How to fix this team...

[lodilobo]

I am sure that when each GM or HC was hired by the Browns that the heirarchy didn't say to themselves "this guy is a moron that won't be able to think straight....so let me hire him". I am sure they thought they were getting the best they could get.

It just hasn't worked out that way.

So....if you are able to distinguish between who the dumbass morons are and those who are not, I am sure they would welcome your advice.

 

Its kinda like identifying and categorizing patrons of this board, you know.

Thanks for pointing that out...Captain Obvious....but wouldn't you think if you picked coaches randomly, with no particular discrimination, you would have to get lucky, at some point, just by luck of the draw? Well, then, how in the Hell can we always end up wiith these losers? I still say.....they should have stuck with Mangini. ...and... I have no problem distinguishing the Morons on this board. There's definitely no shortage of them here.

[The Gipper]

Thanks for pointing that out...Captain Obvious....but wouldn't you think if you picked coaches randomly, with no particular discrimination, you would have to get lucky, at some point, just by luck of the draw? Well, then, how in the Hell can we always end up wiith these losers? I still say.....they should have stuck with Mangini. ...and... I have no problem distinguishing the Morons on this board. There's definitely no shortage of them here.

Well, they didn't pick them randomly, they put a lot of time and research into getting the best they could get....yet stilll got a constant stream of incompetent people.

How do YOU explain that?

How do YOU correct that?

[Westside Steve]

Everyone assumes Bernie would take the job.

 

Maybe he doesn't want to work for the people in charge.

Most likely the fact that he isn't really worth anything to any team as a consultant or coach.

For god sake boys the guys business collapsed. Why in the world would he refused to take a job with a football team? And even if he hated the Browns management why hasn't anyone else offered him anything? You guys just have the rose colored glasses about Bernie Kosar. It's painful to listen to him on the radio.

 

WSS

[wargograw]

Im really not concerned with his sexual preference, but I do know hes a physical freak of nature, who while raw with his technique, is the type of player we need.

He's not that good. People just see 6'9", a 6-pack, and a scary facemask. Ooh I'm so scared.

[lodilobo]

Well, they didn't pick them randomly, they put a lot of time and research into getting the best they could get....yet stilll got a constant stream of incompetent people.

How do YOU explain that?

How do YOU correct that?

My point is that the individuals picking the incompetent coaches and assistants we have witnessed for the last 20 years are just lazy, freeloading losers themselves, with no clue regarding the qualities needed to coach in the NFL. Now...I would think the 2 ownerships we have seen would have had the wherewithall to accomplish such a simple task, or at least through dumb luck, by this time, hit a winner. Of course, I would be wrong about that. Apparently it's a situation where, as others have eluded to, that the decision makers within the organization feel that they are much smarter than the competition, so rather than make obvious choices, they tend to make a choice not so obvious, thinking they will be proclaimed geniuses...seeing something others did not. We're still waiting for that scenario to play out. The solution, in my opinion, would be to build management / coaching with successful NFL people. It's been done in Denver, Pittsburg, and many other teams. It's proven, that winners breed winners. I always mention Kosar, because 30 years ago, he set the NFL on fire with his actions on the field...not with his athletic qualities, but with a strong arm, and mostly his intellect. Why has the ownership never tried to benefit from his NFL experience, and wiining mentality? The younger fans consider him to be a drunk, drug addict, stupid, whatever. I just write that off as ignorance, because they didn't witness what he could do as a player. Whether it would be Bernie, or someone else....this ownership needs to get someone with real NFL experience / knowledge to guide these players. The talent level on this team is not nearly as bad as most believe. I think Brian Hoyer proved that last season before things turned to crap. However...this whole coaching staff is incompetent, in my opinion. Pettine has lost the team, and most of them are just going through the motions for a paycheck. Welcome to another 3 -13 season. Who looks good in the 2016 draft?

[FairHooker11]

He's not that good. People just see 6'9", a 6-pack, and a scary facemask. Ooh I'm so scared.

 

didnt Courtney Brown have the same credentials? all show no go...

 

and of course many unfortunate injuries....

[FairHooker11]

finding fisical freeks of nature type of players wont fix the team,

 

Id say the character guys are better suited to look past the defeat (ie Barnidge McCown)

 

and move on to next week,

 

unlike some of the whiners that always come out around here.

[The Gipper]

My point is that the individuals picking the incompetent coaches and assistants we have witnessed for the last 20 years are just lazy, freeloading losers themselves, with no clue regarding the qualities needed to coach in the NFL. Now...I would think the 2 ownerships we have seen would have had the wherewithall to accomplish such a simple task, or at least through dumb luck, by this time, hit a winner.

You would think that.....and don't be coy.....name names. One was Mike Holmgren. Who else woule you put on the lazy freeloader list?

