Clevfan4life Posted September 3, 2015 Report Share Posted September 3, 2015 I know we still have Shelton, but letting Phil and Kitchen go pretty much wiped out our depth at "real" NT. I know we have guys that can technically play 3-4 NT, but Shelton is now our only real prototype 3-4 NT. That and all the 4-3 looks we gave during pre season make me think we're at least gonna run more of a hybrid than we ever have. Solomon never once stood up and they had Kruger playing 4-3 OLB'er which was weird, I envisioned us using Mingo like that not Kruger. I don't think they'll be sending Kruger out during the season against TE's, he got burned hard in the Buffalo game doing that. I dunno, I wouldn't mind it....we have the versatility to switch up to 3-4 if the situation necessitates. But I think we'd be a better 4-3 team anyhow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miktoxic Posted September 3, 2015 Report Share Posted September 3, 2015 it's a great question but in the end does it really matter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted September 3, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2015 it's a great question but in the end does it really matter? I'm a defense honk so to me, yeah it's a big deal. Lmao Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted September 3, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2015 I remember reading stuff about Pet's time in Buffalo where he showed some weird 3-4 looks with more or less 4-3 personnel...but he also had that freak of nature Mario Williams on the team. Williams is on another food chain, we don't have anyone close to that....Desmond would be closest on our team right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted September 3, 2015 Report Share Posted September 3, 2015 l guess we should run the defense that we have the proper talent for. My question is if we are going to go to the 4-3....2DEs, 2DTs...then why are we ditching Defensive Tackles? In the 4-3 who will be our DTs? Our DEs? Our MLB, our OLBs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted September 3, 2015 Report Share Posted September 3, 2015 This is what the depth chart looks like now....but that is still a 3-4 chart: RDE 94 STARKS, RANDY CC/Mia 93 Hughes, John 12/3 90 Winn, Billy 12/6 66 Meder, Jamie CF14 NT 71 Shelton, Danny 15/1 60 McDaniel, Jacobbi CF14 LDE 92 Bryant, Desmond U/Oak 95 Bryant, Armonty 13/7 96 Cooper, Xavier 15/3 97 Wynn, Dylan CF15 LOLB 54 Solomon, Scott SF14 91 Reilly, Mike CF15 51 Mingo, Barkevious 13/1 LILB 56 DANSBY, KARLOS U/Arz 59 Carder, Tank W/Buf 52 Pullard, Hayes 15/7 RILB 58 Kirksey, Christian 14/3 53 Robertson, Craig CF11 ROLB 99 Kruger, Paul U/Bal 48 Orchard, Nate 15/2 LCB 23 Haden, Joe 10/1 26 Desir, Pierre 14/4 24 Bademosi, Johnson CF12 35 Rankin, Joe SF15 21 Gilbert, Justin 14/1 SS 31 WHITNER, DONTE U/SF 30 Campbell, Ibraheim 15/4 38 Feichter, Landon CF15 FS 39 Gipson, Tashaun CF12 40 Saunders, De'Ante CF15 33 Poyer, Jordan W/Phi RCB 22 WILLIAMS, TRAMON U/GB 36 Williams, K'Waun CF14 43 Gaines, Charles 15/6 37 James, Kendall SF14 27 Nelson, Robert CF14 What would it be if a 4-3? Do Solomon/Kruger/Orchard switch to DE? Does Meder/Hughes/Winn move to DT? Is Jacobbi McDaniel really good enough to be the only other designated DT on this team beside Shelton? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted September 3, 2015 Report Share Posted September 3, 2015 In keeping with the "Play like a Brown"..... Meder has earned a spot on the active roster. http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2015/09/jamie_meder_knows_adversity_an.html Releasing kitchen is far more a surprise. Maybe the Browns have their eyes a couple of big NT's on other teams, who may get released. http://www.ohio.com/blogs/cleveland-browns/cleveland-browns-1.270107/browns-release-kent-state-product-youngstown-native-ishmaa-ily-kitchen-1.620557 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gumby73 Posted September 3, 2015 Report Share Posted September 3, 2015 I can see where your coming from with this topic but it's preseason and we look on every down in a 4-3 but pending on situations we can fall into 3-4 coverage. I like what Pettine's doing with it and not showing any of his cards in Preseason.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted September 3, 2015 Report Share Posted September 3, 2015 More than NT personnel, or how many hands are on the ground, the ILBs still seem to be indicating we're in a 3-4. But the look is very fluid... