***Official Browns Vs. Chargers Game Day Thread***

[jiggins7919]

12 hours ago, CLEVELANDwantsPLAYOFFS said:

Out-schemed today. Those end arounds were left the defense exposed bad, Gregg Williams had no answers.

It’s clearly this defense has a big weakness, that being the outside run. So much space and huge lanes to the outside. 

Offense came out, had one good play to Njoku, then the defense committed an offsides, so 1st and 5.

Next, Instead of trying to establish the run, Haley? calls a play out of shotgun which had all the receivers all run a 5 yard hook route. Baker Mayfield is NOT Drew Brees.

To come out on the second play and call that BS, which resulted in an incomplete pass. Then guesss what? We ran for 0 yards on the next play. Leaving a predictable 3rd and 5 pass. I drove up to Ohio with fam to be disappointed in an offensive playcall on the second play.

We CANNOT beat a winning team like this.

Nick Chubb had a run where he literally was gliding by the defense, and it came back. To a holding call on a receiver(Ratley I think). Guess what, only 3 rushes: 25 yards[8.3 yards a carry], despite that nice run coming back. 

And in regards to the holding, did anyone see a hold on that play? That was one of 2 terrible calls that pop out to me.

What. The. Actual. Fu%#.

Baker, in a less than ideal situation, played ok. The first interception right out of halftime, is a throw we all know he’d like to have back.

But I don’t blame him, he was trying to make something happen when the refs and offensive coordinators weren’t doing a lot to keep the game manageable. 

I think somebody’s gotta go and I hope it’s Haley. I am tired of the approach. 

I don’t like Williams very much at this point either but I think it’s less in his control then it is for Haley.

The holding call on Ratley was very iffy, even the announcer was like, "Uhhhhh." 

I'm just so tired of the cute crap. 1st and 5, pound the rock. Not only that, but we had 3rd and 2, deep in Bolts' territory. We tried a pass. Go for it on 4th. Another not close pass, turned over on downs. If you're going to go for it, why not run on 3RD AND 4TH DOWN?! AHHHHHH! 

 

[flyingfooldoug]

Is Haley missed in the stool city? Not a bit. Is Williams missed in LA? Nope. If Cleveland had not asked, would they be working in the NFL this year? Doubt it. Kinda like the Ryan brothers except they never stopped here.  And our head coach????? We were offsides on the opening kick.  Our new GM has done pretty good on acquiring talent on the field. We should let him revamp this horrid, no history, no win coaching staff top to bottom the next off-season. 

[Ibleedbrown]

29 minutes ago, flyingfooldoug said:

Is Haley missed in the stool city? Not a bit. Is Williams missed in LA? Nope. If Cleveland had not asked, would they be working in the NFL this year? Doubt it. Kinda like the Ryan brothers except they never stopped here.  And our head coach????? We were offsides on the opening kick.  Our new GM has done pretty good on acquiring talent on the field. We should let him revamp this horrid, no history, no win coaching staff top to bottom the next off-season. 

Oh man, l really don’t wanna see a full blown coaching staff demolition derby. 

[flyingfooldoug]

7 minutes ago, Ibleedbrown said:

Oh man, l really don’t wanna see a full blown coaching staff demolition derby. 

Got our clocks cleaned by a newer staff

[Ibleedbrown]

3 minutes ago, flyingfooldoug said:

Got our clocks cleaned by a rookie staff

I know, and credit to them. I think for a defensive game plan the Chargers just took good notes from when we played the Ravens. Crash the tackles and keep Baker in the pocket. They just maybe tweaked it and executed better. 

As far as our defensive game plan, l’m at a loss as to how bad we were stopping the run, but on some of those long passes Rivers made we had DBs in position, they just didn’t execute. 

And then the story played out like a lot of games last year. Down early and relying on the pass to catch up, and it didn’t work.

Will be interesting to see how the coaching staff responds. 

[flyingfooldoug]

1 minute ago, Ibleedbrown said:

I know, and credit to them. I think for a defensive game plan the Chargers just took good notes from when we played the Ravens. Crash the tackles and keep Baker in the pocket. They just maybe tweaked it and executed better. 

As far as our defensive game plan, l’m at a loss as to how bad we were stopping the run, but on some of those long passes Rivers made we had DBs in position, they just didn’t execute. 

And then the story played out like a lot of games last year. Down early and relying on the pass to catch up, and it didn’t work.

Will be interesting to see how the coaching staff responds. 

Why doesn't our staff EVER do similar?  Adjustments?  What? How? Who? Sad and ongoing

[LondonBrown]

Look at how the Rams broke out when they finally had the balls to fire Fisher.

