MDDawg Posted September 9, 2018 Report Share Posted September 9, 2018 I think the D line missed Danny Shelton in my opinion. No excuse for a running back on his first start to have a record day on us. Last year the run defense was good but we'd give up big plays to tight ends, this year we're giving up big plays to both. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted September 9, 2018 Report Share Posted September 9, 2018 ofc it missed danny, but honestly jamie and ogunjobi would have sufficed. hard to understand why meder was cut. But also the left edge was obliterated most of the game. OL were just pulling through there at will on their way to seeking out a LB'er. Cant stop the run like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted September 9, 2018 Report Share Posted September 9, 2018 Nassib might have been a sub par pass rusher but he held up the edge and slid laterally into the run lanes exceptionally well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syd Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 any word on ogbah ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjh2130 Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 10 minutes ago, syd said: any word on ogbah ? Ogbah came back in after getting his ankle retaped Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 Just now, bjh2130 said: Ogbah came back in after getting his ankle retaped but then he went back out. Im not syre ge took a single snap in the 2nd half. If he did it was very limited. Avery was LDE most of the half, and he was the one who strpped ben. But his run d is nonexistent. He's a raw edge rush talent, not a complete player yet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 14 hours ago, Clevfan4life said: ofc it missed danny, but honestly jamie and ogunjobi would have sufficed. hard to understand why meder was cut. But also the left edge was obliterated most of the game. OL were just pulling through there at will on their way to seeking out a LB'er. Cant stop the run like that. 13 hours ago, Clevfan4life said: Nassib might have been a sub par pass rusher but he held up the edge and slid laterally into the run lanes exceptionally well Agree... Dorsey has opted for increased Pass pressure over run stuffing. Not going to fix everything in one season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 13 minutes ago, Tour2ma said: Agree... Dorsey has opted for increased Pass pressure over run stuffing. Not going to fix everything in one season. The 2019 draft is loaded with DTs better than we have now. But why did Brantley go? Not enough pass rush? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 Didn't we like pick up 3 defensive linemen right after the cuts were made? And did any of them contribute anything at all? Devaroe, Davis, Zettel? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 15 minutes ago, The Gipper said: Didn't we like pick up 3 defensive linemen right after the cuts were made? And did any of them contribute anything at all? Devaroe, Davis, Zettel? New DLs Zettel and Odenigbo were inactivated for week 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 odenigbo looks like another pure pass rusher, not sure we should expect any edge presence from him when he dies get in. All i want from him is giving myles rest. Dear god we're gonna wear myles out so bad. We gutted our DE rotation so i knew if sonething happened just to ogbah, we were gonna have major issues....and if myles gets hurt, i can assure everyone we're a solid lock for the #1 pick. We're a lock for a top 5 pick anyway cause neither tyrod nor baker are gonna make it to the end of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 are there mulligans in the nfl? like can we call tampa and say hi, nice opening day win but oh btw we're gonna need carl back? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 14 minutes ago, TexasAg1969 said: New DLs Zettel and Odenigbo were inactivated for week 1. Wait, then.....that makes 4 DL picked up at the very last minute? Right? Zettlel, Davis, Devaroe and Oden? In my opinion, a Defensive Line is very similar to an offensive line, especially when it comes to run defense. There must be some continuity, and they must know their assignments and the gap responsibilities. And, while, yes, the starters have all been here a while, Garrett, Ogbah, Coley, Ogunjobi, still, with DL rotations, I still think continuity is required. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 Sadly some of the bigger gains were the Steelers using our over-aggressiveness to the weakside/open end. The first one @ :30 seconds wasn't the greatest fill by Collins either. Then the problem with having an off-ball MIKE backer is that if he flows laterally one way, it's awfully hard to make up for the lost ground the other. That aside, Myles realizes he got upfield too quickly and then fought to get back around and stay square. Another @ :40 demonstrates what I'm talking about with Schobert. He isn't your classic downhill backer. A few seconds into that frame you'll see the alley, Joe stops, plants his feet and kills his motion. For those that complained about D'qwell Jackson, this should look familiar. As a backer you can't sit there and wait because you're going to get Shmucked up with a RB gaining even more steam. A little snag on MG stopped him from cleaning Conner sideways. Zebra's need to keep an eye on that. The next one @ :53 I called live. Went at the strength/Myles and brought the guard. General rule you follow the pull, especially if you haven't seen any RPO's or assignment conflicts. Which isn't a tendency the Steelers have in the RZ. First Shmuck up was on MG - you see the pull you blow it up. Don't wait for it to get to you. Run defense is