Chris Steuber on Curry

[Guest Aloysius]

From a recent draft chat:

 

The first time I saw Aaron Curry play, I thought I was watching Derrick Brooks. He's such a tremendous force on defense. He's a game changer; a guy who can impact the game from a physical standpoint, but also play with finesse and turn defense into offense. I think he will be a top-five pick and a team like Cleveland or Kansas City will be happy to have him.

[Guest Aloysius]

Steuber also said that he thinks Kansas City will take either one of the top defensive players on the board (Curry, Everette Brown) or an OT. Said he knows that the Chiefs are very high on Virginia OT Eugene Monroe.

[Base_D_Fence]

Curry is a beast. I would love to get him at 5. If he is gone, I like Jenkins or Orakpo.

[YtownBrownsBacker]

Curry is a beast. I would love to get him at 5. If he is gone, I like Jenkins or Orakpo.

 

If he is gone I like the option to trade down. Beside Curry, Crabtree and maybe 2 OTs there isn't anybody worthy of a #5 pick.

[Canton Mike]

If he is gone I like the option to trade down. Beside Curry, Crabtree and maybe 2 OTs there isn't anybody worthy of a #5 pick.

 

I agree, but if Crabtree were still there, your 5 pick value would just have skyrocketed for a trade down.

Mike

 

[Oldcrow1945]

From a recent draft chat:

 

He does look just like Brooks!

[Gips]

You cant help but to like curry its not likely he will be there at 5 but who knows like mike says if crabtree is still there and curry isnt the stock on #5 goes way up...its just another scenario but whats the chance of crabtree being there at 5?

[ballpeen]

I agree....why do we keep talking about a guy who isn't going to be there when we draft???

 

If he is there.....it is nearly a lock we draft him.....but he won't. so we won't, so we need to think about who we will draft.

[heckofajobbrownie]

I think the nightmare scenario is Curry goes #3 and Crabtree goes #4. Then we're stuck, and without one of the big guns to pick or trade down with.

 

 

[Guest Aloysius]

We need linebackers and, as you said, Curry and Brown are the top two defenders in the draft. Seems like a no-brainer to take one or the other.

Steuber's rankings, not mine.

[Guest Aloysius]

I agree....why do we keep talking about a guy who isn't going to be there when we draft???

 

If he is there.....it is nearly a lock we draft him.....but he won't. so we won't, so we need to think about who we will draft.

I think there are still people here who still disagree with Curry being our #1 target. Glad you're not one of them, Peen

 

As for who to take if Curry's not there, there's been a running discussion of that across several different threads. Heck put together a list here, Shep's been bringing up Everette Brown as an alternative, and a bunch of people put together their top 5 lists here.

 

Here's my updated list:

1. Aaron Curry, LB, Wake Forest

2. Michael Crabtree, WR, Texas Tech (but if he's available, trade down)

3. Brian Orakpo, DE-OLB, Texas (pending him looking good in LB drills)

4. B.J. Raji, NT, Boston College - may be better value than Orakpo, but I dropped him a spot due to Rogers & some rumored character concerns

5. Everette Brown, DE-OLB, Florida State (same as Orakpo)

[ballpeen]

There is always going to be people who feel that.....I think we will have 5 targets....we are bound to get one of them.

[JewDago]

personally, i hope we don't take anyone out of curry, crabtree/auctioning him or orakpo as one of them will have to be there when we pick unless something insane happens. detroit is a lock to take either a QB or T. st. louis could go a number of different directions with T, WR, DE and LB all possible. KC could go QB, LB, DE or T, though tackle is less of an option with their having taken brandon albert last year, and seattle could go T, WR, QB or LB, though LB is the least likely because they already have a bunch of money tied up in julian peterson and lofa tatupu and could resign leroy hill this offseason.

 

we need to hope that detroit goes QB and at least one of the other teams goes after a tackle. the absolute worst-case scenario for us is that curry, crabtree and orakpo are all gone by the time we pick, because that leaves us having to decide between a variety of options that don't particularly address our needs and leaves us without a way out of the pick.