 

Of course, I would be wrong about that. Apparently it's a situation where, as others have eluded to, that the decision makers within the organization feel that they are much smarter than the competition, so rather than make obvious choices, they tend to make a choice not so obvious, thinking they will be proclaimed geniuses...seeing something others did not.

I am trying to think who those "obvious choices" for either GM or HC would have been that our FOs did not hire. Again....please illuminate.

 

We're still waiting for that scenario to play out. The solution, in my opinion, would be to build management / coaching with successful NFL people. It's been done in Denver, Pittsburg, and many other teams. It's proven, that winners breed winners. I always mention Kosar, because 30 years ago, he set the NFL on fire with his actions on the field...not with his athletic qualities, but with a strong arm, and mostly his intellect. Why has the ownership never tried to benefit from his NFL experience, and wiining mentality? The younger fans consider him to be a drunk, drug addict, stupid, whatever. I just write that off as ignorance, because they didn't witness what he could do as a player. Whether it would be Bernie, or someone else....this ownership needs to get someone with real NFL experience / knowledge to guide these players.

Well, Holmgren had all the credentials that you would want......SB winning coach with Packers. Took Seahawks to another SB. Hard to beat that.

I mean....maybe they should hired Nick Saban 10 years ago....before he even went to Alabama.

But what would you do now....besides hire Bernie?

 

The talent level on this team is not nearly as bad as most believe. I think Brian Hoyer proved that last season before things turned to crap.

I agree completely

However...this whole coaching staff is incompetent, in my opinion. Pettine has lost the team, and most of them are just going through the motions for a paycheck. Welcome to another 3 -13 season.

I am not sure the whole group is so bad. But at least the DC is imo.

 

Who looks good in the 2016 draft?

I started a whole thread on that call The Final Solution.....go there and see the replies.

[Tour2ma]

My point is that the individuals picking the incompetent coaches and assistants we have witnessed for the last 20 years are just lazy, freeloading losers themselves, with no clue regarding the qualities needed to coach in the NFL. Now...I would think the 2 ownerships we have seen would have had the wherewithall to accomplish such a simple task, or at least through dumb luck, by this time, hit a winner. Of course, I would be wrong about that. Apparently it's a situation where, as others have eluded to, that the decision makers within the organization feel that they are much smarter than the competition, so rather than make obvious choices, they tend to make a choice not so obvious, thinking they will be proclaimed geniuses...seeing something others did not.

Reasonable complaint... I think you have to look at the turnover in our "decision makers" starting with Policy and Clark. Remember how close they were thought to be a dream team when they came in? In all we've had seven GMs since we returned in '99.

 

I think we've gotten close a couple times to the right HC only to snatch chaos from the jaws of stability.

 

I thought we were close with Butch Davis, but having to make him GM as well to lure him to the job doomed him.

 

I thought Mangini was promising and had earned a third year, but he was not Holmgren's guy, so he was vanquished in favor of Shurmur.

 

I think both Farmer and Pet have shown promise, so I choose to ride with them a little longer.

[lodilobo]

 

My point is that the individuals picking the incompetent coaches and assistants we have witnessed for the last 20 years are just lazy, freeloading losers themselves, with no clue regarding the qualities needed to coach in the NFL. Now...I would think the 2 ownerships we have seen would have had the wherewithall to accomplish such a simple task, or at least through dumb luck, by this time, hit a winner.

You would think that.....and don't be coy.....name names. One was Mike Holmgren. Who else woule you put on the lazy freeloader list? Phil Savage, Mike Lombardi, are a couple who come to mind.

 

Of course, I would be wrong about that. Apparently it's a situation where, as others have eluded to, that the decision makers within the organization feel that they are much smarter than the competition, so rather than make obvious choices, they tend to make a choice not so obvious, thinking they will be proclaimed geniuses...seeing something others did not.

I am trying to think who those "obvious choices" for either GM or HC would have been that our FOs did not hire. Again....please illuminate. In this statement I was referring to making draft choices and free agent choices. We passed on Clay Mathews, even though, for me, it was a no brainer, given the fact his Dad played here. We picked Johnny Manziel, when there were numerous better choices at qb, and literally any other position. I know this is all hind sight, and you never know how a player will work out in the NFL, but why not go with a player who the expert evaluators agree on? Why do we always look for the "dark horse"?

 

We're still waiting for that scenario to play out. The solution, in my opinion, would be to build management / coaching with successful NFL people. It's been done in Denver, Pittsburg, and many other teams. It's proven, that winners breed winners. I always mention Kosar, because 30 years ago, he set the NFL on fire with his actions on the field...not with his athletic qualities, but with a strong arm, and mostly his intellect. Why has the ownership never tried to benefit from his NFL experience, and wiining mentality? The younger fans consider him to be a drunk, drug addict, stupid, whatever. I just write that off as ignorance, because they didn't witness what he could do as a player. Whether it would be Bernie, or someone else....this ownership needs to get someone with real NFL experience / knowledge to guide these players.

