Support for Mangini

[mopaji]

I am curious to find out how many people actually like Mangini and understand the enormous task he has rebuilding this team. I hear nothing but trash about him from every media clown and internet drone and I can't seem to figure out the logic behind it. I hear a lot of people talking about blowing this team up and starting over and that is exactly what is happening right before our eyes. This is what it looks like. So, I'm creating a poll to gauge how many people secretly like what Mangini is doing and how many people are just pissed about our Browns and need someone to take the fall for it.

 

 

[ATENEARS]

I am curious to find out how many people actually like Mangini and understand the enormous task he has rebuilding this team. I hear nothing but trash about him from every media clown and internet drone and I can't seem to figure out the logic behind it. I hear a lot of people talking about blowing this team up and starting over and that is exactly what is happening right before our eyes. This is what it looks like. So, I'm creating a poll to gauge how many people secretly like what Mangini is doing and how many people are just pissed about our Browns and need someone to take the fall for it.

 

I agree. Mangini has cut 53 players, of which only 3 have been activated on another teams roster (see my post here). Gradkowski-Oak, Bret Lockett-NE, Phil Trautwein-Stl are the only three to make it on an active roster and are of no loss here. Gradkowski has seen a little playing time, Lockett is a Db who has 5 tackles and a forced fumble, Trautwein hasn't played.

 

We are aligned perfectly for a complete rebuilding process, with 11 Draft picks stock-piled. Actually, the tearing down the team and getting ready for rebuild couldn't have been done much better at this point, IMO.

 

I'm still very much in support of Mangini ... only questioning the coaching on the offensive side of the ball, but realizing this team has very little talent to work with on either side.

[BrownIndian]

Towards the middle of 2008, Browns fans were still hoping for a miracle to help make it to the playoffs ... then with injuries to DA and BQ the Browns fans were first praying for the offense to just score a touchdown. It was that bad. At that point we had Dorsey and Gradkowski, who were called on to the job and hence could not lead the chains. We figured if BQ or DA was there atleast we can score some touchdowns with the talent.

 

2009 came, Mangini came, DA and BQ came but the touchdowns ? they never did. Our offense that seemed mediocre under Chud seems lifeless under Daboll ? 70 dollars to watch this is a rip off.

 

Some of us Browns Fans do realize that we do need more rebuilding and that it is not an easy task or a 1 year job but we also know that we are not so FUBAR that we will struggle to score touchdowns. Mangini' Offense is not doing a great job. The free agents he bought in are hardly replacements for wht we lost. And when we traded away KW2 and BE we did not get any worthy talent via draft or in exchange.

 

Next year even with 11 draft picks, we dont know how many will pan out, how many will be stud prima donnas, how many will even be there in the practice squad. If the most "nfl ready" receiver is struggling to find it going strong with the Browns then it scares me to think that we have 11 draft picks.

 

The way Mangini is rebuilding, I dont know when when it will be successful, but it surely seems painful.

[hammertime]

I agree. Mangini has cut 53 players, of which only 3 have been activated on another teams roster (see my post here). Gradkowski-Oak, Bret Lockett-NE, Phil Trautwein-Stl are the only three to make it on an active roster and are of no loss here. Gradkowski has seen a little playing time, Lockett is a Db who has 5 tackles and a forced fumble, Trautwein hasn't played.

 

We are aligned perfectly for a complete rebuilding process, with 11 Draft picks stock-piled. Actually, the tearing down the team and getting ready for rebuild couldn't have been done much better at this point, IMO.

 

I'm still very much in support of Mangini ... only questioning the coaching on the offensive side of the ball, but realizing this team has very little talent to work with on either side.

 

 

That was an excellent reply.

[ballpeen]

I voted yes, but my opinion is more like "maybe" rather than yes as to the direction, but he needs ample time to implement his vision.

[ClevelandFanForLife]

although i respect what stan and all the other supporters have to say, i have to disagree with their views. i was against mangini from the start and was sure that he would do nothing but set us back 3 or 4 years. in the past 10 months i can honestly say that i have not changed my views of him for one second. he still is horrible and will probably fail if he stays.

