Louisville Slugger Posted March 1, 2018 Report Share Posted March 1, 2018 Looks like Jarvis Landry, Tyrann Mathieu, Richard Sherman and Earl Thomas will be available. Landry will demand a pretty high draft pick plus a huge contract. I would love to have him but that's a steep price. Mathieu seems like the victim of the reconsruction process. Im betting we could have him for a mid round pick. He has a high salary and is pretty injury prone, but when he's on the field he's a stud. Thomas and Sherman are a little older and have worn out there welcome in Seattle. If we can get both of them for cheap that would be ideal. We can develop some draft picks behind them for a few years and maybe a change of scenery brings them back to their legion of boom days. Maybe offer a 3rd for both of them? Which one would you go after or would you avoid trades all together? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canton Mike Posted March 1, 2018 Report Share Posted March 1, 2018 Those are all some fine players, all of which we could use. Let's just wait, see what they want in trade, & see what happens. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted March 1, 2018 Report Share Posted March 1, 2018 Landry was franchise tagged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louisville Slugger Posted March 1, 2018 Author Report Share Posted March 1, 2018 He was tagged but the rumor is they are looking to trade him. 10 minutes ago, TexasAg1969 said: Landry was franchise tagged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimboJones Posted March 1, 2018 Report Share Posted March 1, 2018 There's no possible way the Seahawks let Thomas (who's maybe the best Safety in the league) go for anything but high picks. He's stated he wants to stay with the Seahawks but if they "kick him to the curb" during contract extension talks, then he wants his hometown team the Cowboys to come get him. Sherman is coming off a torn Achillies and I don't think the Seahawks would just give him away without a good return until they see how he's recovered. Landry was franchised for $16+million and would also likely cost a high pick. Would rather just draft a WR or two.... Mathieu has a big contract and two torn ACL's... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louisville Slugger Posted March 1, 2018 Author Report Share Posted March 1, 2018 46 minutes ago, JimboJones said: There's no possible way the Seahawks let Thomas (who's maybe the best Safety in the league) go for anything but high picks. He's stated he wants to stay with the Seahawks but if they "kick him to the curb" during contract extension talks, then he wants his hometown team the Cowboys to come get him. Sherman is coming off a torn Achillies and I don't think the Seahawks would just give him away without a good return until they see how he's recovered If they can move those 2 contracts that frees up 20m. This is a huge free agent market and those 2 are getting older and have been a head ache. I don't think its too far fetched to think the seahawks want to move on. Plus they may want to blow up that defense anyways. Chancellor and Avril maybe retiring due to injury and Wagner, Sherman, and Thomas are said to be unhappy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SissyBoyFloyd Posted March 1, 2018 Report Share Posted March 1, 2018 A couple of expensive all pro type CBs are now on the market. Not a bad way to spend some of that hundred + grand. And there is the Pat's Butler too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gumby73 Posted March 1, 2018 Report Share Posted March 1, 2018 Trading cost draft capital...Just yesterday, the sky is falling cuts began, Buckeyes S Kurt Coleman (29),RB Johnathan Stewart,DE Charlse Johnson all out at Panthers. Jets-- Mo Wilkerson(28) out of work. Out QB Mike Glennon lasted no time as a Bear. soundings of CB Aqib Talib maybe out in Denver..FA board will be growing quickly coming out of combine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiggins7919 Posted March 1, 2018 Report Share Posted March 1, 2018 As we all know, trading for Landry will be quite expensive. Not only do we have to part with picks, we'll have to sign him to a big contract before a trade can be executed. I would envision something similar to the recent Chiefs CB trade, where they gave away the CB and a 6th round, and got a 3rd rounder and maybe a future 2nd or something? I dunno, and too lazy to look up. Free agents almost ALWAYS get "overpaid", but we also have to be prudent with our picks and money. Still, WR is a position of need, and if we don't get Landry, I'm not exactly overwhelmed with the other options. My perfect scenario would be to get Landry for a decent deal AND bring back Terrell Pryor. We shall see. Defensively, I'm more apt to go after Earl Thomas than Sherman. I've always been a huge Thomas fan, but wasn't he injured last year? Or did I make that up? Still, if he medically checks out, he's DEFINITELY worth exploring, AND would fill a giant need on our porous pass defense. Heck, I'd want Earl Thomas, Trumaine Johnson from the Rams, AND to draft Minkah Fitzpatrick with the #4 pick. There's a VERY strong correlation between having a dominant pass defense and winning football games. Additionally, I have always been a huge Mohammad Wilkerson fan, and the Jets recently