Don't Bet Against Quinn

[Drunkandstoopid]

You do understand that both of those sentences apply to Quinn's tenure at Notre Dame, right?

Brady Quinn did get a new coach.

 

The second sentence stands. Nearly every lineman and several receivers Brady Quinn played behind his last two years got drafted, a free agent signing, or a strong sniff from the NFL within a year of his leaving Notre Dame. Several were on team rosters last year. DA had 1 lineman and two receivers that got NFL sniffs within a year of his leaving OSU. I looked it up last year.

[Legacy Fan]

So the win/loss rubric may not be all that helpful. You'd be better off looking at Quinn's stats in games where he faced a lot of pressure, like the '06 opener against Georgia Tech. Or just ditching the college stats & judging him based on his play this year.

 

ND faced a dual ground threat in GT's RB (Tashard Choice) & QB not to mention some bum of a NCAA receiver Calvin Johnson. GT ran all over the Irish that game. So what does Quinn do? Runs one in in the final moments of the half to knot it up.

 

The difference in those "intangibles" (that have become such a bad word for some reason) for me, as a fan, is that I've watched Quinn hate to lose. I have yet to see that from Derek Anderson. I hate to lose too.

[Drunkandstoopid]

ND faced a dual ground threat in GT's RB (Tashard Choice) & QB not to mention some bum of a NCAA receiver Calvin Johnson. GT ran all over the Irish that game. So what does Quinn do? Runs one in in the final moments of the half to knot it up.

 

The difference in those "intangibles" (that have become such a bad word for some reason) for me, as a fan, is that I've watched Quinn hate to lose. I have yet to see that from Derek Anderson. I hate to lose too.

 

 

Hmmmm... apparently you didn't watch DA lead a come from behind win, including the longest run from the line of scrimmage by a Brown that year, in his first NFL game. Add to that the other last minute drives he put together in a few games his first full season, I don't think he's a quitter at any rate.

[Vegasdogg]

Nearly every lineman and several receivers Brady Quinn played behind his last two years got drafted, a free agent signing, or a strong sniff from the NFL within a year of his leaving Notre Dame. Several were on team rosters last year. DA had 1 lineman and two receivers that got NFL sniffs within a year of his leaving OSU. I looked it up last year.

And tell me - which player is still on a roster, and who is starting? Carlson the TE?

[Vegasdogg]

Hmmmm... apparently you didn't watch DA lead a come from behind win..... I don't think he's a quitter at any rate.

He is not quitter, but damn if he doesn't make stupid ass mistakes.

 

He does come from behind so infrequently, and has just as many games where he blows it, that it is very hard to give him any more chances. If we didn't have an unknown in Quinn to take a look at, we'd be waiting for the chance that the rookie we just drafted would get in.

 

Why is it so hard to understand that some Browns fans are fed up with his boneheaded plays game after game.

[Drunkandstoopid]

And tell me - which player is still on a roster, and who is starting? Carlson the TE?

We should revisit this again once the rosters are set in the fall. I'm thinking right off the top of my head that 2-3 Brady Quinn Notre Dame linemen were on NFL rosters last year. Not may college QBs outside of QBs from USC or Ohio State can say they played behind 2 or 3 linemen who were on NFL rosters later.

 

At any rate, why would them being on a roster this next season matter? For a lineman to get a sniff from the NFL, he's probably was considered to be a knotch above the average college lineman. Quinn was surrounded by a bunch of 'em, DA wasn't.

[Guest Aloysius]

Ryan Harris starts at right tackle for Denver. He played LT at Notre Dame, but he had a pretty bad senior year (he dropped from a 1st to a 3rd round prospect as a result).

 

I think he's the only one of BQ's college linemen starting in the league. As I recall, a couple o-linemen graduated after Quinn's junior year. That lack of continuity on the line affected Quinn's play during his senior year.

 

The same thing could happen to Sam Bradford this year.

 

EDIT: Scratch that. John Sullivan's expected to start for the Vikings this year.

[AZBrowns]

We should revisit this again once the rosters are set in the fall. I'm thinking right off the top of my head that 2-3 Brady Quinn Notre Dame linemen were on NFL rosters last year. Not may college QBs outside of QBs from USC or Ohio State can say they played behind 2 or 3 linemen who were on NFL rosters later.

 

At any rate, why would them being on a roster this next season matter? For a lineman to get a sniff from the NFL, he's probably was considered to be a knotch above the average college lineman. Quinn was surrounded by a bunch of 'em, DA wasn't.

 

 

LOL, really?

 

During his OSU career, DA had guys like Adam Koets, Kyle DeVann and Roy Schuening on the line... they are either in the NFL now or were at some point. He also had Stephen Jackson at RB and Mike Hass at WR during his tenure there.

