Since We're Rebuilding, Would You Trade Rogers?

[Guest 88fingerslewy]

Think about this for a second.

 

The guys 30 yrs old. He's got a huge frame that HAS to contribute to his nagging injuries. By the time the team will HOPEFULLY be rebuilt, he'll be ineffective. You could score a king's ransom for this guy in a trade, now; next couple of years....doubt it. How many plays does he take off each game? He was blocked (one on one) by pitt's center on the goal-line TD. Is he good? Ya he's awesome. But he's 30.

 

"Living in the moment" isn't where football teams should be thinking.

 

You have to look to the past. Watch film and identify short-comings and strengths.

 

Look at the present. Where the team is and attack the task at hand.

 

Finally and most important, always be looking around the corner at where the team will be. Next week, next year, next 3 years. IMPROVE, IMPROVE, IMPROVE.

 

This team HAS to be looking into a long-term plan to right a sinking ship. We do we have? What do we need? How can we get what we need?

 

I dunno....just brain-storming. But what I do know is the only 2 people that play consistantly well and have another 10 yrs in the NFL are Thomas and Cribbs. Besides the latest draft and some 2yr or 3 yr guys. Nuke the team....get as much as you can....move on.

[blowe]

Think about this for a second.

 

The guys 30 yrs old. He's got a huge frame that HAS to contribute to his nagging injuries. By the time the team will HOPEFULLY be rebuilt, he'll be ineffective. You could score a king's ransom for this guy in a trade, now; next couple of years....doubt it. How many plays does he take off each game? He was blocked (one on one) by pitt's center on the goal-line TD. Is he good? Ya he's awesome. But he's 30.

 

"Living in the moment" isn't where football teams should be thinking.

 

You have to look to the past. Watch film and identify short-comings and strengths.

 

Look at the present. Where the team is and attack the task at hand.

 

Finally and most important, always be looking around the corner at where the team will be. Next week, next year, next 3 years. IMPROVE, IMPROVE, IMPROVE.

 

This team HAS to be looking into a long-term plan to right a sinking ship. We do we have? What do we need? How can we get what we need?

 

I dunno....just brain-storming. But what I do know is the only 2 people that play consistantly well and have another 10 yrs in the NFL are Thomas and Cribbs. Besides the latest draft and some 2yr or 3 yr guys. Nuke the team....get as much as you can....move on.

 

Interesting thought...I wouldn't trade Rogers now, but 3 years down the road I see that as a very real possibility...I just can not see how Mangini would trade the best player on our team

 

[NigelTufnel]

Absolutely not. You ride the Shaun Rodgers horse for as long as you can. I'd say he still has a few years left in him. Ahtyba Rubin is a young guy who can step in and take Rodgers place when he can't go anymore, and do a pretty damn good job of it from what we've seen of him. Under no circumstances should we give up a guy like Shaun Rodgers, especially since our defense is actually fairly decent and will likely be even better next year.

[bonedawg]

Absolutely not. You ride the Shaun Rodgers horse for as long as you can. I'd say he still has a few years left in him. Ahtyba Rubin is a young guy who can step in and take Rodgers place when he can't go anymore, and do a pretty damn good job of it from what we've seen of him. Under no circumstances should we give up a guy like Shaun Rodgers, especially since our defense is actually fairly decent and will likely be even better next year.

 

IF he stays motivated. This year might ruin it for him.

[NigelTufnel]

IF he stays motivated. This year might ruin it for him.

 

 

I think he understands the situation, and I get the feeling he enjoys playing for Rob Ryan. So I don't know that that is as big of a factor as some may make it out to be.

[Xanthros]

Why? we obviously have no intentions of building for the future when we consistently sit on sh!tty veterans that have no business starting rather than evaluating our younger talent.

Agreed...

[ATENEARS]

You have to start solidifying some area, you can't have all guys the same age. I think we have made strides with both lines. I hope we go after building the defense first, which Rogers is the king pin to build around.

 

I say no. He's a keeper.

[Guest 88fingerslewy]

Why? we obviously have no intentions of building for the future when we consistently sit on sh!tty veterans that have no business starting rather than evaluating our younger talent.

Exactly Mikey, I don't want to ride the Rogers horse right into the glue factory. It definitely has to come from the top. Band-aids (free agents) and duct tape (over-aged veterans) isn't where the team should be concentrating

[NW Ohio Brownie]

Why? we obviously have no intentions of building for the future when we consistently sit on sh!tty veterans that have no business starting rather than evaluating our younger talent.

 

 

Gonna have to disagree with you there, mikey. I really think Crennel was guilty of this, but not necessarily Mangini.

 

Mangini has started his #1 pick in Mack right from the first game. He has now jettisoned Edwards so that Massaquoi and Robiskie can see the field more often.