cut him. Now, Wilkerson had some incredible years, got SUPER PAID, and then turned into a malcontent, underachieving schmuck. Perhaps he was just in a bad situation with the Jets and he's not a bad guy. Problem is, Gregg Williams doesn't suffer fools, so if Wilkerson can't act right with the Jets, he probably wouldn't be a great fit with us. BUT...he's still worth checking out just in case. Don't forget how amazing he was for multiple years in a row, and if he's lined up next to Danny Shelton, I'm not sure who you're going to double-team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimboJones Posted March 1, 2018 Report Share Posted March 1, 2018 9 hours ago, gumby73 said: Trading cost draft capital...Just yesterday, the sky is falling cuts began, Buckeyes S Kurt Coleman (29),RB Johnathan Stewart,DE Charlse Johnson all out at Panthers. Jets-- Mo Wilkerson(28) out of work. Out QB Mike Glennon lasted no time as a Bear. soundings of CB Aqib Talib maybe out in Denver..FA board will be growing quickly coming out of combine. But what Free Agent wants to sign with the F'n Browns without them getting completely overpaid? I guess maybe Terrelle Pryor might. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcam222 Posted March 1, 2018 Report Share Posted March 1, 2018 Landry I read is projected to fetch a 3rd rounder. If that's true I'd surely pay it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canton Mike Posted March 2, 2018 Report Share Posted March 2, 2018 1 hour ago, jcam222 said: Landry I read is projected to fetch a 3rd rounder. If that's true I'd surely pay it. So would I....Hey, we can dream, can't we?? Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louisville Slugger Posted March 2, 2018 Author Report Share Posted March 2, 2018 I'l give a 3rd for Landry in a heartbeat. I thought it would take #33 and maybe more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimboJones Posted March 2, 2018 Report Share Posted March 2, 2018 Instead of paying $16M in cap room+big contract extension ($14M per year?) for a slot guy, keep the 3rd (#65) and draft a slot WR like DJ Moore or Anthony Miller in the 3rd or 4th. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunz41 Posted March 2, 2018 Report Share Posted March 2, 2018 Maybe I am wrong, it has happened once in my lifetime (LOL JUST KIDDING), but I just don't understand people's fascination with draft picks. A lot of times people say I would rather have this pick vs this player so we can draft so and so. It all boils down to me to known production vs unknown. A lot of people when talking about draft picks say I would rather have this pick vs good NFL player. Since Landry has been the most talked about in this thread, let's use him. Is there ANY player in 2nd or 3rd round that you really think can give you that production? Yes money comes into as well, but I see production already shown in the league vs a 50% chance of a different prospect. Now sometimes the chance at the prospect is better than production, as I wouldn't think about anything close to 2 1sts and 2 2nds for Foles, but I certainly would do these (as compared to the draft choice there) 1- Carson Wentz over Darnold, Rosen, Mayfield, Allen 4- Patrick Peterson over Minkah or Gurley over Barkley And so on and so forth. But like I said, I could be wrong or could just be my style. I just think proven beats unproven EVERY time. I dont know the injury prognosis for the 4 guys in the original message, or contract info, but with their talent, I would certainly trade 2s, 3s, and 4s for those guys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimboJones Posted March 2, 2018 Report Share Posted March 2, 2018 1 hour ago, Gunz41 said: Maybe I am wrong, it has happened once in my lifetime (LOL JUST KIDDING), but I just don't understand people's fascination with draft picks. A lot of times people say I would rather have this pick vs this player so we can draft so and so. It all boils down to me to known production vs unknown. A lot of people when talking about draft picks say I would rather have this pick vs good NFL player. Since Landry has been the most talked about in this thread, let's use him. Is there ANY player in 2nd or 3rd round that you really think can give you that production? Yes money comes into as well, but I see production already shown in the league vs a 50% chance of a different prospect. Now sometimes the chance at the prospect is better than production, as I wouldn't think about anything close to 2 1sts and 2 2nds for Foles, but I certainly would do these (as compared to the draft choice there) 1- Carson Wentz over Darnold, Rosen, Mayfield, Allen 4- Patrick Peterson over Minkah or Gurley over Barkley And so on and so forth. But like I said, I could be wrong or could just be my style. I just think proven beats unproven EVERY time. I dont know the injury prognosis for the 4 guys in the original message, or contract info, but with their talent, I would certainly trade 2s, 3s, and 4s for those guys With the salary cap, you NEED to be successful drafting players in order to compete. Or do whatever the Patriots are doing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunz41 Posted March 2, 2018 Report Share Posted March 2, 2018 11 minutes ago, JimboJones said: With the salary cap, you NEED to be successful drafting players on order to compete. Or do whatever the Patriots are doing... I'm not saying you trade every pick for players, but you could get pro bowler players for mid rounder pick . I have no problem drafting guys, but if available and heathly and not way overpriced , sign me up. So let's ask it this way: who would you trade for with each pick (realistic)? 