Gunz41

1. Cardinals and Bears 2. Akron 3. Browns 4. Bears 5. Canton 6. Patriots and Dolphins 7. Patriots, Bills, Dolphins 8. Cardinals, Rams, Raiders, Colts 9. Colts I think 10. Broncos 11. This decade 12. Jaguars, Panthers, Vikings, Bengals, Falcons, Texans 13. Dallas, Houston, Pittsburgh, Cleveland, Baltimore, New York (Jets)??? 14. Steelers, Cowboys 15. Browns, Cardinals, Lions

Pretty sure it was because they were engaging with him while Pat's were still playing, which is tampering.

I was playing his favor on them, where he couldn't justify disagreeing to them. I obviously think the DL is better for the Browns. I said so the last time he wanted to discuss this

Let's not forget that Tenn. has a new OC, as last year's is in Green Bay bumping heads with Rodgers. I will agree that at present that you have to give the edge to Vrabel, it's not his 1st year. Freddie may turn out to be great, but I don't think you can give a 1st game HC the edge in any game

And 1 more thing, somebody EASILY winning a contest doesn't mean anything. You have to put it into context. Andy Dalton easily won that competition, you think he is the next great thing? How about Winston and Mariota? Or let's use backups since that is what you are hanging your hat on. These guys won backup roles: Brett Hundley, Matt Barkley, Drew Stanton, Trevor Siemian, Tom Savage, Matt Schaub, RG3, Cooper Rush

You obviously missed the point. For years the Browns "won" the preseason, so that means NOTHING. And exactly how can you try to lend to Rudolph future, when this is his 2nd year, and has done nothing in real games. But even go off a premise that he is good, in 2 years he will be a FA. So unless you think next year is Ben's last, Mason would be foolish to want to stay if he has aspirations of starting. So no, unless Ben plays just this year and next, he won't be a stop gap. You will either have to blindly go in with him as your future, or have a backup plan from a FA or Draft pick. And with the Steelers success, you will probably be getting at best a lower ranked QB in the draft (of the top guys if the plan is to use a 1st). I didn't know that me saying the Steelers were going to make playoffs was a demise of the Steelers. That is in fact BETTER than they did last year. But as for the Browns having a brighter future, their best players are very young and have shown to have ability. Ben is in the same category as Brady, Brees, Eli, etc. They are at the end of their careers. For the next 5 years (you have to think that far), the Browns are certainly in better position at QB. I think they are in better position at RB. They have more talent at WR. OL is surely in the Steelers favor. DL is really a toss up. LB are the Steelers, and DB I would lean in Browns favor with age. So with those factors, the Browns appear to have a brighter FUTURE. That doesn't mean the Steelers will be bad, and doesn't mean that those things can't change. But if you can't take an honest, unbiased look at your team and not question the future then you aren't being honest

That isn't a factual statement. The Steelers don't sign guys who they THINK are shadows of themselves. No team does. As good as the franchise has been, they aren't batting a thousand. That statement is pretty much the same as saying "the Steelers don't draft bad players"

How do you figure? Even if you factor in guys who have shown a little potential, at moment you have NO answer in the next few years at QB. Take your homerism out of it, can you say FOR sure that you have a future QB, can you count on JuJu being the perfect #1, Washington #2? You think you can count on Haden? The Browns aren't a certainty either, but what they do have on their side is young AND guys who have performed in their current roles. I think Steelers make playoffs this year, and maybe next few, but you have uncertain future

I dunno, maybe it was from one of your old profile pictures. I had an image of something like Mickey Goldmill haha

Na, Browns will roll out Ward and Greedy and be fine. I did hear something interesting though. I heard the Steelers looked the most impressive/won the preseason. Guess who used to do that, the team that will sooner rather than later be the team in the North, BROWNS!!!!!!!!!!

Well I short changed you, yes pun intended. I had you pictured as a lot smaller than that

Alex Mack

You obviously aren't reading. I have said MANY times you can have your opinion. What you're not getting, or purposely ignoring is how you are treating it. You saying your opinion matters just as much as anyone else's. I AGREE. But you have numerous times called people names when they didn't agree with your opinion. So exactly how are we supposed to take that? Not ONCE, EVER, have I said you can't have your opinion. I just think that if you, or anyone (including me) wants to be taken seriously that they should use the same standards for themselves and others.