 

Also, this is the most action we've ever seen from Jerome Harrison. How many years have we been begging to see him get more time? I will agree that it gets frustrating watching Lewis run the ball, but every team has a tandem, if not set, of backs carrying the ball every game (even Minnesota).

 

The one spot where I would tend to agree with your assessment is with Veikune. He's been a no-show on the #1 D. We've got to try him in there, especially at ILB where I think Barton is garbage. Give him a shot.

 

But, there is no question we have mediocre veterans at key positions where we have no younger backups with talent. Like safety, or right tackle, or outside linebacker. That's why our next draft is HUGE.

[ATENEARS]

Don't forget Mangini has also played Cribbs on offense as WR, WildDawg, looked at him at Safety, consider him for RB ... (this is a reply along the line of everyone wanting Harrison in for years)

[NW Ohio Brownie]

Don't forget Mangini has also played Cribbs on offense as WR, WildDawg, looked at him at Safety, consider him for RB ... (this is a reply along the line of everyone wanting Harrison in for years)

 

That's a good point, Ate. I think that's further evidence that Mangini is trying to strike a balance between evaluating the players new to this roster, and experimenting with the holdovers like Cribbs. Take Mike Adams for example. He's starting to turn into a pretty good cover guy under this regime. Last year, he was a little-used safety

 

By the way, we've got to find a way to pay Cribbs. Even when he doesn't get the ball it has an effect. We had the ball outside the 40 both times they tried to kick it away from him today.

[ClevelandFanForLife]

Ok guys, we all know that Mangini is cleaning house and stock piling draft picks and that we all expect a trade by tomorrow. However, I think it is more likely to see Shaun Rogers get traded to the Jets. I know we are all sick of the trades with gang green but this one could be really good. I say this because the Jets' nose tackle, Kris Jenkins, has suffered a season ending injury.

 

Rogers still doesn't like Mangini, I don't care what anyone says. Mangini would love to get another 1st round pick and with Ndamukong Suh coming out, we can definitely afford to make this trade. There is no way that Rogers is worth less than that. I know that the Jets are panicking right now because Rex Ryan is feeling the heat after starting 3-0 and losing 3 straight. I can almost guarantee that the Jets have called their best friend George Kokinas wanting to trade him. I would really like to see this happen. I really like Rogers, but he isn't going to be here long term. He hates Mangini and wants to be on a winning team and I can't necessarily blame him.

 

With two first round picks in next year's draft, we could get Suh with our pick (assuming it will be in the top 5) and possibly Mays or Berry with the Jets (I don't think the Jets are that good so there pick will be in the mid-teens and Sanchez is not going to be anything special: ever).

 

I know that it may not be a popular move for ManKok to make, but come on: when was the last time they did something popular. Let's make this happen and build the right way: through the draft with studs and not mediocre good players from our coach's old team.

[CLEVELandMILIDH]

Jets cant afford to take on Rogers salary

[DeadWombat]

Yes, lets continue trading all our good players to the Jets for scrubs who don't contribute.

[The Gipper]

You must think the Dolans own and Mark Shapiro runs the Browns. I don't think the Browns are going to have the epic fire sale that the Indians regularly engage in. I do believe the salary cap and revenue sharing preclude that so much in this sport. In MLB you can have one team with a 220 million salary and another with a 30 mill salary. Not NFL, each team is pretty close in playing it players all the same amount.

[steel88]

Ok guys, we all know that Mangini is cleaning house and stock piling draft picks and that we all expect a trade by tomorrow. However, I think it is more likely to see Shaun Rogers get traded to the Jets. I know we are all sick of the trades with gang green but this one could be really good. I say this because the Jets' nose tackle, Kris Jenkins, has suffered a season ending injury.

 

Rogers still doesn't like Mangini, I don't care what anyone says. Mangini would love to get another 1st round pick and with Ndamukong Suh coming out, we can definitely afford to make this trade. There is no way that Rogers is worth less than that. I know that the Jets are panicking right now because Rex Ryan is feeling the heat after starting 3-0 and losing 3 straight. I can almost guarantee that the Jets have called their best friend George Kokinas wanting to trade him. I would really like to see this happen. I really like Rogers, but he isn't going to be here long term. He hates Mangini and wants to be on a winning team and I can't necessarily blame him.

 

With two first round picks in next year's draft, we could get Suh with our pick (assuming it will be in the top 5) and possibly Mays or Berry with the Jets (I don't think the Jets are that good so there pick will be in the mid-teens and Sanchez is not going to be anything special: ever).

 

I know that it may not be a popular move for ManKok to make, but come on: when was the last time they did something popular. Let's make this happen and build the right way: through the draft with studs and not mediocre good players from our coach's old team.

 

How do you figure Rogers doesn't like Mangini?

[ClevelandFanForLife]

How do you figure Rogers doesn't like Mangini?

you don't remember the "snub."