 

how so we know that he can build a team? the only year he went to the playoffs was when he coached a team that herm edwards had put together. he has no experience putting a full team together because he was let go by new york after a couple of years.

 

his track record shows this. da'brickashaw ferguson, vernon gholston and kellen clemens are just some of the busts that he was sure would produce. i know that there are some of the guys he drafted that turned out to be ok but these ferguson and gholston were supposed to be dominant at their positions. gholston gets pushed around and ferguson is barely a sufficient right tackle.

 

he is a prick who only thinks that he is right and everyone else is wrong. he lies like crazy: the newest one stating that he didn't know about quinn's escalators yet he commented on them weeks before.

 

nothing would make me happier than to see the browns become a force in this league. i just don't think it will be under mangini. i hope i'm wrong.

[mopaji]

I agree. Mangini has cut 53 players, of which only 3 have been activated on another teams roster (see my post here). Gradkowski-Oak, Bret Lockett-NE, Phil Trautwein-Stl are the only three to make it on an active roster and are of no loss here. Gradkowski has seen a little playing time, Lockett is a Db who has 5 tackles and a forced fumble, Trautwein hasn't played.

 

We are aligned perfectly for a complete rebuilding process, with 11 Draft picks stock-piled. Actually, the tearing down the team and getting ready for rebuild couldn't have been done much better at this point, IMO.

 

I'm still very much in support of Mangini ... only questioning the coaching on the offensive side of the ball, but realizing this team has very little talent to work with on either side.

 

 

ATENEARS, you and Chip Banks are the most logical and informative posters on this site. I think somebody should tell you that.

[peterbell]

Mangini has my total support..This team needed a complete rebuilding and 8 games in thats painfully obvious..He flipped the roster as much as he could, playing the rookies he drafted..I feel he has the right plan and am more then willing to allow him time to implement that vision.

[ClevelandFanForLife]

playing the rookies he drafted..

really? aside from momas and mack, the other rookies have not gotten much of a chance. i remember robiski getting one catch, maybe two. maiva has played special teams and not much defense. veikune has been an absolute ghost. he is only playing two rookies and the others aren't getting much playing time. he needs to let them play so that they can learn something.

[ClevelandFanForLife]

Mangini has my total support..This team needed a complete rebuilding and 8 games in thats painfully obvious..

yeah it's obvious that we need to rebuild and he is the reason we have looked so terrible. he blew up the team with nobody to take their places and the people that are supposed to be taking their places don't play. mangini is lost but won't admit it. he needs to go.

[ATENEARS]

although i respect what stan and all the other supporters have to say, i have to disagree with their views. i was against mangini from the start and was sure that he would do nothing but set us back 3 or 4 years. in the past 10 months i can honestly say that i have not changed my views of him for one second. he still is horrible and will probably fail if he stays.

 

Being 'against him from the start' leads me to believe your bias and never gave him a chance. The Cleveland Browns have NEVER hired an experienced head coach. Mangini is the first EVER in our franchise history to have previous head coacing experience. Couple in that he is young, and it's easy to see why Lerner hired him.

 

A new coach would have waffled along with Edwards and Winslow for three more years, flirting with the playoffs in one of those years, but never reaching it. Mangini had the balls to take a hit to his ego and our record and do this thing right, basically becoming an expansion team all over again. Add in that we've had one of the most difficult schedules to-date. I say give the guy some time. Give him through at least the mid-point next season to evaluate him. Let's see how they do against the softer schedule to come, his draft with the 11 Draft picks the 'HE' stockpiled, a free agent class, training camp, and another half of season. I'll admit, he can't do any worse ... but we all need to shut-up (media especially) and let the guy do his job in adequate time.

 

 

how so we know that he can build a team? the only year he went to the playoffs was when he coached a team that herm edwards had put together. he has no experience putting a full team together because he was let go by new york after a couple of years.

