Our 80 Million Dollar Oline

[miktoxic]

rich4eagle is nothing more than a Fing follower. he has no clue what to do with his life if he doesn't have someone telling him what to do, where to go, who to suck off......

 

you are an embarrassment to any person that has a spine.

 

does your grandmother hear you in the basement when you cry?

[cdl15]

The texans have one of the leagues top offenses every year. How many rings have they won? Playoff wins?

[cdl15]

Defensive and Offensive rankings of recent Super Bowl winners:

 

2000 Ravens Offense rank: 16, Defense rank: 1

 

2002 Bucs Offense rank: 24, Defense rank: 1

 

2003 Pats Offense rank: 17, Defense rank: 1

 

2004 Pats Offense rank: 7, Defense rank: 2

 

2005 Steelers Offense rank: 15, Defense rank: 4

 

2006 Colts Offense rank: 2, Defense rank: 23

 

2007 Giants Offense rank: 16, Defense rank: 7

 

2008 Steelers Offense rank: 22, Defense Rank: 1

 

2009 Saints Offense rank: 1, Defense rank: 20

 

2010 Packers Offense rank: 10, Defense rank: 5

 

Also, 2010 Steelers SB losers: Offense rank: 14, Defense rank: 2

 

Thus, having a mediocre offense and an outstanding defense gives a team a title much more frequently than the other way around. The Saints and Colts were far more the abberation.

09 colts had the #1 postseason defense tho

[calfoxwc]

Give it up, Rich. You are out to lunch with a nickle in your pocket, as usual, in this "argument".

 

But you certainly do blather well. It just doesn't make any sense.

 

And you still do better than Ghoolie............

 

 

[rich4eagle]

Give it up, Rich. You are out to lunch with a nickle in your pocket, as usual, in this "argument".

 

But you certainly do blather well. It just doesn't make any sense.

 

And you still do better than Ghoolie............

 

 

 

Sorry Cal, I am the winner in this argument the Browns have spent more money on OL guys than any other team and stank for 11 years. We wasted three first round choices on OL guys and gave up bundles for the likes of Road Grader Garmon and tatoo man Russ whatever and the great RG on IR.....and the great Andruzzi and the great Lomas Brown and the great Jim Pyne and on and on...................hell we drafted six centers the last 11 years and two with a number one pick

 

 

 

But we still stink and cannot score because our great trenchmen got zilch behind them and proves that O line is dime a dozen

 

Still waitling for a retort the shows how an OL won jack in the NFL .....................BTW in the Browns first twenty NFL years most of them competing for playoffs and winning four championships they drafted exactly ONE OL in the first round and he never made the team

 

and none of you wizards full of factless rhetoric and cool aid will or can retort what I just said ...................because it is fact instead of your BS.....................in the trenches to nowhere

 

and worse is the idiotic belief here in Brownstown that defense wins Championships when it is proven otherwise ......................31 points proven

[rich4eagle]

rich4eagle is nothing more than a Fing follower. he has no clue what to do with his life if he doesn't have someone telling him what to do, where to go, who to suck off......

 

you are an embarrassment to any person that has a spine.

 

does your grandmother hear you in the basement when you cry?

 

 

 

...............your post is what your are a punk and sniveling jackass................bring it............ only childish fool would bring up anothers person grandmother.........and blowjobs..

 

 

 

if you had an ounce of character you would apologize for that abomination of post which had nothing to do with how win football games which is all that I detailed in depth with acumen while you are focused on blowjobs and grandmothers and gutlessness........

 

I I surmise that you are 12 going on 13 because no adult would have posted the garbage you did PUNK

[rich4eagle]

Here's the most amazing stat of all Rich.

 

The team that scores the most points wins!!! 100% of the time!!!

 

You're using a ONE GAME (too small a sample size) to feebly attempt to prove your point. Using your flawed logic I could just as easily say the Saints ( who just racked up 62 points against the Colts) are the greatest offensive juggernaut in the last 15 years. Gipper's numbers clearly showed it's easier to get to (and win) the Super Bowl with a great defense and so-so offense. Yeah, 95 percent of the time you don't even GET to the Super Bowl without at least a decent, and more often than not- GREAT defense.

 

I had to look up some SB history too. The average score in the Super Bowl is 30-15. So why is that? Mainly because there's been an inordinate number of blowouts in the game. (I'll count a blowout as a win by more than 10 points- there's been 21 of the 45 SBs that qualify.) And if you bother to look at those blowout games in more detail, the team that got blown out was horribly overmatched from the get-go, or happened to have an atypical horrible game. See above- you think if the Colts played the Saints again, they'd have another 62 points racked up on them? Don't think so.

 

I for one am done arguing the point with you. There's still people who believe the government is hiding an alien spaceship in Roswell.