 

everette brown is going to be a bust and taking a tackle is sinking more money into the offensive line when we don't have a defense or skill players behind it, which is absolutely insane.

 

if we trade down, i want larry english, who is going to be an absolute monster off the edge, but i wouldn't be too disappointed with maualuga. he's an imperfect player, to be sure, but i like him in the late teens. he's got attitude and swagger, and while he's not a perfect, responsible player, he's a monster who can also rush the passer from the middle, which is definitely something we need.

[Flugel]

personally, i hope we don't take anyone out of curry, crabtree/auctioning him or orakpo as one of them will have to be there when we pick unless something insane happens. detroit is a lock to take either a QB or T. st. louis could go a number of different directions with T, WR, DE and LB all possible. KC could go QB, LB, DE or T, though tackle is less of an option with their having taken brandon albert last year, and seattle could go T, WR, QB or LB, though LB is the least likely because they already have a bunch of money tied up in julian peterson and lofa tatupu and could resign leroy hill this offseason.

 

we need to hope that detroit goes QB and at least one of the other teams goes after a tackle. the absolute worst-case scenario for us is that curry, crabtree and orakpo are all gone by the time we pick, because that leaves us having to decide between a variety of options that don't particularly address our needs and leaves us without a way out of the pick.

 

everette brown is going to be a bust and taking a tackle is sinking more money into the offensive line when we don't have a defense or skill players behind it, which is absolutely insane.

 

if we trade down, i want larry english, who is going to be an absolute monster off the edge, but i wouldn't be too disappointed with maualuga. he's an imperfect player, to be sure, but i like him in the late teens. he's got attitude and swagger, and while he's not a perfect, responsible player, he's a monster who can also rush the passer from the middle, which is definitely something we need.

 

I know we NEED a pass rusher but that doesn't always mean THIS is the year the dream guy is in the top 5 for us. It was the year 2000 when Courtney Brown was running 4.5 forties while weighing in at a lean 270 pounds and coming off an All Planet season. Around the same time, we also signed a very versatile LBer Jamir Miller. Long story short, Courtney Brown faced WAY better Offensive Tackles at the next level and we learned he had glass bones. Jamir would end up becoming the pass rushing specialist we dreamed Courtney would be inspite of much less training in a 3 point stance.

 

This year I think I see the equivalent to Kam Wimbley coming out between Orakpo, Maybin and Brown. If ANY of them get 11 sacks as a rookie it will be considered a GREAT year. I'm kind of looking forward to seeing what Alex Hall can do after a full year of football and NFL strength and conditioning under his belt. I'm also looking forward to a MORE open mind overseeing our defense and what that will mean with a guy like Wimbley. Folks, you REALLY CANNOT suck if you earn 11 sacks as a wide eyed rookie. ALOT of our younger players NOT getting better was bad coaching.

 

If Curry is gone and our new management wants to improve the defense - it's VERY realistic that we trade down for more picks. I have no proof that Orakpo is going to be a better or more versatile OLBer than Clay Matthews Jr.

 

There is also a reality that we'll have the pick of litter for offensive skilled positions. There's an enormous Michael Crabtree bandwagon. He was a BIG reason Texas Tech was alot of fun to watch this year. Great college player that played in the perfect system in the perfect conference for his skills. While I think he'll be a good pro - I'm just not sure he's the BEST WR fit for us. He'd prolly go better with Cotchery and Coles OR he'd make the perfect compliment to the speedy Lee Evans.

