hoorta Posted January 31, 2015 Report Share Posted January 31, 2015 Let's not make a story bigger. How do we know if nothing was said to Josh about Drinking?? Not Team Babysitter's, Josh states he blew it and thought drinking suspension ended to league at end of season, (Yes Dumb) but if was asked by teammate's I would think that was his answer. Josh adult and responsible for his own suspension violations, I am sure he signed his restrictions and sounds like a agent should have told him soon as he heard the word Las Vegas.. You're kidding me Josh- when they suspended you I'm 99.9% certain they spelled out exactly what you could and couldn't do- and when. Too thick to listen? it's not a warning from the Browns is a warning from the league. How much worse off is he if we cut him? None. Where is the punishment? There isn't any. And the benefit for the Browns? None. WSS Ask anyone who's been fired from a high paying job if they were better off? Cutting Gordon says- there are limits as to how much we're going to tolerate around here- regardless of how talented you are. It's a tough call Steve- and the fans aren't the ones who will make it. It would be a nightmare if the Browns do cut Gordon and he straightens out his act and has a great career with another team. How many chances does the guy deserve? He's had plenty of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pumpkin Eater Posted January 31, 2015 Report Share Posted January 31, 2015 So are you spoiled, stupid or just merely allow your emotions to govern how you act, or more aptly, react? I don't give shit away for free. No person who understands the concept of value does. It's called capitalism and it's kind of a big deal around these parts. Insults aside, I'd say it's ignorant to expect a car with a blown engine to miraculously start running like a top the next day. Also, smart capitalism also involves cutting your losses instead of wasting resources on a failed endeavor. It's called opportunity cost. Even without counting towards the cap and not taking a roster spot, the opportunity cost of keeping Gordon is too high. It's time to move on and invest in a player who might someday contribute to the Cleveland Browns. Ya dicknuts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldBrownsFan Posted January 31, 2015 Report Share Posted January 31, 2015 I think you can make a good argument for or against keeping Gordon. I don't see anything telling me he is ever going to learn but on the other hand I hate not getting any value for him in return. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taco918 Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 Insults aside, I'd say it's ignorant to expect a car with a blown engine to miraculously start running like a top the next day. Also, smart capitalism also involves cutting your losses instead of wasting resources on a failed endeavor. It's called opportunity cost. Even without counting towards the cap and not taking a roster spot, the opportunity cost of keeping Gordon is too high. It's time to move on and invest in a player who might someday contribute to the Cleveland Browns. Ya dicknuts. I apologize for the insults, they were unwarranted, I'll admit. We disagree on the opportunity cost. If he does come back, awesome. If he doesn't, well he can't play anywhere else. I see no downside and a lot of risk by letting him go. It might be a tad vindictive but then again I am a dicknuts so it makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyceRolls Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 Cut him/keep him it doesn't matter. The roster for this year will look the same either way, the payroll for this year will look the same either way. Let's revisit this once it actually means something to an upcoming Browns season... Who are you guys voting for in 2020? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldBrownsFan Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 Who are you guys voting for in 2020? I usually just write myself in on the ballot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 No... you send a message to the rest of the locker room. "we want you for your athletic talent, and you can screw up 3 times, 4 times, and we still won't have the nads to dump you off this team." I'm all for second chances, but this ignorant, entitled, enabled guy needs to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dste Ace Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 Some of us are talking like Josh just "made a mistake" and everyone deserves a second chance. Hey, I believe in second chances--I wouldn't be where I am in life without a couple of second chances over the years. Here's the problem: this shit has been going on since October 2010 when he fell asleep in the drive-thru of a Taco Bell and police found weed in his car. I've