 

 

 

Lets go over this again......................average winning score of the Super Bowl is 31 points................does than mean the loser Defense sucked??????????????? There is no way out of this Larry either the winners had great offense or the losers sucked on defense in which both defeat the stupid argument that defense wins super bowls And yes indeed please go again and tell me how the OL caused any team to win jack...............or in our case STANK

 

you can be done arguing wrong headed but denial of reality is a fault of losers and your belief as is Brownstown is the belief of losers and record supports it

[DieHardBrownsFan]

...............your post is what your are a punk and sniveling jackass................bring it................go for it jerk...............get some balls call the place and time.......................and I will kick your ass

 

further you moron anyone with substance would never bring up anothers person grandmother...............but a punk like YOU does that and the stupid fellatio COMMENT among other stupidity

 

I will enjoy beating the living stuffing out of you....................PUNK...............get some balls and lets rumble.................PUNK

 

TEST MY SPINE PUNK

 

better yet punk just send me your address and I will be there.......................spinless and all

 

now if you have an ounce of character apologize for that abomination of post which had nothing to do with how win football games which is all that I detailed in depth with acumen while you are focused on blowjobs and grandmothers and gutlessness................but I will indeed kick the snot out you and pleasurably you balless baboon

 

I do surmise that you are 12 going on 13 because no adult would have posted the garbage you did PUNK

 

 

Watch out Mik. Rich is a real bad ass. When I was working in Sterling VA, he challenged me. Meet him at the Washington MT in DC. The old fooking pussy never showed. Him and Ghoolie are pieces of garbage.

[cdl15]

...............your post is what your are a punk and sniveling jackass................bring it................go for it jerk...............get some balls call the place and time.......................and I will kick your ass

 

further you moron anyone with substance would never bring up anothers person grandmother...............but a punk like YOU does that and the stupid fellatio COMMENT among other stupidity

 

I will enjoy beating the living stuffing out of you....................PUNK...............get some balls and lets rumble.................PUNK

 

TEST MY SPINE PUNK

 

better yet punk just send me your address and I will be there.......................spinless and all

 

now if you have an ounce of character apologize for that abomination of post which had nothing to do with how win football games which is all that I detailed in depth with acumen while you are focused on blowjobs and grandmothers and gutlessness................but I will indeed kick the snot out you and pleasurably you balless baboon

 

I do surmise that you are 12 going on 13 because no adult would have posted the garbage you did PUNK

wow i bet he's in the basement now listening to tina turner applying lipstick and stroking it to everyone's avatar. I could only come up with four centers since 99. 2 of em went to pro bowls and a third will go to a few im sure. Sorry we didn't spring on jamarcus Russell, peter warrick, Charles rogers, Kyle boller, or Ron dayne. Would one of them playmakers have made u cheer up and pick up your toys so grandma doesn't fall down the stairs bringing ya nanas and sippy cup

[cdl15]

Oh wait....................<i put....................<this many...............periods......................so..................u...............know....................i................mean...............business

[rich4eagle]

This thread is so amusing OL is the key despite the losing and defense wins Super Bowls even if the winner scores 31 points on average against those august useless defenses.......................and the beat goes on........................the herd drinking cool aid of losers keeps spouting the dumbmess amd yet Ghoolie and I Correctomundo going a dozen years have been correctomundo all dozen............................but the herd swills the cool aid and never gets it

 

 

 

and maybe that is why Brownstown is where it is .......................LOSERS

 

 

 

meantime losers we spent way more money on OL guys the last twelve years than any other team but we keep losing famously

 

meanwhile back to football after two assholes deflected it to stupidity...especially our retired military buffoon who NEVER MADE OFFICER still going on ten years old..............HOW ABOUT STICKING TO THE SUBJECT cd .................>OL ARE A DIME A DOZEN AND oFFENSE WINS CHAMPIONSHIPS OR IST THAT TOO HARD FOR YOUR JUVENILE MIND...................SAD THE RESPONSES HAVE TURNED TO HISSY SHIT FITS

[rich4eagle]

wow i bet he's in the basement now listening to tina turner applying lipstick and stroking it to everyone's avatar. I could only come up with four centers since 99. 2 of em went to pro bowls and a third will go to a few im sure. Sorry we didn't spring on jamarcus Russell, peter warrick, Charles rogers, Kyle boller, or Ron dayne. Would one of them playmakers have made u cheer up and pick up your toys so grandma doesn't fall down the stairs bringing ya nanas and sippy cup

 

First round Mack and Faine second round Fowler, first signee in expansion Jim Pyne and O"hara free agent signee that makes five.....................since you know everything you can figure out the sixth center.....................I will not help you MR INSULT because no need to waste time on jerks..................and I see you are focused on peoples grandmothers as a good jackass should be.............>IDIOT

[cdl15]

Hey rich SSSSSSSHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH..............

[jake24]

Get'em Rich! Thats what I like...when it comes down to it whos gunna bang..........none of em...thats how life is

[calfoxwc]

Rich, Rich, Rich.

 

Come on, now. I have a huge groundhog out in our alfalpha field that could kick your arse.

 

But you said "drafted six centers" and then you bring up the ones who weren't drafted.

 

And, maybe you know this already.... there's more to an oline than center and LT.

 

Which, speaking of the LT... the Browns never drafted one til Joe Thomas.

 

I'm guessing there... I could be wrong....

 

And they still haven't drafted a RT. The RT play has killed the Browns on the right side, plain and simple.

 

Did you see the stupid, stinkin ratbirds and the Jags play Monday night? Both qbs drafted high, plenty of talent around them...