 

Herm Edwards team was 4-12 that he inherited. The Jets have been a true Roller Coaster of 4-12, 10-6, 4-12, 10-6, 4-12, 10-6 ... shows me that they win with an eased schedule and lose with a tough one, same as here. You can't go by that, we can only go by what Mangini does here over the next 12 Months.

 

he is a prick who only thinks that he is right and everyone else is wrong. he lies like crazy: the newest one stating that he didn't know about quinn's escalators yet he commented on them weeks before.

 

The oppisite of that is a coach who doesn't believe in himself, and runs the team by what the fans want. Sorry, but this is a bonus for wanting mangini, as this media market and this declining fan base have no clue what they are talking about when it comes to QB's and Professional football (see: Crying at the ouster of Bernie, Downing of Belichick, Hype for Tim Couch, Boycott a game against the Baltimore Browns for the ouster of an 8-game old Coach).

 

nothing would make me happier than to see the browns become a force in this league. i just don't think it will be under mangini. i hope i'm wrong.

 

Don't take me wrong, I don't want to force feed my opinion to you, but I think we all owe it to ourselves to give this plan some time. We bared this team and deservingly so. We have a lot to look forward to with the draft and FA Market ... if we can all get through this season without killing one another.

 

Trying times for sure.

[Gips]

Mangini is not the answer...i didnt poll because while i dont support mangini i dont think he is a nazi sent to destroy the browns...i believe he is a below average intelligence coach thats in way over his head...he runs an unacceptable offensive scheme and refuses to dump daboll in which he should have never brought in to begin with...and in the end that will buy him a ticket out of town..

 

He failed to blow the team up right (before the season started)...he found several ways to crawl under the fans skin with his pie in the sky lies and bullshit and little kiddie headgames if he stays longer than one year he will fail to rebuild this team correctly unless the new GM calls all the shots...he has horrible evaluation skills and is slow to study the causes and quick to shrug the blame to anyone but himself...jets fans called us on this hoodwink..they were right..

[ClevelandFanForLife]

Being 'against him from the start' leads me to believe your bias and never gave him a chance.

no argument with this. i hated him then and i hate him now. i do not see myself giving him a shot in the near future because i think he is lost and can't succeed.

 

i guess that there could be a part of me that wants to see the browns go 1-15 because then there will be no way he will be back next year. i would love to see the browns win a few more games. however, we know that we aren't going anywhere this year and it may be pointless to screw up our draft picks. we have a decently easy schedule the rest of the way and could win 3-4 of them. it all depends on how we play. if the players know that if they lose mangini will be fired then they may take off plays (even more than now) and purposely lose. then again they could react by playing hard and not wanting to be on a team that went 1-15 or 2-14.

 

maybe the thing that makes me most mad about mangini is his arrogance and possibly even ignorance. when he was first hired and was asked if he would go away from the 3-4, he responded with a "no" while laughing. it was as if there was no other option and the person asking the question was a moron. he is so arrogant with the whole qb thing as well. he plays it so close to the chest as if it's the he actually got enjoyment in making people wait. he came in and tore everything down that reminded anyone of the old browns because he honestly thinks that his way will be better than in the past.

 

even typing all of this and remembering what he's done and said gets me mad. i hate thinking about the fat ass and want to be rid of him all together.

 

i'm sorry if i come off as a jerk sometimes, but it honestly makes me sick to think of the way he runs bussiness. let me be clear: i have no problems with any of the actual browns fans on this board (with the exception of a few) and love that i have a place to talk browns football everyday. i just wonder how long it will take to start seeing threads named "now that mangini's been canned, will anyone pick him up?"

[Solon16]

"Mangini is the first EVER in our franchise history to have previous head coacing experience"

 

He's the second in the history of the Browns...... but that is still pathetic.

[hoorta]

really? aside from momas and mack, the other rookies have not gotten much of a chance. i remember robiski getting one catch, maybe two. maiva has played special teams and not much defense. veikune has been an absolute ghost. he is only playing two rookies and the others aren't getting much playing time. he needs to let them play so that they can learn something.