Well, Holmgren had all the credentials that you would want......SB winning coach with Packers. Took Seahawks to another SB. Hard to beat that.

I mean....maybe they should hired Nick Saban 10 years ago....before he even went to Alabama.

But what would you do now....besides hire Bernie? I would try to find a proven winner to be the GM....not a Holgren type...a currently unemployed veteran coach or GM ,who wants a challenge. Someone who has Cleveland ties. Ernest Byner?...Holmgrem obviously was a mistake. I didn't like it from the beginning, but who would have thought he was the swindler he was?

 

The talent level on this team is not nearly as bad as most believe. I think Brian Hoyer proved that last season before things turned to crap.

I agree completely

However...this whole coaching staff is incompetent, in my opinion. Pettine has lost the team, and most of them are just going through the motions for a paycheck. Welcome to another 3 -13 season.

I am not sure the whole group is so bad. But at least the DC is imo.

 

Who looks good in the 2016 draft?

I started a whole thread on that call The Final Solution.....go there and see the replies.

 

[The Gipper]

 

 

My point is that the individuals picking the incompetent coaches and assistants we have witnessed for the last 20 years are just lazy, freeloading losers themselves, with no clue regarding the qualities needed to coach in the NFL. Now...I would think the 2 ownerships we have seen would have had the wherewithall to accomplish such a simple task, or at least through dumb luck, by this time, hit a winner.

You would think that.....and don't be coy.....name names. One was Mike Holmgren. Who else woule you put on the lazy freeloader list? Phil Savage, Mike Lombardi, are a couple who come to mind.

I don't think Savage was a lazy freeloader. He was young and upcoming out of the Ravens organization that had been making all the right moves. He just didn't work out.

Lombardi though.....yep.

 

Of course, I would be wrong about that. Apparently it's a situation where, as others have eluded to, that the decision makers within the organization feel that they are much smarter than the competition, so rather than make obvious choices, they tend to make a choice not so obvious, thinking they will be proclaimed geniuses...seeing something others did not.

I am trying to think who those "obvious choices" for either GM or HC would have been that our FOs did not hire. Again....please illuminate. In this statement I was referring to making draft choices and free agent choices. We passed on Clay Mathews, even though, for me, it was a no brainer, given the fact his Dad played here. We picked Johnny Manziel, when there were numerous better choices at qb, and literally any other position. I know this is all hind sight, and you never know how a player will work out in the NFL, but why not go with a player who the expert evaluators agree on? Why do we always look for the "dark horse"?

Well, CMIII was a very late first round pick....so apparently not all the expert evaluators agreed on him.......and a number of our picks WERE agreed by all the experts to be rock solid. You know, like TR, Mingo, et al.

So, total agreement on quality by experts is no sure proof that someone will be good.

 

We're still waiting for that scenario to play out. The solution, in my opinion, would be to build management / coaching with successful NFL people. It's been done in Denver, Pittsburg, and many other teams. It's proven, that winners breed winners. I always mention Kosar, because 30 years ago, he set the NFL on fire with his actions on the field...not with his athletic qualities, but with a strong arm, and mostly his intellect. Why has the ownership never tried to benefit from his NFL experience, and wiining mentality? The younger fans consider him to be a drunk, drug addict, stupid, whatever. I just write that off as ignorance, because they didn't witness what he could do as a player. Whether it would be Bernie, or someone else....this ownership needs to get someone with real NFL experience / knowledge to guide these players.

Well, Holmgren had all the credentials that you would want......SB winning coach with Packers. Took Seahawks to another SB. Hard to beat that.

I mean....maybe they should hired Nick Saban 10 years ago....before he even went to Alabama.

But what would you do now....besides hire Bernie? I would try to find a proven winner to be the GM....not a Holgren type...a currently unemployed veteran coach or GM ,who wants a challenge. Someone who has Cleveland ties. Ernest Byner?...Holmgrem obviously was a mistake. I didn't like it from the beginning, but who would have thought he was the swindler he was?

We have a guy: Kuharich who kinda fits that bill. He did the fill in for Farmer while on suspension.

The talent level on this team is not nearly as bad as most believe. I think Brian Hoyer proved that last season before things turned to crap.

I agree completely

However...this whole coaching staff is incompetent, in my opinion. Pettine has lost the team, and most of them are just going through the motions for a paycheck. Welcome to another 3 -13 season.

I am not sure the whole group is so bad. But at least the DC is imo.

 

Who looks good in the 2016 draft?

I started a whole thread on that call The Final Solution.....go there and see the replies.