calfoxwc Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 Support the lawsuit? Or support the school's freedom, and support our American History? ***************************** Liberty Counsel Mathew Staver, Founder and Chairman 5/4/2012 The American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) of Virginia, on behalf of individual plaintiffs, is suing the School Board of Giles County, Virginia, over a display that contains the Ten Commandments as one of eleven historic documents. Liberty Counsel will represent the school board on Monday, May 7, in the summary judgment hearing. I am calling on the Liberty Counsel team for prayer – Mat. The ACLU of Virginia sued the Giles County School Board after the Board adopted an “open forum” policy, which permits the display of historical documents by private individuals or groups. A privately-sponsored historical display consisting of eleven documents, one of which is the Ten Commandments, was posted in Narrows High School (Narrows is a small community near the West Virginia border, not too far from Blacksburg and Virginia Tech). The additional ten documents in the “Foundations of American Law and Government” display include such items as the Magna Carta, the Declaration of Independence, and the Mayflower Compact. The purpose of the display is simply to teach the historical foundation of American law. An “offended” parent and student have partnered with the ACLU to have the display of the Ten Commandments removed – even though the Ten Commandments is listed in Virginia’s secular schoolbooks as being among the core contributing principles of several civilizations, including the Hebrew people, and among the foundational elements of our own laws and government. The ACLU has done everything it could to run from the facts and the law that control this case! The “Foundations of American Law and Government” display has been upheld by multiple federal courts of appeal. It is clearly appropriate to include the Ten Commandments in a display on law, because there is no dispute that this ancient code helped shape American law and government. The display in question includes a composite of 20 documents and pictures and reflects the approved curriculum for Virginia schools, which is clearly constitutional. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 As long as the display doesn't say "This is the word of God" or "This is the only truth" or something like that then I see no problem with it. I mean, many important documents did take from the commandments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
runyon27 Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 This is a frivolous lawsuit plain and simple and the ACLU should have to pay the taxpayers of Va compensation to cover the cost of this stupid case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Z Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 Support American history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairHooker11 Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 As long as the display doesn't say "This is the word of God" or "This is the only truth" or something like that then I see no problem with it. I mean, many important documents did take from the commandments. So, your statement is a contradiction? As long as the display didnt say from "the word of God" to "many important documents did take from the commandments" ? You are not ok with the "word of God" it's "Truths" and then agree that "many important docs came from the context of the commandments. (i assume you mean the 10 commandments written in the same book? - the word of God - the only truth - the bible right?) You know Woody, you have the freedoms to disagree with us religious folk all you want.... We just want to keep our rights and liberties afforded us in the Bill of Rights too. But you might want to check your hate first - you might find some common ground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 So, your statement is a contradiction? As long as the display didnt say from "the word of God" to "many important documents did take from the commandments" ? You are not ok with the "word of God" it's "Truths" and then agree that "many important docs came from the context of the commandments. (i assume you mean the 10 commandments written in the same book? - the word of God - the only truth - the bible right?) You know Woody, you have the freedoms to disagree with us religious folk all you want.... We just want to keep our rights and liberties afforded us in the Bill of Rights too. But you might want to check your hate first - you might find some common ground. I don't see where I made any contradictions. If they want to say "Some people think this is the word of God" or "Some people think this is the only truth" than go ahead. But there is such a thing as separation of church and state. You can't go around in a public school saying the Bible is all true and it was for sure written by God. I don't see where I made any contradictions or where I showed "hate." You may only think that because you believe in the Bible and Christianity. That's great, but you can't prove any of that to be the truth. And if you can't prove it to be the truth you can't go around in public school saying its the truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairHooker11 Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 I don't see where I made any contradictions. If they want to say "Some people think this is the word of God" or "Some people think this is the only truth" than go ahead. But there is such a thing