[steel88]

you don't remember the "snub."

 

Yeah I do but last I heard Mangini and Rogers smoothed that over.

[ClevelandFanForLife]

Yeah I do but last I heard Mangini and Rogers smoothed that over.

yeah, and mangini was going to make a qb decision and stick with him all season...

[steel88]

yeah, and mangini was going to make a qb decision and stick with him all season...

 

 

Lol, isnt it possible Lerner wanted Quinn and when he showed how terrible he was at the start of the season mangini said screw it and put Anderson in? I mean Id want Quinn as the face of my franchise too...he was a good QB in college(for the most part) and a lot of people loved him.

[Flugel]

Ok guys, we all know that Mangini is cleaning house and stock piling draft picks and that we all expect a trade by tomorrow. However, I think it is more likely to see Shaun Rogers get traded to the Jets. I know we are all sick of the trades with gang green but this one could be really good. I say this because the Jets' nose tackle, Kris Jenkins, has suffered a season ending injury.

 

Rogers still doesn't like Mangini, I don't care what anyone says. Mangini would love to get another 1st round pick and with Ndamukong Suh coming out, we can definitely afford to make this trade. There is no way that Rogers is worth less than that. I know that the Jets are panicking right now because Rex Ryan is feeling the heat after starting 3-0 and losing 3 straight. I can almost guarantee that the Jets have called their best friend George Kokinas wanting to trade him. I would really like to see this happen. I really like Rogers, but he isn't going to be here long term. He hates Mangini and wants to be on a winning team and I can't necessarily blame him.

 

With two first round picks in next year's draft, we could get Suh with our pick (assuming it will be in the top 5) and possibly Mays or Berry with the Jets (I don't think the Jets are that good so there pick will be in the mid-teens and Sanchez is not going to be anything special: ever).

 

I know that it may not be a popular move for ManKok to make, but come on: when was the last time they did something popular. Let's make this happen and build the right way: through the draft with studs and not mediocre good players from our coach's old team.

 

I hear ya and appreciate the thinking outside the box. After all, anything is possible.

 

Here's how I'm starting to make peace with everything this year. We're starting to compete to the extend that we're not a blowout and we're going to be in the ball game in the 4th quarter every week. Trust me when I say I've seen MUCH WORSE Steeler matchups. Where I'm going with this I/WE need Mankok to show our fanbase we are competitive and ready for good things in 2010. To get rid of Shaun Rogers removes the electricity and juice from our Defense. I heard one of the commentators say some of the defenders were telling them that they know anytime Shaun is on the field good things CAN happen and have happened. He's a proven commodity so why take the ONLY thing proven and get rid of it for a 1st round pick that could either get hurt or become the same swing and miss Glen Dorsey became.

 

I've always wanted 1 EASY fix and alot of others do as well. That's why QUINN was so important to so many of us. Guess what? Want other examples of this? How often do you see "fire the OC." We've done that in the past and gotten rid of Mo Carthon for Jeff Davidson. And for 1 week we were all throwing Davidson parades until the next DC did a little film study and turned him into the next Mo Carthon right before our very eyes. Many people think we should just fire Mangini because there's a tree branch with the next Vince Lomardi sitting on it with all the answers. Guess what?

 

I like alot of the moves Mankok has made. Changing over a poor runned organization is never easy in corporate America or in sports. I think the first step has been successful for the most part. The MEDIA wants to portray Mangini as a jerk. That said, if you look at guys like BB and Parcells when they headed off to turn around crappy organizations - they weren't going there to be nice guys. They new what had to be done. Same with Jimmy Johnson. The first year Parcells was in NE he had to endure 1-15 with a rookie named Bledsoe - I think things were just as miserable when he started in NY with Phil Simms and Scott Bruner. Jimmy Johnson went 1-15 with a rookie Troy Aikman. These guys look at it like this: "Tough times don't last - tough people do!" I HOPE Mankok is right and they've learned from some great people.

- Tom F.

[medicineman]

It don't really matter. We keep gettin xxxxd and lose anyhow.

[Riffer X]

We gotta be careful here about thinking we can just stockpile picks and everything will be hunky dory. Rogers is a beast and a game changer, hence probably the only guy on defense that's a bonafide stud.

 

IMO we have three studs on the team in JT, Cribbs and Rogers. The rest are Barton, Pool and Poke Chop types. We have gotten rid of Winslow and Edwards for good reason, but further purging of proven studs is not recommended from my point of view. Proven commodities are just what they are, there is no guarantee even three draft picks could add up to Rogers' value.

 

Mangie is not stupid, he knows it takes playmakers to win in this league. Right now, he's trying to solidify depth and contributors along with an intelligent football team. It's the building blocks, but you can't just start purging all your proven players. This is not Herschel Walker we're talking about here.

