The players can't give up......keep fightin'

[Soju]

if the defense can for one game stop giving up 30+ points we'd actually have a decent record.

[hoorta]

That's what McCown does, lose. He makes you think he might be good for a half but for the rest of the game he fumbles, throws bad interceptions and takes too many sacks, and the Browns eventually end up losing the game.

 

And starts throwing really inaccurate passes. As was once said about Vinny Testaverde- "he's just good enough to get you beat." Great guy, great competitor, mediocre QB.

[Canton Dawg]

How deep are those injuries??......Coleman & Bito are the only 2 starters I think we're missing.....maybe Haden too?......

 

So, 19 out of 22 of our starters should be out there......want to add RGIII?.....I dont, cause McC is better.....

I think we could throw in Erving's name into the injury discussion.

 

However, that can be considered an addition by subtraction.

[wargograw]

It's so browns, so Josh McCown, to bring it back to within a FG and make the 2 points after spending four minutes strolling to the LoS and wasting time. Maybe we recover the onside kick, maybe not, but we didn't give ourselves much of a chance on that one. So Browns to go the extra mile to almost snatch victory from the jaws of defeat but not quite.

 

It's absolutely night and day though between the first and second half. First half they looked good, tackles were mostly being made (TD drive aside), and runners were being stopped at the point of contact. Second half, tackles were mostly missed (the receiving TD - four defenders had hands on him and he got through) and when they were made they were pushed back for a few more yards.

 

Is it a 'half time adjustments' thing or is it a conditioning thing? Is it a result of not having enough depth to be able to rely on backups more to keep the main guys fresh? Because right out of the gate, first two drives they went 3 & out, while we put 10 points on the board. Even from there, we outscored them in the second quarter, but just absolutely laid a turd in the second half.

It's lack of depth, to be expected, and not a big deal this year.

[gftChris]

It's lack of depth, to be expected, and not a big deal this year.

I suspect it's a combination of a lot of things, but lack of depth would be the most glaring. For example, how many snaps have our backup LBers played this year? At corner, we have such a limited group both talent and numbers wise, especially with Haden not active the last few weeks, it's easy to see why they could get gassed. Tramon Williams and Jamar Taylor playing 100% of the snaps last week, that probably changed to Haden and Taylor this week. At free safety, we don't even have a competent starter let alone depth.

[Opal312]

It's so browns, so Josh McCown, to bring it back to within a FG and make the 2 points after spending four minutes strolling to the LoS and wasting time. Maybe we recover the onside kick, maybe not, but we didn't give ourselves much of a chance on that one. So Browns to go the extra mile to almost snatch victory from the jaws of defeat but not quite.

 

It's absolutely night and day though between the first and second half. First half they looked good, tackles were mostly being made (TD drive aside), and runners were being stopped at the point of contact. Second half, tackles were mostly missed (the receiving TD - four defenders had hands on him and he got through) and when they were made they were pushed back for a few more yards.

 

Is it a 'half time adjustments' thing or is it a conditioning thing? Is it a result of not having enough depth to be able to rely on backups more to keep the main guys fresh? Because right out of the gate, first two drives they went 3 & out, while we put 10 points on the board. Even from there, we outscored them in the second quarter, but just absolutely laid a turd in the second half.

I doubt very much they practice the two minute offense. Why would they? They're so used to losing I don't think they even know what the hurry up offense or no huddle means. This is a team of oddballs!

[Opal312]

I suspect it's a combination of a lot of things, but lack of depth would be the most glaring. For example, how many snaps have our backup LBers played this year? At corner, we have such a limited group both talent and numbers wise, especially with Haden not active the last few weeks, it's easy to see why they could get gassed. Tramon Williams and Jamar Taylor playing 100% of the snaps last week, that probably changed to Haden and Taylor this week. At free safety, we don't even have a competent starter let alone depth.

Why didn't they convert Gilbert into a hybrid safety/cornerback? Why did they just get rid of them if they had no depth? He was athletic and a healthy body.

[Opal312]

Unfortunately, you could have dog poop in your hands and technically you'd have something too.