read the accounts of his fuck-ups and in every single one he says he has learned his lesson and is going to apply himself and how tough it is to watch his teammates on the field blah, blah, blah. His recent heart-warming letter is just more of the same---"I've made bad choices, I need to grow up, I won't let you down, etc., etc. The ONLY reason to keep him around is that he won't cost us anything, but how much time do we spend spinning our wheels, running in place with this guy? Does anyone, based on his past conduct, honestly expect him to suddenly change? I'm sorry, I just see more and more and more of the same in the future for Josh Gordon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canton Mike Posted February 1, 2015 Report Share Posted February 1, 2015 Douche, About the only place I disagree with your last 3 posts is that I am NOT yet ready to throw the towel in on Johnny. We'll see what happens there. As far as Josh goes, in a nutshell, your statement "Getting rid of him is addition by subtraction" is exactly what I feel. People are thinking that not cutting him costs us nothing. BULLCRAP! Keeping him costs us FAR MORE than "immediate" money.Keeping him perpetuates the widespread negative perception of the Browns that still exists. Let's get rid of the negative & go forward As Farmer indicated about Johnny, "talk's cheap". Haven't we heard Gordon's talk long enough? I'm for sending a strong message that athleticism is only PART of what is needed for success. Maybe Johnny will get it, but it's too late for Gordon. Cutting Gordon also may send a message to Johnny that talent isn't enough. CUT Josh Gordon now, please. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canton Mike Posted February 2, 2015 Report Share Posted February 2, 2015 I just want to see what happens with Johnny, but on a very short leash. While he must be responsible for his actions, our new offensive coaches CANNOT allow an entire season go by without holding him accountable. Apparently, his week to week progress (lack of) was NOT monitored. This TC, it's "put up or shut up" time for Johnny. The cutting of Gordon will, at least IMO), send the message. We'll see, but I think we basically agree...You can't be healthy as a Family without taking the trash out as needed. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unsympathetic Posted February 2, 2015 Report Share Posted February 2, 2015 I hope everyone takes a long look at the WR makeup of the Pats and the Seahawks. Seahawks: 100% undrafted free agents. Patriots: Amendola - undrafted Edelman - 7th round LaFell - 3rd round Brian Tyms - undrafted. Who? Josh Boyce - 4th round. Who? EARLY DRAFTING OF WR DOES NOT SOLVE ANYTHING. Let Gordon sit - it's a business decision for Farmer. 2015 draft: First round - OT, DT. Second round - DE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miktoxic Posted February 2, 2015 Report Share Posted February 2, 2015 I hope everyone takes a long look at the WR makeup of the Pats and the Seahawks. Seahawks: 100% undrafted free agents. Patriots: Amendola - undrafted Edelman - 7th round LaFell - 3rd round Brian Tyms - undrafted. Who? Josh Boyce - 4th round. Who? EARLY DRAFTING OF WR DOES NOT SOLVE ANYTHING. Let Gordon sit - it's a business decision for Farmer. 2015 draft: First round - OT, DT. Second round - DE. this was from the draft simulator thread. even though i have a wr in the first it still meets all the criteria of filling the essential holes and depth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Couch Pulls Out Posted February 2, 2015 Report Share Posted February 2, 2015 This is a no brainer, you keep him. His value might be greatly diminished but he still has value. Best case: he gets his shit straight, comes back and produces, creates more value or both. The players see that the FO actually cares about them and are willing to work with them. Win-win. Worst case: he keeps fucking up and can only play for us. If he wants redemption, it has to be for us. The players see that the FO isn't going to fuck around and they need to keep their noses clean. We lose out on the talent but send a strong message to the players that the FO will ruin your career if you fuck with them. The only message you send by cutting him is that the FO has no spine and will grant you the opportunity to continue your career elsewhere if you cause enough trouble. Would you give away a 1964 1/2 Mustang because it had a couple dents in it? If the 1964 1/2 Mustang costs you $1.6 million dollars in 2015 and won't be running...yeah, probably. I think your definition of "a couple dents" differs from everyone else. Do "a couple dents" keep the Mustang parked for 1/3 of it's life? So are you spoiled, stupid or just merely allow your emotions to govern how you act, or more aptly, react? I don't give shit away for