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Merry Christmas to everybody (except woodpecker is the gay grinch of the board)

calfoxwc

By calfoxwc
in POLITICAL DISCUSSION

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calfoxwc Grand Master

calfoxwc

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The "uncle fester" ? comparison made me laugh...

 

But I really believe in Cruz. It's time somebody started standing

on principle, once and for all.

 

Cruz does, and trump plays the role like a comedian/actor...

 

and Carson is far more like Cruz in the "stand on principle" dept.

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bbedward Proficient

bbedward

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Cruz: Piggy backed on Trump's immigration plan because it was popular, no abortion even if incest, rape, mother is going to die, rule supreme court ruling on gay marriage unconstitutional, impose a VAT tax on everything - use flawed ass mathemetics to make it sound like a lower rate (see below*), get rid of social security (for younger people, older people will just not be able to retire until their 70s), flat income tax, net neutrality is obamacare for the internet, no longer mandate insurance on birth control.

 

 

* Cruz's VAT tax he says is 16%

What he really means is something like 19% +

 

Meaning if you buy something for $100. You would pay $119 with a 19% sales tax.

 

So how do you get 16% from that? Well, 16% of $119 is $19. He calculates his value after the tax is added.

 

Shady lawyer stuff from a batshit crazy guy. And anyone who wants to say a VAT tax is fair can suck it - lower class people use all of their disposable income and don't save anything - higher class people save a hell of a lot.

 

Cruz is extremely dangerous. Trump is at least reasonable on most everything when you look past the showmanship. Cruz also receives more big money than any other GOP candidate (including Bush I think* If not it's very close).

 

But Cal likes him because he talks about God a lot.

 

---

 

Anyway, Merry Christmas everybody (including Woody)

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gftChris Newbie

gftChris

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Naahhhh...Merry Christmas Woody and Chris. My debates with you guys about Christianity has gotten me to do even more beneficial bible studies :)

Glad I could help?! As I've said before, if it makes you happier and a better person then I'm all for it. Just, keep it to yourself? ;)

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OldBrownsFan Newbie

OldBrownsFan

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Glad I could help?! As I've said before, if it makes you happier and a better person then I'm all for it. Just, keep it to yourself? ;)

 

No can do. Sharing the faith is an important commandment for believers...but I am happier and a better person for my faith. No doubt the life I was living in the 70's would have put me in the grave by now for sure.

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gftChris Newbie

gftChris

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And that's the problem. I have no issue with you being religious, being christian, muslim, hindu, jewish, buddhist, or worshiping at the blocking statue of joe thomas. But when you tell me I *have* to live my life this way because your god tells you so, then I'm going to take issue.

 

I don't mind, so much, people saying "hey, have you heard about jesus? he's a cool guy!" and I can say "yeah, not for me thanks" and they say "ok thanks for listening" - no biggie. And to be honest, most christians I've met have been that way, and indeed most religious people.

 

However, when it goes more like "you're living in SIN! you're going to burn in hell fire for eternity, you man whore! global warming is god being angry with us for allowing gay marriage!" then yeah, we're going to butt heads.

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OldBrownsFan Newbie

OldBrownsFan

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And that's the problem. I have no issue with you being religious, being christian, muslim, hindu, jewish, buddhist, or worshiping at the blocking statue of joe thomas. But when you tell me I *have* to live my life this way because your god tells you so, then I'm going to take issue.

 

I don't mind, so much, people saying "hey, have you heard about jesus? he's a cool guy!" and I can say "yeah, not for me thanks" and they say "ok thanks for listening" - no biggie. And to be honest, most christians I've met have been that way, and indeed most religious people.

 

However, when it goes more like "you're living in SIN! you're going to burn in hell fire for eternity, you man whore! global warming is god being angry with us for allowing gay marriage!" then yeah, we're going to butt heads.

 

Actually Chris the first time I debated you on bible issues was when you made a thread about possible life form on other planets and you asked for input from Christian believers. I have made a few posts on my faith but most of the time I am responding to what is being said.