Exactly, throw insults when you are proven wrong or called out. I seem to remember someone else who did that, his name started with G, ended in E and had Hooli in the middle. All your actions show is that you believe your opinion is the only one who matters

Probably not, almost assuredly not, but to be fair the Vikings ended up trading a 5th round pick for a 0 game, 3 week rental for a kicker lol And if you think about it, a bunch of guys throughout the league are drafted with those low picks and don't make a team. Not much difference in trading a low pick, especially when the player traded for can contribute.

Have a lot of folks clamoring for an upgrade to the OL. Anyone up for giving up a package like that? 2 1sts and a 2nd for a young OL but one that hasn't made a pro bowl when a bunch of players make it due to guys not playing. Stills was part of it, but I am sure the Dolphins were the ones making sure he was part of it. Trent Williams is better than Tunsil, but older. Allegedly Washington turned down offer of a 1st.

Ok Mr. Know it all, PLEASE explain how you can say something like this, but call people degrading names when they have a different opinion than yours?

You won't find ANYWHERE where I have called you or anyone else names. But you have done it many times for people who disagreed with your opinion. Want an indirect example? Talking about the Browns and their move to Baltimore. And sorry man, but some of what you have put on THIS subject is not an opinion. You started by stating that the Colts didn't play their starters. That is not an opinion, that is a statement with evidence that can be determined. And you were wrong. Yes, some of what you have said is opinion. But what you are failing to comprehend, or just blatantly ignoring is that people aren't replying to you because you have an opinion. They are replying because of your double standard. Had you just said, yep I hate the Colts and the major reason is for this, and when faced with the Browns doing it just owned up and said you have a different standard for them, all of this could have been quelled. But you are an unreasonable, self righteous, know it all who will spin away to make something never you being wrong. And there are examples of this on this forum. Just because I remembered it, look at the college board after the NC game. You asked how was it Clemson had an extra REGULAR SEASON game than anyone else. When it was pointed out that was FALSE, instead of just saying "yep, got that one wrong" you deflect and say your post was misunderstood or something along those lines. What I observe, you the majority of the time aren't on here to have a healthy discussion. You are out to argue and tell people how wrong they are. And when you have no way to respond, you deflect, come up with an excuse, try to insult someone, or find a "legal" way to respond. And on one occasion I can remember, there could be more, you tried to insult people for not doing your trivia thing. You told everyone that they weren't smart enough to do it, not even giving credit to ones who just don't care. Anyone can make themselves APPEAR smart when they are making a quiz/test up. You have the answers, so exactly how hard is it. Yet you try to act as if you actually KNOW all the things you put on there. Yet on several occasions when the Browns have signed someone, or even when a player has been brought up you ask what position they play, where they played, etc. And these aren't just back of the roster type players. I have often heard an old adage, if you have problems with multiple people or failures at multiple things, there is only one common denominator in there, YOU. There are MULTIPLE people who seem to have issue with you and how you post in this thread alone, shouldn't that tell you something? Maybe not to a narcissist like you.

O trust me, I have known. Just the hypocrisy with this one Infelt that needed to be said. Once you try to act like the poor little guy because everyone deserves their opinion, yet act terribly to anyone who doesn't agree its ridiculous

Wiseacre Bottom line is nobody is telling you who to like/dislike. What people are telling you is that it's not the only time this happened, and in some form that the team you cheer for has done it. Instead of resting their starters for a half, the Browns traded them away. And I am sure you can find somewhere in history that the Browns rested their starters. That makes you a casuist if you don't have the same issue with them doing it. But let's ask one simple question. Since you are assuming that Colts win that game, let's assume that Browns had won the OT game with Titans in 2017 after they had gotten rid of those players. Do you now feel bad for the Ravens and Chargers since that loss by the Browns cost 1 of them a playoff spot since they ended up with 9-7 record same as Titans? If not, you are a mounteback. See I can use big, rarely used words too. But it does kind of make sense that you think that you are ridiculous JUST because you have a different opinion, which is the furthest from the truth in my case. I even said you can have your hypocritical opinions, as that is some times how fans feel. But don't tell others how wrong they are, and even call people dumb, idiotic, etc for a different viewpoint than yourself

See, like I said DEFLECT and NEVER ADMIT you were WRONG!!!!!!!!! You said they didn't play their starters. But I guess what can we expect from someone whose job it is to spin everything and even more a man who seems to think he is always right. But go ahead and keep on calling people out who don't believe what you believe but when you are on the other end "I'm entitled to my opinion." Moral of the story, you are entitled to your opinion, but nobody is entitled to one that differs from you. That is about as egotistical as it gets.