 

and both qb's stunk up the joint in a huge way.

 

The................oline.....................is..........................the......................engine.................of..............the.....................car.

 

You think the car can win a Nascar race without an engine, or with any old "dime a dozen" lawnmower engine.

 

Right now, the Browns have a good engine, but one of the pistons isn't firing. You fix that, get a new tire or two,

 

and then you can run.

[rich4eagle]

Rich, Rich, Rich.

 

Come on, now. I have a huge groundhog out in our alfalpha field that could kick your arse.

 

But you said "drafted six centers" and then you bring up the ones who weren't drafted.

 

And, maybe you know this already.... there's more to an oline than center and LT.

 

Which, speaking of the LT... the Browns never drafted one til Joe Thomas.

 

I'm guessing there... I could be wrong....

 

And they still haven't drafted a RT. The RT play has killed the Browns on the right side, plain and simple.

 

Did you see the stupid, stinkin ratbirds and the Jags play Monday night? Both qbs drafted high, plenty of talent around them...

 

and both qb's stunk up the joint in a huge way.

 

The................oline.....................is..........................the......................engine.................of..............the.....................car.

 

You think the car can win a Nascar race without an engine, or with any old "dime a dozen" lawnmower engine.

 

Right now, the Browns have a good engine, but one of the pistons isn't firing. You fix that, get a new tire or two,

 

and then you can run.

 

 

You dont get it Cal, that is understandable. The engine is the QB and the RB's and WR's and playmakers on defense. Just ask Indy and NO and NE and Pittsburgh...........................yah know the teams that win every year

[bringbackbrownie2]

You dont get it Cal, that is understandable. The engine is the QB and the RB's and WR's and playmakers on defense. Just ask Indy and NO and NE and Pittsburgh...........................yah know the teams that win every year

 

Not every one of those teams have an amazing OL but they all have some lineman drafted from the 1st and 2nd rounds.

 

NE line this year: Light (2nd round pick in 2001 - with the team for all their Super Bowls), Mankins (1st round pick - 2 time pro bowler), Waters (5 time pro bowler previously with the chiefs), Vollmer (2nd round draft pick in '09), and Connelly (only average lineman on the team). Best OL in the league by far. If you watch any NE games you will see Brady literally standing around all day until someone is open..

 

GB has 2 or 3 lineman drafted in the 1st and 2nd rounds as well. Same as Pittsburgh. I don't know about every other good team but it's obvious that teams put much more emphasis on the OL than you do..

[hoorta]

Not every one of those teams have an amazing OL but they all have some lineman drafted from the 1st and 2nd rounds.

 

NE line this year: Light (2nd round pick in 2001 - with the team for all their Super Bowls), Mankins (1st round pick - 2 time pro bowler), Waters (5 time pro bowler previously with the chiefs), Vollmer (2nd round draft pick in '09), and Connelly (only average lineman on the team). Best OL in the league by far. If you watch any NE games you will see Brady literally standing around all day until someone is open..

 

GB has 2 or 3 lineman drafted in the 1st and 2nd rounds as well. Same as Pittsburgh. I don't know about every other good team but it's obvious that teams put much more emphasis on the OL than you do..

 

We've told that to Rich already- a couple of times. So does every GM in the NFL. Rich thinks guys like Jeff Saturday grow on trees. Functions like keeping your qb healthy and opening holes for running backs can be done by duds. Let's see- Bardford-injured. Stafford-injured. Rothlisberger-injured. Common thread, just like 31 points in the SB? Crummy o-lines.

 

I'm done discussing it any further. He's right- I'm wrong- Cal's wrong-you're wrong- every freaking expert commentator is wrong.

 

He's so far in denial that he's been toasted, it's ridiculous. Gipper put up some telling statistics, and all he's got is 31 points in the Super Bowl- yup, that won the Super Bowl all right- but it didn't get the team that put up the 31 points there. And it doesn't account for teams from the losing conference that wouldn't have even been there if they had played in the other conference- Denver a bunch of times and Atlanta come to mind- and promptly got blown out. Sorry, just because the winning team in the Super Bowl has scored less than 20 points only twice since 1970 does not prove offense wins championships- it does prove from a historical perspective you had better score a lot of points in the Super Bowl if you expect to win.

[rich4eagle]

We've told that to Rich already- a couple of times. So does every GM in the NFL. Rich thinks guys like Jeff Saturday grow on trees. Functions like keeping your qb healthy and opening holes for running backs can be done by duds. Let's see- Bardford-injured. Stafford-injured. Rothlisberger-injured. Common thread, just like 31 points in the SB? Crummy o-lines.

 

I'm done discussing it any further. He's right- I'm wrong- Cal's wrong-you're wrong- every freaking expert commentator is wrong.

 

He's so far in denial that he's been toasted, it's ridiculous. Gipper put up some telling statistics, and all he's got is 31 points in the Super Bowl- yup, that won the Super Bowl all right- but it didn't get the team that put up the 31 points there. And it doesn't account for teams from the losing conference that wouldn't have even been there if they had played in the other conference- Denver a bunch of times and Atlanta come to mind- and promptly got blown out. Sorry, just because the winning team in the Super Bowl has scored less than 20 points only twice since 1970 does not prove offense wins championships- it does prove from a historical perspective you had better score a lot of points in the Super Bowl if you expect to win.