 

I actually think we need a speedy compliment to Edwards and Winslow to really give us that homerun threat on any length of throw. I watched Texas Tech play 5 games this year vrs the following teams: Oklahoma State, Kansas, Texas, Oklahoma and Ole Miss so I'm going on a little more than just the word of Kiper and best-of highlights vrs Big Defenses. He's never had to play in a 2 Receiver set where there's a pre-planned route or all pro corner caliber giving him his undivided attention. If he was overwhelmed against Oklahoma then facing Pitt's zone blitz schemes or a secondary with Ed Reed in centerfield ain't gonna be any easier. Again, I want the homerun threat from anywhere. While Percy Harvin is my favorite choice, Maclin isn't too far behind. I'm basically reversing Kiper's top 3 WRs in sequence of footspeed; and how many different ways that can help us when we couldn't score a single offensive TD in the final 6 weeks of the season. I wouldn't HATE it if we ended up with Crabtree.

- Tom F.

 

[Mr. T]

I think there are still people here who still disagree with Curry being our #1 target. Glad you're not one of them, Peen

 

As for who to take if Curry's not there, there's been a running discussion of that across several different threads. Heck put together a list here, Shep's been bringing up Everette Brown as an alternative, and a bunch of people put together their top 5 lists here.

 

Here's my updated list:

1. Aaron Curry, LB, Wake Forest

2. Michael Crabtree, WR, Texas Tech (but if he's available, trade down)

3. Brian Orakpo, DE-OLB, Texas (pending him looking good in LB drills)

4. B.J. Raji, NT, Boston College - may be better value than Orakpo, but I dropped him a spot due to Rogers & some rumored character concerns

5. Everette Brown, DE-OLB, Florida State (same as Orakpo)

 

Some scouts are saying Everette Brown has better mobility than Orakpo could be good for us if the draft falls in that order.

[JewDago]

warning: long diatribe following. if you don't have an attention span, skip to the next post.

 

in response to flugs, courtney brown was a bad pick because of injuries. he was rounding into form (4.5 sacks in 5 games) before his first injury. after that, he fell apart. however, he was transitioning to the NFL very well when it happened. his ineffectiveness had nothing to do with talent or training, only injuries.

 

best pass rusher this year? larry english. great explosion, good rip to compliment speed to the outside, good size. already weighs 254 and could easily get up to 265 with a serious strength and conditioning program. with a gun to my head and curry and crabtree gone so we can't trade out of the fifth pick, i'd take english. i'd get crucified for it, but i really believe he's going to be the best pass rusher in this draft.

 

between orakpo, maybin and brown, orakpo's going to have the most success.

 

brown? too inconsistent, didn't perform well against talented guys.

 

maybin? too small, coming out too early to have success. he's got no polish, which will kill him in the league.

 

orakpo has faced stiff competition and had success against them. yes, injuries are a concern with him, but anyone in the NFL can be injured just like anyone can get lucky and stay healthy. health is a matter of being in the right place at the right time, or, to a greater extent, not being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

 

wimbley still has potential, but he's 25 and is far behind where he should be right now. he can still be good, but he'll never be anywhere close to what he could have been, which is dwight freeney. freeney has a great spin move, can get to the QB around the edge, has a bull rush and also has an inside rip. wimbley has the outside speed rush and the spin, which are easily countered because they're both speed/agility moves.

 

if wimbley had added strength and bulk to use with an inside rip or bull rush, he'd be a far more effective player, but our old coaching staff focused more on getting him to cover well, which he can now do, because he needs to be able to read and react in the stupid 3-4 that mangini and RAC play, a scheme that ryan won't change.

 

hall's shown a lot of promise. not only am i looking forward to seeing what he can do after bulking up a bit, i'm more looking forward to seeing how the mental side of his game has improved. he should have increased his pass rush repertoire and have better recognition skills than he had last year. he should read plays better, be better dropping into zone or man coverage and be less vulnerable to playaction, screens and draws.

 

if curry is gone and we want to improve the defense, the only way we can trade down is if crabtree is there. we're stuck with the fifth pick unless we have him because everyone else that other teams want will likely fall to them by the natural order of the draft.