 

They don't look like they're a draft away from competing unless it's the Monty Python Idiot Olympics than yes, they're moving in the right direction. The new FO screwed up big time! The draft was terrible! A waste,of time! How many quality players do we have to watch on other teams before someone admits they don't know what the hell they're doing! Has anyone seen how good Derek Carr has been?

Are the Browns really going to NOT draft a QB? We drafted Gilbert instead of Khalil Mack! Manziel instead of Carr! We passed on Wentz, Bosa, Elliot, Prescott but got Cody Kessler? Kessler is not the guy you want out there with no Oline. He's not athletic or mobile and has a weak arm.

I'm disgusted!

[gftChris]

Why didn't they convert Gilbert into a hybrid safety/cornerback? Why did they just get rid of them if they had no depth? He was athletic and a healthy body.

Because he was lazy, immature, unprofessional and has nothing between his ears, so asking him to do the more intellectually strenuous role of safety would be like asking Cam Erving to play center.

[TexasAg1969]

I doubt very much they practice the two minute offense. Why would they? They're so used to losing I don't think they even know what the hurry up offense or no huddle means. This is a team of oddballs!

 

Only team I can compare them to comes from baseball, the 1962 Amazin' Mets. Totally inept in all phases of the game. And a team full of oddballs like Marvelous Marv.

[Tour2ma]

I've never heard of a team giving up with a lead... not even "a little bit". Our D was simple ground down in the 2nd half.

 

Conservative play calling? Lack of depth restricting D rotation? Both were factors. Inexperience is another. Bottom line was we could not run on this Jets D and running is how you seal the deal with a lead. It only helps a little that only one team has managed to run on this Jets D.

 

Interceptions? Trailing and well into the 4th Qtr they tend to happen. On the one intended for Pryor, Pryor slowed up. On the one to Duke, McC was late.

[gftChris]

Running against that Jets front is always nasty, but there are other ways to achieve the same kind of thing, like a short, very high percentage passing game. Obviously you can't run screen after screen, but a five yard hitch, throw and catch, tackle for no YAC, that kind of thing. When they start jumping the routes, make it a hitch and go. Maybe I'm oversimplifying.

[hoorta]

I suspect it's a combination of a lot of things, but lack of depth would be the most glaring. For example, how many snaps have our backup LBers played this year? At corner, we have such a limited group both talent and numbers wise, especially with Haden not active the last few weeks, it's easy to see why they could get gassed. Tramon Williams and Jamar Taylor playing 100% of the snaps last week, that probably changed to Haden and Taylor this week. At free safety, we don't even have a competent starter let alone depth.

 

For those ragging on Haden- I doubt he was playing at 100%.

[hoorta]

They don't look like they're a draft away from competing unless it's the Monty Python Idiot Olympics than yes, they're moving in the right direction. The new FO screwed up big time! The draft was terrible! A waste,of time! How many quality players do we have to watch on other teams before someone admits they don't know what the hell they're doing! Has anyone seen how good Derek Carr has been?

Are the Browns really going to NOT draft a QB? We drafted Gilbert instead of Khalil Mack! Manziel instead of Carr! We passed on Wentz, Bosa, Elliot, Prescott but got Cody Kessler? Kessler is not the guy you want out there with no Oline. He's not athletic or mobile and has a weak arm.

I'm disgusted!

 

You can't blame Gilbert, Manziel, and Erving on the current FO. That was Ray Farmer's doing. As to this year, It really can't be evaluated until we see how that first round 2017 (and second round in 2018) turn out. Coleman has played one game, so way too early to say that was a screw-up. Prescott probably wouldn't be playing 1\2 as well if he was running for his life playing behind that sieve masquerading as the Browns o-line. OK, I wanted Wentz too, knew Elliott was going to be a stud. Bosa made it pretty clear he didn't want to be in Cleveland. We passed on them- boo-hoo, I'm over it.

 

MHO is we got more talent out of this draft than we did out of Farmer's two. I don't see any monumental busts yet out of the first three rounds. I'm sure not going to throw the towel in on Kessler just yet either. One legit target (Pryor) and a patchwork o-line. Shon Coleman may be a project- but he's a third round project- not a first like Erving was.