 

Larry smoke these statistics once more. In the first twenty years of the Browns in the NFL they drafted one offensive lineman in the first round in 1955 and he got cut. They made the playoffs five of the five years there was a playoff game in the sixties. They won the championship four times when there was no playoff and they were an offensive juggernaut all of those years. Since the rebirth they spent a fortune on free agents Lomas Brown, Jim Pyne, Orlando Brown, Tony Jones, Dave Wolabaugh, Shaun O'Hara, Ryan Tucker, Ross Verba, Raod Grader Garmon, Joe Andruzzi, Eric Steinbach and others. They spent the 1st round 21 pick on Jeff Faine, the first round 21 pick on Alex Mack, the first round, 3 pick on Joe Thomas, a third round pick Lavauo, a third round pick on Fowler and 5th round pick on Pontbriand.. For all those players chased and drafted we still stink on offense. Wolabaugh, O'hara, Fowler, Mack, Faine and Pontbriand are all centers all six of em. BTW, Faine and O'Hara and Brown and Oben all played in the Super Bowl for other teams two of left tackles and two em centers after we released them or in Faine's case traded him for nearly nothing. All startes and their teams one at least three of those Super Bowls. Like I said dime a dozen!

 

 

NO team in the NFL has spend higher drafts picks or more money on OL guys in the last 11 years than the Browns. Yet we have not had an offense worth a crap in any of those years.. Because we spent way too much buying an offensive line and not getting playmakers. Smoke that telling statisitc.

 

.

You are supposed to be a mod, yet, ridiculously say I got smoked, for not answering Gipper and Cal and others , who tell lies about me spew insults, why should I respond, or to the Super Mod Zombo liar supreme, or Cal a third liar(albeit he did attempt to be civil and then resorted to lying) or the 13 year old buffoons who added nothing except their perception of my grandmothers sex habits. Especially, while being smoked as you say all I have done is be right 11 straight years while all of you have been wrong about everything 11 straight years.

 

Larry, you should be ashamed of yourself for insulting me for providing facts and data that is relevant while saluting rhetoric that proves nothing and saluting juvenile responses of some. Further Larry, Cal and Gipper should be admonished for perpetuating Zombo's lies and Diehard as well for acting like an ass again.. Sad all you senior members especially super mod and total Liar Zombo instead of admitting like Ghoolie so aptly said, that I been cleaning your clocks for ten years gettting and getting it correct repeatedly while you all have been wrong repeatedly.. You allowed my astute vision and understanding and education to you all of my correct view to be transformed into a slobber match of insults of which all you contributed while I stayed on topiic the whole time.. It is clear that none of you has enough fact or data to just counter my views but rather use insults and lies instead

 

For the idiots, whom none of you so called senior leaders and mods called out for being out of bounds, but rather jumped into and contributed to their dung fiinging, you are all a frigging joke and have no ability to discuss strategic impilications of winning

 

For those members who have the intellectual capability to actually sort the BS slung on the wall here because of my extraordinary canny and candid and winning views and whom are accepting that the herd is acting like fools and that my points are fact based and need to be considered strongly if the Browns ever hope to return to being a winning franchise, your consideration is appreciated.

 

31 Points a game for the Super Bowl winner means either Offense wins Championships or there are 31 shiity defenses in the NFL every year. You cannot have it both ways!

 

BTW, Larry it is you who is in denial, and we been through that a number of times, and yet you have never admitted I been cleaning your clock for a decade. The Browns record and my critiques as to why they would lose prove that. Listen up for once, you may learn about winning or just stay in denial.

 

I am not throwing the Browns management under the bus, I am just hoping some of them have the werewithal to start thinking like me so they lead a winner instead of perennial loser

 

Thanks Ghoolie, for being the only man in this whole debate

 

I sure hope one civil intelligent response is forthcoming, apologies accepted, quit lying Zombo it is disgusting

[hoorta]

Sorry Rich- and that's not an apology. Too bad if you got your feelings all hurt. If you think your opinion is right I happen to disagree, and so do 98% of the guys who actually make a living selecting players for their teams in the NFL, as well as 95% of the other posters on this forum. If all it takes is playmakers- the Rams should have a great team with Bradford and Jackson- no wins. Arizona has Kolb and Fitzgerald- one win.

 

I didn't see anyone in this thread suggest playmakers aren't important. Those will be added in due time. So sure, let's go get us the next Otto Graham, or Jim Brown. Easier said than done. Lord knows we've tried since 1999. The Browns have stunk since their rebirth not because of bad O-line picks, but because of massive busts (or underachievers) in the first round, and even worse drafting in the second and third. Couch, Courtney "soft" Brown, Spare Change Warren, Dupa (your term) Green. Knievel Winslow, Hands of Stone Edwards, Brady "it's a sin if we draft-my term" Quinn and the pick we gave Dallas could have been Rashard Mendenhall or Chris Johnson. Kameron Wimbley isn't reminding anyone of Ray Lewis to date. THAT my dear friend is why the Browns have stunk since 1999, not because we drafted Jeff Faine, who still is playing for Tampa Bay. Geeze Louise, the odds say your should draft a perennial pro bowler 33% of the time in the first round, and we've had exactly one- Joe Thomas.