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted September 4, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 4, 2015 anyone notice that our 2nd stringers are "pure" 4-3 personnel? I like that Dylan Wynn kid, i hope we keep him but if we're gonna be running base 3-4 during the season he's got no spot on our team. Him and the guy on the other side, O'reilly or something...are pure 4-3 DE's. As it pertains to our starters, Kruger and Soloman are imo also pure 4-3 guys although they can stand up...but at least in preseason Soloman has had his hands down every down he's been in. I haven't seen him stand up once. I guess we'll see next week. I like the depth on our defense. I honestly think our 2nd stringers, if they run in base 4-3...are actually a very serviceable NFL defense. Like I might actually be content with the state of affairs of our defense if they were the starters. That's a pretty damn good thing to have even if we really don't have that one world beating freak, at least yet....Shelton may turn into that if he's already this damn good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted September 4, 2015 Report Share Posted September 4, 2015 What is telling you Wynn lacks the chops to play DE in a 3-4? Fast (5.07 w/ 1.73 split), strong (43 reps) and 280+ seems ideal for a 3-4 DE. Coach him up... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted September 4, 2015 Report Share Posted September 4, 2015 Again, we're getting caught into people pigeon holing the idea of a 34 or 43 defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike H Posted September 4, 2015 Report Share Posted September 4, 2015 They run a lot of different fronts already. They aren't a true 3-4 defense. Guys like Hughes, Winn, Starks and Meder are good 3-techs in their 4-3 under, and they line up guys there even in 3-4 base. They're looking for versatile DTs who can play that 3 and 5 tech (3-4 DE). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted September 4, 2015 Report Share Posted September 4, 2015 Agree with Mike-versatility is the name of the game and they want to be able to fluidly drop into multiple defensive sets at any given time in any given play. Confuse the enemy and someone on offense will mistakenly read the wrong thing and get their shorts handed to them. We now have the athletic ability to do this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted September 4, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 4, 2015 What is telling you Wynn lacks the chops to play DE in a 3-4? Fast (5.07 w/ 1.73 split), strong (43 reps) and 280+ seems ideal for a 3-4 DE. Coach him up... Didn't say he couldn't, but aren't we "flush" at 34 DE? He's really that strong eh? Fuck, makes sense though he basically shoulder flys tackles around the corner. I like how he cuts down angles going to the qb. I've been waiting for 3 years now for Kruger to learn how to carve the edge like that, I don't think it's gonna happen. Think i'm really starting to like this Wynn kid now. But "ideally" c'mon, he's a 4-3 DE. He would be pinching down so many pockets from the edge. With our beef coming up the middle there would be literal implosion of QB pockets heard round the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted September 4, 2015 Report Share Posted September 4, 2015 E-N-T with a 2point DE. Similar style to what Pettine did in Buffalo, should be more of a re-occurring look for this defense. However what some must understand is that with a simple shift and sliding out one player substitution, this defense can produce anything from your classic 2 gap 3-4 look, a 4 down and even some 33. The concepts of defense being set in stone with 'x' player having to play 'x' position a certain way are long dead. Offenses have become far more innovative and aggressive with plays, personnel groupings and scheme - defenses are trying to do the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted September 4, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 4, 2015 E-N-T with a 2point DE. Similar style to what Pettine did in Buffalo, should be more of a re-occurring look for this defense. However what some must understand is that was a simple shift and sliding out one player substitution, this defense can produce anything from your classic 2 gap 3-4 look, a 4 down and even some 33. The concepts of defense being set in stone with 'x' player having to play 'x' position a certain way are long dead. Offenses have become far more initiative and aggressive with plays, personnel groupings and scheme - defenses are trying to do the same. well put. I just hope some of the things I saw in preseason were anomalies that Pettine was trying so as to keep his cards hidden, cause some of it will absolutely not work. Like using Kruger as a cover 