Haha, I have said multiple times on this topic how you can have your opinion, what you obviously are wrong about is your moaning and groaning about the Colts in that game. A quick look up shows the starters DID PLAY. So your reasoning for hating them and saying they have no integrity has NO merit. But we can take it further (even though it was pointed out when Colts starters were taken out they were losing). But I think you would have to agree (unless you are just unwilling to waver on your stance) that had the Browns not gotten rid of some of their better players the 0-16 season that they wouldn't have been 0-16. So let's just take the 5 closest games for the purpose of the exercise. Titans and Packers OT loses, and Colts, Jets, and Steelers. Steelers were 13-3, Colts 4-12, Jets 5-11, Titans 9-7 (MADE THE PLAYOFFS), and Packers 7-9. So by YOUR logic, since they got rid of those players and it helped Titans get into the playoffs isnt that against the integrity? You see, as for me, I have been VERY clear. You can certainly have your opinion (whether I agree with it or not), I just have a problem with the hypocrisy of giving the Browns the benefit but not someone else. And in the more general terms, I have an issue with how you want to say you are entitled to your opinion, yet when someone has a different opinion than you you make sure to tell them how wrong they are, and have even called them names because of their differing opinion. So why should you be given any more concessions than them? A lot of your actions on here like that come off as hypocritical. As for earlier, the comment of nobody cares about legal construct was you just spinning something. The point was that in a discussion on a sports forum nobody cares what is legally acceptable. Whether it was your intention or not, your wait and see if the situation comes up for the Browns looks like a deflection to not answer as for other issues on here for you something is more acceptable if it's your team/player that the situation involves. You don't have to justify your disdain for any team. But when you do justify it for a specific reason, when faced with something similar for your team and view it differently your view seems disingenuous and hypocritical. When all you had to respond to me (maybe not others) was you only care about the Browns and it may be irrational but you don't care. But instead you doubled down. Just own your irrationality when it comes to your teams, that is what most fans are like anyway

You mean to tell me that Gipper with all his whining and finding a way to tell everyone they are wrong was the one who was wrong? I'm shocked.

I've noticed the same thing Hoorta

You are obviously missing said point. No matter what the circumstance, by your standards not playing guys is showing no integrity. Instead of the recent injured guy "not being ready" how about the guys are getting MORE ready to achieve the actual goal, WIN A CHAMPIONSHIP. We get it, since it effected the Browns you are against it. And nobody cares what legal construct. You are saying it because you wouldn't feel the same if the Browns were on the other end. While you have that right, it is hypocritical. Like Hoorta said, please feel free to explain how you don't have a groaning session when the Browns got rid of all those vets (which certainly could have cost the team a couple wins) and based on a couple of their losses helped a team squeak into the playoffs. And please don't give me the "trading to get draft picks is trying to get better ultimately." Exactly what do you think getting the best QB is doing? Oh, but I forgot, it was a team other than the Browns doing it so it was wrong. Everyone has seen you complain about a lot of things, so we are supposed to believe that if the Browns were playing in a game that would not improve their playoff position that you wouldn't be up in arms if they played the starters and an integral part of the team (Baker, OBJ, Myles, Ward) got hurt you wouldn't come on here and shout to the world how stupid it was to play them when the game didn't matter? Why not just put your big boy pants on, and just admit that you have less issues with something the Browns do as compared to other teams with the same situation. Im guessing it wouldn't be hard to go back and see how you responded to some instances of DV, yet once the conversation turned to Hunt once he was a Brown you tried to give "excuses/explanations." It may be wrong, but it would get more respect. You come off as the type that wants to make everyone think you are right about everything, and will argue and downright tell anyone with a differing opinion how wrong they are instead of letting them have their opinion (right or wrong). And when you are given facts about how you were wrong, instead of just saying "hey guys I got that wrong" you give reasons/excuses why you were wrong, or try to make it look like you were right and someone else just misinterpreted.