 

As to the marvelous Browns teams of the 50's that was a different era. You could play defensive line if you weighed 220 pounds, or offensive line for that matter. Bill Willis is in the frickin' Hall of Fame and he weighed 213 pounds. He'd get killed in today's NFL. How do you like THAT stat? Jim Brown was running over defensive linemen (Dick Modzelewski) that weren't much bigger than he was. Hickerson and Shafrath weighed in at a whopping 250 pounds. Today you have to have guys that are supreme athletes to play OL- Joe Thomas was a multi sport athlete in High School.

 

And as to our departed high first round OL picks- chalk that up to bad management, not bad picks. If you draft a guy high at ANY position and he starts for 10 years in the NFL, you've done well.

 

So sure, you can occasionally find great (not turnstiles like St Clair) offensive linemen as late round picks or UFA's. About as often as you find a Marquis Colston (seventh round), Earnest Byner (11th I believe), or grocery bagger Kurt Warner.

[bringbackbrownie2]

NO team in the NFL has spend higher drafts picks or more money on OL guys in the last 11 years than the Browns. Yet we have not had an offense worth a crap in any of those years.. Because we spent way too much buying an offensive line and not getting playmakers. Smoke that telling statisitc.

 

FALSE!

 

Number of offensive lineman drafted in rounds 1, 2, or 3 since 1999 (look it up):

 

Pittsburgh: 8

New England: 7

Baltimore: 7

New Orleans: 6

Cleveland: 5

 

Do you ever actually use real statistics?

[hoorta]

FALSE!

 

Number of offensive lineman drafted in rounds 1, 2, or 3 since 1999 (look it up):

 

Pittsburgh: 8

New England: 7

Baltimore: 7

New Orleans: 6

Cleveland: 5

 

Do you ever actually use real statistics?

 

Don't let facts get in the way of a good delusion.

[rich4eagle]

Don't let facts get in the way of a good delusion.

 

 

number of FA's signed for buckoo millions Browns 8 others dah......................you made your bed Larry

 

we spent more money on the OL than other team and we stink

 

and cannot score and have a pathetic offense again

 

and OH yeah the Super Bowl winners still average 31 points a game and yes indeed four of those winners had starters two at center and two at LT that we cut....i.n the dime a dozen OL marry go round

 

 

 

NOW QUOTE ME LARRY INSTEAD OF THE BS

 

 

 

and the one thing you forgot as your mentor forgot the teams you quoted were loaded with talent and draft picks and low in the round draft picks while we spent ours on top of the draft first rounders................

after the first 25 picks the rest our hope to be game changers..............we blew our wad on OL guys

[rich4eagle]

Sorry Rich- and that's not an apology. Too bad if you got your feelings all hurt. If you think your opinion is right I happen to disagree, and so do 98% of the guys who actually make a living selecting players for their teams in the NFL, as well as 95% of the other posters on this forum. If all it takes is playmakers- the Rams should have a great team with Bradford and Jackson- no wins. Arizona has Kolb and Fitzgerald- one win.

 

I didn't see anyone in this thread suggest playmakers aren't important. Those will be added in due time. So sure, let's go get us the next Otto Graham, or Jim Brown. Easier said than done. Lord knows we've tried since 1999. The Browns have stunk since their rebirth not because of bad O-line picks, but because of massive busts (or underachievers) in the first round, and even worse drafting in the second and third. Couch, Courtney "soft" Brown, Spare Change Warren, Dupa (your term) Green. Knievel Winslow, Hands of Stone Edwards, Brady "it's a sin if we draft-my term" Quinn and the pick we gave Dallas could have been Rashard Mendenhall or Chris Johnson. Kameron Wimbley isn't reminding anyone of Ray Lewis to date. THAT my dear friend is why the Browns have stunk since 1999, not because we drafted Jeff Faine, who still is playing for Tampa Bay. Geeze Louise, the odds say your should draft a perennial pro bowler 33% of the time in the first round, and we've had exactly one- Joe Thomas.

 

As to the marvelous Browns teams of the 50's that was a different era. You could play defensive line if you weighed 220 pounds, or offensive line for that matter. Bill Willis is in the frickin' Hall of Fame and he weighed 213 pounds. He'd get killed in today's NFL. How do you like THAT stat? Jim Brown was running over defensive linemen (Dick Modzelewski) that weren't much bigger than he was. Hickerson and Shafrath weighed in at a whopping 250 pounds. Today you have to have guys that are supreme athletes to play OL- Joe Thomas was a multi sport athlete in High School.

 

And as to our departed high first round OL picks- chalk that up to bad management, not bad picks. If you draft a guy high at ANY position and he starts for 10 years in the NFL, you've done well.

 

So sure, you can occasionally find great (not turnstiles like St Clair) offensive linemen as late round picks or UFA's. About as often as you find a Marquis Colston (seventh round), Earnest Byner (11th I believe), or grocery bagger Kurt Warner.