43 OLB'er. I don't want to see that even once during the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted September 4, 2015 Report Share Posted September 4, 2015 well put. I just hope some of the things I saw in preseason were anomalies that Pettine was trying so as to keep his cards hidden, cause some of it will absolutely not work. Like using Kruger as a cover 43 OLB'er. I don't want to see that even once during the season. You're going to see it, so make peace with that. How Kruger is put in that situation, by audible of necessity/scheme or by intention is another story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted September 4, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 4, 2015 You're going to see it, so make peace with that. How Kruger is put in that situation, by audible of necessity/scheme or by intention is another story. but why on earth? We were running 4 man fronts with Solomon's hand down on the other side and Kruger standing up just slightly off the line on his side. Basically showing a 5 man front with the Will possibly showing rush but dropping into protection. Kruger simply can't do it. We are going to get burned with that look. I trust Kruger in zone but man coverage? I was thinking they were just having fun cause Mingo's hurt, that's how we should be using Mingo not fucking Kruger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted September 4, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 4, 2015 And also, can someone explain to me why we would have two SAM OLB'ers on the field at the same time if we're putting 3 DL's on the line? I questioned some of this last year with Sheard and Kruger but I just figured that was mainly because Mingo was down and we had no one else. We also ran a lot of two man fronts though so it kind of made sense to have two Sams standing on the edges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted September 4, 2015 Report Share Posted September 4, 2015 but why on earth? We were running 4 man fronts with Solomon's hand down on the other side and Kruger standing up just slightly off the line on his side. Basically showing a 5 man front with the Will possibly showing rush but dropping into protection. Kruger simply can't do it. We are going to get burned with that look. I trust Kruger in zone but man coverage? I was thinking they were just having fun cause Mingo's hurt, that's how we should be using Mingo not fucking Kruger. Kruger would be checking the TE and dropping underneath him or to a hook/curl/flat responsibility. I have a feeling you're answering your own questions - Mingo isn't good to go. I'm surprised Orchard isn't getting those looks being that he's a bit more fluid and space. If Kruger has any coverage responsibility it will be tracking a back or floating into a curl/flat zone to the boundary, nothing much more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted September 4, 2015 Report Share Posted September 4, 2015 Kruger has looked quicker to me this pre-season... can't hurt his coverage. Solomon has looked one-trick-ish... Back on Wynn... successful 3-4 DEs have been in his mold, I just hope the staff doesn't bulk him up as they did Winn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted September 4, 2015 Report Share Posted September 4, 2015 Kruger has looked quicker to me this pre-season... can't hurt his coverage. Solomon has looked one-trick-ish... Back on Wynn... successful 3-4 DEs have been in his mold, I just hope the staff doesn't bulk him up as they did Winn. Praying that don't do that to Cooper either. He has an elite first step at an already solid weight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted September 4, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 4, 2015 Maybe I don't remember correctly, but that wasn't zone coverage against Buffalo where he got burned. I agree with you though, dropping him underneath into zone on certain routes is perfectly acceptable "if" we can't put another legit Will on the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted September 4, 2015 Report Share Posted September 4, 2015 I was under the impression that Taylor was better suited for a 4-3? If they were switching why would they cut him? WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted September 4, 2015 Author Report Share Posted September 4, 2015 Solomon has looked one-trick-ish... I've been impressed with him insofar as Krugers backup. I'm no defensive guru but I just can't figure out why the two of em are on the field at the same time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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