What does a 3-34-1 team have to be afraid of firing coaches for?! 

Hue can’t gameplan, can’t manage a team and hires terrible coaches all over the three phases of play. 

“Living in our fears” indeed. 

[Ibleedbrown]

10 minutes ago, flyingfooldoug said:

Why doesn't our staff EVER do similar?  Adjustments?  What? How? Who? Sad and ongoing

You’re not wrong. They definitely do need to do a better job of adjusting and adapting. If they can’t or won’t, then sure, make some changes. I’d rather not see a wholesale change though with new coaches implementing new schemes and new “get to know yas” and new figuring out who does what and how well, etc. 

[CLEVELANDwantsPLAYOFFS]

3 hours ago, jiggins7919 said:

The holding call on Ratley was very iffy, even the announcer was like, "Uhhhhh." 

I'm just so tired of the cute crap. 1st and 5, pound the rock. Not only that, but we had 3rd and 2, deep in Bolts' territory. We tried a pass. Go for it on 4th. Another not close pass, turned over on downs. If you're going to go for it, why not run on 3RD AND 4TH DOWN?! AHHHHHH! 

 

TBH, I think the pass heavy approach just isn’t justifiable.

im not even mad that we didn’t run on that first and 5, that playcall of 4 button hooks at the sticks is what gets me. I just would never call that play with our personnel really. Just a playcall that had “pick 6” written all over it.

On the 3rd and 4th and 2, all I can say, those are valuable reps for a young qb like Baker to learn from. I think he had someone moderately open on the 4th down. 

[flyingfooldoug]

20 minutes ago, Ibleedbrown said:

You’re not wrong. They definitely do need to do a better job of adjusting and adapting. If they can’t or won’t, then sure, make some changes. I’d rather not see a wholesale change though with new coaches implementing new schemes and new “get to know yas” and new figuring out who does what and how well, etc. 

I figure they have this season to show some wisdom in the coaching Dept.  Whether or not there are wholesale changes made should be up to Dorsey. Hell, he's shown more wisdom than the past twenty five years worth of GMs combined. 

[CLEVELANDwantsPLAYOFFS]

7 hours ago, Realplayer said:

They need LBs. Collins doesn't always play hard. Schobert gets blocked and gets tackles yards down the field instead of in the backfield. Nobody can cover sideline to sideline. 

I'd say Williams. He's been in CLE longer. He needs more talent to run the scheme he runs. He doesn't seem to adapt to his scheme to the talent he has now. All the blitzing teams have caught on and he still blitz. Guys like Collins and Ojunobi should be benched for their effort. You can't win in the NFL if you can't stop the run.

The offense looked better during garbage time when they actually used Duke. Nice TD catch by Njoku.

I think it starts up front with the DLine, which didn’t show up, and was obliterated by those end arounds, which btw, was probably some kind of presnap adjustment installed in their offense. Because I’d seriously doubt they just kept calling an “end-around” like that. Phillip Rivers studies tape everyday in his van on the way to practice, and it showed. We looked like a college team against the big boys.

I do agree, that for this current defense to work, we’d need some kind of stud LB who is unblockable and can run a 4.2 40 lol

[jiggins7919]

1 hour ago, CLEVELANDwantsPLAYOFFS said:

TBH, I think the pass heavy approach just isn’t justifiable.

im not even mad that we didn’t run on that first and 5, that playcall of 4 button hooks at the sticks is what gets me. I just would never call that play with our personnel really. Just a playcall that had “pick 6” written all over it.

On the 3rd and 4th and 2, all I can say, those are valuable reps for a young qb like Baker to learn from. I think he had someone moderately open on the 4th down. 

Yeah, I guess that's the way to look at it.  As one of our beat writers said, "The Cleveland defense picked a terrible day NOT to stop anybody."

We're going to need our defense to have a short memory because Tampa isn't a great team, but they can certainly score points.  And you can bet your azz they're looking at our game thinking, "This is where we right the ship."  I fully expect to see a better performance.  Not just because it's difficult to conjure up a vision of a WORSE game, but because our pride will be called into question.  We're not getting Higgins back this week (from what I understand), so we're going to need better playcalling AND WR performance.  

If somebody were to ask me to name SOMETHING positive, I guess I'd say the Njoku fade reception was nice.  Again, I'm not exactly sure WHY we ran that play, but it looked fluid and it looked practiced.  I don't know if you remember last year, but we ran the fade approximately 413 times, and didn't score ONCE with Kizer at the helm.  I think Hogan completed one, but that's it.  We had first and goal at the 1, and we tried Hyde ONCE, and then we went to the fade.  I absolutely HATE THAT.  Yes, it worked, but I want to see 4 running plays if need be.  I don't want to see cute reverses, I don't want to see shovel passes, I want to see us line up with POWER and slam it in.  