 

This is what worries me about Mangini. If he's calling the shots in the draft, he's been less than stellar. Yeah, Mack's been mighty good- he should be, if you draft a center in the first round. Gotten nothing out of Robo, he was supposed to be our JJ replacement. The rest of the guys he drafted have been pretty much invisible.

 

Really, I'm ambivalent about EM. Personally, I think he's totally screwed up the qb situation from the get-go. If we get Holmgren in and he can entice Chucky Gruden to coach the Browns, I sure won't shed a tear to see Mangini go. The team's been blown up so thoroughly, does it really matter who does the rebuilding?

[professor_g]

Pretty simple fact..................The type of GM needed in Cleveland is clearly a "complete control" guy who will remake the organization from the ground up.

 

Another pretty simple fact.........A "complete control" guy is not getting complete control if a head coach comes with the package.

 

Think of it this way, if you are looking to take a job as a VP of Human Resources for a big company who is in complete disarray and the CEO says "you have complete control to do whatever you need to do to turn us around, but the Director of HR stays" Now you are faced with the additional task of figuring out the role that the Director played in the existing dysfunction......before you make your decision! It's just not a feasible situation.

 

This is one point I just don't get. Perhaps as a practical matter you need someone with final say. At the very least you need an agreed-upon process for resolving disagreement when it arises. But why do you need a "complete control" guy? What you need are intelligent football minds that are willing to reason through things together, weighing all the relevant considerations. You probably also need a bit of luck as well. But why do you need a football dictator? No disrespect-- maybe I'm missing something, but it just doesn't make sense to me.

[Canton Mike]

This team didn't get the way it is through just ONE or TWO drafts. Mangini inherited a team in disarray. I'm not ready to say our young receivers are bad picks...at last year's Super Bowl, I seem to recall the commentators saying (referring to Fitzgerald, who is a STUD WR!) that it takes 2-3 years for a receiver to develop into a good NFL player.

To expect a winner this year was not reasonable. Personally, I think a lot of positive things have been done & I'm willing to wait it out.

I honestly think Mangini will do fine, but we need to be patient. Folks may agree or disagree with me about him, but I WOULD like to see the personal slurs stop. That comes from a mentality that makes fun of others which I consider to bet a bully's behavior, and that's pretty gutless.

Just my opinions...those of a lifelong Brown's fan who feels we ARE finally on the right track..let's not de-rail the train now.

Mike

[DawgTracker]

This is more support than I expected for mangini on this board. The browns don't have many high level starters, it will take some time to improve this situation. Mangini knows everyone's strengths and weaknesses now so expect more free agent signings this off season.

[CLEVELandMILIDH]

Mangini is the most hated coach (from the local media and nationally) in the history of professional sports. Even more then when Bellicheck was here. Thats why when he succeds Im gonna be glad to say he's our coach, The Cleveland Browns Head coach.

Cleveland has always been pissed on by everyone that has no idea what Cleveland is like, and never even visited Cleveland. From ESPN to The Late Show, everyone takes shots at Cleveland. Alot of people say Clevelanders are arrogant, its not arrogance its a US VERSE THE WORLD mentality because of the unnesisary dissrespect from outsiders. Now Mangini has to deal with all the negative media that us Clevelanders have always dealt with, when he gets this team turned around it wont only be for him or the browns or Cleveland, but all of Ohio. We'll be able to stand proud and say we did it all by are self. Theres no greater satisfaction then proving someone wrong. I hope and beleive Mangini can do that and when he does I'll be glad to call him my coach

[steel88]

Mangini is the most hated coach (from the local media and nationally) in the history of professional sports. Even more then when Bellicheck was here. Thats why when he succeds Im gonna be glad to say he's our coach, The Cleveland Browns Head coach.