 

moreover, depending on who teams want, they don't have to trade up to five to get him and will have to give up less both monetarily and in compensation to the trading team to move up and get their guy. that's why this situation is both frustrating and terrifying. if curry and crabtree are gone by five, we're likely going to get stuck with someone we ultimately don't want and who really isn't talented enough to be the fifth overall pick.

 

as far as WRs go, crabtree compliments anyone well. he's big, a great leaper with excellent hands and is more than fast enough. he's essentially andre johnson, who's one of the best WRs in the NFL right now. he has more than enough breakaway speed.

 

all three top WRs face steep learning curves, but harvin's is the steepest. urban meyer's offense is so different from the NFL because there are a ton of possibilities on every play, whereas, in the NFL, most plays are either pass or run, not either depending on what the defense does and what the QB sees.

 

beyond curry and the crabtree auction, there aren't great options for us at five, which i'm quite sure that pioli knows and will use to grind us and try to get some picks out of us with. he's a smart guy and knows what we need, and, regardless of what he has in mind, will be looking to pick up picks just like we are.

[damajuki]

AWESOME post, JD. Great insight throughout.

 

I like your English idea, if both Crabtree and Curry are gone. I honestly don't see anything wrong with taking the guy you really think will be the best player, regardless of where the "experts" rank the prospects. Finding the best player is, after all, the point, no?

 

Let's remember the famous Reggie Bush v. Mario Williams debate. The media "experts" were uniformly WRONG and Charlie Casserly was RIGHT. He took the BEST FOOTBALL PLAYER, not the most exciting flavor of the month.

 

Let's keep it simple: the point of the draft is to pick the best players, regardless of their rank or position.

 

If our worst case happens, then we need to take the guy WE need, rankings be damned.

[Guest Aloysius]

I asked Draft Countdown's Scott Wright what he thought the chances were that the Chiefs would take Curry. Here's his response:

 

I think there is a very good chance the Chiefs will take Aaron Curry at #3. He is a safe choice, he is a legit Top 5 value and he addresses one of their most glaring needs. I really think it will be Curry for Kansas City but the wild card is how the new front office and coaching regime feels about Tyler Thigpen. If they don't like him they have to take a quarterback, whether it be Stafford or Sanchez.

As someone said here about a month ago, "The key to Curry is the Chiefs going quarterback."

[Guest Aloysius]

Today, Mayock predicted the top three picks will be Georgia QB Matthew Stafford (Lions), Jason Smith (Rams) and Wake Forest linebacker Aaron Curry (Chiefs). So that would leave the Seahawks with Crabtree or one of the other top-rated tackles – if that's the direction they decide to go.

[YtownBrownsBacker]

I don't believe KC takes another LB with their #1 pick. They desparately need OL and QB more then LB. They could even trade down a few spots, which Pioli (under Belichick) liked to do, because there will be interest to move up to get Crabtree. KC has more needs then us so a trade down just might be in the cards for them.

[Guest Aloysius]

I think Curry is going to be a Chief. They drafted their LT last year, and 3's too high to take a RT.

 

Maybe they go QB, but I don't know if they'd be willing to invest in either of the top two guys.

[Solon16]

I think Curry is going to be a Chief. They drafted their LT last year, and 3's too high to take a RT.

 

Maybe they go QB, but I don't know if they'd be willing to invest in either of the top two guys.

 

 

I say QB is a must...if they do not take a chance on Sanchez...Josh Freeman might be a candidate...He's from there and grew up as a Chiefs fan...blah blah.... Assuming Stafford goes to Detroit....which is a good possibilty

[Guest mz.]

Solon, your mancrush on Josh Freeman makes Alo's for Curry look like puppy love.

[JewDago]

I think Curry is going to be a Chief. They drafted their LT last year, and 3's too high to take a RT.

 

Maybe they go QB, but I don't know if they'd be willing to invest in either of the top two guys.

what would you want to see us do with the fifth, then? i'm especially interested to hear who you'd want if we can't trade out.