[Dutch Oven]

While the shovel pass has been used down at the goal line with success, I agree with the gist that Haley gets too cute in short yardage situations. 

Carlos Hyde and Nick Chubb aren't exactly Eric Metcalf. 

[jiggins7919]

44 minutes ago, Dutch Oven said:

While the shovel pass has been used down at the goal line with success, I agree with the gist that Haley gets too cute in short yardage situations. 

Carlos Hyde and Nick Chubb aren't exactly Eric Metcalf. 

I actually LIKE the shovel pass play, and it appeared as if it could've worked but our timing was all flubbed up.  Heck, we actually scored LAST year using that play, so you know it can't be TOO hard to execute, LOL.  My biggest problem with the shovel pass is we only run it from the 1 yard line, which is where I don't WANT to run it.  Why not try it on 1st and ten?  On 2nd down?  It's a very safe play since it's a forward pass, so I don't understand the inclination to only try it near the goal line, when defenses are probably waiting for it.  I think it's an excellent way to get Duke additional touches, and we should figure out ways to run it from different formations.  You know what play I really liked from last week?  The direct snap to Duke.  Yet another way to get him touches and keep the defense off balance.  Not sure why we didn't run it at least once yesterday.  Maybe we did and I missed it.  

I'm just a little sad from the game, ya know?  Last week I literally popped out of bed on Monday morning and couldn't wait to read all the fun articles about our team, and watch the various Youtube videos about our performance.  And while it's fair to say I didn't expect us to win yesterday, I also didn't expect to witness a game like THAT.  I don't even remember a time when I stood up and cheered, or ran over to my wife for a high-five, or even really got into it.  It was just....BLAH.  

I know we aren't a complete team, heck, everyone knows that, but I certainly hope we get it together for a better performance next week.  I don't have unrealistic expectations about our team, but I do expect them to compete and provide a somewhat enjoyable product.  If I was a betting man, I'd put money on our team coming out with fire this Sunday.  And here's something else:  If we don't figure out a way to score some DAM POINTS in the first quarter of games, it's going to be a very long year indeed.  I'm so sick and tired of the first quarter punt-fest, I could puke.  We have scored a total of SIX POINTS in the first quarter through 6 games.  How the heck is that even possible?  I know most coaches "script plays" for the first drive or two, but you know what?  Scratch that crap.  Whatever we're doing is obviously not working.  What makes it especially painful is the wonderful field position we managed to screw up Sunday.  Last week it seemed like every drive started at our freaking 4 yard line, and this week we somehow got some good returns and had half a field (or less) to go for a TD.  What hurts the worst is that this debacle happened in front of the home crowd.  Just when they were thinking the team had a true "home field advantage" and we were getting better.  

Watch the film, learn from the mistakes, and rinse this atrocity off.  Big game this Sunday, and it's definitely winnable.  Oh, and if we get a chance to connect on a deep TD, I better see our WR make every effort to catch the dang ball.  I know those two TD chances were extremely difficult, but that's what we need if we're going to compete. 

[Dutch Oven]

The strange thing is, I get the impression that secretly many people were worried that the Ravens game a week before was going to play out the way the Chargers game did. 

Hopefully the Chargers game was an aberration, not a trend. They are a very good team, though. Probably would have won 10-12 games last year if not for some (sound familiar?) horrible special teams play early in the season. 

[Mark O]

29 minutes ago, Dutch Oven said:

The strange thing is, I get the impression that secretly many people were worried that the Ravens game a week before was going to play out the way the Chargers game did. 

Hopefully the Chargers game was an aberration, not a trend. They are a very good team, though. Probably would have won 10-12 games last year if not for some (sound familiar?) horrible special teams play early in the season. 

Not going to read through 6 pages of whining but to try to bring some reality to this thread and to add to this above, the Chargers are a really good team.   FG kicker cost them several games last year and the only 2 losses they have this year are to the Rams (who haven't lost to anyone) and the Chiefs (who have only lost once) so there's no shame in losing to them at this point in our teams development.  I would've like to see a closer game and without the mistakes on offense (dropped TD passes early) and on defense (90 yards in 2 plays???) it could've been a closer game.

I'll worry if we go to Tampa (who isn't very good) and stink it up again this week.  Till then, its just one game and the team is still young and getting better each week.  