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gftChris Newbie

gftChris

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Debating on the existence of god is both redundant and endless. It can never be proven one way or the other and has no impact on reality.

 

When I said keep it to yourself, I was more talking about keeping it out of legislation.

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bbedward Proficient

bbedward

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Debating on the existence of god is both redundant and endless. It can never be proven one way or the other and has no impact on reality.

 

Spoken like a true agnostic.

 

Though it does have an impact on reality in terms of wars and people denying things like evolution and refusing to teach it in schools.

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gftChris Newbie

gftChris

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Spoken like a true agnostic.

 

Though it does have an impact on reality in terms of wars and people denying things like evolution and refusing to teach it in schools.

Hence the 'keep it out of legislation' part.

 

I'm not sure I'd call myself agnostic. I firmly believe that there is no personal god as described by the bible, listening to prayers and deciding who gets to beat cancer and who doesn't as part of his plan. That being said, I can't prove it, for obvious reasons (see russell's teapots and invisible pink unicorns etc).

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OldBrownsFan Newbie

OldBrownsFan

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The bible plays a big part in legislation:

 

Jesus did not usher in a political kingdom. But Christianity has been the single largest influence on western society. America's Founding Fathers had the benefit of thousands of years of history to draw on when establishing their government. They could see what had failed in the past. There had been times when the state had absolute authority and persecuted the church. At other times the church had effective control of the state. The founders saw that neither of these extremes were ideal. They developed a system that stood the test of time. Observers everywhere generally agree that American's Founding Fathers achieved a solid balance between church and state, one consistent with biblical concepts.

 

 

The Bible and Government Biblical Principles: Basis for America's Laws

 

PRINCIPLE LEGAL DOCUMENT BIBLE Sovereign authority of God, not sovereignty of the state, or sovereignty of man Mayflower Compact, Declaration, Constitution, currency, oaths, mention of God in all 50 state constitutions, Pledge of Allegiance Ex. 18:16, 20:3, Dt. 10:20, 2 Chron. 7:14, Ps. 83:18, 91:2, Isa. 9:6-7, Dan. 4:32, Jn. 19:11, Acts 5:29, Rom. 13:1, Col 1:15-20, 1 Tim. 6:15

 

Existence of objective moral values, Fixed standards, Absolute truth, Sanctity of life Declaration ("unalienable" rights—life, etc., "self-evident" truths) Ex. 20:1-17, Dt. 30:19, Ps. 119:142-152, Pr. 14:34, Isa. 5:20-21, Jn. 10:10, Rom. 2:15, Heb. 13:8

 

Rule of law rather than authority of man Declaration, Constitution Ex. 18:24-27, Dt. 17:20, Isa. 8:19-20, Mat. 5:17-18 All men are sinners Constitutional checks and balances Gen 8:21, Jer. 17:9, Mk. 7:20-23, Rom. 3:23, 1 Jn. 1:8

 

All men created equal Declaration Gen. 1:26, Acts 10:34, 17:26, Gal. 3:28, 1 Peter 2:17 Judicial, legislative, and executive branches Constitution Isa. 33:22 (See Madison)

 

Religious freedom First Amendment 1 Timothy2:1-2 Church protected from state control (& taxation), but church to influence the state First Amendment Dt. 17:18-20, 1 Kgs. 3:28, Ezra 7:24, Neh. 8:2, 1 Sam. 7:15-10:27, 15:10-31, 2 Sam. 12:1-18, Mat. 14:3-4, Lk. 3:7-14, 11:52, Acts 4:26-29

 

Republican form of government and warnings against kings but in favor of Godly rulers

ConstitutionEx. 18:21, Dt. 1:13, Jud. 8:22-23, 1 Samuel 8, Pr. 11:14, 24:6 Importance of governing self and family as first level of governance

 