 

 

[Vegasdogg]

Not may college QBs outside of QBs from USC or Ohio State can say they played behind 2 or 3 linemen who were on NFL rosters later.

 

Quinn was surrounded by a bunch of 'em, DA wasn't.

WTF? So you're telling me Ohio State and USC have about 96 NFL lineman in the NFL today?

 

And the last statement - a bunch of them? Who are these mysterious lineman you think provided Quinn all this time to throw? Name them. And while you're at it, name me the starting WR and RB that played with him that are tearing up the NFL.

 

 

[Vegasdogg]

But many sportswriters have said Quinn's professionalism, work ethic, and "film rat" status are Peyton-esque.

I read a lot and especially about Quinn. Many sportwriters? Really? Come on now man, Quinn and Manning in the same sentence doesn't sound like a H U G E reach? Maybe over-selling?

[Lumbergh]

LOL, really?

 

During his OSU career, DA had guys like Adam Koets, Kyle DeVann and Roy Schuening on the line... they are either in the NFL now or were at some point.

 

not exactly.

 

Schuening never played with DA.

 

DeVan started 2 games as a freshman while DA was in school.

 

 

Anderson played Arizona 3 times and them by the scores of 38-3, 52-23, and 28-14 while he was in school. Hence AZ Clown chimes in with the Anti-DA talk on here.

 

 

 

[Zombo]

No, Manning does not have a stronger arm than Quinn.

Yes he does.

 

Just because Quinn can wind up and supposedly throw the ball 70 yards isn't what NFL scouts look for in "arm strength". They want bullets through the wind on a out pattern. And Manning delivers them again and again.

 

And I can't believe you are still railing on the virtues of the wonderlic in a Peyton Manning thread. Manning scored mid-level and is the smartest QB ever. He is the anti-wonderlic.

 

You sound like Manning and Quinn are in the same football IQ club because they have similar wonderlic scores.

 

He's Peyton Manning. Quinn's not.

 

Not sure why you had to take a swing at Derek Anderson even though he's not involved in the discussion. You know what team he plays for, right?

 

Zombo

[Drunkandstoopid]

not exactly.

 

Schuening never played with DA.

 

DeVan started 2 games as a freshman while DA was in school.

 

 

Anderson played Arizona 3 times and them by the scores of 38-3, 52-23, and 28-14 while he was in school. Hence AZ Clown chimes in with the Anti-DA talk on here.

 

Actually, I think Schuening did play with DA, but he was a true freshman. I hate to have to look up once again the juniors and seniors who later got NFL contracts or strong interest that Brady played behind, done it before.

 

Erickson had a habit of rarely recruiting big true offensive linemen. Most of his guys were either smaller athletic O linemen or highschool D linemen who made the switch to the O side once they got to OSU. I remember talk on the boards that Riley was amazed at the lack of depth on the line when he got here.

[Lumbergh]

Actually, I think Schuening did play with DA, but he was a true freshman.

 

Schuening redshirted that year. They weren't ever in a game together.

[Lumbergh]

I hate to have to look up once again the juniors and seniors who later got NFL contracts or strong interest that Brady played behind, done it before.

 

Quinn played with all these guys. He also played with guys like Ryan Grant of the Packers who wasn't drafted and also Jeff "the man responsible for Brady Quinn's career" Samardzija

 

2008 2 38 SEA John Carlson TE

2008 2 47 PHI Trevor Laws DT

2008 3 86 BAL Tom Zbikowski DB

2008 6 187 MIN John Sullivan C

2007 2 57 PHI Victor Abiamiri DE

2007 3 70 DEN Ryan Harris T

2007 5 166 JAX Derek Landri DT

2007 6 202 NWE Mike Richardson DB

2007 7 230 CIN Dan Santucci G

2007 7 253 CIN Nedu Ndukwe DB

2006 2 53 DAL Anthony Fasano TE

2006 3 90 TAM Maurice Stovall WR

2006 6 205 NWE Dan Stevenson G

2005 3 74 NYG Justin Tuck DE

2005 5 144 STL Jerome Collins TE

2004 2 43 DAL Julius Jones RB

2004 2 60 NOR Courtney Watson LB

2004 4 122 HOU Glenn Earl DB

2004 6 170 HOU Vontez Duff DB

2004 6 180 WAS Jim Molinaro T

[Guest mz.]

They want bullets through the wind on a out pattern. And Manning delivers them again and again.

 

In a dome.

 

Just sayin'.

 

I have no idea who has the better arm, but if Quinn even comes close to being the QB Manning is, well, you know...

[Lumbergh]

I have no idea who has the better arm, but if Quinn even comes close to being the QB Manning is, well, you know...

 

I have an idea. His initials are P and M.

 

Now for the good news: Peyton had a 46.8 QB rating in CLE last year.