[browns52]

 

For those ragging on Haden- I doubt he was playing at 100%.

hard to remember the last time he was 100 percent...that is the point here...he's become an injury liability...

[Flugel]

I've never heard of a team giving up with a lead... not even "a little bit". Our D was simple ground down in the 2nd half.

 

Conservative play calling? Lack of depth restricting D rotation? Both were factors. Inexperience is another. Bottom line was we could not run on this Jets D and running is how you seal the deal with a lead. It only helps a little that only one team has managed to run on this Jets D.

 

Interceptions? Trailing and well into the 4th Qtr they tend to happen. On the one intended for Pryor, Pryor slowed up. On the one to Duke, McC was late.

 

Nice job with that Tour! Interesting read.

 

I thought the time of possession battle in the second half led to really led to some fatigue defensively. The trend I'm seeing in games we got leads vrs teams like Baltimore and the NY Jets is we're not a difficult offense to adjust to just yet. Once that happens, we're looking at an impact on time of possession, quality of depth and overall endurance.

 

Just my perception, but sometimes Josh looks like he processes information downfield slower than Kessler. That's part of the reason he always takes a pounding in the pocket aside from the volume of experience our WR Corps has. I might be getting greedy here but a veteran like Josh also seems to forget the situation/time urgency when he's up against the clock late in games. More specifically, get up there and spike the ball like other QBs do rather than wait 10-12 more seconds to get the play off. Some of that is on our Offensive Coaches as well. The amount of time our defense was on the field in the second half - there should have been ample time for Josh and Hue to plan accordingly together on the sidelines for the upcoming series. I can't always see what's happening on the sidelines when our defense is out there so in fairness - they might have been communicating more than I'm crediting them.

 

Dom gummit, there has to be an alternative to the Rock quarry for hands we keep seeing from Ricky Ricardo-Louis. Let's see what Payton has. If he's got hands we can't afford to hold them hostage. Free those suckers - dad blast it.

[Mudfly]

 

Nice job with that Tour! Interesting read.

 

1) I thought the time of possession battle in the second half led to really led to some fatigue defensively. The trend I'm seeing in games we got leads vrs teams like Baltimore and the NY Jets is we're not a difficult offense to adjust to just yet. Once that happens, we're looking at an impact on time of possession, quality of depth and overall endurance.

 

2) Just my perception, but sometimes Josh looks like he processes information downfield slower than Kessler. That's part of the reason he always takes a pounding in the pocket aside from the volume of experience our WR Corps has.

 

3) Dom gummit, there has to be an alternative to the Rock quarry for hands we keep seeing from Ricky Ricardo-Louis. Let's see what Payton has. If he's got hands we can't afford to hold them hostage. Free those suckers - dad blast it.

1) They definitely wore down, BUT.....lets be honest..... they rolled over the second the half began. The Jets came out and scored twice in the 3rd, well "before" any fatigue had set in.....We just are not coming out and looking good in the second half(period).....dont know if it's effort, lack of adjustments, low confidence, whatever.....but we are fading as the games go.....almost every game...

 

2) I think one big difference is that Josh IS actually looking downfield.....Kess?...not so much. And the number of long passes that were completed this week are kind of testament to that. Dink and dunk will get the ball out quicker every time....and thats what we are doing with Kess....dink.....dunk....etc

 

3) You said it!.....Ive been bitchin about drafting the 4 WR's and now am getting ready to start bitching about them not playing and/or not playing well.....where the hell are Payton and Higgins????

[Tour2ma]

1. Certainly the D is rested for the first drive of a half, but that drive was a 12 play one just shy of 7 minutes long. Our O followed with a 3 minute possession. The next Jets drive was a mere 8 plays, but included the long catch and run by Enunwa and the demoralizing 4th down TD. Our O's response? 3 and out. Not saying it's the only factor... just a significant one.

Agree... more shots from McC, but he seemed a tad slow and given how long he'd been sidelined that would not be too surprising.