unselfish football. Second Shmuck up was... #26? Is that Kindred? I have no idea what he was playing here or why he followed the TE on the seal/pin. It's a monumentally dumb read because he knows that is HIS gap. Again, boils down to assignment football and being unselfish. Hold your gap, fill and rally to the ball carrier. The others to close out the first half were good calls by the Steelers on the draw, going after an over-aggressive Williams using a variety of 5 man pressures The next run Conner almost scored on was @ 1:20. Same god damn gun/pull look he scored on previously. Minus the fact the TE looked for the SLB/Contain and the guard was leading through. We appeared to be out leveraged before the play even happened. The big one I'm talking about that teams will use against us moving forward is @ 1:33. Once again going at Myles as the WSE/Open end. This is a designed cutback the whole way and even if it wasn't, our interior line was blown TF up. We simply lack interior lineman to consistently anchor and hold the point it appears. Of course by this point the defense had been out there quite a bit so I'm sure some fatigue was setting in. On a base block usually you'll double the 1-tech then the center or guard will disengage and peel to the second level. Pittsburgh never had to bother with that, they went right for the backers never having to even throw a double. Myles gets a step or too far upfield and the design is there when Collins fills against the lead. Not winning on the interior and being over-aggressive on the edge. MG will need to show discipline moving forward with that. Reminds me of a kid I played with, Joey (won't use his last name) 6'4 225, long butt arms. Could beat a TE and get around the edge like a MoFo. He just couldn't hold his ground and didn't enjoy contact so teams ran right at him. The next few runs are displays of not breaking down, not playing your assignment/gap, arriving to the ball carrier not under control and our DB's not attacking their lanes with heads up football and quality tackling. This is on coach Williams. Aggressive is good, over aggressive is why the designed cutbacks and counter pulls will eat his defenses alive. We also lack a true anchor in the middle. Something I was hoping Danny would continue, maybe we would sign Hankins for but perhaps the answer is already on roster with Carl Davis. Either way, assignment gap sound football and understanding you need to earn those pass rushing snaps is what this team needs to drill into their head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 4 minutes ago, Clevfan4life said: are there mulligans in the nfl? like can we call tampa and say hi, nice opening day win but oh btw we're gonna need carl back? Well.....as far as TB is concerned.....there WAS talk that maybe Ryan Fitzpatrick would be the veteran "Bridge" QB that we would bring in here, rather than TT. But they did not go that route. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 what stood out to be on the run at 1:33 was thatbyeah myles might be upfield a little too much, but he does funnel the run inside. Collins gets the lead block but its schobert that got swallowed up by the center. Not good. As a mlb'er u have to slide off to a side. You read the FB...The fb was going left so schobert should have ripped to his right. Ibstead he engages straight up with the center, and thats that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 on the very next play which is a TD run, dear god look at the penetration to the 2nd level that the steers o line gets. This is precisely what didnt happen last year with danny and jamie up the middle. I dont know, i guess this is where i part ways with williams on defensive philosophy. You keep ur two gap monster, u keep the guy who can do 1 or 2 gap (jamie), and u rotate in other guys who might be more one gapping penetrators. First impressions feel like instead of building on a strength last year, we tore it up to be pass rush pass rush pass rush. When other teams, like the steelers...managed throughout the years to do both. Its not like we had some massively overpaid coksuckers on the line either that we had to get rid of for cap concerns. Makes no sense. teams now are gonna do exactly what u do to a gifted pass rusher, u run at him..negate his pass rushing. And we really dont have an opposite edge to make them pay for that. Nassib at least ran down those runs at myles from behind. We had a DL could affect the play like an extra LB'er from the other side of the field.That game footage tiamat put up just reinforced my initial smell test when i heard of the cuts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 16 minutes ago, Clevfan4life said: what stood out to be on the run at 1:33 was thatbyeah myles might be upfield a little too much, but he does funnel the run inside. Collins gets the lead block but its schobert that got swallowed up by the center. Not good. As a mlb'er u have to slide off to a side. You read the FB...The fb was going left so schobert should have ripped to his right. Ibstead he engages straight up with the center, and thats that. I don't think Schobert had a chance to engage the center or not but as an off ball MIKE he is going to have to be quicker laterally than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 I repeat: Four Defensive Linemen on this team who had not been with them for a week.....no matter how good (and remember, they were cut by other teams....so how good are they)....cannot help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 1 hour ago, tiamat63 said: Sadly some of the bigger gains were the Steelers using our over-aggressiveness to the weakside/open end. MG ran himself out of a number of plays early. I did not notice it so