First, Second, Ninth, and Tenth Amendments Mat. 18:15-18, Gal. 5:16-26, 1 Cor. 6:1-11, 1 Tim. 3:1-5, Tit. 2:1-8

 

Establish justice Declaration Ex. 23:1-9, Lev. 19:15, Dt. 1:17, 16:19-20, 24:17-19, 1 Sam. 8:3, 2 Sam. 8:15, 1 Kings 3:28, 10:9, Mic. 6:8, Rom. 13:4 Fair trial with witnesses Sixth Amendment Ex. 20:16, Dt. 19:15, Pr. 24:28, 25:18, Mat. 18:16

 

Private property rights Fifth Amendment Ex. 20:15-17 Biblical liberty, Free enterprise Declaration Lev. 25:10, Jn. 8:36, 2 Cor. 3:17, Gal. 5:1, James 1:25, 1 Peter 2:16

 

Creation not evolution Declaration Gen. 1:1 Biblical capitalism not Darwinian capitalism (service and fair play over strict survival of the fittest)

 

Anti-trust laws Ex. 20:17, Mat. 20:26, 25:14-30, 2 Thes. 3:6-15, 1 Pet. 2:16 Importance of the traditional family State sodomy laws, few reasons for divorce Ex. 20:12-14, Mat. 19:1-12, Mk. 10:2-12, Rom. 1:18-2:16, 1 Cor. 7:1-40, Religious education encouraged Northwest Ordinance Dt. 6:4-7, Pr. 22:6, Mat. 18:6, Eph. 6:4, Servanthood not political power Concept of public servant Ex. 18:21, Rom. 13:4, Php. 2:7,

 

Sabbath day holy "Blue laws" Ex. 20:8 Restitution Restitution laws Lev. 6:1-5, Num. 5:5-7, Mat. 5:23-26

 

http://www.faithfacts.org/christ-and-the-culture/the-bible-and-government

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tiamat63 Veteran

tiamat63

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All that information to draw upon yet blacks, Irish, Asians and non land owners were slaves and or second rate citizens for how long ?

 

There is no doubt that personal faith of a Christian orientation was in the hearts and minds of those whom shaped the frame work of our constitution. However what we're finding is that having a balance of 'state and god' is rubbing many upon many the wrong way on both sides of the isle.

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OldBrownsFan Newbie

OldBrownsFan

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All that information to draw upon yet blacks, Irish, Asians and non land owners were slaves and or second rate citizens for how long ?

 

There is no doubt that personal faith of a Christian orientation was in the hearts and minds of those whom shaped the frame work of our constitution. However what we're finding is that having a balance of 'state and god' is rubbing many upon many the wrong way on both sides of the isle.

 

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StinkHole Newbie

StinkHole

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Debating on the existence of god is both redundant and endless. It can never be proven one way or the other and has no impact on reality.

 

When I said keep it to yourself, I was more talking about keeping it out of legislation.

 

Stuart

 

 

No sooner you suggest refraining from debating the existence of God, you give your opinion that it has no impact on reality.

 

There are those that would debate you on that.

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gftChris Newbie

gftChris

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In all seriousness thought, merry Christmas, Xmas, hannukah, divali or whatever the fuck else to you fine folks. Even you cal.

 

What's everybody doing this year? For me it's my first Christmas away from the family rituals so a bit of a big one, starting my own traditions and cooking dinner for myself and Mrs gft. Roast duck with pork and chestnut stuffing and cranberry and orange sauce, and crispy roast potatoes. Can't wait.

 

She's French and so we are doing both a Christmas eve celebration and Christmas day, double the fun. Seafood amuse bouche and booze.

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calfoxwc Grand Master

calfoxwc

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Merry Christmas to EVERYBODY, honestly. Even Chris and the....eh....Wood...y.....

 

We are having a big sugar cured ham, sweet potatoes,

different pies, scalloped potatoes, and a bunch of rolls etc, other stuff.

 

we are going to go back today, and buy some pies for our friends, and deliver them.

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