1- 4- 33- 35- 63- 65- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted March 2, 2018 Report Share Posted March 2, 2018 We really shouldn't be too concerned about large contracts. We have tons of cap and a young team Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcam222 Posted March 2, 2018 Report Share Posted March 2, 2018 1 hour ago, Gunz41 said: Maybe I am wrong, it has happened once in my lifetime (LOL JUST KIDDING), but I just don't understand people's fascination with draft picks. A lot of times people say I would rather have this pick vs this player so we can draft so and so. It all boils down to me to known production vs unknown. A lot of people when talking about draft picks say I would rather have this pick vs good NFL player. Since Landry has been the most talked about in this thread, let's use him. Is there ANY player in 2nd or 3rd round that you really think can give you that production? Yes money comes into as well, but I see production already shown in the league vs a 50% chance of a different prospect. Now sometimes the chance at the prospect is better than production, as I wouldn't think about anything close to 2 1sts and 2 2nds for Foles, but I certainly would do these (as compared to the draft choice there) 1- Carson Wentz over Darnold, Rosen, Mayfield, Allen 4- Patrick Peterson over Minkah or Gurley over Barkley And so on and so forth. But like I said, I could be wrong or could just be my style. I just think proven beats unproven EVERY time. I dont know the injury prognosis for the 4 guys in the original message, or contract info, but with their talent, I would certainly trade 2s, 3s, and 4s for those guys Great post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiggins7919 Posted March 2, 2018 Report Share Posted March 2, 2018 11 hours ago, Canton Mike said: So would I....Hey, we can dream, can't we?? Mike As I'm sure you already know, it's more than just the cost of the 3rd rounder. We'd have to agree to terms on a contract with Landry before a trade could be executed, so it's a 3rd round pick AND millions of dollars per year. And we already know free agents get over paid, ESPECIALLY if they have to go to Cleveland. I could be mistaken, but I BELIEVE Landry would have the right to negate the trade. Again...I'll double check that because I'm not sure. But, we have picks and we need money. I'm not totally in love with any of the WRs in the draft, and normally rookie WRs take a while to learn anyway. All this means we have to seriously consider making this trade for Landry. I've been saying for a while that I want Landry AND Pryor, and that could take the possibly the worst WR group at the start of the 2017 season, to one of the BEST in 2018. Let THAT resonate for a minute. Think I'm exaggerating? Josh Gordon, Jarvis Landry, Terrell Pryor, Corey Coleman is not something to scoff at, and then you throw in other positions like Duke Johnson, David Njoku, and Seth Devalve. Sold yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canton Mike Posted March 2, 2018 Report Share Posted March 2, 2018 2 hours ago, jiggins7919 said: As I'm sure you already know, it's more than just the cost of the 3rd rounder. We'd have to agree to terms on a contract with Landry before a trade could be executed, so it's a 3rd round pick AND millions of dollars per year. And we already know free agents get over paid, ESPECIALLY if they have to go to Cleveland. I could be mistaken, but I BELIEVE Landry would have the right to negate the trade. Again...I'll double check that because I'm not sure. But, we have picks and we need money. I'm not totally in love with any of the WRs in the draft, and normally rookie WRs take a while to learn anyway. All this means we have to seriously consider making this trade for Landry. I've been saying for a while that I want Landry AND Pryor, and that could take the possibly the worst WR group at the start of the 2017 season, to one of the BEST in 2018. Let THAT resonate for a minute. Think I'm exaggerating? Josh Gordon, Jarvis Landry, Terrell Pryor, Corey Coleman is not something to scoff at, and then you throw in other positions like Duke Johnson, David Njoku, and Seth Devalve. Sold yet? No, I'm not yet sold. Here's why: 1) Gordon...We cannot count on his presence OR solid, every down effort. We can only hope. 2) Coleman...Has proven NOTHING positive. I (flat out) do NOT like this kid. 3) Landry...IS proven & would be a solid addition. 4) Pryor...We'll see 5) Duke...Needs to be utilized more often IF he improves ball security. 6) Njoku & DeValve...Njoku needs to cut down drops & both need to improve blocking. IMHO, we'll address QB & DB, but WR remains our weak link. I trust Dorsey & staff plus Haley & Hue to address this. A BIG "We'll see". Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flugel Posted March 2, 2018 Report Share Posted March 2, 2018 On 2/28/2018 at 10:52 PM, TexasAg1969 said: Landry was franchise tagged. It was reported on the NFL Channel that he will be granted permission to seek a trade. Here's the catch (or drop), he will cost any interested NFL franchise at least 2 first round picks plus a gigantic salary. Sounds like an interesting way to say good night... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted March 2, 2018 Report Share Posted March 2, 2018 35 minutes ago, Flugel said: It was reported on the NFL Channel that he will be granted permission to seek a trade. Here's the catch (or drop), he will cost any interested NFL franchise at least 2 first round picks plus a gigantic salary. Sounds like an interesting way to say good night... Sounds like a baited hook was thrown out for us and Buffalo. EDIT: I'd take Ridley @ 4 before giving that much away for Landry. Keep #1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flugel Posted March 2, 2018 Report Share Posted March 2, 2018 1 hour ago, Flugel said: It was reported on the NFL Channel that he will be granted permission to seek a trade. Here's the catch (or drop), he will cost any interested NFL franchise at least 2 first round picks plus a gigantic salary. Sounds like an interesting way to say good night... Well, I'm glad I just double-checked this - I stand corrected! I have a feeling this story is going to change more frequently Kim Kardashian; but the news seems to be a little better than what I heard this morning. Here's something I found online. Landry has been given permission to seek and facilitate a trade from the Dolphins, Ian Rapoport of NFL Network reports. After failing to agree to a long-term extension, the Dolphins placed a $16.2 million franchise tag on Landry last week -- but that doesn't guarantee the wideout will call Miami home come Week 1. It was initially believed that any trade for Landry would have to involve two first-round draft picks, but it has been reported that the asking price has lowered for the Dolphins. Landry is coming off an NFL-leading 112-catch season, to go along with 987 receiving yards and nine touchdowns in 16 games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted March 2, 2018 Report Share Posted March 2, 2018 Bears Rumor on Landry. http://www.sportingnews.com/ca/nfl/news/nfl-trade-rumors-bears-dolphins-wr-jarvis-landry-stats/743na0i4f27c1s17jfsyzo4lw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flugel Posted March 2, 2018 Report Share Posted March 2, 2018 Signing veterans is very important but you have to get these guys/re-sign them at the right time in their careers, which hasn't always been easy here. For those that thought Joe Haden wasn't the same after we gave him his dream contract extension - this happens in other places as well to guys that looked deserving of the re-commitment at the time. For example here's a cut and paste of an article I found on the Web about a guy that used to be a badass. NY Jets release DE Muhammad Wilkerson, who disappointed after signing a big contract Andy Vasquez, Staff Writer, Associated Press INDIANAPOLIS -- The Jets' intentions have been clear for months. But on Wednesday, they finally acted on them. The Jets released defensive end Muhammad Wilkerson, ending months of speculation and closing the final chapter of his career with the team in disappointment. Jets general manager Mike Maccagnan and coach Todd Bowles, speaking at the NFL Combine on Wednesday, called it a "business decision." And this was a sensible move. Wilkerson was set to count $20 million against the Jets' salary cap — far more than the struggling, former Pro Bowl defensive end was worth. By cutting him now, the Jets save $11 million in cap space. Wilkerson, a Linden native, was a Jets' first-round pick in 2011 and became a Pro Bowler and the team's best pass rusher. The feel-good story continued when he signed a five-year, $86 million deal in the summer of 2016. But Wilkerson underperformed on the field after signing that contract and was a disappointment and distraction off of it — getting benched repeatedly for chronic tardiness. The Jets were quick to limit the damage and move on. They'll have to carry $9 million in dead money this season on Wilkerson's contract. "[It] was a business decision," Bowles said. "It wasn't disciplinary at all. ... I'm disappointed for the team, I'm disappointed for him. Obviously, it didn't work out." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted March 2, 2018 Report Share Posted March 2, 2018 14 hours ago, Gunz41 said: Maybe I am wrong, it has happened once in my lifetime (LOL JUST KIDDING), but I just don't understand people's fascination with draft picks. A lot of times people say I would rather have this pick vs this player so we can draft so and so. It all boils down to me to known production vs unknown. A lot of people when talking about draft picks say I would rather have this pick vs good NFL player. Since Landry has been the most talked about in this thread, let's use him. Is there ANY player in 2nd or 3rd round that you really think can give you that production? Yes money comes into as well, but I see production already shown in the league vs a 50% chance of a different prospect. Now sometimes the chance at the prospect is better than production, as I wouldn't think about anything close to 2 1sts and 2 2nds for Foles, but I certainly would do these (as compared to the draft choice there) 1- Carson Wentz