as separation of church and state. You can't go around in a public school saying the Bible is all true and it was for sure written by God. I don't see where I made any contradictions or where I showed "hate." You may only think that because you believe in the Bible and Christianity. That's great, but you can't prove any of that to be the truth. And if you can't prove it to be the truth you can't go around in public school saying its the truth. you are too young to know that the bible was legislated out of public schools in the 60's, at a time when all hell did break loose. (A correlation? but I digress) "hate" maybe is too strong here I agree... but after reading your other posts elsewhere with your take on the subject of religion, you have to admit you are very outspoken against those who take a stand WITH Christianity and belief in the bible. just sayin but hey, you arent the only one. and I dont take it personally either! But you are contradictory here! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 you are too young to know that the bible was legislated out of public schools in the 60's, at a time when all hell did break loose. (A correlation? but I digress) "hate" maybe is too strong here I agree... but after reading your other posts elsewhere with your take on the subject of religion, you have to admit you are very outspoken against those who take a stand WITH Christianity and belief in the bible. just sayin but hey, you arent the only one. and I dont take it personally either! But you are contradictory here! I really don't see how I am, please show me. Public schools have separation of church and state. Therefore, you can't go around and say any one religion is right in a public school. Just having the 10 Cs and saying "this is what some people believe and some important documents were based on these principles" is fine. Saying "This is the word of God and the only truth" is not alright.... And on the religion thing, I am generally for things I can prove and find evidence for. Blind faith in something because I happened ot grow up in a certain part of the world does not really suit me. I'm fine with people being religious if they want (I've said I believe it is slowly going away) but I am not fine with religious beliefs affecting public policy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted May 6, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 6, 2012 so.... Woody dreams of our country where we elect Christians, but they are required to make decisions based on atheism and anti-religious stances. See? Libs don't reason, they emote, and want to turn everything upside down and inside out so they can own it. Dang Woody, I feel like if I had the dough, I could pay you and other libs for you excellently prooving of what I say about you libs is correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted May 6, 2012 Report Share Posted May 6, 2012 so.... Woody dreams of our country where we elect Christians, but they are required to make decisions based on atheism and anti-religious stances. See? Libs don't reason, they emote, and want to turn everything upside down and inside out so they can own it. Dang Woody, I feel like if I had the dough, I could pay you and other libs for you excellently prooving of what I say about you libs is correct. Cal, you are some senile old farmer that will see whatever he wants to see. Throwing the label liberal on the best thing in the world will make you hate it and saying a piece of shit is conservative will make you love it. Sure, you can tell yourself you don't emote, but emoting beats blindly following the pack. Also, I am not sure you understood what I said. 1) I don't dream of a country where we elect Christians. I dream of a country where we elect competent, smart politicians (well not really, I can't remember most of my dreams, but you get the idea) 2) I didn't realize Separation of Church and State was an "atheism and anti-religious" stance. I mean, I guess it kind of is, but you love everything old American and would never criticize any of it, so I don't see how you could be criticizing this. Really, I want you to explain why you think I am wrong and didn't reason my way through. This happens a lot on here, and instead of you actually saying anything constructive you go on and on about how liberals emote and blah blah blah. I can see why some of the other non-super conservative voices are posting less on this thread. Between the conservative dictator moderator to trying to have a conversation with you and Bunker, it really doesn't seem worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. T Posted May 6, 2012 Report Share Posted May 6, 2012 This is a frivolous lawsuit plain and simple and the ACLU should have to pay the taxpayers of Va compensation to cover the cost of this stupid case. Then we might be able to put a stop to all of these type of lawsuits. Before we can get around to passing any type of legislation like that we will need to stop electing lawyers as law makers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaporTrail Posted May 6, 2012 Report Share Posted May 6, 2012 you are too young to know that the bible was legislated out of public schools in the 60's, at a time when all hell did break loose. (A correlation? but I digress) "hate" maybe is too strong here I agree... but after reading your other posts elsewhere with your take on the subject of religion, you have to admit you are very outspoken against those who take a stand WITH Christianity and belief in the bible. just sayin but hey, you arent the only one. and I dont