much later. Old rule of thumb for Offenses: Run at speed and away from strength. We saw it Sunday and will see it many times this season. MG is going to be run at a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 50 minutes ago, tiamat63 said: I don't think Schobert had a chance to engage the center or not but as an off ball MIKE he is going to have to be quicker laterally than that. he's strong enough to engage/disengage with OL because of his days as a 34 olb'er...but he doesnt get that thise nano seconds of engagement take him out of the play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 1 minute ago, Tour2ma said: MG ran himself out of a number of plays early. I did not notice it so much later. Old rule of thumb for Offenses: Run at speed and away from strength. We saw it Sunday and will see it many times this season. MG is going to be run at a lot. last year he had jamie or danny fighting into that off guard gap. Now its a giant hole u can drive cars through. I like edges that get upfield enough to turn the runs inside, but then the interior guys gave to do their jobs. Jamie took on the lead block and no other lb'er showed up. We might have to tell myles to read run first. As we saw yesterday, teams can still put up a bunch of points on u with the run. Gotta stop the run Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 8 minutes ago, Clevfan4life said: he's strong enough to engage/disengage with OL because of his days as a 34 olb'er...but he doesnt get that thise nano seconds of engagement take him out of the play. Not sure about this... remember he trimmed down significantly in prep for his move inside last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickers Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 Connor will probably disappear next Sunday... I gotta figure someone will game plan for him.. The Browns certainly did not... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 1 hour ago, Tour2ma said: Not sure about this... remember he trimmed down significantly in prep for his move inside last season. it still looks like he has power taking on guards and centers, they certainly dont throw him around if he has his base. But if the play is away from him he's done often cause he allows himself to tangle too much. When he does flow around those attempted blocks the guy makes some pretty eye opening plays behind the los. I think pgh knew that ur nit gonna get around our defense much, our lb'ers are too fast....so they freeze em by running right at em. Thats when the DL is supppsed to keep OL from the 2nd level. But they come off the ball and as they feel themselving getting released they dont cave in they drift further upfield. Thats a big prob and i susoect a majirvreason why some of those big run plays you saw 2 to 3 steelers OL 5 or more yds deep just swallowing up 2nd level defenders. really disappointed williams allowed a srrength to possibly become an acute weakness.We needed to keep our interior line as is from last year but should have worked harder at getting a vet LDE. That would gave solved our pressure issue. If u all saw mack last night...dear god, im wondering if we should have landed him afterall. He hasnt lost sht, he's the best def player in the NFL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 14 minutes ago, nickers said: Connor will probably disappear next Sunday... I gotta figure someone will game plan for him.. The Browns certainly did not... Well, you do have to give credit to the Steelers OL...(who do have 3 Pro Bowl players on that line) .and to their OL coach, Mike Munchak, whom I think may be the best in the business. In fact, I had been in favor of the Browns hiring him as HC....when they hired Jackson. He had about a .500 record with the Tits, with a pretty lousy team and no QB. So, I think that any reasonably competent RB could have performed well back there. If they had Carlos Hyde, he could be All Pro because of the blocking he would get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 does joe wanna coach? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickers Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 13 minutes ago, The Gipper said: Well, you do have to give credit to the Steelers OL...(who do have 3 Pro Bowl players on that line) .and to their OL coach, Mike Munchak, whom I think may be the best in the business. In fact, I had been in favor of the Browns hiring him as HC....when they hired Jackson. He had about a .500 record with the Tits, with a pretty lousy team and no QB. So, I think that any reasonably competent RB could have performed well back there. If they had Carlos Hyde, he could be All Pro because of the blocking he would get. Yeah... I was not big on Hue... Munchak has been there and played the game.. So I automatically would lend more creedence to his experience... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted September 10, 2018 Report Share Posted September 10, 2018 4 hours ago, nickers said: Yeah... I was not big on Hue... Munchak has been there and played the game.. So I automatically would lend more creedence to his experience... i dont think wylie is hues guy. He xame in with dirsey/haley. Im starting to smell a similiar situation to that fukking walruscunt who's name i cant remember but famously broke up the hillis/vickers combo that obliterated NFL front 7's, cause fullbacks dont matter. not feeling good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted September 11, 2018 Report Share Posted September 11, 2018 12 hours ago, Clevfan4life said: that fukking walruscunt who's name i cant remember That would be Mike "walruscunt" Holmgren... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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