[Kvoethe]

We should be old school pounding the rock till they stack the box and throw a bit.

 

[TexasAg1969]

1 hour ago, Mark O said:

Not going to read through 6 pages of whining but to try to bring some reality to this thread and to add to this above, the Chargers are a really good team.   FG kicker cost them several games last year and the only 2 losses they have this year are to the Rams (who haven't lost to anyone) and the Chiefs (who have only lost once) so there's no shame in losing to them at this point in our teams development.  I would've like to see a closer game and without the mistakes on offense (dropped TD passes early) and on defense (90 yards in 2 plays???) it could've been a closer game.

I'll worry if we go to Tampa (who isn't very good) and stink it up again this week.  Till then, its just one game and the team is still young and getting better each week.  

And it happened worse to the Jags via Dallas. Sometimes you are just outmatched on an off day for players and coaches.

[Mark O]

3 minutes ago, TexasAg1969 said:

And it happened worse to the Jags via Dallas. Sometimes you are just outmatched on an off day for players and coaches.

Correct and the Jags are a good team with playoff hopes and they got blasted by a very average (at least so far this year) Cowboys team. 

[nickers]

Not making excuses but lets face it... The Browns have been playing over time games.. High drama games... and it just caught up with them... they need to reboot , regroup and refocus... They'll be ok... Take it one game at a time..They were hideously flat... it happens.

[Tour2ma]

13 hours ago, Realplayer said:

Joe sucks.

Ummmmm.... no.

6 hours ago, CLEVELANDwantsPLAYOFFS said:

TBH, I think the pass heavy approach just isn’t justifiable.

Agree... I really want to see is us pound the rock with Hyde and whoever the H-back du jour is, and thus set up the PAP. Hyde is the back to  do that.

4 hours ago, jiggins7919 said:

Yeah, I guess that's the way to look at it.  As one of our beat writers said, "The Cleveland defense picked a terrible day NOT to stop anybody."

There's a good day to NOT stop anybody?

Had to be Grossi or MKC.

[Tour2ma]

20 hours ago, hoorta said:

STs, bitch, bitch, bitch. There- you happy? Going from atrocious to mediocre is improvement I suppose. And the crisp tacking was unobservable....   

Thanks... Now we need Njoku covered.

Kid played a good game AND for the first time he was the tall, red-zone target we've been craving.

[jiggins7919]

1 hour ago, Tour2ma said:

There's a good day to NOT stop anybody?

I think the implication was that it's worse to not stop anyone when your offense isn't scoring many points. But yeah, you're right. There's never a good time. 

[PoeticG]

SD held and blocked in the back on nearly every single big run, including the first one for a TD. If the refs are going to allow that type of Sheet, they are allowing the teams to play by two different sets of rules. Obvious cowpoop.

[PoeticG]

That Shmucking long TD Randall picked it off and that bitch WR just rips it from him on the ground and the motherShmucking refs give him the TD. Laughable.

I don't even count this one against Cleveland. Shmuck that Sheet. Refs should be fired, there is plenty of evidence biased officiating. 

[PoeticG]

Watch this Sheet on 50% speed, it's painful to watch again but afterwards you know the truth.

[gumby73]

1 hour ago, Tour2ma said:

 Hyde and whoever the H-back du jour is, 

am guessing 6ft'ish-250lbs of Orson Charles?

[CLEVELANDwantsPLAYOFFS]

1 hour ago, Tour2ma said:

Agree... I really want to see is us pound the rock with Hyde and whoever the H-back du jour is, and thus set up the PAP. Hyde is the back to  do that.

Why can’t we be like New England.? And get all the talented RBs involved?

Chubb seems way faster than expected and Duke is a straight up playmaker who’s not getting enough looks. Hyde is tough and I like him but they can mix it up and distribute the carries/touches a bit better.

is it really as simple as “Chubb can’t block”? Because he sure can run.

[Dutch Oven]

23 minutes ago, CLEVELANDwantsPLAYOFFS said:

Why can’t we be like New England.? And get all the talented RBs involved?

Chubb seems way faster than expected and Duke is a straight up playmaker who’s not getting enough looks. Hyde is tough and I like him but they can mix it up and distribute the carries/touches a bit better.

is it really as simple as “Chubb can’t block”? Because he sure can run.

Chubb is way more explosive than I expected, to be honest. 

[LondonBrown]

2 hours ago, Tour2ma said:

Thanks... Now we need Njoku covered.

Kid played a good game AND for the first time he was the tall, red-zone target we've been craving.

But but but drops. Cut him.