few yards behind or go through his hands and hit him in the face mask? Sure there were some uncathable but

His JOB is to CATCH the ball. Not all throws by any QB are right between the numbers on every pass but other wide outs seem to make the catch or take the hit for the team." Do we pay these guys to catch?

Remember the 80 yard bomb he scored on vrs the Saints called back for Shaffer holding? I do.

No i don't remember playing them in 08 or 07 for that matter.

Do you remember-vs Bal. the ball that hit him in the hands when he ran a post and he was wide open and didn't catch it? 2008

Here's the thing, and pay attention because it matters - when Randy Moss had a crappy Oakland QB throwing him passes, he dropped more passes than ever before, lost interest and found the Stallworth hammy excuses (you can only measure by "how are ya feeling?"). Then Moss went to the best QB, best team where he had Wes Welker clearing out people underneathe and minimizing as much attention as possible. He had similar luxuries in Minnesota.

I see no comparison, Moss layed down hard on the Raiders even the press said it and I think most see it that way too.

[YtownBrownsBacker]

Here is what I see or saw plain and simple he doesn't look comfortable. He jumps when there is no need to jump looks up field before he makes the catch etc.

Yeah I will agree that most of the team quit and most of that was the coaches fault collectively but w/o a veteran presence in the locker room its hard to reunite a team with a hanging head.

How great would it be to have a Ray Lewis type presence to bitch slap some of these guys when they act like bitches.

 

Edwards catches the ball with his body instead of his hands, again that's why he jumps when he doesn't have to. Most receivers who catch the ball with their body drop balls. Coaches worked every day in practice with Edwards to catch balls with his hands and bring them to his body and he does that during practice and in some games when he doesn't have time to think. But, he always reverts back letting the ball get to his body and trying to wrap his arms around it.

 

He knows how to catch and when he doesn't have to think (some circus catches) he makes catches with his hands. He lacks concentration and confidence. Once he drops a ball, he will try to jump up so the next one hits him in the gut and he can wrap it up.

 

Sorry, but he will never be a consistent receiver unless someone can get inside his head. So, you take what he gives you which is a combination of 2007 and 2008 and live with it or you move on. Reminds me of someone with ADD, and that isn't said to be funny. He defends himself because he lacks confidence yet he can't seem to maintain a high level of concentration. In one respect, he is somwhat like Dennis Northcutt, but bigger and a better physical specimen. I wonder how this guy did academically at Michigan and how he did on the NFL testing?

 

Bottom line is you can't blame it all on the QBs. Edwards is his own worst enemy.