Cleveland has always been pissed on by everyone that has no idea what Cleveland is like, and never even visited Cleveland. From ESPN to The Late Show, everyone takes shots at Cleveland. Alot of people say Clevelanders are arrogant, its not arrogance its a US VERSE THE WORLD mentality because of the unnesisary dissrespect from outsiders. Now Mangini has to deal with all the negative media that us Clevelanders have always dealt with, when he gets this team turned around it wont only be for him or the browns or Cleveland, but all of Ohio. We'll be able to stand proud and say we did it all by are self. Theres no greater satisfaction then proving someone wrong. I hope and beleive Mangini can do that and when he does I'll be glad to call him my coach

 

Post of the decade!

[Chicopee John]

He needs to show me the money, so to speak.

 

I am skeptical but would love nothing better than to be pleasantly surprised.

 

There is no reason for me to support this guy or not. Support can be measured with Ws and Ls.

[shockubtches]

Things that annoy me about Mangini

 

#1I know both QBs suck, but stick with one, dont flip flop, its gets us nowhere, the Qbs cant improve, and its just annoying

 

#2. this draft better be freaking amazing, cause this one, other than one good game by Mohammad, has shown me nothing at all.

 

#3 Make damn sure Quinn IS NOT the future, cause if he isnt than we need another QB, so get one.

 

#4 Quit being a control freak, i know its crazy but there are other people out there more talented than Mangini at what they specifically do. MAngini is a coach. Coaches coach, General Managers manage, so Mangini, do your job and the new GM will do theirs, if the even keep you on.

 

I am not saying all this because i hate the guy, he had two winning seasons in three years with the Jets which we havent had in awhile so he can coach some, its just the hiding stuff, the flip flopping, the abrupt dismissal of the GM that bother me. Yes i want wins and losses but i also want class, and it just doesnt seem like Mangini has much.

[ATENEARS]

I am curious to find out how many people actually like Mangini and understand the enormous task he has rebuilding this team. I hear nothing but trash about him from every media clown and internet drone and I can't seem to figure out the logic behind it. I hear a lot of people talking about blowing this team up and starting over and that is exactly what is happening right before our eyes. This is what it looks like. So, I'm creating a poll to gauge how many people secretly like what Mangini is doing and how many people are just pissed about our Browns and need someone to take the fall for it.

 

 

You have to be pleased with the results of this poll. I'm thinking it surprised you?

[EdwardG]

I say fire him. Yes, the team needs to be rebuilt but imo he isn't the one to do it. He alienates people, trouble follows the guy, and you don't want a guy like this running your team. Sure, he unloaded people he should've unloaded, and maybe he is setting this team up well so it can be rebuilt, but look who they got in these trades. None of the former Jets picked up at the start of the year are imo any better than the people we replaced. The team looks worse than last year, too... There is nothing I've seen from this team that looks the least bit promising. Again, I'm all for blowing it up as they've done, and I was definitely ready for Savage's act to be over, but eventually you have to actually build a winner. Despite his horrid drafting, Jim Paxson did a great job of shedding payroll for the Cavs, but I sure am glad he was canned when he was. I doubt Mangini will be getting any more coaching/GM offers when he's on the street than Paxson has.

 

However, my main contention is that Mangini should have NOTHING to do with the hiring of the new exec and GM. When that exec and GM comes in, it should be HIS choice on whether Mangini stays or goes.

[ATENEARS]

I say fire him. Yes, the team needs to be rebuilt but imo he isn't the one to do it. He alienates people, trouble follows the guy, and you don't want a guy like this running your team. Sure, he unloaded people he should've unloaded, and maybe he is setting this team up well so it can be rebuilt, but look who they got in these trades. None of the former Jets picked up at the start of the year are imo any better than the people we replaced. The team looks worse than last year, too... There is nothing I've seen from this team that looks the least bit promising. Again, I'm all for blowing it up as they've done, and I was definitely ready for Savage's act to be over, but eventually you have to actually build a winner. Despite his horrid drafting, Jim Paxson did a great job of shedding payroll for the Cavs, but I sure am glad he was canned when he was. I doubt Mangini will be getting any more coaching/GM offers when he's on the street than Paxson has.