 

MY feelings are not hurt! I am sorely disappointed the so called leadership here is acting like sophomoric fools quoting and adulating juveniles. That means you and the rest of the supposed leaders, Larry, is that clear. I expected a lot more from you and you are betraying intelligence but that goes around here. I did not read other than your first phrase of your post, if you have some substance please rescind the asshole first phrase and then repeat whatever points of astute football knowledge you want to enlighten me, otherwise all that I said still holds, you are leading a bunch of jackasses and aciting like one

[rich4eagle]

FALSE!

 

Number of offensive lineman drafted in rounds 1, 2, or 3 since 1999 (look it up):

 

Pittsburgh: 8

New England: 7

Baltimore: 7

New Orleans: 6

Cleveland: 5

 

Do you ever actually use real statistics?

 

I wish you would take time to read what I said and use simple logic and understand we spent about 50 million signing free agents, maybe you would get it.. Further, I did enumerate just what you said about 5 picks, it is all in my recent post, boom I already knew that and it changes nothing.. But yu know the answer and refuse to attempt to understand what we have done to screw ourselves over and over. Acutally, I use all the statistics and you pick a bunch that are irrelevant, like teams loaded with talent can pick OL guys and teams defunct of talent no matter how many OL guys they pick and sign as free agents it becomes a revolving door of ineptitude

 

 

 

NOW READ WHAT I SAID AND THINK ABOUT WHAT TEAMS DO AND COME AND SLUR ME WITH ANOTHER STUPID STATEMENT AS LAST SINCE YOU COMPLETELY IGNORED THE IMPORTANT STATISTICS HOW MUCH YOU PAY FOR WHAT AND WHAT YOU GET

 

 

if you cannot make a rational retort.................please do insult my grandmother and create and support lies about a bet that never existed and do call me stupid..............and then you are officially what you already stated by accident a full fledged member of the cool aid drinking herd wjoch never thinks ebecause they know the answer without the question

 

thanks for your consideration and reply which ignored what I said but yet used simplicity to get the wrong answer

[rich4eagle]

Wrong, then again bandwagon fans usually are.

 

1954 NFL draft-

Guard- John Bauer, 1st round

 

1955 NFL draft-

Center- Kurt Burris, 1st round

 

That would be two. Additionally....

 

1950-

OT- John Sandusky, 2nd round

 

1958-

OG- Buzz Guy, 3rd round

 

1959-

OT- Dick Schafrath, 2nd round

OT- Fran O'Brien, 3rd round

 

1961-

OT- Ed Nutting, 2nd round

 

You might THINK you're going to bullshit everyone with your lies but you're not, you will continue to be put into check. Why? Because you are a loud mouth no balls bandwagon Stooler fan talking out his cum dumpster about shit he has no clue about. I realize when the Browns were winning in the 60's you half assed jumped onto the bandwagon alongside the Packers bandwagon then whichever between here and you're newfound Pisstown "fan"ship but you still have zero clue what the hell you're talking about. None. Zero. Nada. In a 10 year period Paul Brown used 1st-3rd round picks on Offensive linemen. Likewise when he created the Bengals he did similar.

 

You're out of your league lightweight and that sound you hear? That's the rest of TBB laughing at you and the Muslim terrorist Ghoolie.

 

 

 

You are full of shit asshole, the first round pick was Bauer.......................which is what I said and correct.......Burriss was drafted as Linebacker.........read each of my posts jackass and they are consistent, you are stupid and that is expected..........................now what you can do best is call my daugther a blow job queen...............you are up asshole and your stats are DEAD ON WRONG .........or prove otherwise................or get Zombo to make your lie into truth as he does................and you are liar...................because my statement was first round picks and you decided to expand that to your own stupidity whcih I admire your asinesiess, and you included some fantasy picks that were not first round or ever picked /////////////////////but it is what you are an asshole substanceless bluster full and stupid

 

 

 

and YOUR POST IS FLAT OUT LIE AND DECEPTION BUT I DO UNDERSTAND I AM DEALING WITH YOU STUPID

[rich4eagle]

Larry smoke these statistics once more. In the first twenty years of the Browns in the NFL they drafted one offensive lineman in the first round in 1955 and he got cut. They made the playoffs five of the five years there was a playoff game in the sixties. They won the championship four times when there was no playoff and they were an offensive juggernaut all of those years. Since the rebirth they spent a fortune on free agents Lomas Brown, Jim Pyne, Orlando Brown, Tony Jones, Dave Wolabaugh, Shaun O'Hara, Ryan Tucker, Ross Verba, Raod Grader Garmon, Joe Andruzzi, Eric Steinbach and others. They spent the 1st round 21 pick on Jeff Faine, the first round 21 pick on Alex Mack, the first round, 3 pick on Joe Thomas, a third round pick Lavauo, a third round pick on Fowler and 5th round pick on Pontbriand.. For all those players chased and drafted we still stink on offense. Wolabaugh, O'hara, Fowler, Mack, Faine and Pontbriand are all centers all six of em. BTW, Faine and O'Hara and Brown and Oben all played in the Super Bowl for other teams two of left tackles and two em centers after we released them or in Faine's case traded him for nearly nothing. All startes and their teams one at least three of those Super Bowls. Like I said dime a dozen!