 

That's almost as bad as Quinn.

[Guest mz.]

That's almost as bad as Quinn.

 

Well, to be fair, the only names that come up in comparison with DA are Rex Grossman types.

 

Sorry.

 

[AZBrowns]

not exactly.

 

Schuening never played with DA.

 

DeVan started 2 games as a freshman while DA was in school.

 

 

Anderson played Arizona 3 times and them by the scores of 38-3, 52-23, and 28-14 while he was in school. Hence AZ Clown chimes in with the Anti-DA talk on here.

 

What do the Arizona / Oregon State matchups have anyhing to do with this? N-O-T-H-I-N-G

 

 

 

Also, Schuening debuted in 2004 for Oregon State (2003 he was a redshirt), which was Anderson's last year. You should probably learn more about your own team before responding.

 

http://oregonstate.scout.com/a.z?s=182&amp...242306&pg=1

 

P.S - Arizona still leads the all-time series vs. OSU 20-11-1, so if you want to take cheap shots, give it another 10-20 years so you have a chance to catch up. OSU has dominated Arizona this past decade and still isn't within striking distance of evening that record up. Now the Wildcats aren't the ass end of the Pac-10 anymore so i dont see that happening any time soon

[Drunkandstoopid]

WTF? So you're telling me Ohio State and USC have about 96 NFL lineman in the NFL today?

 

And the last statement - a bunch of them? Who are these mysterious lineman you think provided Quinn all this time to throw? Name them. And while you're at it, name me the starting WR and RB that played with him that are tearing up the NFL.

 

 

There are a very few teams, USC and Ohio State being among the most notable, that seem to send linemen to the NFL on a regular basis. I think you might be able to add LSU, maybe Michigan and a couple others (maybe even Notre Dame)

 

DA Played behind Adam Koets for a couple years, apparently also played behind a freshman (any time you are starting freshmen on the line, you've gotta wonder about depth) in Roy Scheuning. Go with Hass for a year as a primary receiver and a few years of Tim Euhus and that's about it for NFL sniffs out of OSU. Quinn played behind John Sullivan, Dan Stevenson, Ryan Harris and Dan Santucci, all of which were drafted, for a couple years or more each, also had tight ends Carson, Fasono and Collins drafted, and had an all-american receiver go baseball... And I'm not even going to bother looking up the free agent signings, gotta go to work in a few minutes. And... Darius Walker wasn't exactly a slouch for a running back.

[Lumbergh]

What do the Arizona / Oregon State matchups have anyhing to do with this?

 

as I explained clearly, it has to do with your motivation RE: Anti DA

 

And you're right about Schuening. I was off a yr. Nice googling.

[AZBrowns]

as I explained clearly, it has to do with your motivation RE: Anti DA

 

And you're right about Schuening. I was off a yr. Nice googling.

 

 

My motivation is to point out the idiocy and hypocrisy you bring to this board. You never respond to people who prove you wrong, and you selectively pick your arguments because you know if you respond to what most people say to you, you would look like a moron.

 

Yes, I google. It's called being resourceful, something that you aren’t (i.e. making statements like Schuening not playing with DA, and DA making the elite 11 twice, and DA being a five star recruit even though star ratings were not given out then, are just a couple of items of evidence I'll submit to prove my theory)

 

I would actually like to see the starting QB succeed whether it's Anderson or Quinn. You on the other hand, want Anderson to succeed and don't care about the rest of the team.

 

You're a hack.

 

 

 

 

[Legacy Fan]

Well, this is what I get for reading before signing in....

Quinn played with all these guys. He also played with guys like Ryan Grant of the Packers who wasn't drafted and also Jeff "the man responsible for Brady Quinn's career" Samardzija

 

2008 2 38 SEA John Carlson TE

2008 2 47 PHI Trevor Laws DT

2008 3 86 BAL Tom Zbikowski DB

2008 6 187 MIN John Sullivan C

2007 2 57 PHI Victor Abiamiri DE

2007 3 70 DEN Ryan Harris T

2007 5 166 JAX Derek Landri DT

2007 6 202 NWE Mike Richardson DB

2007 7 230 CIN Dan Santucci G

2007 7 253 CIN Nedu Ndukwe DB

2006 2 53 DAL Anthony Fasano TE

2006 3 90 TAM Maurice Stovall WR

2006 6 205 NWE Dan Stevenson G

2005 3 74 NYG Justin Tuck DE

2005 5 144 STL Jerome Collins TE

2004 2 43 DAL Julius Jones RB

2004 2 60 NOR Courtney Watson LB

2004 4 122 HOU Glenn Earl DB

2004 6 170 HOU Vontez Duff DB

2004 6 180 WAS Jim Molinaro T

 

Outside of Justin Tuck, the only name on that list making any kind of highlight reel would be Chinedum Ndukwe (Brady's roommate all 4 years) - but that's only thanks to your boyfriend's performance in the game that cost us our playoff spot.