take it personally either! But you are contradictory here! Coincidentally, that's about the same time they added "under God" to the pledge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Z Posted May 6, 2012 Report Share Posted May 6, 2012 Then we might be able to put a stop to all of these type of lawsuits. Before we can get around to passing any type of legislation like that we will need to stop electing lawyers as law makers. I think religion will be a big issue in the election. Neither candidate is Christian. OOPS, did I put my foot in it by excluding Mormons from Christianity? At least Romney isn't a lawyer, oops again, never mind, he is one. But more than that he is a businessman and he's way less a progressive-lib-lab than Prez Peace Prize. One can have Christian values without being a Christian. I mean, I don't think anyone here who identifies as a non-Christian would run out a stone a woman to death under suspicion of adultery. The ACLU has gone overboard on a lot of issues, and by denying the history of our country's roots are Judaeo - Christian values they have set themselves up as being anti-religion. Religion is part of what the USA is all about, freedom of religion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted May 6, 2012 Report Share Posted May 6, 2012 Mormanism is hilarious. It's even more ridiculous than other religions. It's funny though, if Mormanism was the really old one and catholicism was the new one it'd be the complete opposite. I guess it's kinda Christianity..... but who really cares. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Z Posted May 6, 2012 Report Share Posted May 6, 2012 Religious freedom, that's one one thing we've got. We have to put up with a lot of nonsense, but freedom of religion is something the rest of the world wishes they had. Ask any Christian or Jew or woman living in a Muslim country if they've got human rights. Freedom of religion is a human right. THE SUPREME COURT: Animal Sacrifice; Court, Citing Religious Freedom, Voids a Ban on Animal Sacrifices By LINDA GREENHOUSE Published: June 12, 1993 The Supreme Court ruled today that a Florida city's ban on ritual animal sacrifice violated the religious freedom of the followers of an Afro-Cuban religion in which the sacrifice of animals plays a central role. http://www.nytimes.com/1993/06/12/us/supreme-court-animal-sacrifice-court-citing-religious-freedom-voids-ban-animal.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted May 6, 2012 Report Share Posted May 6, 2012 Freedom of religion includes freedom from religion. There's also separation of church and state. Idk what your post had to do with anything because I do agree people should be able to practice whatever they want, but bringing it into public schools is a problem. I stick by what I said earlier, if they said "this is what some people believe" then showed the commandments I'm fine with it. I wonder what the animal cruelty angle was in that sacrifice case. and you mentioned non Muslims living in a Muslim country, I think we could do a little better with Muslims living in our country, since we are supposed to have freedom of religion and all. It just seems like there have been a few instances where they were not treated equally because of religion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Z Posted May 6, 2012 Report Share Posted May 6, 2012 Freedom of religion includes freedom from religion. There's also separation of church and state. Idk what your post had to do with anything because I do agree people should be able to practice whatever they want, but bringing it into public schools is a problem. I stick by what I said earlier, if they said "this is what some people believe" then showed the commandments I'm fine with it. I wonder what the animal cruelty angle was in that sacrifice case. and you mentioned non Muslims living in a Muslim country, I think we could do a little better with Muslims living in our country, since we are supposed to have freedom of religion and all. It just seems like there have been a few instances where they were not treated equally because of religion. Freedom from religion was covered in the First Amendment. Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof. Technically, separation of church and state was something in a letter Jefferson wrote around 1820. Yea, I'm fine with what you said about the Ten Commandments and public school. Stop wondering what the animal cruelty angle was and read at the link. In a nut shell, they practiced animal sacrifice as part of their religion and the Supremes upheld their religious freedom. There are Muslims in this country and around the world that want to kill us, their religion specifically tells them to kill infidels. Some Muslims want Sharia law to creep into our justice system. There is a world jihad going on. There have been Muslim honor killing and female genital mutilation going on here. These are facts. When Muslims push against the Bill of Rights and the Constitution we must push back. Don't even dream the Supremes will uphold these vile foundations of their religion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted May 6, 2012 Report Share Posted May 6, 2012 Well at least we agree on the original topic in this thread, haha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaporTrail Posted May 7, 2012 Report Share Posted May 7, 2012 Freedom from religion was covered in the First Amendment. Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof. Technically, separation of church and state was something in a letter Jefferson wrote around 1820. Yea, I'm fine with what you said about the Ten Commandments and public school. Stop wondering what the animal cruelty angle was and read at the link. In a nut shell, they practiced animal sacrifice as part of their religion and the Supremes upheld their religious freedom. There are Muslims in this country and around the world that want to kill us, their religion specifically tells them to kill infidels. Some Muslims want Sharia law to creep into our justice system. There is a world jihad going on. There have been Muslim honor killing and female genital mutilation going on here. These are facts. When Muslims push against the Bill of Rights and the Constitution we must push back. Don't even dream the Supremes will uphold these vile foundations of their religion. If you think the Bible and Christianity aren't teaching the same thing, then you have a severe case of selective reading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Z Posted May 7, 2012 Report Share Posted May 7, 2012 If you think the Bible and Christianity aren't teaching the same thing, then you have a severe case of selective reading. Christians have a reputation for honor killing, female genital mutilation, killing non-Christians simply because of religion, and laws that make you actually stone suspected adulteresses to death? You been huffing your own vapor trail sonny? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaporTrail Posted May 7, 2012 Report Share Posted May 7, 2012 Christians have a reputation for honor killing, female genital mutilation, killing non-Christians simply because of religion, and laws that make you actually stone suspected adulteresses to death? You been huffing your own vapor trail sonny? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-abortion_violence There are extremists in every group. Your very own Bible tells you to dash the heads of your enemies' children against the rocks and rejoice. You're classifying all Islamic people as extremists. It's asinine and ignorant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Z Posted May 7, 2012 Report Share Posted May 7, 2012 http://en.wikipedia....ortion_violence There are extremists in every group. Your very own Bible tells you to dash the heads of your enemies' children against the rocks and rejoice. You're classifying all Islamic people as extremists. It's asinine and ignorant. I'm not talking about what it SEZ in the Bible, I'm talking about what the Muzz ARE DOING TODAY - right here in the USA. You're still doin' your homework from Wiki and huffing that vapor I see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted May 8, 2012 Report Share Posted May 8, 2012 If you're not gonna take his valid point seriously then don't bother responding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaporTrail Posted May 8, 2012 Report Share Posted May 8, 2012 I'm not talking about what it SEZ in the Bible, I'm talking about what the Muzz ARE DOING TODAY - right here in the USA. You're still doin' your homework from Wiki and huffing that vapor I see. And I'm talking about what extremist "CRIZ ARE DOING TODAY - right here in the USA." How about you try taking your head out of your ass and explaining to me how murdering an abortion doctor is any different than a Muslim committing an honor killing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Z Posted May 8, 2012 Report Share Posted May 8, 2012 And I'm talking about what extremist "CRIZ ARE DOING TODAY - right here in the USA." How about you try taking your head out of your ass and explaining to me how murdering an abortion doctor is any different than a Muslim committing an honor killing? I didn't come here to be abused with vile language. Our conversation is over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadbrownsfan Posted May 8, 2012 Report Share Posted May 8, 2012 I didn't come here to be abused with vile language. Our conversation is over. It seems 90% of the conversations here turn into some sort of name calling/insulting. Usually between Cal/Bunker and Woody. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadbrownsfan Posted May 8, 2012 Report Share Posted May 8, 2012 Also its the reason why I try to stay out of any religion related posts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted May 8, 2012 Report Share Posted May 8, 2012 I didn't come here to be abused with vile language. To quote groucho marx " Where do you usually go?" You need to realize that these kids are under the impression that they are the first ones to figure out there are inconsistencies in the Bible. They feel a need to hate somebody and there aren't many minorities left that are hip to despise. That means if you are christian over 30 or work for a living..... They can't see the irony in the fact that they hate Christians because they seem intolerant. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Z Posted May 8, 2012 Report Share Posted May 8, 2012 It seems 90% of the conversations here turn into some sort of name calling/insulting. Usually between Cal/Bunker and Woody. Dare I say they enjoy that banter? It seems mostly good natured. Vapor trail lashed out with vile language, nothing clever about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted May 8, 2012 Report Share Posted May 8, 2012 Dare I say they enjoy that banter? It seems mostly good natured. Vapor trail lashed out with vile language, nothing clever about that. We're allowed to lash out at each other as long as it clever though? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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