 

 

NO team in the NFL has spend higher drafts picks or more money on OL guys in the last 11 years than the Browns. Yet we have not had an offense worth a crap in any of those years.. Because we spent way too much buying an offensive line and not getting playmakers. Smoke that telling statisitc.

 

.

You are supposed to be a mod, yet, ridiculously say I got smoked, for not answering Gipper and Cal and others , who tell lies about me spew insults, why should I respond, or to the Super Mod Zombo liar supreme, or Cal a third liar(albeit he did attempt to be civil and then resorted to lying) or the 13 year old buffoons who added nothing except their perception of my grandmothers sex habits. Especially, while being smoked as you say all I have done is be right 11 straight years while all of you have been wrong about everything 11 straight years.

 

Larry, you should be ashamed of yourself for insulting me for providing facts and data that is relevant while saluting rhetoric that proves nothing and saluting juvenile responses of some. Further Larry, Cal and Gipper should be admonished for perpetuating Zombo's lies and Diehard as well for acting like an ass again.. Sad all you senior members especially super mod and total Liar Zombo instead of admitting like Ghoolie so aptly said, that I been cleaning your clocks for ten years gettting and getting it correct repeatedly while you all have been wrong repeatedly.. You allowed my astute vision and understanding and education to you all of my correct view to be transformed into a slobber match of insults of which all you contributed while I stayed on topiic the whole time.. It is clear that none of you has enough fact or data to just counter my views but rather use insults and lies instead

 

For the idiots, whom none of you so called senior leaders and mods called out for being out of bounds, but rather jumped into and contributed to their dung fiinging, you are all a frigging joke and have no ability to discuss strategic impilications of winning

 

For those members who have the intellectual capability to actually sort the BS slung on the wall here because of my extraordinary canny and candid and winning views and whom are accepting that the herd is acting like fools and that my points are fact based and need to be considered strongly if the Browns ever hope to return to being a winning franchise, your consideration is appreciated.

 

31 Points a game for the Super Bowl winner means either Offense wins Championships or there are 31 shiity defenses in the NFL every year. You cannot have it both ways!

 

BTW, Larry it is you who is in denial, and we been through that a number of times, and yet you have never admitted I been cleaning your clock for a decade. The Browns record and my critiques as to why they would lose prove that. Listen up for once, you may learn about winning or just stay in denial.

 

I am not throwing the Browns management under the bus, I am just hoping some of them have the werewithal to start thinking like me so they lead a winner instead of perennial loser

 

Thanks Ghoolie, for being the only man in this whole debate

 

I sure hope one civil intelligent response is forthcoming, apologies accepted, quit lying Zombo it is disgusting

 

 

What a great post still waiting for a thinking mans reply who knows jack about football

[bringbackbrownie2]

I wish you would take time to read what I said and use simple logic and understand we spent about 50 million signing free agents, maybe you would get it.. Further, I did enumerate just what you said about 5 picks, it is all in my recent post, boom I already knew that and it changes nothing.. But yu know the answer and refuse to attempt to understand what we have done to screw ourselves over and over. Acutally, I use all the statistics and you pick a bunch that are irrelevant, like teams loaded with talent can pick OL guys and teams defunct of talent no matter how many OL guys they pick and sign as free agents it becomes a revolving door of ineptitude

 

Wrong again! Teams loaded with talent spend high draft picks providing depth where it is needed. Sometimes that is the oline, sometimes it is something else. I will give you some more relevant facts and I'll watch you try and refute them again:

 

The Browns have drafted 5 lineman in the top 3 rounds since 1999. 3 of those guys were since 2007. Thank god our crappy management got Joe Thomas in 2007 and Alex Mack in 2009 or we would have absolutely nothing to show for the past decade. Heckert and Holmgren have only been a part of the 2010 and 2011 draft and have drafted outstanding compared to the crap since 1999. They are building blocks along with our 2010 and 2011 drafts..

 

The Steelers won Super Bowls in 2005-06, 2008-09, and lost last year (2010-11). Yes they have picked up some OL in high rounds recently, but they did so before they were a great team too:

 

1998 1st round Alan Faneca OG

1999 3rd round Kris Farris OT

2000 2nd round Marvel Smith OT

2002 1st round Kendall Simmons OG

2004 3rd round Max Starks OT

 

 

Noteable free agent agent OL signings:

1999 Wayne Gundy RT (former 1st round pick by the rams)

2001 Jeff Hartings C (former 1st rounder by the Lions)

 

OL for the 2005-06 Super Bowl:

Marvel Smith, Alan Faneca, Jeff Hardings, Kendall Simmons, Max Starks.

 

What do you know? Smith, Faneca, Hartings, and Simmons were all on the steelers line before Pittsburgh drafted Roethlisberger or Polamalu. So much for your theory of only drafting OL guys after you have a highly talented team. Please try again..

[rich4eagle]

And since i'm having a xxxxing blast owning the Stool trolls how about this. Let's take a list of the great minds in the NFL and see exactly where they fall, if it's with clinically Retarded homosexuals from bumf*ck Cacka-Lacky in the doublewide or the opposite end of the spectrum, shall we?