 

Also, anybody find it funny that Cribbs' agent came out last week talking contract? That should have told us all Cribbs would have a much bigger role in the offense. They need to take care of Cribbs, but there is nothing he can do during the year besides sitting out, and that ain't gonna happen.

 

Meanwhile, JT continues to domnate. Did Jaret Allen even play against us?

[ATENEARS]

Riff, you're forgetting Mack ... he's a keeper.

[Mr. T]

I wouldn't trade him, he is a keeper.

 

He is the type of guy who can teach the younger guys what its all about, he makes a great mentor for the younger players. I love his work ethic the man keeps working every down regardless the situation.

[Earl34]

After he went to all the trouble to smooth things over with him?

 

So that we have no presence in the middle?

 

Absolutely not. No friggin way.

 

The last player a 3-4 coach wants to trade is his Pro Bowl NT.

[samoth]

Since we got him for free, yes I'd trade him.

[Earl34]

Ok guys, we all know that Mangini is cleaning house and stock piling draft picks and that we all expect a trade by tomorrow. However, I think it is more likely to see Shaun Rogers get traded to the Jets. I know we are all sick of the trades with gang green but this one could be really good. I say this because the Jets' nose tackle, Kris Jenkins, has suffered a season ending injury.

 

Rogers still doesn't like Mangini, I don't care what anyone says. Mangini would love to get another 1st round pick and with Ndamukong Suh coming out, we can definitely afford to make this trade. There is no way that Rogers is worth less than that. I know that the Jets are panicking right now because Rex Ryan is feeling the heat after starting 3-0 and losing 3 straight. I can almost guarantee that the Jets have called their best friend George Kokinas wanting to trade him. I would really like to see this happen. I really like Rogers, but he isn't going to be here long term. He hates Mangini and wants to be on a winning team and I can't necessarily blame him.

 

With two first round picks in next year's draft, we could get Suh with our pick (assuming it will be in the top 5) and possibly Mays or Berry with the Jets (I don't think the Jets are that good so there pick will be in the mid-teens and Sanchez is not going to be anything special: ever).

 

I know that it may not be a popular move for ManKok to make, but come on: when was the last time they did something popular. Let's make this happen and build the right way: through the draft with studs and not mediocre good players from our coach's old team.

 

Absolutely not. Mangini smoothed it over with him and Rogers is on board. If he wasn't we'd all be hearing about it. I know it for a fact.

 

Also, he wouldn't trade a Pro Bowl 3-4 NT. The defense without him is useless.

 

Nice try though. It would otherwise make sense.

 

[Riffer X]

Riff, you're forgetting Mack ... he's a keeper.

 

Oh yeah, Mack is a keeper and getting better, but he is far from stud status yet.

 

Did anybody catch Puke players talking about what a bitch Cribbs is? This dude is one of the best pound for pound players in the league, hands down.

 

PS That's bitch in a bad ass way you mouth inhalers.

[Flugel]

Riff, you're forgetting Mack ... he's a keeper.

 

Well said Riff and Stan! We've really got a nice core group of young guys to build a strong team around. Mack & Thomas comprise 40% of the oline so that ain't bad. I'd still like us to take a stab at bringing in a guy like Harrison just for the remainder of THIS year.

 

If we go week by week, with the understanding we aren't a Superbowl contender - I think we can all evaluate what excites us about our short term future and long term future. Hopefully we can start to win some games and build momentum.

 

I REALLY don't want to start all over from square 1 in 2010 w/ 1 more new head Coach, 1 more new GM and 1 more new OC and DC. Don't believe EVERY thing the media tells us about Mangini because they had everyone convinced Bill Belichick couldn't coach, Vinny Testaverde couldn't win and Eric Zeier was the best QB in town. Be careful with all that. THEN, all of a sudden they were telling us we were going to the Superbowl when in actuality we were moving to Baltimore by the time that Superbowl was kicking off.

 

Here's the thing - Ernie Accorsi has been a GREAT advisor around the league regarding GM hires and he highly recommended 3 guys to Atltanta in 2008. 1 was Thomas Dimitroff who they hired and things went great. Another recommendation was Kokkinos whom was recommended to Lerner by Accorsi and it's even better he already had a great working relationship with Mangini. I'm liking what we're getting for Edwards and Winslow while their new times got 0 wins in return so far. One of Sanchez's 5 INTs bounced off Braylon's right paw first. Imagine that!

 

While Sanchez is going through some predictable growing pains in NY - we opted to see if Quinn or DA could take the bull by the horns while adding a very impressive Safety from NY, a starting ILBer, Kenyon Coleman, and Bowens. I think our running game is okay when we have the right RBs in there. Our passing game needs a legit #1 WR and more consistency with the hands from the supporting cast. We also need Heiden healthy. I expect to see Robiskie and MoMass getting better. My biggest wish is to bring in Harrison as a stop gap for the remainder of the season.

- Tom F.