over Darnold, Rosen, Mayfield, Allen 4- Patrick Peterson over Minkah or Gurley over Barkley And so on and so forth. But like I said, I could be wrong or could just be my style. I just think proven beats unproven EVERY time. I dont know the injury prognosis for the 4 guys in the original message, or contract info, but with their talent, I would certainly trade 2s, 3s, and 4s for those guys You sound like a George Allen disciple. For nearly a decade the Washington Redskins did not use a first round draft pick because they always traded them for a more proven veteran. That approach had fair results. The Skins of that time did make one SB....but lost. But they were in contention most of the time for the playoffs. The Browns of late have been the antithesis of that. Instead of the Over the Hill Gang.....they are The Not Ready for Prime Time Players due to how young this team has been. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted March 2, 2018 Report Share Posted March 2, 2018 48 minutes ago, Flugel said: Signing veterans is very important but you have to get these guys/re-sign them at the right time in their careers, which hasn't always been easy here. For those that thought Joe Haden wasn't the same after we gave him his dream contract extension - this happens in other places as well to guys that looked deserving of the re-commitment at the time. For example here's a cut and paste of an article I found on the Web about a guy that used to be a badass. NY Jets release DE Muhammad Wilkerson, who disappointed after signing a big contract Andy Vasquez, Staff Writer, Associated Press INDIANAPOLIS -- The Jets' intentions have been clear for months. But on Wednesday, they finally acted on them. The Jets released defensive end Muhammad Wilkerson, ending months of speculation and closing the final chapter of his career with the team in disappointment. Jets general manager Mike Maccagnan and coach Todd Bowles, speaking at the NFL Combine on Wednesday, called it a "business decision." And this was a sensible move. Wilkerson was set to count $20 million against the Jets' salary cap — far more than the struggling, former Pro Bowl defensive end was worth. By cutting him now, the Jets save $11 million in cap space. Wilkerson, a Linden native, was a Jets' first-round pick in 2011 and became a Pro Bowler and the team's best pass rusher. The feel-good story continued when he signed a five-year, $86 million deal in the summer of 2016. But Wilkerson underperformed on the field after signing that contract and was a disappointment and distraction off of it — getting benched repeatedly for chronic tardiness. The Jets were quick to limit the damage and move on. They'll have to carry $9 million in dead money this season on Wilkerson's contract. "[It] was a business decision," Bowles said. "It wasn't disciplinary at all. ... I'm disappointed for the team, I'm disappointed for him. Obviously, it didn't work out." Question.....can a guy that has been released by that be signed BEFORE the start of the Free Agency period? Like any released player usually can be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flugel Posted March 2, 2018 Report Share Posted March 2, 2018 17 minutes ago, The Gipper said: Question.....can a guy that has been released by that be signed BEFORE the start of the Free Agency period? Like any released player usually can be? I think so Gips because we just signed a WR the other day, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunz41 Posted March 2, 2018 Report Share Posted March 2, 2018 1 hour ago, The Gipper said: You sound like a George Allen disciple. For nearly a decade the Washington Redskins did not use a first round draft pick because they always traded them for a more proven veteran. That approach had fair results. The Skins of that time did make one SB....but lost. But they were in contention most of the time for the playoffs. The Browns of late have been the antithesis of that. Instead of the Over the Hill Gang.....they are The Not Ready for Prime Time Players due to how young this team has been. I never once said I would trade this or that pick. But apparently you are one of these guys who thinks draft picks are more valuable than proven players. I'll tell you what, I know that they would never happen, but I would guarantee if I took the 5 1st 2 rounds and traded them for someone at the same position, it would look better for the team. It's the EXACT reason I have went back and forth with Pog about Barkley. He hasn't proven ANYTHING as of now, and Gurley has. Would I trade 1 for Wentz, you betcha. For Goff, yep. For Trubisky, nope. For Mahomes, no not even close as haven't seen anything from him. Watson, no. Would I trade 4 for Gurley, everyday. Zeke, maybe. Patrick Peterson, uh huh, Von, Mack, Bosa, ding ding we have a winner. There is a BIG difference to me in saying trading 1s vs 2s and lower. Just for a round number, say 25% of all those picks work out, yes probably way lower. 10 picks Right? So 2.5 players, where I can take them and get proven production. If it were me, I'm sure I would make way more mistakes than good moves, but if Sherman, Thomas, Landry, and Honey Badger were presented for 64, 65, etc in jumping on it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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