 

Paul Brown-

1950- OT John Sandusky, 2nd round

1954- OG John Bauer, 1st round

1955- Center Kurt Burris, 1st round

1958- OG Buzz Guy, 3rd round

1959- OT Dick Schafrath, 2nd round, OT Fran O'Brien, 3rd round

1961- OT Ed Nutting, 2nd round

1968- Center Bob Johnson, 1st round

1971- OT Vern Holland, 1st round, OG Steve Lawson, 2nd round

1974- OG Dave Laphan, 3rd round

1975- OT Al Krevis, 2nd round

1972- OG Glen Bujnoch, 2nd round

1978- Center Blair Bush, 1st round

1979- OG Barney Cotton, 3rd round

1980- OT Anthony Munoz, 1st round

1983- Center Dave Rimington, 1st round

1984- OT Brian Blados, 1st round

1989- OG Freddy Childress, 2nd round

 

Vince Lombardi-

1962- OG Ed Baine, 2nd round

1963- OT Tony Liscio, 3rd round

1966- OG Gale Gillingham, 1st round

1967- Center Bob Hyland, 1st round

1968- OG Bill Lueck, 1st round, OT Dick Himes, 3rd round

 

Yes for those keeping score Lombardi went Oline in round 1 THREE years in a row.

 

Tom Landry-

1965- Center Malcolm Walker, 2nd round

1966- OG John Niland, 1st round

1969- OG Halvor Hagen, 3rd round

1970- OT Bob Asher, 2nd round

1975- OG Burton Lawless, 2nd round

1976- OG Jim Eidson, 2nd round

1979- Center Robert Shaw, 1st round

1981- OT Howard Richards, 1st round, OG Glen Titensor, 3rd round

1985- OG Crawford Ker, 3rd round

1987- OG Jeff Zimmerman, 3rd round

 

Jimmy Johnson-

1989- OG Steve Wisniewski, 2nd round, Center Mark Stepnoski, 3rd round

1991- OT Erik Williams, 3rd round

1992- OT James Brown, 3rd round

 

Chuck Noll-

1969- OT Jon Kolb, 3rd round

1972- Gordon Gravelle, 2nd round

1973- OG Roger Bernhardt, 3rd round

1976- OT Ray Pinney, 2nd round

1981- Center Rick Donnalley, 3rd round

1985- OT Mark Behning, 2nd round

1986- OG John Reinstra, 1st round

1988- Center Dermontti Dawson, 2nd round, Center Chuck Lanza, 3rd round

1989- OG Tom Ricketts, 1st round

 

Bill Cowher-

1992- OT Leon Searcy, 1st round

1995- OG Brenden Stai, 3rd round

1996- OT Jamain Stephens, 1st round

1997- OT Paul Wiggins, 3rd round

1998- OG Alan Faneca, 1st round, OT Chris Conrad, 3rd round

1999- OT Chris Farris, 3rd round

2000- OT Marvell Smith, 2nd round

2002- OG Kendall Simmons, 1st round

2004- OT Max Starks, 3rd round

2005- OT Trai Essex, 3rd round

 

Bill Parcells-

1983- OT Karl Nelson, 3rd round

1984- OG William Roberts, 1st round

1985- Center Brian Johnston, 3rd round

1988- OT Eric Moore, 1st round, OT Jumbo Elliot, 2nd round

1989- Center Brian Williams, 1st round, OG Bob Kratch, 3rd round

1993- OT Todd Rucci, 2nd round

1994- Center Joe Burch, 3rd round

1999- OG Randy Thomas, 2nd round, OG David Loverne, 3rd round

2003- Center Al Johnson, 2nd round

2004- OT Jacob Rogers, 2nd round, OG Stephen Peterman, 3rd round

2008- OT Jake Long, 1st round

2010- OG John Jerry, 3rd round

 

Bill Belichick-

1991- OG Ed King, 2nd round

1993- Center Steve Everitt, 1st round

2000- OT Adrian Klemm, 2nd round

2001- OT Matt Light, 2nd round

2005- OG Logan Mankins, 1st round, OT Nick Kazcur, 3rd round

2009- OT Sebastian Vollmer, 2nd round

2011- OT Nate Solder, 1st round

 

The above list? That's the greatest minds in the NFL laughing at you and telling you you're f*cking clueless Shortbus2HeinzField. Consider yourself schooled featherweight.

 

 

 

unfortunately your list is bogus as Curt Burris was drafted as LB.................now spew some other shit.......................meanwhile answer my fact filled post ASSHOLEand yes asshole why are you quoting other than first round picks which was my subject in the fifties and sixties....other being what you are a complete asshole defecting and lying about my premise

[bringbackbrownie2]

unfortunately your list is bogus as Curt Burris was drafted as LB.................now spew some other shit.......................meanwhile answer my fact filled post ASSHOLEand yes asshole why are you quoting other than first round picks which was my subject in the fifties and sixties....other being what you are a complete asshole defecting and lying about my premise

 

Actually he was drafted as a Center: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1955_NFL_Draft

 

Do you know anything about football?