 

However, my main contention is that Mangini should have NOTHING to do with the hiring of the new exec and GM. When that exec and GM comes in, it should be HIS choice on whether Mangini stays or goes.

 

 

I'm still a Mangini apologist, but I can agree with this post. Good post, well said.

 

I just want to excuse all the so-called trouble, because a lot of it is whiney media posers acting like they have a personal vendetta. It's not even journalism, it's whining.

 

... and I will probably say this 80 times before Mangini is let go ... but this whole media rantings reminds me of the Belichick lynching of the early 90's.

[EdwardG]

I just hope Lerner doesn't screw up the next hire. Frankly, I'm concerned he's going to hand the keys over to Cowher. I'm not convinced whether Cowher's success was in great coaching or just being part of a great system. Tomlin has come right in with barely a hiccup. If Cowher is a bad hire, it could set the team back a decade.

 

Lerner needs to simply pick a good exec and let that guy pick the coach. No more of this svengali coach nonsense where the coach rules the roost. No more immature dingalings like Savage. I'm sure there were fans who thought that Lerner hiring Mangini the way he did was a good idea (before the GM), but I don't know any. It was so OBVIOUSLY ridiculous. Now Lerner has another guy in Kokonis who he's paying to hang out at the beach.

[ATENEARS]

An Holmgren/Gruden hiring would sell pretty well.

[Canton Mike]

I just hope Lerner doesn't screw up the next hire. Frankly, I'm concerned he's going to hand the keys over to Cowher. I'm not convinced whether Cowher's success was in great coaching or just being part of a great system. Tomlin has come right in with barely a hiccup. If Cowher is a bad hire, it could set the team back a decade.

 

Lerner needs to simply pick a good exec and let that guy pick the coach. No more of this svengali coach nonsense where the coach rules the roost. No more immature dingalings like Savage. I'm sure there were fans who thought that Lerner hiring Mangini the way he did was a good idea (before the GM), but I don't know any. It was so OBVIOUSLY ridiculous. Now Lerner has another guy in Kokonis who he's paying to hang out at the beach.

 

As I've mentioned before, Lerner needs a President of Football Operations & that person should be hired by Lerner AND a team of "football wise" consultants. Then that person or team needs to select a GM, then go with a Coach (be it Mangini or another) with whom they can work cohesively.

As good a Coach as I believe Cowher was, you are correct, he hired into a GREAT system. Hopefully, we can create a good & well functioning system here.

Mike

[hoorta]

I'm still a Mangini apologist, but I can agree with this post. Good post, well said.

 

I just want to excuse all the so-called trouble, because a lot of it is whiney media posers acting like they have a personal vendetta. It's not even journalism, it's whining.

 

... and I will probably say this 80 times before Mangini is let go ... but this whole media rantings reminds me of the Belichick lynching of the early 90's.

 

Yeah Stan, I remember "Metcalf up the middle" and Bernie's diminishing skills. Wrong on one, right on the other.

 

Oh, the Belichek lynching of the 90s was a tempest in a teapot compared to this. Now shall we discuss Anderson's "diminishing skills"? DA has the potential of a whale turd sitting on the bottom of the ocean, yet Mangini seems primed to give this POS yet another chance- and that would be to set the ALL TIME RECORD FOR WORST PASSER RATING IN THE HISTORY OF THE NFL!!!

 

When your team captain spouts off to the media, you'd better notice. When 95% of the national reporting is negative, you'd better notice. When your offensive (really offensive) coordinator is afraid to let a college quarterback try more than one pass out of the WildDawg, I sure notice.

 

[mohican]

I don't mind a dry, disciplanarian coach (although upbeat coaches are more fun to watch - the players wouldn't need showers with cowher spitting on the sidelines). Mangini seems to bring a total lack of integrity. I have to look no further than the quarterback debacle to determine that. There is no doubt in my mind that the only reason he is playing Quinn is not because he wants to, but he was told to or he thinks he can save face that way.