[Legacy Fan]

Which side of the argument was that list supporting?

 

I do know it's a list of NFL total non-entities, right?

Ha!

 

Exactly.

 

re:

Jeff "the man responsible for Brady Quinn's career" Samardzija

What week do the Browns play the Cubbies this season?

[Lumbergh]

Which side of the argument was that list supporting?

 

I do know it's a list of NFL total non-entities, right?

 

a) that Quinn's team was loaded (fyi, BQ homers such as shepwrite say he only lost all those games since he had no supporting cast)

 

b ) we're talking college here bubba. And getting drafted is a good indication of a college bad ass.

[Lumbergh]

but we can't compare pro careers because Quinn's hasn't begun.

 

we can compare the first two years of their careers:

 

Manning: 50 touchdowns

 

Quinn: BENCH

[Guest Aloysius]

I do know it's a list of NFL total non-entities, right?

I disagree. Just look at the last two draft classes:

 

2008: John Carlson had 55 catches as a rookie. Trevor Laws was stuck behind a bunch of veterans last year, but he's certainly a talented player (he dominated at the Senior Bowl). John Sullivan will be starting for the Vikings this year.

 

2007: Abiamiri would have started for the Iggles last year had he not gotten hurt during camp. Ryan Harris has turned into a very good right tackle (only allowed 2.5 sacks last year). It looks like Ndukwe's going to be a backup this year, but he's a decent player.

 

Not sure why any of this matters much, but we don't have to trash young players for not contributing. That's Lum's job re: Quinn.

[AZBrowns]

Haven't even read the article yet, just responding to Shep's comparison of Quinn's arm and intelligence to Manning's.

 

You know maybe all the things Shep says about Quinn will come true, maybe not. But I heard him say the exact same things about Joey Harrington.

 

So far in the NFL Brady Quinn has won one game, has thrown two TDs, has a passer rating of 65 and got punched by a teammate.

 

It's not playing out like the Peyton Manning story.

 

I have great hope for Quinn as well.

 

But can we wait until he effing does something at this level before we gush?

 

Go out and win 11 games, throw for 4,000 yards and 30 TDs and I'll gush like a motherphucker.

 

Zombo

 

 

So, why won't you jump on Lumbergh when he gushes something about Derek Anderson that's completely off-base? I think that's what some have a beef with.

 

Not trying to jump on you Zombo, but that's the kind of impression I get. That you go back and forthwith Shep for his Quinn-love, but ignore Lumbergh for his DA-love. Why is that?

[Legacy Fan]

I disagree. Just look at the last two draft classes:

 

2008: John Carlson had 55 catches as a rookie. Trevor Laws was stuck behind a bunch of veterans last year, but he's certainly a talented player (he dominated at the Senior Bowl). John Sullivan will be starting for the Vikings this year.

 

2007: Abiamiri would have started for the Iggles last year had he not gotten hurt. Ryan Harris has turned into a very good right tackle. It looks like Ndukwe's going to be a backup this year, but he's a decent player.

 

Not sure why any of this matters much, but we don't have to trash young players for not contributing. That's Lum's job re: Quinn.

I know, I know. That's why I put him on ignore to begin with, I cant' resist.

 

I think I suggested picking up Laws for a DE if he was available round 4ish way back when.

Quinn played with Carlson for 1 season (and Carlson is going to be a solid TE, imo) because he was sitting behind Anthony Fasano (who is now Jason Witten's towel boy) both good TE's at ND and good weapons for Quinn. Carlson often created Winslow-esque mismatches because of his size, speed & hands.

As much as it pains me to say it, Zibby will probably be a good safety for the Ratheap.

 

As one of the Domer's on the board I've long maintained that with a half-step more, Darius Walker would have been Barry Sanders.

 

And yes, Samardzija was a pigskin magnet when the Irish needed a big play (except during the fiesta bowl against tOSU. The coverage on him looked like the prison shower scene from American History X).

[Zombo]

So, why won't you jump on Lumbergh when he gushes something about Derek Anderson that's completely off-base? I think that's what some have a beef with.

 

Not trying to jump on you Zombo, but that's the kind of impression I get. That you go back and forthwith Shep for his Quinn-love, but ignore Lumbergh for his DA-love. Why is that?

Shep is a much more formidable opponent. No one really challenges him sometimes, so I pick up the mantle.

 

Lumbergh bores me (other than a good one-line zinger every now and then) and has plenty of opposition, you guys don't need me to battle Lumbergh.

 

But someone has to keep Shep in check or he'll have Brady in the Hall before he wins his second game.

 

Zombo