[Guest Aloysius]

Assuming it goes like Mayock has it, I'd take Orakpo. He's not as refined a pass-rusher as Brown, but he'll hold up better against the run.

[Guest Aloysius]

Though I have to say, JD, your trade way down & take English idea is very appealing. You already have Mel Kiper on your side:

 

Kiper has the Browns taking Wake Forest outside linebacker Aaron Curry with the fifth pick, but when he was asked to name the top pass-rushing linebacker in the draft, he did not name Curry.

 

"The best pass rushers are Larry English from Northern Illinois and Clay Matthews from USC," Kiper said. "They need to get more heat on the quarterback.

 

"Some of these outside linebackers are going to go later in the first round. They (the Browns) could drop from five into the 20s. I had Clay Matthews out of the first round, barely, but I think he could go 22 to 32. If you get into the 20s, you're guaranteed a pretty good outside linebacker."

The model would be what Baltimore did last year, trading down from 8 to 26. When they did that, they ended up acquiring two additional 3rd Round picks and a 4th Rounder. We may be able to get something similar, though Crabtree being off the board and the cost of the #5 contract would be working against us.

[Guest mz.]

"The best pass rushers are Larry English from Northern Illinois and Clay Matthews from USC," Kiper said. "They need to get more heat on the quarterback."

 

I think this may be because Kiper has Brown, Orakpo and Maybin listed/pegged as DE...

 

[Guest Aloysius]

I think this may be because Kiper has Brown, Orakpo and Maybin listed/pegged as DE...

Could be. It's a little frustrating trying to figure out what Kiper & Mayock actually said in these conference calls. Most of the journalists participating in them are just now starting to read up on the draft prospects, so they're prone to making mistakes and not understanding what the draft guru actually said.

 

But Mayock just moved English ahead of Everette Brown on his OLB rankings. That says something.

[Guest mz.]

With everyone being a hybrid something-or-other these days, and with teams employing 3-4 and 4-3 base defenses, it doesn't even make much sense to even classify a guy as anything but a "front seven defender."

 

But Mayock just moved English ahead of Everette Brown on his OLB rankings. That says something.

 

It tells me one thing: we sure as shit ain't taking Brown #5.

 

[JewDago]

if we can't get curry, i'd vastly prefer to get into the mid-twenties, pick up at least two picks and get english, which got me wondering how we'd be able to pull off such an awesome feat, and then it hit me: raji. he's someone we've been ignoring that people would likely be willing to trade up for, especially since he looks like he'll be entirely dominant.

 

it's also very possible that the bengals could take him at six if they look to shore up their defense, which means that we can sell the fifth pick as someone's last chance to get him. the bengals currently have three defensive tackles on their roster, and none was drafted higher than the third. plus, with the addition of a player like keith rivers to their LB corps, there should be pressure within the organization to get someone in front of him so he's free to live up to his potential. otherwise, we can sell green bay as the team that will take him at nine, which is even more likely because they switched to the 3-4 this offseason.

 

therefore, here's the list of teams that we can auction the fifth to based on raji:

 

denver, 12 - also switched to the 3-4 and needs a NT

 

tampa bay, 19 - a massive tackle like raji would really open thing up for jovan haye and the rest of their DL

 

detroit, 20 - they traded us their best DT last season, and schwartz will likely want to beef up his D

 

atlanta, 25 - this, i think, could be the best spot for us. atlanta's offense was surprisingly efficient last year, but their defensive line desperately needs an influx of youth and talent. their best DT right now is jonathan babineaux, but they have two decent ends in john abraham and jamaal anderson who could set the world on fire if only their tackles could get a push up the middle, which raji would definitely do for them.

 

indianapolis, 29 - also a team in desperate need of a tackle, though bill polian prefers his tackles smaller and quicker than raji really is. i wouldn't want to trade this low, either, because there's a chance that english could be gone at this point.

 

realistically, i'd like to trade with detroit just to be sure that we can get english, but also because we'd pick up higher picks in later rounds, too.