free. No person who understands the concept of value does. It's called capitalism and it's kind of a big deal around these parts. No person who understands NFL contracts deeper than "don't give away good players" sits on a WR who's failed multiple drug tests and can't stay on the field. If they can use the multiple suspensions to re-sign him to a bargain basement contract, then it would be stupid to release him. However, if he even asks for Top 25 - money, it's not worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Couch Pulls Out Posted February 2, 2015 Report Share Posted February 2, 2015 I hope everyone takes a long look at the WR makeup of the Pats and the Seahawks. Seahawks: 100% undrafted free agents. Patriots: Amendola - undrafted Edelman - 7th round LaFell - 3rd round Brian Tyms - undrafted. Who? Josh Boyce - 4th round. Who? EARLY DRAFTING OF WR DOES NOT SOLVE ANYTHING. Let Gordon sit - it's a business decision for Farmer. 2015 draft: First round - OT, DT. Second round - DE. The key difference between us and them is that they have a QB who is more than capable of turning those WR's into stars. We do not. Someone has to bail someone out on one side. Either a top WR target to bail out a less than average QB or a talented QB to bail out his less than average WR's. (I'd also like to note that the play style of Wilson allows for Seattle to have less talented WR's, since it's nearly impossible for a corner to cover a WR for more than 5-6 seconds. If Johnny could replicate that, I would be all for us following Seattle's model.) Gordon is going to have to be resigned before he plays another down. I don't think the argument is cutting him today, it's more do we trade him or sign him to a new contract even though he will play as many downs next season as Franklin D. Roosevelt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted February 2, 2015 Report Share Posted February 2, 2015 The reason to cut him yesterday is simple. The Browns have been a dysfunctional organization for a long time and the only way they will shed that image is to get rid of the junk (including little Johnny) and build a real team. Keeping him on the off chance, against all odds, that he will get his shit together is like keeping junk cars in your yard in case they become worth something and then wondering why your neighbors think you are a loser. Keeping him is a bright shining example that the Cleveland Browns simply don't know what they are doing. Clinches it... I am now positive we must keep Josh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted February 2, 2015 Report Share Posted February 2, 2015 Gordon is going to have to be resigned before he plays another down. I don't think the argument is cutting him today, it's more do we trade him or sign him to a new contract even though he will play as many downs next season as Franklin D. Roosevelt. not really..... because of his 2015 suspension, we now have him under contract through 2016......AND..... because he was suspended for that final game(plus the 10 others) he now cannot meet the playing time standard for UFA, meaning at the end of 2016 he will be RFA.... so, we got him as long as we want him really.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Couch Pulls Out Posted February 2, 2015 Report Share Posted February 2, 2015 not really..... because of his 2015 suspension, we now have him under contract through 2016......AND..... because he was suspended for that final game(plus the 10 others) he now cannot meet the playing time standard for UFA, meaning at the end of 2016 he will be RFA.... so, we got him as long as we want him really.... Ah, I thought 2014 was his contract year, not 2015, and that's why that last game suspension was ultra-shifty. Turns out it was only marginally less shifty. So now we have an entire year to sit on Gordon while his suspension plays out. This situation is much different than what I originally imagined, however still not ideal. Worst case scenario is that Gordon returns from his suspension, has a Pro Bowl season, signs a huge contract and then gets suspended again. Best case scenario is that Gordon comes back, has a pedestrian season, signs a franchise-friendly contract, then tears it up for the next 10 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted February 2, 2015 Report Share Posted February 2, 2015 exactly......and if he's good in 2016, I still doubt anyone trusts him enough to offer an outrageous amount.....and well be closer to the situation, so I think well be in a good position to know how he's coming along AND to get him at a fair value......... HA!...and it's all 2 years out and he's never even gone a year w/o trouble.......so, well see........not holding my breath Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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